Topic: Lucas a cut above as trim inspires improved Liverpool FC form

[jckliew]

You need that slack to be taken up by the players supporting Torres- create movement and space, be more aware and generally play a more intelligent game- by which I mean, know when to drop deep and push on to support the various players around you.

Guess that means the backs have to become wingbacks more reffectively. Like what Insua showed today.

[woof]

Lucas seems to be reluctant to go forward in attack or maybe that's been Rafa's instructions but today he was pretty peripheral. He needs to will himself to take the game by the scruff of the neck. Gerrard seems to have lost his mojo so someone like Lucas needs to step up

[deadlybuzz]

No one expects Lucas and Masch (et al) to replace Alonso's 40 yard passes.

People are talking about how that gap between attack and defence will be filled- because we're finding it extremely hard when trying to move possession from our defenders to our attackers. The 2 big pre season games were massive telltale signs of what was coming, it happened against Tottenham, it happened against Villa and it'll probably happen against the next side we play who has the balls to stick players in midfield who isolate our defenders and Masch away from the others.

As mentioned in killer_heels other thread; pass and move. It's something that did not happen tonight. The forward thread-through balls to Gerrard from Lucas in the opening 10 minutes were pleasant to see but no one was moving with the ball which made things more difficult when Villa perked up and put pressure on us to pass sloppily.

Aquilani is not going to sit back in a deeper role with Masch and just place passes to the wings or to Gerrard, he's going to move with the ball and become apart of the attack. This is why I'm baffled that Lucas or Mascherano seemed reluctant to bring the ball forward more so than Gerrard, Kuyt or Benayoun were to retrieve it. They joined in an attack when it seemed Masch was positioned outside the box (and had a few attempts at goal) or Lucas was waiting for a set-piece in the box.

No one in midfield or from attack were in sync with eachother, they were far too apart from eachother as the game went on that if Alonso was on the pitch tonight, he might have been able to pull a few strings. One of Lucas or Masch need to carry the ball further forward (like Agger) to get the attack moving down the middle like a wave or an ambush.

A lot of things went wrong tonight but I felt that one is the big elephant in the room; the formation either needs to change or one of Lucas/Masch needs to get further up and join in with 4 upfront.

[gaztop08]

Why dont you all just get off Lucas,s back..he,s trying and just needs more time to gel.


Something like twenty fucking years to work out how to play in the premiership.

[kkhaku]

i love lucas and have been an ardent supporter of his ever since he joined, but it dawned on me today that he is only as good as the team performance. If players are moving well and and retaining possession he can be very effective. When players are fucking around and losing the ball on every occasion like today then he can't influence the game as much. He is not the type of player to go on a power run with the ball like a stevie or a torres, he is a player who will move the ball around creating space and chances for others.

WTF happened today, honestly?!?

Please go easy on this common sense stuff okay.

People want this young lad to shine when his game depends on those around him.

Torres and Gerrard had horrible games. In fact it I think it was Gerrard who gave away posession cheaply that lead to Lucas having to chase back and make that foul. Everyone forgot about that though. Torres also gave away the ball cheaply at the end of the half that lead to the contreversial corner where they went two up. When that corner came in, Torres was in front of Davies, Skrtel behind him. Both were quite tight on him, yet neither could win the ball or put Davies off enough to prevent a goal.

Lucas made a stupid mistake by heading the ball into his own net - no question there...but he didn't do much else wrong. Neither did Masch. Both gave away a few unnecassary fouls but that's part of the game - we had plenty of freekicks ourselves. We may have not generated enough chances today, but we did get the ball into that crowded final 3rd quite often - which is credit to Lucas. Everything that went through Kuyt and Torres broke down today. Gerrard wasn't much better although at least he managed to get quite a few shots away.

Gerrard and Torres have played horribly in 2 out of 3 matches. I know Torres gets a lot of dirty shite from defenders - but that doesn't make up for losing the ball countless times and not passing it off when there are 3 defenders around you. People are banging on about how we can't win the title with Lucas in the middle as he can't take the game by the scruff of the neck. How about winning the title when your two attacking superstars are completely nullified by mid-table defenses, and the two attacking wingers are unable to create anything?

