Author Topic: Some quality/important posts you may have missed  (Read 472646 times)

Online kavah

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Re: Some quality/important posts you may have missed
« Reply #880 on: August 25, 2018, 10:27:16 PM »
And this

Enjoying the evolution of our game.

Initially under Klopp it was all about the press. It is the key ingredient about how Klopp wants to play the game and understandably it was the first thing that was drummed into the team. It was all about getting the players used to the triggers that initiate the press, that progressed and became more nuanced when managers became accustomed to our ability to win the ball with an all out press. Initially it was all about pressing at pretty much every opportunity. The work rate and physicality overwhelmed teams. Unfortunately that led to us tiring late in games.

It was what you would describe as unintelligent pressing then we moved on to creating situations that allowed pressing traps. It was far more selective it wasn't about looking to overwhelm the opposition physically, it was about consolidating energy and waiting for the correct triggers. It was about forcing the opposition into situations that compromised their shape and then pouncing when the opportunity arrived. What you would describe as intelligent pressing.

For me that pretty much describes Klopp's time at Liverpool. In the first full season season it was all about heavy metal football, pressing at a tempo that the opposition couldn't cope with. We caught the opposition by surprise.

Last season was more subtle City at home in the League was the perfect example. It wasn't an all about press but we had a crazy 15 minutes when we went eyeballs out and destroyed City. Again though we ended up running out of steam and City almost comically ended up getting back into the game.

For me the initial work that went in to making us brilliant at pressing had a cost. We prioritised athleticism and physical abilities in certain areas over an ability to keep the ball. It was only certain areas and other areas of the team made up for that slightly agricultural approach. That has changed this season though. We are no longer a team that relies on overwhelming the opposition with work rate and desire. We no longer depend on creating passing traps or intelligent pressing. As the winning goal showed today we still have both of those qualities in our locker but we have more strings to our bow.

The transformation in January and the summer has been remarkable. I sat there today thinking I had been transported back to the 70's and 80's. We no longer have a weak link in possession. It was like the days of pass and move. Every player wanted the ball, every player was comfortable in possession and more importantly every player trusted their team mates in possession. Every time a player got on the ball it wasn't a case of getting goal side of their opponent in case their team mate made a mistake it was all about offering options.

In the first full season you could stop us by bypassing the unintelligent press and waiting for us to tire. Last season you could defend deep allow certain players to get on the ball and rely on our lack of creativity safe in the notion that we were vulnerable at the back. I am not sure what you can do now.

We can keep it for fun, show great patience and then all of a sudden pick you apart. Van Dijk and Alisson mean we can't be bullied anymore.

As I said initially we have become so more well rounded it is untrue. The main thing for me though is that rushed clearances are a thing of the past. Giving the ball back to the opposition is a last resort . Which means we no longer have to expend so much energy looking to regain the ball.

Onwards and upwards.

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Re: Some quality/important posts you may have missed
« Reply #881 on: September 23, 2018, 08:22:29 PM »
As controlled a performance at home as we could wish for. Game over by half time, players rested, Salah gets the goal he needed, a clean sheet, and at times it looked like a practice match.

Shaqiri looks like just the player we needed - someone who can play anywhere across the front 3, or just behind the strikers in a roaming role - getting into those spaces between midfield and attack, getting wide, stretching the play, and finding a way through the parked buses. His substitution was nothing other than a case of 'job done', and we changed it up to control the game to the end.

The numbers get better each time you read them. 6 wins from 6 (or 7 from 7 in all competitions), 8 clean sheets on the bounce at Anfield, unbeaten at home since April 2017, 14 goals scored in the league and only 2 conceded. We have individuals having excellent games even though the team is still not fully firing yet, a bench that we could only have dreamed of a few years ago, a bit of rotation to keep the squad fresh, and no worrying injuries so far. We are also restricting the opposition to very few chances and its increasingly difficult to bypass our midfield and defence, with Alisson barely involved for large periods.

It really feels like each week we're witnessing the culmination of all of Klopp and his team's hard graft, coupled with intelligent use of transfer funds, and a highly motivated group of players with talent, determination and team spirit in abundance. Its not even October, yet already big teams have been controlled and beaten, smaller teams outplayed in every part of the pitch, games have been won without playing well, we've held onto leads and managed games, and scored late goals. Its like we've had every type of win so far this season already, and all of this without Fabinho, Lallana, the Ox, and several more quality players in reserve.

Now that Chelsea have dropped points we're top of the league and the early pacesetters, and for the first time in a very long time I have every confidence we can stay the distance this time around. We are no longer reliant on a Gerrard, a Torres, or a Suarez to dig us out of trouble or win a game single handed, nor do we need to score 3-4 goals to win each game. There is quality everywhere you look, no weak links, no passengers, and a strong bench ready and willing when called upon. My heart and fingernails have never been in better shape, and you just sense this time its the real deal - not a false dawn, not seeing things through rose tinted spectacles, and not desparation.

