Topic: General West Ham thread

[rafathegaffa83]

I see Phil Blundell on Twitter saying the Paqueta gambling issue is ‘as bad as it gets - worse than Toney.’ (Slightly paraphrasing but that’s the gist of what he is saying).

Can anyone explain why that is?

Didn't all the bets take place on the island he's from and using accounts registered with West Ham's sponsor (Betway) who were the ones who flagged it

[Red-Soldier]

Paqueta was quality today.

He was.  Really good player.

[Ciara (with a capital "C")]

Didn't all the bets take place on the island he's from and using accounts registered with West Ham's sponsor (Betway) who were the ones who flagged it

I get that yeah, but how can they link that to Paqueta getting booked on purpose.

We all know he probably did. But how do you prove that? If it wasn’t him personally making the bets.

[Crosby Nick]

I see Phil Blundell on Twitter saying the Paqueta gambling issue is ‘as bad as it gets - worse than Toney.’ (Slightly paraphrasing but that’s the gist of what he is saying).

Can anyone explain why that is?

I know he has been getting bookings that people have been profiting off, but I thought the loop hole was that it would be hard to prove. Nearly impossible? And that’s why he isn’t banned now?

Really haven’t looked into it that much, nor heard any good summations.

Haven’t seen anything on it since the story broke but wasn’t his family placing big amounts on him getting booked and then there’s clear evidence of him picking up ridiculous bookings. Guess that directly impacts a game in. Toney was betting on anything and everything and I think bet on Brentford to lose, but in a game he wasn’t playing in.

[Bennett]

I thought West Ham were outstanding today to be honest. First half felt like the best away performance I've seen at Anfield for a while. Soucek, Paqueta and Alvarez in midfield is a pretty outstanding trio. Ward-Prowse is 100% better as a footballer than people give him credit for too. Much more than just free-kicks and corners. Very good.

[Ciara (with a capital "C")]

Haven’t seen anything on it since the story broke but wasn’t his family placing big amounts on him getting booked and then there’s clear evidence of him picking up ridiculous bookings. Guess that directly impacts a game in. Toney was betting on anything and everything and I think bet on Brentford to lose, but in a game he wasn’t playing in.

But without him physically making the bets himself, how can they prove those bookings were on purpose? I think that’s what I’m getting at but doing a shitty job explaining haha. Toney got caught placing bets himself.

Paqueta’s friends/family are betting - not him, but betting on games he is playing in. Is that allowed? And if it is, then the issue is Paqueta deliberately getting booked but how can they prove that?

Maybe they don’t need to prove it and they can just ban him on that alone? But the fact he is still playing feels like it’s not as cut and dry compared to Toney. 

[Sangria]

Paqueta was quality today.

I bet he'd be great for us.

[Crosby Nick]

But without him physically making the bets himself, how can they prove those bookings were on purpose? I think that’s what I’m getting at but doing a shitty job explaining haha. Toney got caught placing bets himself.

Paqueta’s friends/family are betting - not him, but betting on games he is playing in. Is that allowed? And if it is, then the issue is Paqueta deliberately getting booked but how can they prove that?

Maybe they don’t need to prove it and they can just ban him on that alone? But the fact he is still playing feels like it’s not as cut and dry compared to Toney. 

Toney did play on for a long time before getting his ban. That story broke around Christmas (I think) and he played almost all the rest of the season.

I don’t know the rules about family members being allowed to bet. Didn’t Sturridge get done for giving someone inside info on a transfer? Maybe it is hard to prove, maybe the City lawyers are just working away quietly behind the scenes! Although they’ve moved on with Nunes presumably.

[Stockholm Syndrome]

I see Phil Blundell on Twitter saying the Paqueta gambling issue is ‘as bad as it gets - worse than Toney.’ (Slightly paraphrasing but that’s the gist of what he is saying).

Can anyone explain why that is?

I know he has been getting bookings that people have been profiting off, but I thought the loop hole was that it would be hard to prove. Nearly impossible? And that’s why he isn’t banned now?

Really haven’t looked into it that much, nor heard any good summations.

I thought the reason he wasn't banned now was because these things take time for a tribunal and then time for a decision.

Like Toney was charged in November (just before the world cup started) didn't have a hearing until January (just after our game against Brentford) and wasn't banned until like May

Until he has the hearing and the verdict made I think he can continue to play.

[RedSince86]

I see Phil Blundell on Twitter saying the Paqueta gambling issue is ‘as bad as it gets - worse than Toney.’ (Slightly paraphrasing but that’s the gist of what he is saying).

Can anyone explain why that is?

I know he has been getting bookings that people have been profiting off, but I thought the loop hole was that it would be hard to prove. Nearly impossible? And that’s why he isn’t banned now?

Really haven’t looked into it that much, nor heard any good summations.

This Tweet was trending again just after the charges came out last month.