[MidwestWool]

Why dont you all just get off Lucas,s back..he,s trying and just needs more time to gel.


Something like twenty fucking years to work out how to play in the Premier League.

Gerrard's been here long enough. Why the wank performance?

[Marko B]

Gerrard and Torres have played horribly in 2 out of 3 matches. I know Torres gets a lot of dirty shite from defenders - but that doesn't make up for losing the ball countless times and not passing it off when there are 3 defenders around you. People are banging on about how we can't win the title with Lucas in the middle as he can't take the game by the scruff of the neck. How about winning the title when your two attacking superstars are completely nullified by mid-table defenses, and the two attacking wingers are unable to create anything?

Is spot on.

You can't lay any blame on Lucas when the fact is that he is playing his role perfectly. It's not as though the ball isn't getting to our attacking players - it is and that's both his and Masche's job - the problem is that our attacking players (who we all know have the quality and who we do and should expect more of) can't seem to retain the ball for more than 2 touches. With this being the case we are always going to be open to quick counter attacks by being out of position. Personally I'm thankful for both Mache and Lucas' outstanding contributions here as were it not for them we may well have been seriously pumped on the counter. They both were excellent in both holding up and stifling these.

Our method of play is to retain the ball in our attacking third and keep possession until an opening appears but when we break down so quickly due mainly to Torres and Gerrard losing the ball where they really shouldn't be (Yossi was also as much to blame today as well with some shockingly wayward passing) then we have no chance to bring in our midfielders and defence when attempting to find those openings which is vital to us scoring through play. Voronin (lack of bottle in shying for a 50-50 aside) at least showed what both Gerrard and Torres should have been doing when he came on. Retain the pass, hold the ball for just enough so that our players can all position themselves and lay it off. Gerrard and Torres' seemingly sudden ineptitude at this is unacceptable. If I were Rafa I would be pulling my hair out right now.

But on the positive side at least these problems are stemming from our players who we know are far better and who we can expect to perform far better.

[Bugsy Siegel]

think besides johnson and pepe, lucas has been out best player so far this season

[Bennyo]

If anyone thinks Lucas put in an acceptable performance tonight they clearly weren't at the same game as I was this evening. I'm no Lucas-basher, but he was woeful tonight. His distribution, movement and awareness were all rubbish. In short, he gave away the ball far too much, picked the wrong pass far too often, didn't show enough when we were in possession, and shirked when it came to Villa's box when it was crying out of someone to pull the trigger.

He made one nice turn to get away from his man which all very attractive, but if my memory serves, he just used it to run straight into trouble and lose possession again.

[rafathegaffa83]

Torres and Gerrard had horrible games. In fact it I think it was Gerrard who gave away posession cheaply that lead to Lucas having to chase back and make that foul. Everyone forgot about that though. Torres also gave away the ball cheaply at the end of the half that lead to the contreversial corner where they went two up. When that corner came in, Torres was in front of Davies, Skrtel behind him. Both were quite tight on him, yet neither could win the ball or put Davies off enough to prevent a goal.

Lucas made a stupid mistake by heading the ball into his own net - no question there...but he didn't do much else wrong. Neither did Masch. Both gave away a few unnecassary fouls but that's part of the game - we had plenty of freekicks ourselves. We may have not generated enough chances today, but we did get the ball into that crowded final 3rd quite often - which is credit to Lucas. Everything that went through Kuyt and Torres broke down today. Gerrard wasn't much better although at least he managed to get quite a few shots away.

Gerrard and Torres have played horribly in 2 out of 3 matches. I know Torres gets a lot of dirty shite from defenders - but that doesn't make up for losing the ball countless times and not passing it off when there are 3 defenders around you. People are banging on about how we can't win the title with Lucas in the middle as he can't take the game by the scruff of the neck. How about winning the title when your two attacking superstars are completely nullified by mid-table defenses, and the two attacking wingers are unable to create anything?

Good post. And as far as the last sentence goes, we need our two fullbacks to add additional width to aid Lucas.

