Author Topic: Jordan Henderson  (Read 432382 times)

Offline Brentieke

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Re: Jordan Henderson
« Reply #1200 on: March 22, 2012, 09:51:47 am »
Haha fair enough. I think Henderson is a good player but thought he was awful yesterday - didn't seem like he fancied it. Saying that would rather he played then Adam.

Think he hasn't fancied it and been extremely average for 90% of the season.
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Offline Geezer08

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Re: Jordan Henderson
« Reply #1201 on: March 22, 2012, 10:06:19 am »
I wish that we had a player like Alonso around this year who he could learn from. I think that he is a good prospect and needs someone in the cm that could help him improve his game.

He is nothing like Alonso as a type of player, so the things he could learn from Alonso would be limited. Henderson is not a holding midfielder, Alonso is a holding midfielder with immense ability to control and dictate a football game, that is not Hendersons trait at all.

Henderson right now is trying to find his role, he is not winger nor an attacking midfielder, he is really trying to find his position, I believe thats why he appears to be hiding in games because he is simply not aware of his role or it he hasnt been given a clear role.

Whether he will find it is another discussions, but to be honest I struggle to see which role he will really excel at. He comes across as extremely average at many roles, and I dont think he will develop that unique skillset that allows him to be brilliant at one role.
« Last Edit: March 22, 2012, 10:24:57 am by Geezer08 »

Offline tubby

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Re: Jordan Henderson
« Reply #1202 on: March 22, 2012, 10:22:16 am »
Thought it was quite telling that when Adam went off injured at half time and Henderson came on, it looked like we switched to 442.  So I think Kenny sees him as either a wide midfielder or as the furthest forward in a midfield 3, which just doesn't suit his abilities at all.  Can't understand it.
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Re: Jordan Henderson
« Reply #1203 on: March 22, 2012, 11:15:48 am »
Think he hasn't fancied it and been extremely average for 90% of the season.

he's shown glimpses of good technical ability and excellent one touch passing.give him 2-3 years he will become a beast
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Offline Fuzion6

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Re: Jordan Henderson
« Reply #1204 on: March 22, 2012, 11:22:51 am »
Thought it was quite telling that when Adam went off injured at half time and Henderson came on, it looked like we switched to 442.  So I think Kenny sees him as either a wide midfielder or as the furthest forward in a midfield 3, which just doesn't suit his abilities at all.  Can't understand it.
Agree with this -exactly how I saw it.

Offline alfonso

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Re: Jordan Henderson
« Reply #1205 on: March 22, 2012, 01:51:57 pm »
he's shown glimpses of good technical ability and excellent one touch passing.give him 2-3 years he will become a beast

But fans don't want to wait 2-3 years.
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Offline Suareznumber7

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Re: Jordan Henderson
« Reply #1206 on: March 22, 2012, 02:08:05 pm »
Thought it was quite telling that when Adam went off injured at half time and Henderson came on, it looked like we switched to 442.  So I think Kenny sees him as either a wide midfielder or as the furthest forward in a midfield 3, which just doesn't suit his abilities at all.  Can't understand it.

WIth you on this one.  Henderson is not a wide midfielder and actually is pretty bad playing as one. 

Offline joezydudek

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Re: Jordan Henderson
« Reply #1207 on: March 22, 2012, 02:08:25 pm »
when u pay almost 20M£ i shouldnt have to wait. Only retards buy players for that kind of cash and wait for something to happen.

Have you really just called our manager a retard? What load of fucking gobshites this forum is full of these days.

Offline hesbighesred

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Re: Jordan Henderson
« Reply #1208 on: March 22, 2012, 02:08:29 pm »
Thought it was quite telling that when Adam went off injured at half time and Henderson came on, it looked like we switched to 442.  So I think Kenny sees him as either a wide midfielder or as the furthest forward in a midfield 3, which just doesn't suit his abilities at all.  Can't understand it.
That was a poor tactical choice, IMO. Our midfield had already left gaps at times before that, afterward we built an excellent spell of pressure but equally offered absolutely nothing in response to QPR actually having the ball - like all too many teams this season they were able to stroll through our midfield as if it weren't there, which will always be a problem with Gerrard in there as a CM. It would be fine if he actually played as a deeper CM but he doesn't - wherever you put him he tends to default back to being an AM which is dangerous.

