Topic: Everton's stadium problems

[AndoNagasaki]

Growler, I think you should be in charge of all new plans for the stadium.

[Anthony]

Ever since these reports of interest in taking over Everton one thing has worried me.

If they were taken over by a megarich owner is there any possibility they could gazump us and hijack the Stanley Park development?

[StormyDog]

Looking at it purely practically, without bringing any other emotive issues into the equation, it does make the most sense of any option taking into account that neither club appears to have the money for a new stadium.

Of course I'm not suggesting for 1 minute I would want a shared stadium.

How can the ground staff keep the pitch in tip top shape if their are games every few days ?

[mikeb58]

Ever since these reports of interest in taking over Everton one thing has worried me.

If they were taken over by a megarich owner is there any possibility they could gazump us and hijack the Stanley Park development?

Not sure what our legal right ( if any ) is to hold on to the land without actually doing anything on it.

I assume there must be some sort of timescale before we're told by the council, either get the thing built or we'll hand over the area to someone who can guarantee a construction start date.

Must say,you couldn't really them if they lose patience with LFC, and give us that ultimatum. I mean, we have had about 3 lots of planning permission given since this project begun, and so far all we've produced is countless promises that have never come to fruition.

Anyway,an interesting point,and would love to hear a responce from anybody that knows more about this scenario.

[Valore]

Can't imagine it. Imagine the announcers.

"Well its another heated European night of passion here at Liverpool's Stanley Park Stadium, where local rivals Everton FC also play..."

Well if that didn't spoil the whole fucking thing. Fuck off. Having that load of shite soil our pitch a few times a season is bad enough. Can't imagine them over week in and out. Its like having to put up with your mother in law for the weekend. Imagine if she fucking moved in. Fucking buy some strychnine.

[Anfieldite]

How can the ground staff keep the pitch in tip top shape if their are games every few days ?

Everton play the long ball game so the middle of the pitch will be fine

[i_wun_bite]

how about if we own the stadium and they share the stadium with us through renting? Would that work?

[shanklyboy]

The problem with efc's stadium is that efc play there.

[HarryLabrador]

Everton winning race for new 50,000-seater stadium in Kirkby

By Joe Bernstein Last updated at 8:21 PM on 29th November 2008

Everton enter a critical week in the club's history confident they will be playing in a new home before Liverpool if plans for a 50,000-seat stadium in Kirkby are approved.

Acting chief executive Robert Elstone is due to address a public inquiry into his club's proposed move this week and his arguments could go a long way to persuading Government inspectors to recommend it to Communities Secretary Hazel Blears. She is due to make the final decision early next year (this will of course be delivered in Spanish by Ms Blears, proving MPs expenses are very well spent  )

Everton believe they can stage Premier League football at a new home in 2011, at least 12 months before Liverpool can move into their proposed stadium at Stanley Park if American owners George Gillett and Tom Hicks are still able to finance a move. 


Homing in: The new proposed stadium in Kirkby could be in sight for Everton

Elstone will tell the inquiry that the Tesco-backed project is Everton's only hope of being able to leave Goodison Park and so compete with the biggest clubs in the Premier League.

He said: 'If we get planning approval through the inquiry, we are ready to start work. And if we start work, we are pretty confident we will get in for 2011. We are not racing anybody. All we are interested in is Everton Football Club.'

Everton see the £120million stadium as the centrepiece of a £400m retail centre.
Chairman Bill Kenwright's plan to sell is on hold until he knows if the club are moving, while manager David Moyes is unlikely to have transfer funds to spend in January.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-1090531/Everton-winning-race-new-50-000-seater-stadium-Kirkby.html

[TSC]

It's in all our interests this gets the green light.

[HarryLabrador]

It's in all our interests this gets the green light.

Precisely.