[woof]

If anyone thinks Lucas put in an acceptable performance tonight they clearly weren't at the same game as I was this evening. I'm no Lucas-basher, but he was woeful tonight. His distribution, movement and awareness were all rubbish. In short, he gave away the ball far too much, picked the wrong pass far too often, didn't show enough when we were in possession, and shirked when it came to Villa's box when it was crying out of someone to pull the trigger.

He made one nice turn to get away from his man which all very attractive, but if my memory serves, he just used it to run straight into trouble and lose possession again.

I think you got it wrong, mate. He did not play poorly. He didn't play very well either. He was being safe and so he looked to be peripheral in the game.

[Bugsy Siegel]

he has the best movement of any of our midfielders!!!!!

[mooks]

Please go easy on this common sense stuff okay.

People want this young lad to shine when his game depends on those around him.

Torres and Gerrard had horrible games. In fact it I think it was Gerrard who gave away posession cheaply that lead to Lucas having to chase back and make that foul. Everyone forgot about that though. Torres also gave away the ball cheaply at the end of the half that lead to the contreversial corner where they went two up. When that corner came in, Torres was in front of Davies, Skrtel behind him. Both were quite tight on him, yet neither could win the ball or put Davies off enough to prevent a goal.

Lucas made a stupid mistake by heading the ball into his own net - no question there...but he didn't do much else wrong. Neither did Masch. Both gave away a few unnecassary fouls but that's part of the game - we had plenty of freekicks ourselves. We may have not generated enough chances today, but we did get the ball into that crowded final 3rd quite often - which is credit to Lucas. Everything that went through Kuyt and Torres broke down today. Gerrard wasn't much better although at least he managed to get quite a few shots away.

Gerrard and Torres have played horribly in 2 out of 3 matches. I know Torres gets a lot of dirty shite from defenders - but that doesn't make up for losing the ball countless times and not passing it off when there are 3 defenders around you. People are banging on about how we can't win the title with Lucas in the middle as he can't take the game by the scruff of the neck. How about winning the title when your two attacking superstars are completely nullified by mid-table defenses, and the two attacking wingers are unable to create anything?

Agree completely

[mooks]

Is spot on.

You can't lay any blame on Lucas when the fact is that he is playing his role perfectly. It's not as though the ball isn't getting to our attacking players - it is and that's both his and Masche's job - the problem is that our attacking players (who we all know have the quality and who we do and should expect more of) can't seem to retain the ball for more than 2 touches. With this being the case we are always going to be open to quick counter attacks by being out of position. Personally I'm thankful for both Mache and Lucas' outstanding contributions here as were it not for them we may well have been seriously pumped on the counter. They both were excellent in both holding up and stifling these.

Our method of play is to retain the ball in our attacking third and keep possession until an opening appears but when we break down so quickly due mainly to Torres and Gerrard losing the ball where they really shouldn't be (Yossi was also as much to blame today as well with some shockingly wayward passing) then we have no chance to bring in our midfielders and defence when attempting to find those openings which is vital to us scoring through play. Voronin (lack of bottle in shying for a 50-50 aside) at least showed what both Gerrard and Torres should have been doing when he came on. Retain the pass, hold the ball for just enough so that our players can all position themselves and lay it off. Gerrard and Torres' seemingly sudden ineptitude at this is unacceptable. If I were Rafa I would be pulling my hair out right now.

But on the positive side at least these problems are stemming from our players who we know are far better and who we can expect to perform far better.

Right again

I avoided the 'Lucas' thread for a few hours and come on to find an outbreak of common sense.  Thank heavens for that.  And pray to the heavens you're right about Gerrard and Torres learning to play football again.

[kkhaku]

If anyone thinks Lucas put in an acceptable performance tonight they clearly weren't at the same game as I was this evening. I'm no Lucas-basher, but he was woeful tonight. His distribution, movement and awareness were all rubbish. In short, he gave away the ball far too much, picked the wrong pass far too often, didn't show enough when we were in possession, and shirked when it came to Villa's box when it was crying out of someone to pull the trigger.

