Author Topic: Spurs: fucking useless  (Read 2632572 times)

Offline PoetryInMotion

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Re: Spurs - 1 Billion Pound Millstone Without Cheese
« Reply #18040 on: May 9, 2019, 08:24:28 pm »
Also, PiM, I'm doing 3-4 things at the same time here, including getting ready for work and watching the Chelsea game, so I don't want to come across as being short or terse. Your points are valid, but I'm short of time to do big paragraphs explaining my position :)

No issues PoP, respond when you have time  :)

I always find discussions with you interesting, I remember the Wijnaldum vs Allen discussion as well  :D

Offline PhaseOfPlay

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Re: Spurs - 1 Billion Pound Millstone Without Cheese
« Reply #18041 on: May 9, 2019, 08:34:45 pm »
Correction - Mourinho WAS a better coach and manager. If he is better now, he has to prove that in his next management job. Until then, Poch IS better.

I'm not talking about their overall achievements so far. The point was that, what Mourinho did with the trophies at Man United, did not catapult Man United to any sort of progress in his tenure. They are still shambles. Whereas Pochettino has catapulted Spurs to a level now, now they're a relevant club in European football, before they were not even a relevant club in English football to a large extent. Long way away those tenures are the way they compare.

Spine or no spine, whose mistake was that? Mourinho was there for 3 years, if he couldn't build a decent spine with all the millions that he had and what Pochettino did not, Mourinho could've built a far better spine & squad than what Pochettino has. Anything else is just plain excuses for Mourinho. This spine thing is only relevant if you're competing in one competition with one target that you throw everything else. For doing anything more, you need a squad. Net spend has a massive influence. Yes, some sides can balance that advantage, that's what Spurs are doing now.

If net spend is not a factor, then why cannot a side like Newcastle ever come close to Manchester United now or in the next few years, even when Man United are being horrible managed and Newcastle is being managed excellently? If you can explain this, I'll ignore talking wages and spend in this context. Else, that line will keep coming as valid  :)

Bad scouting. Net spend is a red herring, as it fluctuates based upon a team's needs and wants per season. Wages is also a correlation to success, but not a cause of it. Remember, Spurs were 1 minute away from missing out on the CL final to a team that costs a fraction of the Spurs starting 11, brought together through good scouting and great youth development. Who is the better coach there, Ten Hag or Pochettino?

Games are won and lost by players, who are recruited and organised by managers, and trained by coaches. Having money only means you can aggregate the best talents to your team. Not having as much, doesn't mean you can't get top talents. Pochettino's ideal shape is a 1-4-2-3-1 playing a pressing game. Looking at his starting 11, to assess the quality of his team according to who he has available. He was bequeathed most of a good spine, that he didn't have to spend money on: Lloris, Vertonghen, Eriksen, Kane. That reduces his need to buy players for those positions. He brought in Alli, Son, Alderweireld, Moura, Sanchez, Sissoko, Wanyama, Llorente and Aurier. That's a strong first 11 and two off the bench, not to mention Trippier and Foyth. And he didn't have to sell any of his best players to do that. So I'm not really seeing this "miracle" work. Where is the "miracle", exactly? I just see very good management and what would be expected of a top 6 manager.
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Offline PhaseOfPlay

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Re: Spurs - 1 Billion Pound Millstone Without Cheese
« Reply #18042 on: May 9, 2019, 08:35:39 pm »
No issues PoP, respond when you have time  :)

I always find discussions with you interesting, I remember the Wijnaldum vs Allen discussion as well  :D

Wijnaldum?

You mean "Tall Joe Allen"?

;D ;D ;D
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Offline Clayton Bigsby

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Re: Spurs - 1 Billion Pound Millstone Without Cheese
« Reply #18043 on: May 9, 2019, 08:37:45 pm »
so had he finished 5th/6th instead of 3rd and won a few league cups he’d be more legit?

Good point well made. I Still don't rate him but you are right, top 4 is their trophy

Offline PoetryInMotion

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Re: Spurs - 1 Billion Pound Millstone Without Cheese
« Reply #18044 on: May 9, 2019, 09:07:11 pm »
Bad scouting. Net spend is a red herring, as it fluctuates based upon a team's needs and wants per season. Wages is also a correlation to success, but not a cause of it. Remember, Spurs were 1 minute away from missing out on the CL final to a team that costs a fraction of the Spurs starting 11, brought together through good scouting and great youth development. Who is the better coach there, Ten Hag or Pochettino?