[Football CRAZY]

I think alot of the Everton die hards are going to get egg on their faces sooner or later with this, I can see it passing going ahead from what I've been hearing. Can't wait either, even though I think a groundshare will never happen I don't want the subject on the table either as it makes me extremely nervous. I don't even care if they are playing in a new ground sooner than us either. The fact that ground would be in Kirkby takes away and bragging rights that they would have + obviously it suits our stadium intrests for them to have this approved.

[Tony Kelly]

No way will Kirkby happen.

[spionkop76]

No way will Kirkby happen.

Because you fancy groundshare? I'll be extremely glad if they bastard can fcuk off to Kirkby.

[mikeb58]

No way will Kirkby happen.

Why ?

For your own sakes the move should go ahead. Tesco will be your only saviour, groundshare is never going to happen and the pit is all but falling down and probably crawling with woodworm.

[adamreadthis]

I was at the inquiry today (I'm a Kirkby resident) and it was a VERY GOOD day for Everton FC and Tesco. Basically their opponents be it Liverpool City Council or Keep Everton In Our City had no alternatives on offer, Everton FC meanwhile had their experts on hand to rebutt the weak questioning.

Also, the inspector cant help but have noticed the very grim, grey, rundown nature of our town centre - its just crying out "RE-GENERATE MEEEEE!!!!!".

[mikeb58]

I was at the inquiry today (I'm a Kirkby resident) and it was a VERY GOOD day for Everton FC and Tesco. Basically their opponents be it Liverpool City Council or Keep Everton In Our City had no alternatives on offer, Everton FC meanwhile had their experts on hand to rebutt the weak questioning.

Also, the inspector cant help but have noticed the very grim, grey, rundown nature of our town centre - its just crying out "RE-GENERATE MEEEEE!!!!!".

How do the Kirby residents feel about this move in general, it's one big decision to have a big footy stadium on your doorstep.

Plus once it's up, it's up for good.

Are the Tesco big wigs confident it'll go ahead, I take it Tesco have some very powerful, influential people behind them.

[Something Else]

cant see a joint stadium working, although some blues may want it i think the majority deep down dont want it as much as us.

As for their stadium I hope they get this one in Kirby to be honest

[adamreadthis]

How do the Kirby residents feel about this move in general, it's one big decision to have a big footy stadium on your doorstep.

Plus once it's up, it's up for good.

Are the Tesco big wigs confident it'll go ahead, I take it Tesco have some very powerful, influential people behind them.

Most people arnt arsed either way, there doesnt seem to be any great opposition here, personally i'll be made up when they come. When you hear of Tesco's Leahy and Evertonian Culture Secretary Mr.Burnham laughing and joking with each other at the Convention centre recently i'm even more confident.

[Istanbul, 2005]

sent them off to krikby!!

[Benimar Col]

Are they going to put groundshare back on the agenda now that Everton look like messing up their new stadium?

unfortunately the vultures are circling again over a shared stadium, lets hope the new owners dispell this once and for all and get the bulldozers into Stanlet Park early 2011

[Benimar Col]

well if Liverpool are set to announce a redevelopment of Anfield ?

we could find ourselves gazumpted with building additional facilities on Stanley Park bringing further revenue,  they could take the prime spot and instead of being land locked find themselves in an affluent area with council agreement ?   

[xerxes1]

well if Liverpool are set to announce a redevelopment of Anfield ? we could find ourselves gazumpted with building additional facilities on Stanley Park bringing further revenue,  they could take the prime spot and instead of being land locked find themselves in an affluent area with council agreement ?   

It's an interesting scenario.

Stanley Park is owned by the Council, not us. We simply have a planning consent which is due to lapse in a few months. SP was being offered to us on a lease which it was rumoured was going to be around £300,000 pa. We have not taken up that lease.

As of now, it appears that Everton do not have the money to move to SP themselves and redevelop Goodison as a "Goodison Plaza". It is true that new ownership could change that. It is also most likely that Everton would apply for a smaller (50k) stadium (with the potential to increase in the unlikely event that would be necessary in the future) which would be cheaper to build.