He made one nice turn to get away from his man which all very attractive, but if my memory serves, he just used it to run straight into trouble and lose possession again.

I'd love to see the stats for his pass completion rate compared to the senior players.

[rafathegaffa83]

I'd love to see the stats for his pass completion rate compared to the senior players.

According to the Guardian's Chalkboards:

Against Aston Villa

Lucas: Passes Attempted: 35/Completed: 32. Percentage of Completion: 91%
Gerrard: Passes Attempted: 57/Completed: 41 Percentage of Completion: 71.9%
Mascherano: Attempted: 88/Completed: 78 Percentage of Completion: 88.6%
Kuyt: Attempted 37/Completed:30 Percentage of Completion: 81%
Benayoun: Attempted: 29: Completed 21: Percentage of Completion: 72.4%

Against Stoke:

Lucas: Attempted: 57/Completed: 53 Percentage of Completion: 92.9%
Gerrard: Attempted: 55/Completed: 37 Percentage of Completion: 67.2%
Kuyt: Attempted: 41/Completed: 29 Percentage of Completion: 70.7%
Mascherano: Attempted: 100/Completed: 95: Percentage of Completion: 95%
Benayoun: Attempted 41: Completed: 36 Percentage of Completion: 87.8%

Against Tottenham

Lucas: Attempted: 37/Completed: 36 Percentage of Completion: 97.2%
Gerrard: Attempted: 53/Completed: 36 Percentage of Completion: 67.9%
Kuyt: Attempted: 28/Completed: 22 Percentage of Completion: 78.5%
Mascherano: Attempted: 53/Completed: 48 Percentage of Completion: 90.5%
Babel: Attempted: 12/Completed: 10 Percentage of Completion: 83.3%

His pass completion ratio is exceptionally high. I think his main dilemma now is confidence. The fans get on his bag too easily when he makes the simplest of mistakes. I think he was more confident, he'd try more moves like that fabulous roulette or attempt more creative, long-range passes with a higher risk of failure, but a greater reward. The lad needs confidence and support from the stands. He's a good young player, he just needs people to vocally believe in him more.

[mooks]

Those are the Gerrard stats which pretty much confirm what we have observed this season.

How about the Torres stats?  I bet they're even worse.

[rafathegaffa83]

Those are the Gerrard stats which pretty much confirm what we have observed this season.

How about the Torres stats?  I bet they're even worse.

Not really.

Against Aston Villa

Passes Attempted: 17/Completed: 15 Pass-Completion Percentage: 88.2%
Shots: 5. On Target: 2. Goals: 1

Against Stoke

Passes Attempted: 12/Completed: 9 Pass Completion Percentage: 75%
Shots on Goal: 4 On Target: 2 Goals: 1

Against Tottenham:

Passses Attempted: 19/Completed: 15 Pass Completion Percentage: 78.9%
Shots: 1 On Target: 0 Goals: 0

[kkhaku]

If anyone thinks Lucas put in an acceptable performance tonight they clearly weren't at the same game as I was this evening. I'm no Lucas-basher, but he was woeful tonight. His distribution, movement and awareness were all rubbish. In short, he gave away the ball far too much, picked the wrong pass far too often, didn't show enough when we were in possession, and shirked when it came to Villa's box when it was crying out of someone to pull the trigger.

He made one nice turn to get away from his man which all very attractive, but if my memory serves, he just used it to run straight into trouble and lose possession again.

As the stats above tell you - he had the best pass completion rate of all our midfielders (including Stevie) in all 3 of our matches.

I agree he could've been better around the box though.

As for that nice turn you were talking about, he passed it off to Kuyt who quite stupidly tried to give it back to him when he was tightly marked by two defenders.

[kevmck]

i think lucas needs another haircut.. the haircut stolen from Top Gun is starting to piss me off.. maybe all that extra curly foofy hair is screwing him up

[mooks]

Not really.

Against Aston Villa

Against Stoke
Against Tottenham:

I guess what these stats don't tell you is the total number of times the player loses possession - that's where Torres has struggled the most.

[Marko B]

Those are the Gerrard stats which pretty much confirm what we have observed this season.