I'd really like to see Henderson getting some games alongside either Lucas or Spearing, I think it'd offer a much better balance.
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Offline THE7KING

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Re: Jordan Henderson
« Reply #1209 on: March 22, 2012, 02:09:44 pm »
Ok lets compare two players of a similar age...Henderson and Ramsey!

Ok we bang on about how Henderson will be good ONE day where Ramsey preforms at a level week in week out that by going on what
we judge hendo by would make him up there with the Xavi, Iniesta and Gerrard of this world. In fact Ramsey as plenty of potential box to box, good passer, good technical skills and TAKE RISKs not the fecking simple little pass alway the time.

Cost: Henderson 16 mill - Ramsey 6 - 7mill wasn't it not 100 per cent sure though.

I don't see Henderson ever being a top quality player let alone a world class player. He will be at best an average English midfielder nothing more.


Offline Cpt_Reina

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Re: Jordan Henderson
« Reply #1210 on: March 22, 2012, 02:11:48 pm »
I'd really like to see Henderson getting some games alongside either Lucas or Spearing, I think it'd offer a much better balance.

I really dont know why Kenny hasnt tried it.

It pushes Gerrard further forward and it plays to Henderson's strengths much more then having him out wide.

Im struggling to find a reason why it's not been tested out.

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Re: Jordan Henderson
« Reply #1211 on: March 22, 2012, 03:06:34 pm »
when u pay almost 20M£ i shouldnt have to wait. Only retards buy players for that kind of cash and wait for something to happen.

yeah

ferguson was retarted when he waited for almost 2 years for nani to reach this sort of consistency

or maybe mourinho was retarted when he waited for drogba to hit some sort of form.

the only retard is a fucking dipshit like you
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Offline cptrios

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Re: Jordan Henderson
« Reply #1212 on: March 22, 2012, 03:29:50 pm »
when u pay almost 20M£ i shouldnt have to wait. Only retards buy players for that kind of cash and wait for something to happen.

Somehow I doubt that there are enough mentally handicapped people who've become managers of football clubs to provide any kind of basis for that particular theory. And I dare say that if there were, nobody would be going around calling them "retards."

Either way, it's not Henderson's fault we paid £13-16m for him. And given that we could afford it, and the money's long gone now, can't we just look at him as a talented young player with lots of upside?

Ok lets compare two players of a similar age...Henderson and Ramsey!

Ok we bang on about how Henderson will be good ONE day where Ramsey preforms at a level week in week out that by going on what
we judge hendo by would make him up there with the Xavi, Iniesta and Gerrard of this world. In fact Ramsey as plenty of potential box to box, good passer, good technical skills and TAKE RISKs not the fecking simple little pass alway the time.

Cost: Henderson 16 mill - Ramsey 6 - 7mill wasn't it not 100 per cent sure though.

I don't see Henderson ever being a top quality player let alone a world class player. He will be at best an average English midfielder nothing more.

Yeah and Messi cost Barca nothing. If Henderson had come from a Championship club like Ramsey did, and the transfer had happened 4 years ago like Ramsey's, and Henderson had been Welsh instead of English, then yeah we'd have gotten ripped off at £16m.

Offline THE7KING

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Re: Jordan Henderson
« Reply #1213 on: March 22, 2012, 03:38:24 pm »
Somehow I doubt that there are enough mentally handicapped people who've become managers of football clubs to provide any kind of basis for that particular theory. And I dare say that if there were, nobody would be going around calling them "retards."

Either way, it's not Henderson's fault we paid £13-16m for him. And given that we could afford it, and the money's long gone now, can't we just look at him as a talented young player with lots of upside?