A New Goodison on SP would be able to soak up the lucrative conference/external event market if a redeveloped Anfield could not match what was on offer. OT/The Emirates currently average hosting one non-football related event per day.

This speculation is marginal, insofar as Everton have strangely failed to attract much interest from outside investors in any shape or form. A significantly redeveloped Anfield which did offer state of the art conference/event facilities could be built just as quickly as Everton could build a New Goodison, and I think that it would be highly unlikely that they would want to race to complete rival facilities for the same market.

But if there was a modest Anfield revamp only, then it is true to say that for an investor that had the money ( and there is no-one apparantly around at the moment) an opportunity does exist for them to front Everton seizing the opportunity we had passed on.

[Trousers]

If Liverpool stay at Anfield, then Stanley Park is a moot point as Everton will simply not be allowed to build on it.

[18 yard line]

If Liverpool stay at Anfield, then Stanley Park is a moot point as Everton will simply not be allowed to build on it.

Why not mate?  I'd have thought the Council would find it difficult to justify rejecting an application similar to ours if we decided not to take up the option.?

[Trousers]

Why not mate?  I'd have thought the Council would find it difficult to justify rejecting an application similar to ours if we decided not to take up the option.?

Because Anfield will only be yards away. The opposition to moving Everton to our side of Stanley Park would be overwhelming.
The area can just about sustain one 44,000 seat stadium and it's going to have even more difficulty with a 61,000 let alone with another 50,000 stadium right on its doorstep.

[xerxes1]

Because Anfield will only be yards away. The opposition to moving Everton to our side of Stanley Park would be overwhelming.
The area can just about sustain one 44,000 seat stadium and it's going to have even more difficulty with a 61,000 let alone with another 50,000 stadium right on its doorstep.

There is no planning reason why Everton could not build on the current consented site, although a new application will almost certainly be required.

The proximity of Goodison to Anfield now means that having it even closer makes no material difference. In fact it could help with overflow facilities.

[Trousers]

There is no planning reason why Everton could not build on the current consented site, although a new application will almost certainly be required.

The proximity of Goodison to Anfield now means that having it even closer makes no material difference. In fact it could help with overflow facilities.

It actually does.
Because I live in Anfield, off Priory Road to be exact and the difference between match days is night & day.
There's just no way the area can sustain both grounds, nor would local residents accept another new stadium.
Planning permission for a stadium on Stanley Park is one thing. Planning permission for a 50,000 all seater stadium on Stanley Park 50 yards away from another 61,000 all seater stadium is something else entirely.
Even if it got past local planning, which it wouldn't, the government would throw it out themselves.

[xerxes1]

It actually does. Because I live in Anfield, off Priory Road to be exact and the difference between match days is night & day.
There's just no way the area can sustain both grounds, nor would local residents accept another new stadium.
Planning permission for a stadium on Stanley Park is one thing. Planning permission for a 50,000 all seater stadium on Stanley Park 50 yards away from another 61,000 all seater stadium is something else entirely.
Even if it got past local planning, which it wouldn't, the government would throw it out themselves.

There is a difference between what you as a resident may like or prefer, and what may or may not be granted planning permission.

On what basis would a consent be thrown out on appeal or judicial review?

One of the associated benefits of New Anfield was the development of Anfield Plaza. If Everton took SP, Goodison Plaza would offer the employment and regeneration benefits to the area instead.

I wholly understand why personally it may be a minus for you. But there is no planning reason why not, and the area would benefit significantly more than if Anfield alone is just subject to modest redevelopment.

[Trousers]

There is a difference between what you as a resident may like or prefer, and what may or may not be granted planning permission.

On what basis would a consent be thrown out on appeal or judicial review?

One of the associated benefits of New Anfield was the development of Anfield Plaza. If Everton took SP, Goodison Plaza would offer the employment and regeneration benefits to the area instead.

I wholly understand why personally it may be a minus for you. But there is no planning reason why not, and the area would benefit significantly more than if Anfield alone is just subject to modest redevelopment.