How about the Torres stats?  I bet they're even worse.

Thing with Torres is that he is losing the ball while in possession, getting it stripped off of him, rather than losing it by misplaced passing therefore those stats are more flattering than they perhaps should be. Stevie's stats probably the same. Yossi I don't remember losing the ball when in possession at all so his pass completion ratio is probably fairly reflective of the amount of turnovers of the ball he caused.

[Beninger]

Like has been said, Lucas gets the ball to the front 4 pretty consistently...so does Masch.  He hardly ever puts forth a bad pass.  Keeping the ball moving is as important as anything on the pitch.  He may not be putting forth very many killer passes, but I didn't see the front 4 doing too much of that either in our 2 losses.  I can't think of the last time I saw him put someone in a bad position with one of his passes so that they lose the ball.  I saw plenty of our front 4 with possession this evening...and it wasn't because it was hoofed up to them.  What they do with that possession isn't really Lucas' fault.

[Stevie-G]

Good to see the majority of posts here are constructive. The posts declaring Lucas to not be good enough for Liverpool are laughable, however. Just days ago he was one of the MOTM in the Stoke game, now all of a sudden an own goal has given the doubters the opportunity to poke there heads once again.

Those criticizing his slow reactions when the ball hit him for the own goal, should at least attempt to remember a certain own goal against Middlesborough, last season, scored by the man who Lucas will supposedly 'always shadow'.

[Crackerjack Sam]

He's neat and tidy with his passing and slowly developing his game. Must keep my eye on him

[TSC]

As the stats above tell you - he had the best pass completion rate of all our midfielders (including Stevie) in all 3 of our matches.
 

Stats and stats and stats and stats.

Problem is how many of the 92% completed were creative penetrating incisive leading to goal scoring opportunities compared to 10 yarders square or back to the safety of defence?

I don't think any led to a goal scoring opportunity.  In fact I can't think of many from last season either.

That's the problem - no creativity post Alonso from the middle.  Lucas and Masch distribution wise are too similar. 

And if you don't have the penetrative creative ability of alonso, well then get in the box at least when the ball's out wide.  Don't hover in the safety zone 15 yards outside it.  Take responsibility - how many years has he been with us, and he's still a 'prospect'?

[MaschHead]

I only have seen the first half yesterday, but did anyone see the real problem? Nearly every time Lucas got the ball he looked up to pass it forward, except no one was really moving and/or willing to get the ball, that's what shocked me most.

[Marko B]

Stats and stats and stats and stats.

Problem is how many of the 92% completed were creative penetrating incisive leading to goal scoring opportunities compared to 10 yarders square or back to the safety of defence?

I don't think any led to a goal scoring opportunity.  In fact I can't think of many from last season either.

That's the problem - no creativity post Alonso from the middle.  Lucas and Masch distribution wise are too similar. 

And if you don't have the penetrative creative ability of alonso, well then get in the box at least when the ball's out wide.  Don't hover in the safety zone 15 yards outside it.  Take responsibility - how many years has he been with us, and he's still a 'prospect'?

If they are the passes you are referring to then how many direct assists did Xabi or Masche have last season, Xabi in particular?

That's not the role of our central midfield in attack nor was it last year therefore using it as a stick to beat Lucas with and praise Xabi is ill-conceived and just plain wrong.

The passes our midfield are responsible for are to take the ball from defence and provide good service to our attack, once that phase is complete then to provide passing options for our attackers as we probe for openings. Balls from our midfield leading to goal scoring opportunities are a rare bonus generally occurring on a quick counter attack as has been the case over the last 2 years.

[TSC]

If they are the passes you are referring to then how many direct assists did Xabi or Masche have last season, Xabi in particular?

That's not the role of our central midfield in attack nor was it last year therefore using it as a stick to beat Lucas with and praise Xabi is ill-conceived and just plain wrong.

The passes our midfield are responsible for are to take the ball from defence and provide good service to our attack, once that phase is complete then to provide passing options for our attackers as we probe for openings. Balls from our midfield leading to goal scoring opportunities are a rare bonus generally occurring on a quick counter attack as has been the case over the last 2 years.