Yeah and Messi cost Barca nothing. If Henderson had come from a Championship club like Ramsey did, and the transfer had happened 4 years ago like Ramsey's, and Henderson had been Welsh instead of English, then yeah we'd have gotten ripped off at £16m.

So you don't think we got ripped of for Henderson? When we already had a player in Shelvey who is no worse and a lot more confident

Offline farawayred

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Re: Jordan Henderson
« Reply #1214 on: March 22, 2012, 03:52:41 pm »
So you don't think we got ripped of for Henderson? When we already had a player in Shelvey who is no worse and a lot more confident
Shelvey is more like Adam than Henderson.
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Re: Jordan Henderson
« Reply #1215 on: March 22, 2012, 03:55:14 pm »
I really dont know why Kenny hasnt tried it.

It pushes Gerrard further forward and it plays to Henderson's strengths much more then having him out wide.

Im struggling to find a reason why it's not been tested out.
I thought he did for a couple of games? He's definitely tried Henderson in front of a two with Gerrard in CM which worked pretty well, though it did seem to end up with them more-or-less swapping each other's positions.
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Offline Rohit

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Re: Jordan Henderson
« Reply #1216 on: March 22, 2012, 04:06:03 pm »
Henderson doesn't really make tackles and won't put a foot in. Don't think he reads the game well enough to make interceptions, thats possibly the only reason I can think why kenny doesn't play him there. That said he looks like a fish out of water on the right and he lacks the invention and guile to play further forward so it doesn't play too his strengths either.

Offline Fordy

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Re: Jordan Henderson
« Reply #1217 on: March 22, 2012, 04:08:02 pm »
I really dont know why Kenny hasnt tried it.

It pushes Gerrard further forward and it plays to Henderson's strengths much more then having him out wide.

Im struggling to find a reason why it's not been tested out.

Cause he isn't good enough or has the mind set to carry out that role for us.

Offline cptrios

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Re: Jordan Henderson
« Reply #1218 on: March 22, 2012, 04:19:39 pm »
So you don't think we got ripped of for Henderson? When we already had a player in Shelvey who is no worse and a lot more confident

I think we overpaid, certainly, but not by any higher amount than I'd have expected to overpay for a young English player starting for a PL team. Keep in mind that United were sniffing around as well, and probably would have been in for him this summer. Shelvey's a very different kind of player, too. I think they would be very good on the pitch together rather than competing for the same spot.

Offline Cpt_Reina

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Re: Jordan Henderson
« Reply #1219 on: March 22, 2012, 04:20:36 pm »
I thought he did for a couple of games? He's definitely tried Henderson in front of a two with Gerrard in CM which worked pretty well, though it did seem to end up with them more-or-less swapping each other's positions.

Always looked to me as if Henderson was the more advanced player.

Offline Z e u s

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Re: Jordan Henderson
« Reply #1220 on: March 22, 2012, 04:23:09 pm »
I think we'd be better off sending Henderson on loan and playing Shelvey.

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Re: Jordan Henderson
« Reply #1221 on: March 22, 2012, 04:33:16 pm »
Just sell him..... average player

Offline ChristophLFC

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Re: Jordan Henderson
« Reply #1222 on: March 22, 2012, 04:47:30 pm »
the thing with henderson is that he has a major confidence issue, personally im not sure whether it will come or not, i just dont see it happening.

he seems more of a player that when it starts getting tough he will put his head down and coast through the game

listen there is no doubt this boy has talent, what id like to start seeing is he become more aggresive and trying things out, your not going to learn unless you fail first

can he over come this confidence problem?
« Last Edit: March 22, 2012, 04:52:05 pm by ChristophLFC »

Offline Euskadi

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Re: Jordan Henderson
« Reply #1223 on: March 22, 2012, 04:48:37 pm »
when u pay almost 20M£ i shouldnt have to wait. Only retards buy players for that kind of cash and wait for something to happen.

u havnt got a clue
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Offline -Daws-

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Re: Jordan Henderson
« Reply #1224 on: March 22, 2012, 04:53:22 pm »
For me, Jordan somewhat sums up the current Liverpool side, raw, incomplete, but with the basic attributes to be very successful given time and patience, something which unfortunately is rarely afford in football generally, not just on RAWK.