At what cost though?
And the planning reason for rejection is sound, that there is already a stadium 50 yards away.
Are you seriously saying that if Everton were in Anfield and we'd applied for permission to build in Stanley Park it would have been granted?
When Liverpool applied for Stanley Park, we'd already rejected Kings dock and Everton were all set to get that site.
That's what you have to remember that when it was granted to us the understanding was that Everton would be leaving the area.

[xerxes1]

At what cost though?
And the planning reason for rejection is sound, that there is already a stadium 50 yards away.
Are you seriously saying that if Everton were in Anfield and we'd applied for permission to build in Stanley Park it would have been granted?
When Liverpool applied for Stanley Park, we'd already rejected Kings dock and Everton were all set to get that site.
That's what you have to remember that when it was granted to us the understanding was that Everton would be leaving the area.

Trousers, I am giving you a planning view, I understand your concerns as a near resident. The "cost" may well be regarded as a significant net benefit in jobs and income to the area.

That there is another stadium 50 yards away is not in itself a reason for refusal. The fact that their current ground is nearby ironically is a plus, as it demonstrates that the infrastructure can cope - which it can.

I do not believe that the consent for SP was dependent on Everton moving away.

The good news is that unless Everton are sold, there is no chance of this even being considered, and no-one has wanted the b****** so far!

[18 yard line]

Xerxes - is there any reason why, if we opt not to build at SP, that Everton couldn't get Planning Permission across the Park, ie adjacent to Goodison which would at least maintain the current distance between the 2 stadiums?   Apologies if there is an obvious answer but I'm an OOTer restricted to 2 or 3 visits per season!

And while I love Anfield, been going since the late seventies, I think we need to transplant our memories and our glorious history to a new Anfield to allow us to compete for the next 50 years.       

[babraham]

I think we need to transplant our memories and our glorious history to a new Anfield to allow us to compete for the next 50 100 years.       

Fixed.

But I agree.

[Alan_X]

Xerxes - is there any reason why, if we opt not to build at SP, that Everton couldn't get Planning Permission across the Park, ie adjacent to Goodison which would at least maintain the current distance between the 2 stadiums?   Apologies if there is an obvious answer but I'm an OOTer restricted to 2 or 3 visits per season!

And while I love Anfield, been going since the late seventies, I think we need to transplant our memories and our glorious history to a new Anfield to allow us to compete for the next 50 years.       

The area of the park nearest us directly across the Anfield Road is of lesser quality than the area adjacent to Goodison and it's unlikely that a major development would be allowed there.

[xerxes1]

The area of the park nearest us directly across the Anfield Road is of lesser quality than the area adjacent to Goodison and it's unlikely that a major development would be allowed there.

I agree.

I also re-iterate that unless Everton find a new, rich, owner. Nothing is likley to happen from the Everton end.

The unknown is whether a new owner may come in for Everton if they feel that FSG have squandered the SP oportunity/ can't afford it by looking to modestly redevelop Anfield only.

A new Everton owner would not want to go head to head with a redeveloped Anfield that boasted state of the art Hospitality/ conference facilities - if its a fudged cut-price job, they might.

[paul j]

The area of the park nearest us directly across the Anfield Road is of lesser quality than the area adjacent to Goodison and it's unlikely that a major development would be allowed there.

another reason that the park adjacent to goodison wouldn't get the go ahead for development is tha,t area has just had alot of money spent on it including doing up the lake and bridge.

[18 yard line]

Thanks for the info lads 

[MrGrumpy]

I just saw an advert for Ronseal on TV. Is this the answer to Evertons problems?

[loveisreal]

I just saw an advert for Ronseal on TV. Is this the answer to Evertons problems?

[Liveforthereds67]

Did Everton not apply for planing permision to build on Stanley Park First and Knocked back. Hence all the uproar when we applied and got the Planning for a new stadium on Stanley Park. Can't remember why they where knocked back, but I doubt they will ever leave their ground unless they ever get new owners which seems unlikly as Kenwright say's he would but inrealty he won't.