Games are won and lost by players, who are recruited and organised by managers, and trained by coaches. Having money only means you can aggregate the best talents to your team. Not having as much, doesn't mean you can't get top talents. Pochettino's ideal shape is a 1-4-2-3-1 playing a pressing game. Looking at his starting 11, to assess the quality of his team according to who he has available. He was bequeathed most of a good spine, that he didn't have to spend money on: Lloris, Vertonghen, Eriksen, Kane. That reduces his need to buy players for those positions. He brought in Alli, Son, Alderweireld, Moura, Sanchez, Sissoko, Wanyama, Llorente and Aurier. That's a strong first 11 and two off the bench, not to mention Trippier and Foyth. And he didn't have to sell any of his best players to do that. So I'm not really seeing this "miracle" work. Where is the "miracle", exactly? I just see very good management and what would be expected of a top 6 manager.

I kind of get the point you're making about players, but I stand by the point that you need a whole squad to compete in different competitions, because fatigue & injuries play a major part during a whole season, & the strongest squads survive through them. Others give up other targets & try to stick to one target to make it, and that target is relative to what is expected of them & the resources they have.

Okay, he had a good spine to start with, but many of these players have reached their peak under Pochettino than under anyone else (even Lloris has improved his consistency - he used to flap around more earlier). That is also a big thing to consider. Every player you have mentioned (except Llorente who is ageing and only a back-up & maybe Wanyama) have hit their peak and played their best football under Pochettino and no one else. What you're seeing now are developed versions of these players & then we say they're good, but there's also the thing. Has the coach made them better? In that sense, with & without resources, he is over-achieving.

And then there are clubs who get innumerable hits/attempts to improve their spine & squad, some succeed & Spurs are at a disadvantage to them & some still fail to do so. The fact that he has has a very little margin for error in transfers, as as it is he isn't getting much, then he has pretty much been spot on with most of his transfers. It's not just good scouting, it's plenty of team-work. It's how we also praise Klopp for the signings. Pochettino has even lesser power with Levy & still makes things work.

Talking about the budget of Ajax and Spurs, the fact is that Ajax are not competing in the Premier League. Make Ajax compete in the Premier League with their same budget, endure a full season of 4 competitions and then see if they'd have reached a CL Semi-Final with it. I think they'd be below Wolves frankly over the course of the season. That doesn't mean their CL run was weak, they were just able to save themselves, their energy & minds for the CL games, as they were comfortable in their league & domestic cup. But ask them to do it with a XI and without a squad in a league like PL, they'd not be able to produce consistent results at all. Wages/Net Spend is relative in your league & mostly doesn't apply to knock-out comps.

As for Ten Hag or Pochettino, if we're making judgments based on one-off games, then I mean, Hogdson has beaten Guardiola. Even if you are talking about reaching the CL final, they still didn't do it. Pochettino found weaknesses in Ajax's game, I'm sure he did this deliberately on purpose in both legs, they saved their energy for the 2nd half, tried to contain them in the first half and then went after them in the 2nd half. Ajax on the other hand, pressed like madmen and attacked hard in the first halves of both games, dropped off massively in the 2nd and left gaps in and around.

Ten Hag is a good coach, but ultimately the weaknesses in his side were brought out. This is his first season at this level, and Pochettino has been managing a Top 4 side in a Big 4 League, so it'll be a while before Ten Hag can be actually compared to him.
« Last Edit: May 9, 2019, 09:14:34 pm by PoetryInMotion »

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Re: Spurs - 1 Billion Pound Millstone Without Cheese
« Reply #18045 on: May 11, 2019, 01:28:48 am »
https://www.theguardian.com/football/2019/may/10/tottenham-mauricio-pochettino-champions-league-ajax-daniel-levy

Quote
“We know very well that we need to operate in a different way and that doesn’t mean to spend more or less money. It’s to be transparent and say: ‘This is what we want for the next year, or the next five or 10 years.’ It would be very naive to think we can continue to operate as we have done and that it will get us to the Champions League final and the top four every season when we’re competing against projects like Liverpool or the Manchester clubs.

“If you want to expect the same from us as from Liverpool, the Manchester clubs and Chelsea, give me different tools to work with. If not and I see people working in the same way in the future, and I’m going to be this guy, I am the most stupid person to work. We need to create a realistic plan to develop in the next year, five years, and to match people’s expectations because, if not, our destiny is to crash.”