What I like about Henderson is his movement and the way he can travel with the ball while keeping his head up. This means he can bring the play forward comfortably and pop the ball off in tight situations to a man in space. Given his technical ability and the graceful way in which he moves while retaining the ball, he looks like he can become a very good ball carrier for the side in the long run and go on to become a top player at club and international level. Yes he is far from complete, but the basic qualities are already there and he is an intelligent player in a high tempo league still finding his feet. Much like the team in general, at times he has looked very good, others poor, and in general it's his inconsistancy and to a degree his final product which has let him down. The boy has ability though, I can see it. He's also quite versatile.

A player like Henderson is much like a player like Xavi. Yes, Steven Gerrard was firing all guns blazing at 21-22, but Gerrard was physically a lot more imposing and a lot more agressive and dynamic; it was easy for Stevie to stand out because of these obvious qualities. Now compare that to somebody like Xavi (Lucas too), who although technically superior, almost seemed a little out of his depth in the Bacelona side when he was the same age as Jordan, and you can see why some players can stand out more than others given their different strengths. Sometimes, a young player who doesn't take games by the scuff of the neck and obviously stand out, can go on to be a just as good a player as somebody who does. Certain qualities and abilities are easier to see than others. Lucas is a perfect example of a young player who didn't show any outstanding signs of being a great player at a young age, but because of his intelligence and game craft, has gone on to be an influencial part of this team. I feel, Henderson will go much the same way.

He has the foresight to know when to tuck inside when Stevie bombs on, he has the technical quality to keep the ball in tight situations and the passing ability to pick players out even when he is under pressure. He has had poor games this season, but he is one of many playing in a brand new football team and for christ sake, he's 21. Senior players like Carra, Skrtel, Gerrard even Suarez or Reina, have all made mistakes this season in this newly founded Liverpool side and I for one feel that Jordan needs time and support in order to fulfill his, in my opinion, excellent potential. Much like the team does in general.

I think his best role will be the ball carrier in centre midfield, whether we play with 3 through the middle (say, Stevie given the licence to get forward and Lucas holding with Henderson playing a more box to box role) or in a couple of years in just a two man midfield, he has all the required basic qualities, and most importantly the football brain, to be successful in these positions. Even from the right, he has looked capable of doing a job and also allows us to play with a more advanced centre midfielder because he's clever enough to know when he needs to drop in or when he could make a run beyond the strikers (he used to do this more often at Sunderland). For me, like the Liverpool team as a whole, he's just lacking that consistancy and a bit of confidence this season, but given time to settle, get used to his new surroundings and gel with his team mates, I believe he will also become a very important player to our club, particularly when Stevie calls it a day.

But of course this is RAWK, and this is modern day football, so unless he is scoring 10 a season with 15 assists at 21, then he's shite. I'll tell you what's shite - Liverpool fans being the most "intelligent in the world." We have turned into an embarrisment.
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Offline Max999

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Re: Jordan Henderson
« Reply #1225 on: March 22, 2012, 04:55:30 pm »
For me, Jordan somewhat sums up the current Liverpool side, raw, incomplete, but with the basic attributes to be very successful given time and patience, something which unfortunately is rarely afford in football generally, not just on RAWK.

What I like about Henderson is his movement and the way he can travel with the ball while keeping his head up. This means he can bring the play forward comfortably and pop the ball off in tight situations to a man in space. Given his technical ability and the graceful way in which he moves while retaining the ball, he looks like he can become a very good ball carrier for the side in the long run and go on to become a top player at club and international level. Yes he is far from complete, but the basic qualities are already there and he is an intelligent player in a high tempo league still finding his feet. Much like the team in general, at times he has looked very good, others poor, and in general it's his inconsistancy and to a degree his final product which has let him down. The boy has ability though, I can see it. He's also quite versatile.