Alonso can ping a ball 40 yrds to a player in space - could spot someone out wide from the side of his eye.  Neither masch or Lucas can do that and to be fair not many footballers in general have that ability.

My point is that Lucas is a generally neat and tidy player in midfield.  But he's basically Masch with less aggression.  You don't need two of those types of players, esp at home when we're looking to create.

Lucas has been described as 'box-to-box' midfielder.  Well he's not, 'cos he never gets into the opponents box.

Maybe the new guy when he gets off his sick bed can make a difference.   

[row25seat38]

He's shit. Anyone who thinks he will succeed in a red shirt and can take us to places where we want to go knows fuck all about football. Absolute bollocks.

It's as if droves of supporters have become disciples of that bellend Paul Tomkins. Fucks sake, if he says Voronin had a good season in Germany and can make a difference everyone believes it. Do you think Deggan is half decent as well?

Where have people's brains and eyes gone. That thread about Ryan Babel's development. Cut the long story short, he's shit as well. I wonder if I start banging books out year on year, with words like dynasty and bastion and other such bollocks, telling supporters what they want to hear, if I'll make a few quid on those soft enough to buy and believe it. Wake up people ffs.

[xavidub]

Alonso can ping a ball 40 yrds to a player in space - could spot someone out wide from the side of his eye.  Neither masch or Lucas can do that and to be fair not many footballers in general have that ability.

My point is that Lucas is a generally neat and tidy player in midfield.  But he's basically Masch with less aggression.  You don't need two of those types of players, esp at home when we're looking to create.

Lucas has been described as 'box-to-box' midfielder.  Well he's not, 'cos he never gets into the opponents box.

Maybe the new guy when he gets off his sick bed can make a difference.   

Is true. Lucas should be given a more forward role or dropped as we already have Masch for DM play. I think Lucas is ok and has some potential but I don't believe for a minute that Rafa would be playing him if we had a proper transfer budget.

[Zverko]

He's shit. Anyone who thinks he will succeed in a red shirt and can take us to places where we want to go knows fuck all about football. Absolute bollocks.

It's as if droves of supporters have become disciples of that bellend Paul Tomkins. Fucks sake, if he says Voronin had a good season in Germany and can make a difference everyone believes it. Do you think Deggan is half decent as well?

Where have people's brains and eyes gone. That thread about Ryan Babel's development. Cut the long story short, he's shit as well. I wonder if I start banging books out year on year, with words like dynasty and bastion and other such bollocks, telling supporters what they want to hear, if I'll make a few quid on those soft enough to buy and believe it. Wake up people ffs.

You really do have a problem, don't you?

[abhred]

How many times did he find Yossi and Gerrard with a pass in space, but they just lost the ball. Even 9 out 10 passes Xabi made was just to keep the ball moving.

He's the usual scapegoat, along with Voronin (who created our goal), but the real blame should lie on our set pieces, and our attackers inability to keep the ball.

[Marko B]

Alonso can ping a ball 40 yrds to a player in space - could spot someone out wide from the side of his eye.  Neither masch or Lucas can do that and to be fair not many footballers in general have that ability.

My point is that Lucas is a generally neat and tidy player in midfield.  But he's basically Masch with less aggression.  You don't need two of those types of players, esp at home when we're looking to create.

Lucas has been described as 'box-to-box' midfielder.  Well he's not, 'cos he never gets into the opponents box.

Maybe the new guy when he gets off his sick bed can make a difference.   

I don't really care, those long passes more often than not led to nothing and as good as they looked I am glad they are gone. Long balls is not how we play.

The point is 'creation' isn't the role of our central midfield and despite the commonly held belief, Xabi wasn't for the most part creative, he simply held the ball and distributed. The same role Lucas has been playing in leading up to the ball passing on to our attackers and the same role he would be playing had our attackers retained the ball until we were positioned before looking to attack after setting up.

He's the usual scapegoat, along with Voronin (who created our goal), but the real blame should lie on our set pieces, and our attackers inability to keep the ball.

