Topic: 2018 League position prediction.. with Keith, VvD or without...

[jillcwhomever]

It's not about spending insane amounts of money to solve the problem but there has to be a middle ground. We spend nowhere near enough to keep up, we need a hybrid team of investment and youth development.

At this point in the window with mumblings about us 'being done', we've spent just over £50m net in the last 3 seasons. That's disgraceful for a team with our revenues whilst tv money has gone through the roof over that period. It should be double or triple that and this summer was supposed to be 'the big one' where we built out the squad to compete on all fronts.  There is a correlation between investment and trophies and by ignoring that we're just going round and round in circles.

You can say 'oh we were prepared to spend £120m on two players' but we didn't at the end of the day. Instead we're keeping Moreno and using Milner as a midfielder. Intensions mean jack shit.

A lot of people are talking about just spending money though. I'm not against the middle ground I never have been, yes we need signings but we also need to develop in conjunction with it.

I've made this point a lot recently but I think people are misunderstanding what was said yesterday. I think we are still looking to invest but a lot of business will be done at the end of the transfer window, rather than now. A lot of teams are sitting on what they have, so that they can have better value late on. I expect it will be the same for us. So of course he's going to talk positively about his squad in the meantime. It is what any sensible manager would do. Also I think a lot of people underestimate what good coaching can do, and how it can improve players who are interesting in developing and improving.

[sms1986]

If we don't get top 4 this year trying to replace Coutinho without top 4 next year is going to be an impossible task. So top 4 is an absolute must this year.

Again not improving the squad has knock on effects beyond this season.

How do you know that Barcelona or anyone else will be interested in him next summer, whether we get top four or not?

[thelinnen]

A lot of people are talking about just spending money though. I'm not against the middle ground I never have been, yes we need signings but we also need to develop in conjunction with it.

I've made this point a lot recently but I think people are misunderstanding what was said yesterday. I think we are still looking to invest but a lot of business will be done at the end of the transfer window, rather than now. A lot of teams are sitting on what they have, so that they can have better value late on. I expect it will be the same for us. So of course he's going to talk positively about his squad in the meantime. It is what any sensible manager would do. Also I think a lot of people underestimate what good coaching can do, and how it can improve players who are interesting in developing and improving.

Development at this time isn't going to keep Coutinho about though, it's not going to challenge for the title. We've been given a unique opportunity this summer to fill out the squad without anyone important leaving. In all honesty we needed 2-3 more players who could step into the team without a drop in quality and we didn't get them. It's demoralising because I don't doubt the quality of the first 11 but our season will fall apart again when they start getting injured or tired if things stay as they are. it's fucking ridiculous that I'm saying that before we've kicked a ball in anger but we all know it.

I just can't see a dealine day transfer, we've never been the type for the last minute trolley dash. Only time I remember us doing that was when we sold Torres and had £50m burning in our pockets. Sky Sports will have some knob outside Melwood, the doors will close at 5.30pm and people will start reassuring themselves that everything will be alright.

[sms1986]

And SMS Barca have wanted him for years. Don't be naive mate.

You know how Leipzig wouldn't sell Keita to us? We're in a much stronger position with Coutinho than they are with Keita, so if they come in for him next summer, we will want a lot more than we were offering for Keita.

Besides, all of this is irrelevant if we get top four.

Plus, we've signed many good players without CL football, such as Mane, and Coutinho stayed last summer without any European football last season.

[killer-heels]

Come on Killer you know aswell as I do Arsenal being out for 1 year is a bit different from ourselves.

And SMS Barca have wanted him for years. Don't be naive mate.

We signed Mane, Coutinho, Sturridge, Firmino, Suarez, Henderson, Matip, Clyne etc. all without Champions League football. All but Salah and Lallana signed with CL football but we could very well have signed both without it.

We have never really showed the intention to spend shed loads of money on the top players so all this panicking about CL football was silly.

At the end of last season the press were going mad about how it would be a disaster without CL football because we couldnt attract the best. Well we hardly have bought the best and instead signed players who we could have attracted without it. It will be the same next year. We will sign good players with or without CL.