A player like Henderson is much like a player like Xavi. Yes, Steven Gerrard was firing all guns blazing at 21-22, but Gerrard was physically a lot more imposing and a lot more agressive and dynamic; it was easy for Stevie to stand out because of these obvious qualities. Now compare that to somebody like Xavi (Lucas too), who although technically superior, almost seemed a little out of his depth in the Bacelona side when he was the same age as Jordan, and you can see why some players can stand out more than others given their different strengths. Sometimes, a young player who doesn't take games by the scuff of the neck and obviously stand out, can go on to be a just as good a player as somebody who does. Certain qualities and abilities are easier to see than others. Lucas is a perfect example of a young player who didn't show any outstanding signs of being a great player at a young age, but because of his intelligence and game craft, has gone on to be an influencial part of this team. I feel, Henderson will go much the same way.

He has the foresight to know when to tuck inside when Stevie bombs on, he has the technical quality to keep the ball in tight situations and the passing ability to pick players out even when he is under pressure. He has had poor games this season, but he is one of many playing in a brand new football team and for christ sake, he's 21. Senior players like Carra, Skrtel, Gerrard even Suarez or Reina, have all made mistakes this season in this newly founded Liverpool side and I for one feel that Jordan needs time and support in order to fulfill his, in my opinion, excellent potential. Much like the team does in general.

I think his best role will be the ball carrier in centre midfield, whether we play with 3 through the middle (say, Stevie given the licence to get forward and Lucas holding with Henderson playing a more box to box role) or in a couple of years in just a two man midfield, he has all the required basic qualities, and most importantly the football brain, to be successful in these positions. Even from the right, he has looked capable of doing a job and also allows us to play with a more advanced centre midfielder because he's clever enough to know when he needs to drop in or when he could make a run beyond the strikers (he used to do this more often at Sunderland). For me, like the Liverpool team as a whole, he's just lacking that consistancy and a bit of confidence this season, but given time to settle, get used to his new surroundings and gel with his team mates, I believe he will also become a very important player to our club, particularly when Stevie calls it a day.

But of course this is RAWK, and this is modern day football, so unless he is scoring 10 a season with 15 assists at 21, then he's shite. I'll tell you what's shite - Liverpool fans being the most "intelligent in the world." We have turned into an embarrisment.

100% agree, great post mate

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Re: Jordan Henderson
« Reply #1226 on: March 22, 2012, 04:55:55 pm »
We have to change from doubter to believer. Now.

Offline Euskadi

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Re: Jordan Henderson
« Reply #1227 on: March 22, 2012, 05:01:57 pm »
For me, Jordan somewhat sums up the current Liverpool side, raw, incomplete, but with the basic attributes to be very successful given time and patience, something which unfortunately is rarely afford in football generally, not just on RAWK.

What I like about Henderson is his movement and the way he can travel with the ball while keeping his head up. This means he can bring the play forward comfortably and pop the ball off in tight situations to a man in space. Given his technical ability and the graceful way in which he moves while retaining the ball, he looks like he can become a very good ball carrier for the side in the long run and go on to become a top player at club and international level. Yes he is far from complete, but the basic qualities are already there and he is an intelligent player in a high tempo league still finding his feet. Much like the team in general, at times he has looked very good, others poor, and in general it's his inconsistancy and to a degree his final product which has let him down. The boy has ability though, I can see it. He's also quite versatile.

A player like Henderson is much like a player like Xavi. Yes, Steven Gerrard was firing all guns blazing at 21-22, but Gerrard was physically a lot more imposing and a lot more agressive and dynamic; it was easy for Stevie to stand out because of these obvious qualities. Now compare that to somebody like Xavi (Lucas too), who although technically superior, almost seemed a little out of his depth in the Bacelona side when he was the same age as Jordan, and you can see why some players can stand out more than others given their different strengths. Sometimes, a young player who doesn't take games by the scuff of the neck and obviously stand out, can go on to be a just as good a player as somebody who does. Certain qualities and abilities are easier to see than others. Lucas is a perfect example of a young player who didn't show any outstanding signs of being a great player at a young age, but because of his intelligence and game craft, has gone on to be an influencial part of this team. I feel, Henderson will go much the same way.