Can’t blame him for this, his leverage is absolutely huge right now so I don’t think anyone could blame him for wanting out if there is another summer of mingebaggery

Offline newterp

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Re: Spurs - 1 Billion Pound Millstone Without Cheese
« Reply #18046 on: May 11, 2019, 02:17:14 am »
https://www.theguardian.com/football/2019/may/10/tottenham-mauricio-pochettino-champions-league-ajax-daniel-levy

Can’t blame him for this, his leverage is absolutely huge right now so I don’t think anyone could blame him for wanting out if there is another summer of mingebaggery

Reminds me a bit of Rafa demanding signings after the 07 loss

Offline bravoco

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Re: Spurs - 1 Billion Pound Millstone Without Cheese
« Reply #18047 on: May 11, 2019, 02:27:37 am »
Weird quotes in some respects. He talks like the club have no plan, or at least not one that's he's party to. Which seems strange given that he's one of their best assets.

And then there's this whole going home to Argentina thing. Is that a coded way of saying he's on the market for other clubs that are showing more ambition??

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Re: Spurs - 1 Billion Pound Millstone Without Cheese
« Reply #18048 on: May 11, 2019, 02:33:50 am »
https://www.theguardian.com/football/2019/may/10/tottenham-mauricio-pochettino-champions-league-ajax-daniel-levy

Can’t blame him for this, his leverage is absolutely huge right now so I don’t think anyone could blame him for wanting out if there is another summer of mingebaggery

but the thing is, he knows where the money is going at Spurs, and he is choosing to stay. Saying 'projects like Liverpool' is a bit disingenuous too, until very recently, both teams whre spending similar amounts. Difference is, Spurs have got themselves a shiny new stadium at a huge cost since, while Liverpool decided to spend more on a couple key players last year. Sure, not spending anything was a bit mad, but he knew there wouldnt be a massive budget for a while.

Pochetinno seems to be talking a lot, but he knows whats going on there, it's pretty transparent. If he wants to walk away, he should walk away in the summer, his stock will not be higher.

Offline davidlpool1982

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Re: Spurs - 1 Billion Pound Millstone Without Cheese
« Reply #18049 on: May 11, 2019, 07:32:47 am »
Admittedly, I don't follow Italian football much so there may be be big clubs there who have money and a "project" (I fucking hate that word when used about football), but otherwise who is about for him to manage?

United just hired Ole and as fucking hilarious as it has been they aren't going to sack a club legend 8 weeks after getting a full time deal. There'd be riots (on the internet). Arsenal have Emery, obviously we have Klopp, Chelsea might lose Sarri but have a 2 window transfer ban over their heads.

Pep Pippin Guardiola probably won't leave City this season, I mean there's vague rumours of him going to Juve and I can see next season being his last but he'll surely stay one more year to try ram through Abu Dhabi's Champions League Sports-washing Dream.They basically spent 7 years setting everything up for him to come what with taking Barca's sporting hierarchy piecemeal and showing him a lubed up rusty balloon knot for years to make him turn up and I can't see them letting him leave without a fight.

Madrid just hired Zidane back and he's always said he won't manage Barca  due to his Espanyol links (whether he sticks to that or not is another thing). Atletico don't have the same money as the other two and while I can see Simeone leaving soon, if the job he really covets is the Real one then that's not the best move to take. There's PSG which is the obvious one since they fluffed their lines this season even in the French cup final let alone the Champions league but would Pochetino be happy in a one team league where he would have to manage super egos properly so they could raise their game come the knock out phase of the CL?

Bayern might look at the manager situation at the end of next year I suspect since I'm not sure Kovac is not seen as the way forward by fans. I might be wrong about that, I don't follow Bundesliga as much as England and Spain, but that's what I get from looking around the internet.

Offline decosabute

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Re: Spurs - 1 Billion Pound Millstone Without Cheese
« Reply #18050 on: May 11, 2019, 08:57:44 am »
Admittedly, I don't follow Italian football much so there may be be big clubs there who have money and a "project" (I fucking hate that word when used about football), but otherwise who is about for him to manage?

United just hired Ole and as fucking hilarious as it has been they aren't going to sack a club legend 8 weeks after getting a full time deal. There'd be riots (on the internet). Arsenal have Emery, obviously we have Klopp, Chelsea might lose Sarri but have a 2 window transfer ban over their heads.

Pep Pippin Guardiola probably won't leave City this season, I mean there's vague rumours of him going to Juve and I can see next season being his last but he'll surely stay one more year to try ram through Abu Dhabi's Champions League Sports-washing Dream.They basically spent 7 years setting everything up for him to come what with taking Barca's sporting hierarchy piecemeal and showing him a lubed up rusty balloon knot for years to make him turn up and I can't see them letting him leave without a fight.

Madrid just hired Zidane back and he's always said he won't manage Barca  due to his Espanyol links (whether he sticks to that or not is another thing). Atletico don't have the same money as the other two and while I can see Simeone leaving soon, if the job he really covets is the Real one then that's not the best move to take. There's PSG which is the obvious one since they fluffed their lines this season even in the French cup final let alone the Champions league but would Pochetino be happy in a one team league where he would have to manage super egos properly so they could raise their game come the knock out phase of the CL?