[jillcwhomever]

Development at this time isn't going to keep Coutinho about though, it's not going to challenge for the title. We've been given a unique opportunity this summer to fill out the squad without anyone important leaving. In all honesty we needed 2-3 more players who could step into the team without a drop in quality and we didn't get them. It's demoralising because I don't doubt the quality of the first 11 but our season will fall apart again when they start getting injured or tired of things stay as they are. it's fucking ridiculous that I'm saying that before we've kicked a ball in anger but we all know it.

I just can't see a dealine day transfer, we've never been the type for the last minute trolley dash. Only time I remember us doing that was when we sold Torres and had £50m burning in our pockets. Sky Sports will have some knob outside Melwood, the doors will close at 5.30pm and people will start reassuring themselves that everything will be alright.

He will stay as long as he feels this is a club that is developing into a team able to win. With the best will in the world you don't know what he will do anymore than me. He has always said that he wants to win things with Liverpool. He also said last year he wants to play in the Champion's League with Liverpool. He has spoken more than once about how much he admires Klopp and what he is doing here, say nothing of being grateful to the club, for rescuing him from his Italian experience.

We enter a new season next week and I have every confidence we will be better than we were last season. Does that guarantee anything? No it doesn't but nor does it mean that everything will be as bad, as what a number of people on here, seem to think it will be. Here's a nice suggestion what about and waiting and seeing before covering everything in doom and gloom?

[SerbianScouser]

Think if people accepted we have a mad manager life would be easier for them.

You wouldn't put it past him not getting anyone till the end of the window but he will live or die by his decisions, there's really no point fretting about it or expecting him to do stuff he's uncomfortable with. It's so crazy it might just work.

[NorthamptonKopite]

If we don't sign a centre back my gut feeling is it'll be another tough battle for 4th. If we sign VVD then it could make that difference to be title contenders.

[thelinnen]

He will stay as long as he feels this is a club that is developing into a team able to win. With the best will in the world you don't know what he will do anymore than me. He has always said that he wants to win things with Liverpool. He also said last year he wants to play in the Champion's League with Liverpool. He has spoken more than once about how much he admires Klopp and what he is doing here, say nothing of being grateful to the club, for rescuing him from his Italian experience.

We enter a new season next week and I have every confidence we will be better than we were last season. Does that guarantee anything? No it doesn't but nor does it mean that everything will be as bad, as what a number of people on here, seem to think it will be. Here's a nice suggestion what about and waiting and seeing before covering everything in doom and gloom?

Losing Lallana did it for me, they'll be a point this season where players start dropping like flies or get tired and no one Klopp trusts on the bench to step in for them. Happened last January and with only one proven quality addition it's hard to see why it won't happen again. We've lost Lucas as well he turned out to be very important in getting top 4 when Henderson went missing on his '4 week injury'.

[jillcwhomever]

Losing Lallana did it for me, they'll be a point this season where players start dropping like flies or get tired and no one Klopp trusts on the bench to step in for them. Happened last January and with only one proven quality addition it's hard to see why it won't happen again. We've lost Lucas as well he turned out to be very important in getting top 4 when Henderson went missing on his '4 week injury'.

Time will tell, you're in entitled to you're opinion I feel differently.

[thelinnen]

Time will tell, you're in entitled to you're opinion I feel differently.

8 extra mid week games as well. I'm sorry I just don't see this squad being up to it, pretty much the same size with more games. If we end up in a similar situation next January with us having to choose between top 4 and the FA Cup, I hope we choose differently.

[clinical]

Think if people accepted we have a mad manager life would be easier for them.

You wouldn't put it past him not getting anyone till the end of the window but he will live or die by his decisions, there's really no point fretting about it or expecting him to do stuff he's uncomfortable with. It's so crazy it might just work.

Well he has to be mad because the mistake he admitted to doing last season. He's doing again and with extra games

[Djimi Smicer34]

Same as last year: a minimum of a top four finish and a trophy.  We got one, it's time we start deliving on the other.  We need a strong showing in the CL too.

I don't think we're done in the transfer market yet and if we can further quality to what we already have then I'd predict that we can aspire to a lot more.

[Nick110581]

We will surely sign players.

There is too much panic at moment and the journalists don't really know much.