He has the foresight to know when to tuck inside when Stevie bombs on, he has the technical quality to keep the ball in tight situations and the passing ability to pick players out even when he is under pressure. He has had poor games this season, but he is one of many playing in a brand new football team and for christ sake, he's 21. Senior players like Carra, Skrtel, Gerrard even Suarez or Reina, have all made mistakes this season in this newly founded Liverpool side and I for one feel that Jordan needs time and support in order to fulfill his, in my opinion, excellent potential. Much like the team does in general.

I think his best role will be the ball carrier in centre midfield, whether we play with 3 through the middle (say, Stevie given the licence to get forward and Lucas holding with Henderson playing a more box to box role) or in a couple of years in just a two man midfield, he has all the required basic qualities, and most importantly the football brain, to be successful in these positions. Even from the right, he has looked capable of doing a job and also allows us to play with a more advanced centre midfielder because he's clever enough to know when he needs to drop in or when he could make a run beyond the strikers (he used to do this more often at Sunderland). For me, like the Liverpool team as a whole, he's just lacking that consistancy and a bit of confidence this season, but given time to settle, get used to his new surroundings and gel with his team mates, I believe he will also become a very important player to our club, particularly when Stevie calls it a day.

But of course this is RAWK, and this is modern day football, so unless he is scoring 10 a season with 15 assists at 21, then he's shite. I'll tell you what's shite - Liverpool fans being the most "intelligent in the world." We have turned into an embarrisment.

One of the best posts ive seen in a long time. Im glad others remember that it took Xavi years to mature. I remember he was nearly not picked for the spain 2006 world cup squad. Im sick of the desperation amongst us, the knee jerk shite. I want results just as much as the next man but even bloody City took 3-4 yeears to get to where they are now and they have a bottomless pit of oil. We have to patient with our team in the same way that we have to be patient with our players. Jordan has shown the attributes , in my opinion all he needs is to find his right position and possibly get a bigger set of balls to sometimes take the man on or take a shot. I have no doubt that he will be a beast and you can quote me on that.
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Offline unusg

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Re: Jordan Henderson
« Reply #1228 on: March 22, 2012, 05:04:52 pm »
Its an interesting debate as to how good he could be or not. If you compare the role he plays for the England U21s he plays central and makes a lot of short passes, much like Carrick who doesnt stand out for the Mancs but is a regular which i think is a closer comparison than the one with Xavi.

He is a longer term replacement for a post Gerrard midfield and was probably bought a year or two too soon.  He does look to be hiding in some games but he is young and under serious pressure to perform in a position he is not suited to and looks short of confidence expecting to be subbed at any time. but i would still have him ahead of Adam.

Offline GonzalezIsARed

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Re: Jordan Henderson
« Reply #1229 on: March 22, 2012, 05:10:38 pm »
Just sell him..... average player

ha ha

Offline redprodigal

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Re: Jordan Henderson
« Reply #1230 on: March 22, 2012, 05:18:38 pm »
ha ha

You're right, a stupid post. Don't know which is worse, that or comparing him to Xavi.

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Re: Jordan Henderson
« Reply #1231 on: March 22, 2012, 05:22:26 pm »
You're right, a stupid post. Don't know which is worse, that or comparing him to Xavi.

I think that some of the above posters are comparing him to a 20 / 21 year old Xavi, not the player we see week in week out today. He grew into a fantastic player - and what i believe if i'm not mistaken posters are highlighting a player with some very good attributes, but with much to learn.

If in 5 years time he becomes half the player Xavi has turned out to be he'll have done very well.