Bayern might look at the manager situation at the end of next year I suspect since I'm not sure Kovac is not seen as the way forward by fans. I might be wrong about that, I don't follow Bundesliga as much as England and Spain, but that's what I get from looking around the internet.

That's all true that the options right now aren't brilliant, but I think if he was to go, it would be a sabbatical first. The United job will almost certainly come up within a few months - they probably want rid of Solskjaer already, but have to let him at least start next season to save face - and that could be what Pochettino still has his eye on if Spurs continue to keep the pursestrings shut.

Personally I think they'll spend a bit this summer, but when they're probably losing Rose, Alderweireld and possibly Eriksen too (with Vertonghen and Lloris not getting any younger) a massive amount is needed just to stand still.

Offline decosabute

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Re: Spurs - 1 Billion Pound Millstone Without Cheese
« Reply #18051 on: May 11, 2019, 09:14:17 am »
but the thing is, he knows where the money is going at Spurs, and he is choosing to stay. Saying 'projects like Liverpool' is a bit disingenuous too, until very recently, both teams whre spending similar amounts. Difference is, Spurs have got themselves a shiny new stadium at a huge cost since, while Liverpool decided to spend more on a couple key players last year. Sure, not spending anything was a bit mad, but he knew there wouldnt be a massive budget for a while.

Pochetinno seems to be talking a lot, but he knows whats going on there, it's pretty transparent. If he wants to walk away, he should walk away in the summer, his stock will not be higher.

Haven't heard that sort of shite for a while about all the money we're spending, but for someone who people keep saying is such a likable gentleman, Pochettino has form for this.

Until one year ago, the spends were similar as you said (Spurs spent nearly Ł115m in 2017/18, which is a shitload for any club) and if Pochettino wants to cry about our big-spending "project", then maybe they'd like to do what we did with Coutinho and sell one of their crown jewels to fund the spending. But good luck getting anywhere near as much for Eriksen when they've let him slip into the last year of his deal.

Harry Redknapp used to also wheel out the "we're just plucky paupers taking the fight to the big boys" shtick a few years ago and it's as annoying and disingenuous now as it was then.
« Last Edit: May 11, 2019, 09:40:52 am by decosabute »

Offline Tommy_W

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Re: Spurs - 1 Billion Pound Millstone Without Cheese
« Reply #18052 on: May 11, 2019, 09:47:07 am »
Until one year ago, the spends were similar as you said (Spurs spent nearly Ł115m in 2017/18, which is a shitload for any club) and if Pochettino wants to cry about our big-spending "project", then maybe they'd like to do what we did with Coutinho and sell one of their crown jewels to fund the spending. But good luck getting anywhere near as much for Eriksen when they've let him slip into the last year of his deal.

It's wages as much as anything. I think your yearly wage bill is around 100 million more than ours.

Offline decosabute

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Re: Spurs - 1 Billion Pound Millstone Without Cheese
« Reply #18053 on: May 11, 2019, 09:54:14 am »
It's wages as much as anything. I think your yearly wage bill is around 100 million more than ours.

Well that's fair (without knowing the exact numbers), and Spurs did pull off an impressive balancing act for a while with paying players below market value, and the manager's quality has probably encouraged the players to buy-in despite the lower wages. But those days are surely numbered to an extent - Eriksen, Alderweireld and Rose allowing their deals to run down without wanting to re-sign is evidence of this.

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Re: Spurs - 1 Billion Pound Millstone Without Cheese
« Reply #18054 on: May 11, 2019, 09:55:02 am »
It's wages as much as anything. I think your yearly wage bill is around 100 million more than ours.
It’s about double yours...

That’s got to change.  Incredible that you’ve hung on to your players really.
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Offline Zeb

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Re: Spurs - 1 Billion Pound Millstone Without Cheese
« Reply #18055 on: May 11, 2019, 09:55:09 am »
It's wages as much as anything. I think your yearly wage bill is around 100 million more than ours.

Aye. You've paid less for years too. Current gap is mainly Spurs freezing their wages around the Ł100m mark for several years not so long back, where our's nearly doubled in the same time period.
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Offline Red-Soldier

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Re: Spurs - 1 Billion Pound Millstone Without Cheese
« Reply #18056 on: May 11, 2019, 09:55:55 am »
Yeah it's the wages at Spurs that are massively different to the others around them, not transfer spending.

They've been punching above their weight for years.