That day in march there was flurry of bets of Paqueta getting booked as well a Brazilian player in a Ligue 1 game that evening, i'm guessing some betters made lots of money on that double bet that is just so random and it caused some flashing lights at Betfair, especially if the actual bets all came from a specific island off Brazil (IP address i'm guessing) where his family are based.

[Ciara (with a capital "C")]

Ah ok, that’s a fair point you both make about Toney. Had forgotten he was still playing for ages with that hanging over him.

[Wabaloolah]

But without him physically making the bets himself, how can they prove those bookings were on purpose? I think that’s what I’m getting at but doing a shitty job explaining haha. Toney got caught placing bets himself.

Paqueta’s friends/family are betting - not him, but betting on games he is playing in. Is that allowed? And if it is, then the issue is Paqueta deliberately getting booked but how can they prove that?

Maybe they don’t need to prove it and they can just ban him on that alone? But the fact he is still playing feels like it’s not as cut and dry compared to Toney. 

he was odds on for a booking in one game wasn't he, it may be difficult to prove but I guess it's a tribunal not a court of law so the threshold might be lower

[WhereAngelsPlay]

he was odds on for a booking in one game wasn't he, it may be difficult to prove but I guess it's a tribunal not a court of law so the threshold might be lower

And the islanders were still lumping on him.

[LovelyCushionedHeader]

But without him physically making the bets himself, how can they prove those bookings were on purpose? I think that’s what I’m getting at but doing a shitty job explaining haha. Toney got caught placing bets himself.

Paqueta’s friends/family are betting - not him, but betting on games he is playing in. Is that allowed? And if it is, then the issue is Paqueta deliberately getting booked but how can they prove that?

Maybe they don’t need to prove it and they can just ban him on that alone? But the fact he is still playing feels like it’s not as cut and dry compared to Toney.

When Sturridge got caught, they seized his mobile phone and found texts. I imagine they can do the same in this case and I'm sure there will be a trail somewhere (if true). What he's accused of also isn't just against the laws of football but also illegal, so the police could get involved and gather such information too.

[DangerScouse]

https://twitter.com/WestHam_Central/status/1692613840926539901?t=GJtY5EsKMjGQ3SOpmAk07Q&s=08

https://twitter.com/xmonicamusic/status/1692623968203608540?t=81ojW2NGV_FHOLg9LgAIyw&s=08

Tackle in question above.

[Sangria]

I get that yeah, but how can they link that to Paqueta getting booked on purpose.

We all know he probably did. But how do you prove that? If it wasn’t him personally making the bets.

You can tell by watching how he runs. He doesn't put in the effort, but just gambols.

[Drinks Sangria]

What’s alleged is that Paqueta had direct contact with family members and friends of Paqueta island - where he gets his family name - I think it hinges on this proof or lack thereof. Sturridge was banned for a non-game affecting breach of info, and this does look bad for Paqueta. Leaks in Brazil allege that Betway and another UK bookie raised alarms when Rio De Janeiro IP addresses directly from Paqueta island we’re betting in flurries on markets with bookings, then internet activity linked to another area of mainland Brazil in which further suspicious bets were placed after clear contact from IP addresses located on the island.

They’ve set a precedent because he’ll have to be given a significantly worse ban than Toney.

A shame because he’s a phenomenal footballer, but you can’t do something match-affecting and quite clearly stupid in such a way. How they can prove the contact was there between Paqueta and the family is the difficult thing. He clearly has contact, but if they can’t directly prove it happened then what can they do?

[Stockholm Syndrome]

Yeah this is one of them where by if he gets banned, it has to be for years if not a permanent ban, because he is actively taken part in the action

I think back to Mutu who I believe got a 2 year ban for doing coke, I feel this would be a much harsher punishment than even that

I say it is a shame because he is quality, but if he is doing something like this he deserves it frankly, this isn't like Toney who is an addict, this is a concentrated effort towards a scam

[disgraced cake]

Fucking Clinton Antonio, there

[jckliew]

Fucking Clinton Antonio, there

Laugh at Antonio here.

LOL

[kavah]

Shame if he gets a ban. He’s a wonderful footballer.

Bowen is good too

[WhereAngelsPlay]

Shame if he gets a ban. He’s a wonderful footballer.

I hope the greedy twat gets 2years minimum. I could never trust somebody like that at our Club.

[LovelyCushionedHeader]

Is it okay to sing "we're Champions of Europe" after winning the Conference League?

[Son of Spion]

Is it okay to sing "we're Champions of Europe" after winning the Conference League?

Tell me they didn't really sing that. Please.

[bradders1011]

I think it's tongue in cheek. Nothing wrong with them celebrating the best thing that benighted club will ever do.

[Dim Glas]

Paqueta was quality today.

he’d have been another ready made star walking into that Abu Dhabi team, thankfully he did a dodgy bet thing 

Him and bowen are two very good players and showed it again yesterday.