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Offline GonzalezIsARed

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Re: Jordan Henderson
« Reply #1232 on: March 22, 2012, 05:25:13 pm »
You're right, a stupid post. Don't know which is worse, that or comparing him to Xavi.

Tell you, Daws is right - our fan base has just become a complete embarrassement, its shameful.
Most of it on Twitter, which I'm tempted to get rid of.

Regards to comparing him to Xavi - that is the first thing which comes to mind 'oh shut the fuck up' but I understand where he is coming from, people expect so much - we said at the start of this season it would be a transitional season, seriously I'm not suprised we have had results not go our way, the draws at home, the odd shit away performance. It's going to take a long time to get back where we want to be.

Back to Henderson - he'll come good. I'm sure of it. Daws post is one of the best ones i've seen for a while.
« Last Edit: March 22, 2012, 05:30:06 pm by GonzalezIsARed »

Offline -Daws-

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Re: Jordan Henderson
« Reply #1233 on: March 22, 2012, 05:30:10 pm »
One of the best posts ive seen in a long time. Im glad others remember that it took Xavi years to mature. I remember he was nearly not picked for the spain 2006 world cup squad. Im sick of the desperation amongst us, the knee jerk shite. I want results just as much as the next man but even bloody City took 3-4 yeears to get to where they are now and they have a bottomless pit of oil. We have to patient with our team in the same way that we have to be patient with our players. Jordan has shown the attributes , in my opinion all he needs is to find his right position and possibly get a bigger set of balls to sometimes take the man on or take a shot. I have no doubt that he will be a beast and you can quote me on that.

Cheers mate.

The reason I make the Xavi comparision is because in terms of style, and their approach to the game, I feel they are more similar than Carrick and Henderson. For me Adam is a more a suiter of Carricks game, because they both like to sit deep in that 'quaterback" role and dictate the play from there by spreading the ball. Both are a poor mans Alonso, but both can have roles to play within the squad (you don't see Carrick start every game for the mancs, and we won't see Charlie get so much game time once all our midfielders are fit), and can be used for certain games, mainly ones where we might see less of the ball against good footballing sides.

Henderson is more of a pass and move footballer. He likes to take a touch or two if he has the time and draw defenders (well, opposition) towards him, which creates space for others, and then pop a short pass off and move beyond the defender to receive it back. This is akin to what Xavi has done throughout the years, and mastered it. It is a way of playing through the midfielder into the final third. Gerrard likes to smash through the door, Xavi likes to pick the lock, and Alonso would rather go round and use the side door, if you see what I'm saying?

I agree, he does need to gain some confidence and become a little more aggressive, but he is very talented. The whole situation rememinds me of Lucas four years ago where, because he wasn't smashing the door down and still learning his trade, he was disregarded by many on here and booed at Anfield. A minority of us however, could see a wonderful footballer who was still breaking out of his shell and needed the confidence and aggression to really push through the other side. Luckily, despite a lot of fans and the medias best efforts, Lucas had the mental capacity to do this on his own and with the help of a great manager. Henderson too, I'm sure will come good as Lucas did, as he has a great teacher and superb role models such as Stevie, but it would be nice if these young players could have the support and the patience from the fans too, in order to reach their potential, rather than having to have an 'I'll prove them wrong' attitude, because I feel Jordan is not quite as strong mentally as Lucas was, and if we start booing him, we could lose a quality player.

It's the fickleness that pisses me off. If we win and he plays well, then everything is hunkydorey, but when we loose, we look for scapegoats. I use the term 'we' loosely, because I for one can see a talent that needs to be nurtured and needs time. If he is afforded this by his manager and the fans, then maybe, just maybe, we can reap the rewards in the long run.
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Re: Jordan Henderson
« Reply #1234 on: March 22, 2012, 05:30:13 pm »
Great post. The only bit I'd slightly disagree with is the '...no outstanding qualities'. Someone else brought out one of those qualities as a criticism 'average in all areas' is how he put it - same was said of Lucas. A jack-of-all-trades is exactly what you want as a central midfielder, especially when, like Lucas too, Henderson seems to possess an outstanding football brain, and outstanding ability on the ball. It's very difficult to be consistently tidy and reliable, even under pressure, even when you're not necessarily playing that well. He's got the same mastery of all the basics that Lucas had and that in itself is an, perhaps even the, outstanding quality in any young player.
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Offline GonzalezIsARed