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Re: Spurs - 1 Billion Pound Millstone Without Cheese
« Reply #18057 on: May 11, 2019, 10:09:21 am »
Aye. You've paid less for years too. Current gap is mainly Spurs freezing their wages around the Ł100m mark for several years not so long back, where our's nearly doubled in the same time period.

Yep, I'd imagine that Eriksen, Alli, Moura, Verthongen, Rose could all improve their wages enormously - looking at this site https://www.spotrac.com/epl/tottenham-hotspur-f.c/payroll/ comparing theirs to ours for example, then Eriksen could almost triple his wages elsewhere and Rose easily too. And the others could improve their wages with 50-60% probably and it might be that one leaves and the others follow if they keep their wage limits like they do.

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Re: Spurs - 1 Billion Pound Millstone Without Cheese
« Reply #18058 on: May 11, 2019, 10:32:02 am »
It’s about double yours...

That’s got to change.  Incredible that you’ve hung on to your players really.
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Re: Spurs - 1 Billion Pound Millstone Without Cheese
« Reply #18059 on: May 11, 2019, 10:37:35 am »
All those seeking concessions because we may have a higher wage bill thus constituting an unfair playing field....... Nobody gives a shit, for years we  have been hampered by expectation against Oil states, Glazers & Oligarrch's   nobody cared/or cares 1 hoot for us.       Quit with the inferiority complex , this is a result of your mindset being 'Top 4's our everything'. You want  to rub shoulders with the big boys then this is how it pans out I'm afraid.   See you all in Madrid.    Must admit  rather dissapointed to be facing  this lot in  the final,  they dont  even havea cultured fan base to explore and enjoy on and around the  final in Madrid, another  plastic club with plastic fans and plastic flags.
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Re: Spurs - 1 Billion Pound Millstone Without Cheese
« Reply #18060 on: May 11, 2019, 10:43:30 am »
All those seeking concessions because we may have a higher wage bill thus constituting an unfair playing field....... Nobody gives a shit, for years we  have been hampered by expectation against Oil states, Glazers & Oligarrch's   nobody cared/or cares 1 hoot for us.       Quit with the inferiority complex , this is a result of your mindset being 'Top 4's our everything'. You want  to rub shoulders with the big boys then this is how it pans out I'm afraid.   See you all in Madrid.    Must admit  rather dissapointed to be facing  this lot in  the final,  they dont  even havea cultured fan base to explore and enjoy on and around the  final in Madrid, another  plastic club with plastic fans and plastic flags.

Not sure if anyone has an inferiority complex.  The facts are that they have been punching above their weight for years as their wage bill is dwarfed by all those around them.  And they aren't a plastic club either (not owned by a state or oilgarch).


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Re: Spurs - 1 Billion Pound Millstone Without Cheese
« Reply #18061 on: May 11, 2019, 11:05:28 am »
If they are spending as much on fees but not on wages then it brings up some questions...

Are they spending too much on fees for players who only demand low wages? Or is Levy that good of a negotiator that he can get players to accept ultra low wages compared to elsewhere?

I know they’ve benefited from buying players way before their peak, or them coming from the academy, which always help keep the wages low. Only lasts so long though - especially when players are getting to CL finals and see their wages half of their competitors despite being in the same league, playing in a bigger stadium, etc.

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Re: Spurs - 1 Billion Pound Millstone Without Cheese
« Reply #18062 on: May 11, 2019, 12:58:47 pm »
Haven't heard that sort of shite for a while about all the money we're spending, but for someone who people keep saying is such a likable gentleman, Pochettino has form for this.

Until one year ago, the spends were similar as you said (Spurs spent nearly Ł115m in 2017/18, which is a shitload for any club) and if Pochettino wants to cry about our big-spending "project", then maybe they'd like to do what we did with Coutinho and sell one of their crown jewels to fund the spending. But good luck getting anywhere near as much for Eriksen when they've let him slip into the last year of his deal.

Harry Redknapp used to also wheel out the "we're just plucky paupers taking the fight to the big boys" shtick a few years ago and it's as annoying and disingenuous now as it was then.

exactly, it's boring, but he's pulled the wool over everyones eyes, so fair dos for that!

Spending was indeed similar, then their financial priority had to change to the new stadium, LFC's turned to a colossal defender and goalie  :P

We'll get all this shoved down our throats for the next 3 weeks though with Pochetinno the head cheer-leader.  He's a sly one, cos he knows full well the situation, it's up to him to do something about it, rather than yap.  We'll see in the summer if he's willing to.

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Re: Spurs - 1 Billion Pound Millstone Without Cheese
« Reply #18063 on: May 11, 2019, 01:14:49 pm »
Not sure if anyone has an inferiority complex.  The facts are that they have been punching above their weight for years as their wage bill is dwarfed by all those around them.  And they aren't a plastic club either (not owned by a state or oilgarch).