[PhilV]

What’s alleged is that Paqueta had direct contact with family members and friends of Paqueta island - where he gets his family name - I think it hinges on this proof or lack thereof. Sturridge was banned for a non-game affecting breach of info, and this does look bad for Paqueta. Leaks in Brazil allege that Betway and another UK bookie raised alarms when Rio De Janeiro IP addresses directly from Paqueta island we’re betting in flurries on markets with bookings, then internet activity linked to another area of mainland Brazil in which further suspicious bets were placed after clear contact from IP addresses located on the island.

They’ve set a precedent because he’ll have to be given a significantly worse ban than Toney.

A shame because he’s a phenomenal footballer, but you can’t do something match-affecting and quite clearly stupid in such a way. How they can prove the contact was there between Paqueta and the family is the difficult thing. He clearly has contact, but if they can’t directly prove it happened then what can they do?

Just a quick correction there, his name is Lucas Tolentino Coelho de Lima, just a normal Portuguese name, his nickname is Paqueta, it is normal to nickname someone to the name where they are from if there is another person with same name, my cousin had it too in the Portuguese Navy.

But ya, Paqueta is not his family name.

Nothing to do with the charges or topic, just a tidbit for you haha.

[Lynndenberries]

Looking at their forum and seeing a few videos making the rounds, they really don’t hide their contempt for Salah. Not sure how anyone can say that wasn’t a penalty. It was about as stonewall as they come.

[LovelyCushionedHeader]

Looking at their forum and seeing a few videos making the rounds, they really don’t hide their contempt for Salah. Not sure how anyone can say that wasn’t a penalty. It was about as stonewall as they come.

Also claiming Mac Allister's challenge on Bowen was a penalty.

"You never get a penalty at Anfield" forgetting that they had a penalty at Anfield last fucking season.

[gerrardisgod]

Antonio back at it again, saying he won against us, even though they didn’t win because he got into our fans heads.

Buffoon.

[tubby]

Antonio back at it again, saying he won against us, even though they didn’t win because he got into our fans heads.

Buffoon.

Haha what.  You got a link for that?

[gerrardisgod]

Only seen it on a load of Liverpool related Twitter pages, assume he’s said it on his podcast (that he’s actually bothered to show up for this week).

There’s an Echo link actually… https://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/michail-antonio-breaks-silence-after-27841209

[tubby]

Ta.  Winning without winning?  I know a club who might be interested in him.

[So… Howard Philips]

Antonio back at it again, saying he won against us, even though they didn’t win because he got into our fans heads.

Buffoon.

He’s taking his lead from his manager, famous for winning without winning.

[thaddeus]

Current players doing podcasts about teams and players they're facing seems incredibly stupid.  That the two current protagonists - Antonio and Callum Wilson - themselves seem incredibly stupid and lacking in self awareness doesn't help.

I really hope not to be proven wrong but I don't see it being something Klopp or FSG would ever sanction.

[Flaccido Dongingo]

Current players doing podcasts about teams and players they're facing seems incredibly stupid.  That the two current protagonists - Antonio and Callum Wilson - themselves seem incredibly stupid and lacking in self awareness doesn't help.

I really hope not to be proven wrong but I don't see it being something Klopp or FSG would ever sanction.

Wilson is a complete imbecile.

[TheShanklyGates]

First English side to go 17 consecutive games in European competition without defeat after their win last night. Yes, a lot of them were in the 3rd tier Conference League, but it's still very impressive when so many mid table PL sides crash and burn in Europe. Moyes has done a very good job with this lot.

[Fromola]

First English side to go 17 consecutive games in European competition without defeat after their win last night. Yes, a lot of them were in the 3rd tier Conference League, but it's still very impressive when so many mid table PL sides crash and burn in Europe. Moyes has done a very good job with this lot.

I was very impressed with them at Anfield the other week. Moyes is a very good team builder, he's just tactically limited. Winning a trophy has given them confidence though.

They also reached the Europa League semi the year before, so it was odd that Brighton (in the toughest group and never played in Europe before) were 2nd favourites to win the Europa League. They had a bad league season but European exertions and the hangover from playing so many games the year before without a proper break (which we also suffered) didn't help.

Looking at the odds now they're still behind Brighton in the betting for the competition. Leverkusen and Roma have shot up though (and you'll get some big CL dropouts).

[Ciara (with a capital "C")]

How has JWP not made the England squad?

7 assists and 2 goals in his 9 games this season.

How are Phillips and Henderson getting in there ahead of him.

[[new username under construction]]

How has JWP not made the England squad?

7 assists and 2 goals in his 9 games this season.

How are Phillips and Henderson getting in there ahead of him.

Southgate, who my uncle met once by a river and described him to me as the most boring man he'd ever met