[scatman]

ah the usual scapegoat.

did his job to a tee, it's suprising how we had 4 times as many chances yet scored 3 times less then the opposition, hmm i wonder who's to blame.

OHHHHH must be the central midfielders mascherano and lucas, i mean they got the ball up to the strikers so many times and we still didnt score.

Oh how shit those midfielders are, they couldnt even make our strikers convert their chances.

Listen to yourselves fools.

[mybacklight]

Rafa is putting Lucas in trouble straight away by playing him!
He hasn't got the quality required for a strong central midfield role.

I have watched him for a long time now. Lucas trys bless him, but we will not win anything with lucas in a strong role in the central midfield. He is negative, no ball control, not aware of his surroundings, slow reactions, scared of taking the ball forward, passing is woefull plus against stronger opposition we have no chance with him. We need to get Gerrard back in the center with mash.  The foundation of any great team.
 
Anyone who thinks lucas has quality needs to go to specsavers. QUICKLY!


 

[kopk1w1]

Agree with most here this morning.

Fault was in attack and defence, end of story.

We have players that have been to the very top of the game - Champions League finals, European National Finals, won trophies at their various clubs, yet we can't score from chances or defend set pieces.

People that get the big bucks get the big responsibility, not the young lads making it in the game.

[TSC]

I don't really care, those long passes more often than not led to nothing and as good as they looked I am glad they are gone. Long balls is not how we play.

The point is 'creation' isn't the role of our central midfield and despite the commonly held belief, Xabi wasn't for the most part creative, he simply held the ball and distributed. The same role Lucas has been playing in leading up to the ball passing on to our attackers and the same role he would be playing had our attackers retained the ball until we were positioned before looking to attack after setting up.

It doesn't matter that you don't 'care' - you're only a fan like the rest of us anyway.  'Long passes' led to nought?  Long balls isn't how we play?  Who mentioned long balls?  I said 40 yard pinpoint passes was what Alonso offered - not 100 yard/100 ft high hoofs to no-one in particular.

There's a reason he runs the game from centre of midfield for the Spanish.  There's a reason Real paid £30m for him, and it wasn't based on 'long ball' football.

Anyway he's gone now.  My point was there's a lack of creativity now in midfield, and then ...

'Creation' isn't the role of midfield?

Feck it mate, I give up.  Enjoy the season.

[abhred]

It doesn't matter that you don't 'care' - you're only a fan like the rest of us anyway.  'Long passes' led to nought?  Long balls isn't how we play?  Who mentioned long balls?  I said 40 yard pinpoint passes was what Alonso offered - not 100 yard/100 ft high hoofs to no-one in particular.

There's a reason he runs the game from centre of midfield for the Spanish.  There's a reason Real paid £30m for him, and it wasn't based on 'long ball' football.

Anyway he's gone now.  My point was there's a lack of creativity now in midfield, and then ...

'Creation' isn't the role of midfield?

Feck it mate, I give up.  Enjoy the season.

How many clear cut chances did Alonso create. He job was to keep possession, give tempo to our game, and give the to our attackers in dangerous positions. He's arguably the world's best at that.

Lucas can't control a game like that, but he did get the ball to Gerrard, Benayoun, Torres and Kuyt on enough occassions. However, they just seemed inept at keeping possession.

[Adeemo]

Rafa is putting Lucas in trouble straight away by playing him!
He hasn't got the quality required for a strong central midfield role.

I have watched him for a long time now. Lucas trys bless him, but we will not win anything with lucas in a strong role in the central midfield. He is negative,no ball control, not aware of his surroundings, slow reactions, scared of taking the ball forward, passing is woefull plus against stronger opposition we have no chance with him. We need to get Gerrard back in the center with mash.  The foundation of any great team.
 
Anyone who thinks lucas has quality needs to go to specsavers. QUICKLY!


 

If you truly believe he has no ball control then I think it's you that needs to get your eyes tested. Very early on in the match last night he produced the best piece of control I've seen for a very long while. The ball was fired towards him on the edge of the box and he completely took all the pace out of the ball and pinged it to a red shirt all with one touch. It was a truly sublime 1st time pass.