On the contrary, maybe they have been punching above their weight so what?, but they have won fuck all for how long? in terms of them being plastics to me they are, ok no oil state or whatever but they are a plastic club, from the plastic flags on their 1st champions league campaign, to their 1 hit wonder  (top 4's their everything).
Media darlings due to their geographical location, good manager, yes, good players , yes, good side , yes but they are still a bunch of plastics that do not even register with our great club.   So the plastic piece isn't  exclusive to Chelsea & City,  it runs deeper and this lot are plastics as anything.
A decent side but lets get some perspective. My main point being was anybody backing us when we had the cancers in charge expecting to compete  with Cheslea and mancs?    No they didn't, even our own fan base was ignorant to it in terms of their expectations of teh team and manager.   
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Re: Spurs - 1 Billion Pound Millstone Without Cheese
« Reply #18064 on: May 11, 2019, 01:31:30 pm »
On the contrary, maybe they have been punching above their weight so what?, but they have won fuck all for how long? in terms of them being plastics to me they are, ok no oil state or whatever but they are a plastic club, from the plastic flags on their 1st champions league campaign, to their 1 hit wonder  (top 4's their everything).
Media darlings due to their geographical location, good manager, yes, good players , yes, good side , yes but they are still a bunch of plastics that do not even register with our great club.   So the plastic piece isn't  exclusive to Chelsea & City,  it runs deeper and this lot are plastics as anything.
A decent side but lets get some perspective. My main point being was anybody backing us when we had the cancers in charge expecting to compete  with Cheslea and mancs?    No they didn't, even our own fan base was ignorant to it in terms of their expectations of teh team and manager.   

Not being funny but Spurs absolutely aren't a 'plastic' club. They've done exceptionally well over the past few years in terms of spending vs. achievement, so they haven't just had their success handed to them on a plate ala City and Chelsea. They have a large fan base considering their lack of trophies (I don't think we'll be seeing empty seats at WHL in the way we do at the Etihad). Their fans are also vocal and create a decent atmosphere; agreed they could do better than plastic flags but I don't think that justifies writing off the entire club. If Tottenham are a 'plastic' club, then surely most clubs are too?

I understand that the build-up to the final is going to inevitably result in insults being traded between the two sets of fans but after an entire season of aggression toward Liverpool from supporters of random teams who have nothing to do with us, I could do without the forced rivalries and hatred.
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Offline PoetryInMotion

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Re: Spurs - 1 Billion Pound Millstone Without Cheese
« Reply #18065 on: May 11, 2019, 01:41:44 pm »
Admittedly, I don't follow Italian football much so there may be be big clubs there who have money and a "project" (I fucking hate that word when used about football), but otherwise who is about for him to manage?

United just hired Ole and as fucking hilarious as it has been they aren't going to sack a club legend 8 weeks after getting a full time deal. There'd be riots (on the internet). Arsenal have Emery, obviously we have Klopp, Chelsea might lose Sarri but have a 2 window transfer ban over their heads.

Pep Pippin Guardiola probably won't leave City this season, I mean there's vague rumours of him going to Juve and I can see next season being his last but he'll surely stay one more year to try ram through Abu Dhabi's Champions League Sports-washing Dream.They basically spent 7 years setting everything up for him to come what with taking Barca's sporting hierarchy piecemeal and showing him a lubed up rusty balloon knot for years to make him turn up and I can't see them letting him leave without a fight.

Madrid just hired Zidane back and he's always said he won't manage Barca  due to his Espanyol links (whether he sticks to that or not is another thing). Atletico don't have the same money as the other two and while I can see Simeone leaving soon, if the job he really covets is the Real one then that's not the best move to take. There's PSG which is the obvious one since they fluffed their lines this season even in the French cup final let alone the Champions league but would Pochetino be happy in a one team league where he would have to manage super egos properly so they could raise their game come the knock out phase of the CL?

Bayern might look at the manager situation at the end of next year I suspect since I'm not sure Kovac is not seen as the way forward by fans. I might be wrong about that, I don't follow Bundesliga as much as England and Spain, but that's what I get from looking around the internet.

Bayern or PSG should go for him. He's better than either of their current managers and would do much better to pull them out of the rut they are in, now. Both of them want to do well in the CL, so if his current CL exploits don't attract them, it's hard to see much sense in that.

He'd make Juve play better too.

Offline PoetryInMotion

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Re: Spurs - 1 Billion Pound Millstone Without Cheese
« Reply #18066 on: May 11, 2019, 01:45:01 pm »
Yeah it's the wages at Spurs that are massively different to the others around them, not transfer spending.

