Topic: 70,000 seats my arse

[Alan_X]

55,000.

Stay at Anfield and expand.

More pies?...

[LiamG]

55,000.

Stay at Anfield and expand.

It's not gonna happen

[hoonin]

3    Barcelona            73,913    Camp Nou     

If that's accurate then Barca averaged around 25,000 EMPTY seats. Cant be right, can it?

[rednich85]

If that's accurate then Barca averaged around 25,000 EMPTY seats. Cant be right, can it?

Thats right mate.

Apart from the big games Barca dont sell out on a regular basis.

[LiamG]

and they are increasing there capacity 15,000 more to 113,000!!

[rednich85]

and they are increasing there capacity 15,000 more to 113,000!!

They'll fill it....I'd say about 5-7 times a season.

[redprodigal]

Part of the problem some people have is believing that they can't get a ticket so why bother trying.

Nice to see someone talking sense.

[redprodigal]

55,000.

Stay at Anfield and expand.

Oh yeah, that'll solve all our problems.

[hoonin]

Thats right mate.

Apart from the big games Barca dont sell out on a regular basis.

Wow.

There were a lot of empty seats in the upper sections when I went years ago, but surprised they only avg 74K. 'Only'

[redprodigal]

Anybody who even thinks about building a 70,000 plus capacity stadium will have guarantees that permission will be granted before they start the build. If it means upgrading the infrastructure then they will take into account the cost of this. So if permission is granted and they can afford the cost then they will go ahead. You do not need to guarantee a full house every week to justify a stadium this size. As it's been said, if we are a successful team (by that I mean challenging for honours up to the final stages of the two main competitions) then most weekend games will be full to capacity or very near. Even now, after we are out of the running for those two comps and have played shite boring football for most of the season, our weekend games have been sold out, and earlier in the season when we were still in contention for fourth place and still in the ECL the demand for tickets was huge and in a bigger stadium the tickets will become freely available to those who want to go. The difference in cost between having 60,000 and 70,000 capacity will surely soon be recuperated by the increased number of seats and corporate packages if we get investment in the team so I don't see what the issue is.

[LiamG]

But whats stupid about the yanks plans are they plan on leaving 1 stand half built until they have permission to build up to 73,000!

[redoneusa]

70,000 might work if they had plans on other potential uses I suppose. If we get things right on the pitch more people will come.

Now, whether or not its the 70,000 full capacity  every day game I doubt it. Especially with teams like Wolves and West Brom in the league.

[redprodigal]

But whats stupid about the yanks plans are they plan on leaving 1 stand half built until they have permission to build up to 73,000!

The plans showed the away end with only a small portion of the seats in, but the idea was that by the time the stadium was finished, the planning permission would have been granted for the larger capacity so this smaller capacity stadium would never actually happen. That, I think, was the idea they had.

[Alan_X]

The plans showed the away end with only a small portion of the seats in, but the idea was that by the time the stadium was finished, the planning permission would have been granted for the larger capacity so this smaller capacity stadium would never actually happen. That, I think, was the idea they had.

It's the idea but there are a whole host of reasons why we could end up with a joke of a stadium. It's been done that way because the American architects simply don't understand the way a "soccer" ground works.

[redprodigal]

It's the idea but there are a whole host of reasons why we could end up with a joke of a stadium. It's been done that way because the American architects simply don't understand the way a "soccer" ground works.

What do you mean by a joke of a stadium Alan?

[Alan_X]

Apart from the stands sloping down towards the away end, the fact that we could end up with a 3,000 seater "away" end. If you're going to phase a project for construction reasons and you know you have the planning consents and cash to build it then you accept that the stadium looks daft during construction.

If you phase a project because there is doubt over planning or finance, you make sure the first phase still makes sense if the next phase doesn't go ahead.

What we've got is a design that takes the first approach when in fact our situation is the second.

It's just bad project planning.

[redprodigal]

Apart from the stands sloping down towards the away end, the fact that we could end up with a 3,000 seater "away" end. If you're going to phase a project for construction reasons and you know you have the planning consents and cash to build it then you accept that the stadium looks daft during construction.

If you phase a project because there is doubt over planning or finance, you make sure the first phase still makes sense if the next phase doesn't go ahead.

What we've got is a design that takes the first approach when in fact our situation is the second.

It's just bad project planning.

Don't mind the stands sloping away from the Kop, but the rest I agree with.

[LiamG]

It's the idea but there are a whole host of reasons why we could end up with a joke of a stadium. It's been done that way because the American architects simply don't understand the way a "soccer" ground works.

check the other thread Alan

[Niru Red4ever]

55,000.

Stay at Anfield and expand.

Is it possible to rebuild a 60k seater at Anfield? Read in some thread that the club has bought houses - so its possible?

[blert596]

Apparently theres a design by an architect, that spoke with SOS at the Football Quarter, that says Anfield could be redeveloped with no reduction in capacity whilst it was done, and the architectural designs have been available. I'm not sure if it was for upgrading to 60,000 now, with  70,000 eventually.