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Re: Jordan Henderson
« Reply #1235 on: March 22, 2012, 05:31:31 pm »
Its an interesting debate as to how good he could be or not. If you compare the role he plays for the England U21s he plays central and makes a lot of short passes, much like Carrick who doesnt stand out for the Mancs but is a regular which i think is a closer comparison than the one with Xavi.

He is a longer term replacement for a post Gerrard midfield and was probably bought a year or two too soon.  He does look to be hiding in some games but he is young and under serious pressure to perform in a position he is not suited to and looks short of confidence expecting to be subbed at any time. but i would still have him ahead of Adam.

See I don't agree with people when they say 'replacement for Gerrard' I don't think we can replace Steven Gerrard. For sure - we will move on as a football club, players all come and go and we will get much success without Steven Gerrard but I don't feel Hendo will replace him in that way like.

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Re: Jordan Henderson
« Reply #1236 on: March 22, 2012, 05:33:49 pm »
You're right, a stupid post. Don't know which is worse, that or comparing him to Xavi.

I'm comparing a 21 year old Xavi, to a 21 year old Henderson, their similarities in style and strengths and weaknesses at the same age. Of course he isn't the player Xavi is now, that would be fucking ridiculous.

Lucas was shite four years ago, I seem to remember. Right about that one too, weren't ya?
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Offline The Ghost of Titi Camara

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Re: Jordan Henderson
« Reply #1237 on: March 22, 2012, 05:33:49 pm »
For me, Jordan somewhat sums up the current Liverpool side, raw, incomplete, but with the basic attributes to be very successful given time and patience, something which unfortunately is rarely afford in football generally, not just on RAWK.

I agree that he may very well yet come good, although it's always impossible to tell. He seems to be the kind of character who requires a lot of hands-on management and specific instruction to gain and maintain confidence and needs to be plainly told what his role is and how to perform it (whereas other players his age are more instinctive). He may rise with a trajectory similar to that of Lucas; a gradual, steady progression that requires patience but results in an accomplished player.

However, I just don't see the elegant passer that others currently characterise him as. Elegant passers are spatially aware, see both simple passes and killer balls, can spread the play as well as serving as willing outballs when holding a lead and instinctively see and make triangles. That's not to say he won't one day be one, but at the moment, I don't understand what his function is or what he adds to the team, either on the right or in the middle. Perhaps that will change if he's beside Lucas in a central pairing. But I see no compelling reason bar his price tag why he's been one of the first names on the teamsheet week in, week out, during the entire season. As a very expensive gamble, he may or may not work out in the long-term. Players mature at different ages, we can't get every transfer right and despite our views on the fee and his being bought, there's some kind of basic ability he seems to have in training that can be developed. He's here, so let's put him to some kind of use based on an honest assessment of his strengths and weaknesses. But what would have been the harm in gradually bedding him in when, at the moment, he's quite clearly out of his depth on match days and seems totally overwhelmed every week? It does the team no good at all and diminishes his stature in all our eyes, piling more pressure on him (and he's clearly not the type who thrives in that situation).

Why is he in the first XI? What is he bringing to the table right now?
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Re: Jordan Henderson
« Reply #1238 on: March 22, 2012, 05:34:03 pm »
It is a way of playing through the midfielder into the final third. Gerrard likes to smash through the door, Xavi likes to pick the lock, and Alonso would rather go round and use the side door, if you see what I'm saying?
Lovely description.
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Re: Jordan Henderson
« Reply #1239 on: March 22, 2012, 05:35:13 pm »
Not Liverpool standard, is he?

Lets be honest. :butt
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