They've been punching above their weight for years.

Net spending is also low when you compare to other Top 6 teams, the caveat is except us (we're just above them in net spend, the rest are well above).

Only Liverpool & Spurs have the lowest net spend of the Top 6 teams. But yes, the wages thing make it even harder for them to run the club.
« Last Edit: May 11, 2019, 01:50:22 pm by PoetryInMotion »

Offline PoetryInMotion

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Re: Spurs - 1 Billion Pound Millstone Without Cheese
« Reply #18067 on: May 11, 2019, 01:48:58 pm »
Not being funny but Spurs absolutely aren't a 'plastic' club. They've done exceptionally well over the past few years in terms of spending vs. achievement, so they haven't just had their success handed to them on a plate ala City and Chelsea. They have a large fan base considering their lack of trophies (I don't think we'll be seeing empty seats at WHL in the way we do at the Etihad). Their fans are also vocal and create a decent atmosphere; agreed they could do better than plastic flags but I don't think that justifies writing off the entire club. If Tottenham are a 'plastic' club, then surely most clubs are too?

I understand that the build-up to the final is going to inevitably result in insults being traded between the two sets of fans but after an entire season of aggression toward Liverpool from supporters of random teams who have nothing to do with us, I could do without the forced rivalries and hatred.

Absolutely. It doesn't make sense to do insults and come up with straw-men about them being plastics or anything. Properly run club, they are, who are a good side with a good manager. That is all. Now, we can beat them.

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Re: Spurs - 1 Billion Pound Millstone Without Cheese
« Reply #18068 on: May 11, 2019, 07:09:26 pm »
Absolutely. It doesn't make sense to do insults and come up with straw-men about them being plastics or anything. Properly run club, they are, who are a good side with a good manager. That is all. Now, we can beat them.
who is making up straw men and insults with a team just because they have the nerve to get  to the final?  not me.  Regardless of whether they beat Ajax, City or the harlem fucking globetrotters, i deem they as a plastic fan base and one that i simply can't  stomach, maybe its Sir  harry, maybe its just  teh fact they are the media darlings either way i view them as plastics and it has nothing to do with your points or that  of Koplass.    Love the fact the moral high ground police  wade in with their skewed opinions.
Condemnation without investigation is the height of ignorance.  Albert Einstein.  
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Offline PoetryInMotion

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Re: Spurs - 1 Billion Pound Millstone Without Cheese
« Reply #18069 on: May 11, 2019, 07:33:11 pm »
who is making up straw men and insults with a team just because they have the nerve to get  to the final?  not me.  Regardless of whether they beat Ajax, City or the harlem fucking globetrotters, i deem they as a plastic fan base and one that i simply can't  stomach, maybe its Sir  harry, maybe its just  teh fact they are the media darlings either way i view them as plastics and it has nothing to do with your points or that  of Koplass.    Love the fact the moral high ground police  wade in with their skewed opinions.

Who pissed your chips? Calm down.

Yes, they're are media darlings because they have quite a few English National Team players, just like Man United under Ferguson used to have. That has nothing to do with being plastics. Do you even know why certain clubs are called plastics?

And calm down before you reply. Try to reason and justify your posts before you call other opinions as skewed.

Note: I should have read 'G for Grumpy' before  ;)

Note2: It's just a joke.

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Re: Spurs - 1 Billion Pound Millstone Without Cheese
« Reply #18070 on: May 11, 2019, 07:41:04 pm »
Weirdos.
My cup, it runneth over, I'll never get my fill

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Re: Spurs - 1 Billion Pound Millstone Without Cheese
« Reply #18071 on: May 11, 2019, 11:39:54 pm »
who is making up straw men and insults with a team just because they have the nerve to get  to the final?  not me.  Regardless of whether they beat Ajax, City or the harlem fucking globetrotters, i deem they as a plastic fan base and one that i simply can't  stomach, maybe its Sir  harry, maybe its just  teh fact they are the media darlings either way i view them as plastics and it has nothing to do with your points or that  of Koplass.    Love the fact the moral high ground police  wade in with their skewed opinions.

You really aren't using the term plastic correctly if you think it applies to Spurs, it is fine to dislike them for numerous reasons such as the media darlings stuff (a tag that also gets labelled at us by many clubs don't forget), but being a plastic club doesn't seem like it fits and people are not on any kind of high horse so much as they are confused by your use of the term.

Offline harleydanger

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Re: Spurs - 1 Billion Pound Millstone Without Cheese
« Reply #18072 on: May 12, 2019, 12:56:41 am »
Net spending is also low when you compare to other Top 6 teams, the caveat is except us (we're just above them in net spend, the rest are well above).