[LiamG]

If that was the case then where are the plans?

[blert596]

If that was the case then where are the plans?

No idea. Maybe someone from SOS can dig them up. 

But I doubt/hope SOS wouldn't be calling up a bag of shite on a national sports radio debate if they didnt exist. I cant remember the guys name, but he didnt come across too well , not in a bad way, more of it sounded like he wasnt used to public speaking and seemed to be away in his own architectural world, instead of forcefully saying that there are existing feasible designs that allow Anfield to be expanded withouit losing existing capacity that have been overlooked/rejected/ignored.

[Stussy]

The trouble is that expanding Anfield's seats capacity is not the only thing that the club desires. It wants to expand the corporate boxes and hospitality suites and facilities by the power of X to match the mancs and Arsenal. That will be the great revenue generator for the new stadium.

[Red_Mist]

Apparently theres a design by an architect, that spoke with SOS at the Football Quarter, that says Anfield could be redeveloped with no reduction in capacity whilst it was done, and the architectural designs have been available. I'm not sure if it was for upgrading to 60,000 now, with  70,000 eventually.

Would be worth considering if it's a feasible plan.

Sorry if this has been answered before, but does anyone know roughly how many extra corporate boxes could be built in a redeveloped Main Stand/Anfield Rd end? The 'corporates revenue' issue is one of the valid arguments in favour of a new stadium (as is disruption during construction), but just wondering how big an issue it is. Surely demand for corporates could be met in a redeveloped Anfield? And if it can be done without disruption, and would be cheaper than a new stadium, and it meant us staying at our spiritual home, maybe it should at least be reconsidered.

[Stussy]

Didn't see this posted anywhere else, apologies if it has been. Just saw it on the Liverpool pages of skyscrapercity.com

A presentation by someone from the architects firm HKS about the new stadium design.

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/2dkc-nAclLg&amp;rel=0&amp;color1=0xb1b1b1&amp;color2=0xcfcfcf&amp;hl=en_US&amp;feature=player_embedded&amp;fs=1" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer" class="bbc_link bbc_flash_disabled new_win">http://www.youtube.com/v/2dkc-nAclLg&amp;rel=0&amp;color1=0xb1b1b1&amp;color2=0xcfcfcf&amp;hl=en_US&amp;feature=player_embedded&amp;fs=1</a>

[Terry de Niro]

Didn't see this posted anywhere else, apologies if it has been. Just saw it on the Liverpool pages of skyscrapercity.com

A presentation by someone from the architects firm HKS about the new stadium design.

Very interesting that. Thanks for posting.

[shanklyboy]

Didn't see this posted anywhere else, apologies if it has been. Just saw it on the Liverpool pages of skyscrapercity.com

A presentation by someone from the architects firm HKS about the new stadium design.

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/2dkc-nAclLg&amp;rel=0&amp;color1=0xb1b1b1&amp;color2=0xcfcfcf&amp;hl=en_US&amp;feature=player_embedded&amp;fs=1" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer" class="bbc_link bbc_flash_disabled new_win">http://www.youtube.com/v/2dkc-nAclLg&amp;rel=0&amp;color1=0xb1b1b1&amp;color2=0xcfcfcf&amp;hl=en_US&amp;feature=player_embedded&amp;fs=1</a>

Do you know when that presentation was Stussy?

[Alan_X]

If that was the case then where are the plans?

I emailed him and he won't release them. Seems they're his designs not SOS and aren't for public consumption:

Peter McGurk. The plans have been there from him a lot longer than SOS has. Obviously we can push it, but we have to respect his wishes.

[Stussy]

Do you know when that presentation was Stussy?

edited:

The video itself was posted on youtube 11 December 2009.

I googled his name and the college faculty which is at the start of the video and he gave a presentation at this University on December 8th 2009:

http://www.facebook.com/note.php?note_id=207345593328


So it looks to be about 6 months ago. The fella who uploaded the video is a Red and I guess you could enquire further to him:


http://www.youtube.com/user/anfieldroaduk


Here he is, Bryan Tubey, talking about the Dallas Cowboys stadium which he also designed.

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/Ek-pAosmfLg&amp;hl=en_GB&amp;fs=1" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer" class="bbc_link bbc_flash_disabled new_win">http://www.youtube.com/v/Ek-pAosmfLg&amp;hl=en_GB&amp;fs=1</a>

[shanklyboy]

The video itself was posted on youtube 11 December 2009.

I googled the name and institution he lectured at which is given at the start of the video and came up with this report of his presentation at the college which is only dated in the url as Spring 2008:





So it could be a full a couple of years back. I can only find one other trace of him giving a presentation at this University and that is from December 8th 2009:

http://www.facebook.com/note.php?note_id=207345593328


So its either two years ago or about 6 months ago. The fella who uploaded the video is a Red and I guess you could enquire further to him:


http://www.youtube.com/user/anfieldroaduk


Here he is, Bryan Tubey, talking about the Dallas Cowboys stadium which he also designed.