[IndianRed]

Here's my 2 cents:

With no more signings and assuming our squad has injury issues at a similar rate to last season: 6th/7th, out of CL in the group stages
With no more signings and assuming our squad has better luck with injuries: 5th, final 16 stage in CL
We sign a first team CB (VVD or anyone else): 3rd/4th, final 16 stage in CL
We sign a first team CB and a first team CM (Seri, Kovacic, etc): Title contenders and a chance to progress all the way in the CL

In addition, it'd be nice to finally win one of the domestic cup competitions, but I have a feeling that Klopp will sacrifice progress in those competitions for a better run in the CL and the league given how threadbare the squad currently is.

[deFacto please, you bastards]

Signing one or two players is imperative, Klopp knows this, he's admitted it, he said he and the coaching staff took a risk last year. It would be maddening to go down the same path again this year. We have time still, I hope we do something.

[Shepnois]

I'll wait for the window to close but as it stands now I can't see us getting top 4. 5th/6th looks the most likely outcome.

[7777]

Think if people accepted we have a mad manager life would be easier for them.

You wouldn't put it past him not getting anyone till the end of the window but he will live or die by his decisions, there's really no point fretting about it or expecting him to do stuff he's uncomfortable with. It's so crazy it might just work.

100% this

[Mr_Shane]

Think if people accepted we have a mad manager life would be easier for them.

You wouldn't put it past him not getting anyone till the end of the window but he will live or die by his decisions, there's really no point fretting about it or expecting him to do stuff he's uncomfortable with. It's so crazy it might just work.

Agree wholeheartedly. He is mad, a risk-taker, and probably among one of the most courageous managers. This season is going to be a roller-coaster, and is not going to be for for the faint of heart

[El Lobo]

Well he has to be mad because the mistake he admitted to doing last season. He's doing again and with extra games

Is he....?

He's got Salah, where we had no cover for Mane
He's got Robertson, where we had no cover for Milner
He's got Solanke for added cover up top
He's got Kent back for added wide cover

My memory isn't what it used to be but I'm pretty sure the whole argument from January onwards (probably before January actually) was why didn't we plan for Mane going to the AFCON, why didn't we have cover for Mane, why don't we sign a winger, surely there is a winger in world football we can sign etc. I genuinely don't remember much whinging about CM options.

After the last one and 7/8ths of a season, it seems pretty clear to me that the manager prefers to work with a smaller squad. Is it a risk? Yeah, probably. But it seems to be the way, so that might be something you're just going to have to get on board with. We risked it last season and it worked, and it worked with pretty horrendous luck with injury and Mane going off to the AFCON.

[jillcwhomever]

Think if people accepted we have a mad manager life would be easier for them.

You wouldn't put it past him not getting anyone till the end of the window but he will live or die by his decisions, there's really no point fretting about it or expecting him to do stuff he's uncomfortable with. It's so crazy it might just work.

Spot on.

[Djimi Smicer34]

If we only signed a quality centre back between now and the end of the month, that would be enough to make me believe we challenge on all fronts.

That's the one imperative thing left for me in this window, to bring in that difference maker in defence.

[CallumLFC]

At the end of last season the press were going mad about how it would be a disaster without CL football because we couldnt attract the best. Well we hardly have bought the best and instead signed players who we could have attracted without it. It will be the same next year. We will sign good players with or without CL.

To be fair Van Dijk would not have chosen us without CL football. We might not have signed him yet but without CL football, he would have been looking at City or Chelsea at this moment in time.

[jegz1uk]

A CB is still a must, VVD or otherwise, Lovren has proved time and time again that he can't be trusted when needed, hopefully Klopp has a Plan B for a CB otherwise the same defensive issues as last season will be on repeat

[DangerScouse]

Signing one or two players is imperative, Klopp knows this, he's admitted it, he said he and the coaching staff took a risk last year. It would be maddening to go down the same path again this year. We have time still, I hope we do something.

Couldn't agree more mate.

[Le_Mot_Juste]

City haven't really bought anyone I would consider a game changer, and neither have Spurs. Purely because I don't think the teams around us have improved to the extent that we should be left massively behind - I think we'll finish 3rd or 4th. Would take 4th place + a really good CL run, to be honest. Some pride back on the European stage would be awesome.

[Nick110581]

Few more links surfacing so let's hope that's good news

[LCapitane81]

Stop fucking "lol"ing

[Red-Soldier]

Think we'll get top 4 as it is.

If we sign VVD and another quality CM, we may challenge for the title.

[Titi Camara]

This has run it's course as a thinly veiled transfer thread.