Only Liverpool & Spurs have the lowest net spend of the Top 6 teams. But yes, the wages thing make it even harder for them to run the club.

Net spend isn't the best to judge by though as you get lottery wins like Coutinho or Bale. We got two world class players for one sub world class player that brought us from top 4 to title challenging. They got half a team from Bale that brought them from a top ten club to consistent top four. If you look at wages they've done exceptionally well but they've also got half the team going into the final contract year at the end of the season. They're a house of cards built on sand at the moment and could quite easily do a Leeds.

Michel Vorm – 2019
Toby Alderweireld – 2020
Jan Vertonghen – 2020
Danny Rose – 2021
Ben Davies – 2021
Eric Dier - 2021
Victor Wanyama – 2021
Christian Eriksen – 2020
Moussa Sissoko – 2021
Fernando Llorente - 2019
« Last Edit: May 12, 2019, 01:01:28 am by harleydanger »
WHAT A TIME TO BE ALIVE!

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Re: Spurs - 1 Billion Pound Millstone Without Cheese
« Reply #18073 on: May 12, 2019, 01:11:42 am »
Spurs plastic?!? 😂 they're the opposite really.

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Re: Spurs - 1 Billion Pound Millstone Without Cheese
« Reply #18074 on: May 12, 2019, 01:22:11 am »
Spurs plastic?!? 😂 they're the opposite really.

I would think the poster who refered to them as plastic may not know what that means!

Spurs are many things, and many of those things not particularly likeable, be it their fans, their constant diving and play-acting, their yappy and sneaky coach, but yeah, one thing you can't say about them is they are a plastic club! Just because they had some dreadful club paid for plastic choreo in a couple games recently, doesn't put them in the Abu Dhabi FC league.

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Re: Spurs - 1 Billion Pound Millstone Without Cheese
« Reply #18075 on: May 12, 2019, 08:38:30 am »
They wont do a Leeds, they're too well run. They'll sell players going into the last year of their contracts and reinvest. They may drop off slightly but they wont be relegated and go into administration like Leeds.

Offline The North Bank

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Re: Spurs - 1 Billion Pound Millstone Without Cheese
« Reply #18076 on: May 12, 2019, 09:06:28 am »
Hopefully they lose the final, lose their manager, and all their best players. Apart from that, good luck to them.

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Re: Spurs - 1 Billion Pound Millstone Without Cheese
« Reply #18077 on: May 12, 2019, 09:23:27 am »
Edited this little film yesterday. Thought a game like that needed the Hollywood treatment ;) Ha ha

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Exkvqy7JBxg

Best of luck today by the way.

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Re: Spurs - 1 Billion Pound Millstone Without Cheese
« Reply #18078 on: May 12, 2019, 09:30:34 am »
Nice one Tommy

Offline deano2727

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Re: Spurs - 1 Billion Pound Millstone Without Cheese
« Reply #18079 on: May 12, 2019, 10:20:05 am »
On the contrary, maybe they have been punching above their weight so what?, but they have won fuck all for how long? in terms of them being plastics to me they are, ok no oil state or whatever but they are a plastic club, from the plastic flags on their 1st champions league campaign, to their 1 hit wonder  (top 4's their everything).
Media darlings due to their geographical location, good manager, yes, good players , yes, good side , yes but they are still a bunch of plastics that do not even register with our great club.   So the plastic piece isn't  exclusive to Chelsea & City,  it runs deeper and this lot are plastics as anything.
A decent side but lets get some perspective. My main point being was anybody backing us when we had the cancers in charge expecting to compete  with Cheslea and mancs?    No they didn't, even our own fan base was ignorant to it in terms of their expectations of teh team and manager.   

Thats a terrible take.

I don't quite understand some peoples hatred for Spurs. I get disliking them, but not the hatred that many have on here. Yeah, they have players like Kane and Ali who are tw*ts, but as a club they are pretty ok in comparison to the likes of City and Chelsea. They aren't rivals like United and Everton. They aren't winning trophy after trophy. They don't overspend and do thing diligently. The only thing I don't like about them is they are our direct rivals to trophies alongside City, despite their collapse in the league, as shown by them reaching the final where we will play them - and much like us, they are resilient f*ckers - getting results late on and when they need them.

They are much, much closer to our style than they are the plastic sides. Like it or not. I respect them much more than any of the other side in the top 6. I don't have any real dislike for Arsenal either, but feel Spurs are the better run club and better side to boot.

With all that said, we are going to absolutely smash those Spurs c*nts.  ;D