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/Ek-pAosmfLg&amp;hl=en_GB&amp;fs=1" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer" class="bbc_link bbc_flash_disabled new_win">http://www.youtube.com/v/Ek-pAosmfLg&amp;hl=en_GB&amp;fs=1</a>

Cheers mate.

Ever thought of opening The Stussy Detective Agency?

[Stussy]

They call me Phillip Marlowe on the mean streets where I come from Shanklyboy.

Amended my post though - the first article I quoted doesn't seem to have been a lecture, just an interview he gave, I only speed read it originally, so that is incorrect.

So it looks to certainly be from December 2009. Either something was brewing or he seems to have been as much in the loop as we are (ie clueless or was just bullshitted to by Hicks) when he says 'we're finally going to get our financing for Liverpool'

[Red_Mist]

Interesting video, thanks for finding & posting that.

[OLDIE]

Have to agree with Alan F. 

I cant see us having a full 70,000 ground week in week out. I have never been convinced by the argument that we have xyz thousands on the waiting list, so it naturally follows that they will take up the tickets.

The waiting list is probably full of dead people anyway and some of our season ticket holders are aged 90+.

Perhaps the novalty of the first year or two will have a massive effect, but when things settle down, I very much doubt that we will average 50,000.

I too remember the glory days, empty seats in the Kemlyn and main stand except for the big games, European attendances were a joke, how many time did we see whole sections empty ? The Kop was hardly ever totally full, and we were the best team around.

Can any historians tell me when we had a capacity of 56,000 how many times did we reach 56,000 ? and how many times did the average exceed 50,000.

I know there are loads more OTT's but when was the last time we actually had a full house ? what is the average now ?

70,000 we are deluded

[Roady]

then what do you want to build then? 55? Coz in my eyes thats just silly.I we are going to build a stadum surely we build it or 70k because i we are successul down the line it will get illed.And we dont want to be in the position of looking to increase the capacity of a newly built gound do we?

[OLDIE]

then what do you want to build then? 55? Coz in my eyes thats just silly.I we are going to build a stadum surely we build it or 70k because i we are successul down the line it will get illed.And we dont want to be in the position of looking to increase the capacity of a newly built gound do we?

Silly ? Not really, look at the economics in the game now, the ever increasing costs of going to the match, the dependence on Sky for revenue that the clibs have. Its a recipe for disaster, why have 70,000 with the additional debt and interests when you not going to fill it ? I think 60 is more than enough.

[west_london_red]

then what do you want to build then? 55? Coz in my eyes thats just silly.I we are going to build a stadum surely we build it or 70k because i we are successul down the line it will get illed.And we dont want to be in the position of looking to increase the capacity of a newly built gound do we?

While im more inclined to go for th 70,000 myself, it needs to be thought out sensibly.

What if we aint successful? What if we carry on as we are, fighting for 4th for the next 10 years? The top 4 doesnt change very often, and once your out its very hard to get back in, ask Leeds and Newcastle.

PS I think you need a new 'F' key on your keyboard.

[Brian Blessed]

While im more inclined to go for th 70,000 myself, it needs to be thought out sensibly.

What if we aint successful? What if we carry on as we are, fighting for 4th for the next 10 years? The top 4 doesnt change very often, and once your out its very hard to get back in, ask Leeds and Newcastle.

PS I think you need a new 'F' key on your keyboard.

He ucking does, doesn't he?

[Roady]

f! get in 

[redprodigal]

Have to agree with Alan F. 

I cant see us having a full 70,000 ground week in week out. I have never been convinced by the argument that we have xyz thousands on the waiting list, so it naturally follows that they will take up the tickets.

The waiting list is probably full of dead people anyway and some of our season ticket holders are aged 90+.

Perhaps the novalty of the first year or two will have a massive effect, but when things settle down, I very much doubt that we will average 50,000.

I too remember the glory days, empty seats in the Kemlyn and main stand except for the big games, European attendances were a joke, how many time did we see whole sections empty ? The Kop was hardly ever totally full, and we were the best team around.

Can any historians tell me when we had a capacity of 56,000 how many times did we reach 56,000 ? and how many times did the average exceed 50,000.

I know there are loads more OTT's but when was the last time we actually had a full house ? what is the average now ?

70,000 we are deluded

We won't fill the ground every week to capacity but we don't need to, and as for the glory days, we have many more OOT supporters now and many more OOC fans also. Did you ever see Irish, Scandanavians and people from Asia in the seventies and eighties in the numbers you see these days? Our support has grown immensely in the last 20 years and if we became successful again (which the correct investment would hopefully bring) you would see a much greater demand for tickets.

[west_london_red]

We won't fill the ground every week to capacity but we don't need to, and as for the glory days, we have many more OOT supporters now and many more OOC fans also. Did you ever see Irish, Scandanavians and people from Asia in the seventies and eighties in the numbers you see these days? Our support has grown immensely in the last 20 years and if we became successful again (which the correct investment would hopefully bring) you would see a much greater demand for tickets.

Agree with that totally. But not just OOTs and OOCs, what about women? How many women went to watch football in the 70's and 80'? Im sure it was a lot less then go now.