Bring on your Chelsea's, bring on your City's, and give us anyone you like in the cups. We are coming up the hill and this time we're not stopping for anyone.

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Re: Some quality/important posts you may have missed
« Reply #882 on: November 9, 2018, 07:41:31 AM »
I have to say I've been surprised by the overreaction on here. Yes, your team was below its best, but at the same time it feels like all three clubs in the group don't understand what the Marakana represents. That's the greatest mistake made by both Napoli and Liverpool, and one I hope PSG make as well. I also should note that your front three all played without a break in the summer. Give it a bit more time.

My impression of the night was eerily similar to what I noted in my pre-match preview (in chronlogical order of play):

1. The Marakana created an atmosphere whcih gave us the extra 10-15% which in the opening 30 minutes Liverpool did not find an answer to (we had luck with the Sturridge chance). One telling statistic in terms of work rate - Crvena Zvezda 115.6km, Liverpool 109.8km. This is that extra 10-15% especially in the opening 30 minutes.

2. Our controlled press in the first half, which your team didn't have an answer for, was eerily similar to the opening at Anfield, the key difference being that we capitalized during our good spell.

3. The return of Marko Marin into the side brought us a much needed creative outlet who was able to dictate play, especially when we countered in the first half.

4. The pressing by Dusan Jovancic on your central pairing was critical, if not more than Pavkov's goals, in creating our good spell in the first half. His inclusion changed our approach significantly.

5. Your entire back line and midfield being almost too pedestrian in the second half. You had possession, but it was too sideways and the lack of some vertical bravery was plain to see. This played right into our hands, as our coach is a defensive structure specialist. He has created a system with two blocks of four in the past 2 seasons that's hard to really beat with sideways passing. I'm not saying this to be a jerk, but in the second half we were hardly troubled, even though you clearly outplayed us and had more of the ball. The method in which you attacked played to our strengths in a lot of ways and that frustration has been exhibited by several other European opponents who have come here.

6. The travelling Liverpool contingent. What class. You applauded our side as we did a lap of honor to thank our fans in this historic night for us. I have to say, no club in Europe (and no club in England for that matter) would have/has paid us the respect your club and supporters have in the past month. It's evident even here on the forum. It's another example to me that money cannot buy history or class and even when you endured a torrid away trip, you still applauded our team. I sincerely do hope you beat PSG in your next fixture.

Now, onto the comments -

Cheers Rocco. We know we're in for a tough day in Naples (a game I'll be going to), but we have a particular bitter taste after Paris, and some of our players have noted they can't wait for that next home game in December. I wouldn't write us off at the Marakana when PSG come here. As much class as they have, they don't have heart to win when faced with true mental barriers (see their collapses in the CL these past several seasons). We will be up for it that night.

This was exactly the tactical work I believe Milojevic put into the preparation for this game. The plan was to press for the opening half and hopefully get something from it while remaining responsible at the back. Our controlled press in the opening half hour was as good as I've seen us do it at this level. We don't have the fitness levels of the major sides in Europe, especially when you don't play against similar opposition week in, week out, so that's why the second half (especially the last 30 minutes) went the way they did. However, the first point in your post is exactly what we all felt last night; the pace of your attacks made it relatively predictable barring 1-2 chances that Salah had.

Since Milojevic has come to the club (2 seasons ago) the only opposition to defeat us at the Marakana is Arsenal in the 86th minute off a ridiculous Giroud bicycle that he will never score again for 0-1, and that was a game in which we dominated the first half and should have been up at half time. Since he has come to the club, our European home record stands at 8 wins, 5 draws and 1 loss.

I will be very surprised if they look like this the rest of the season. You had a tough away game in Arsenal and this was a tough away trip.

Well said. It's one game.

That's what I think the Liverpool players thought as well given how they came out in the opening 20 minutes. Games are not won on paper.

I will disagree with the referee bit of it. I thought you were a tad fortunate with Milner's hand ball in the 47th minute after Marin's shot clearly hit his arm. Given the officiating on display at Anfield (in which two relatively soft penalties were given, especially the second one which our player had no idea about), that might have been a penalty for a different referee. In regards to the first goal, it's the fifth official to the side of the goal that makes the call. You can see in the replay he is the one that gives the corner as he had the best angle when Srnic and Robertson sprinted after Alisson's rebound.

Thank you for showing us the respect our first half display deserved. We historically have played well against Italian sides, especially away from home, but Napoli is about as far off an Italian side as you can get given Sarri's style is still there with a bit more directness that Ancellotti has inserted. I'm trying to say we're hopeful against Napoli, but we're confident against PSG at home. That game is going to be a cracker, especially after the first game. I wouldn't write us off in that last game.

Well spotted. That was where and when we did most of the damage.

This is the Marakana, and once our players started the game well, we all felt a result here was possible. We know technically on paper we're nowhere near the other 3 teams in the group, but our history makes us believe it, and that's power of sport. Another stat - value of Liverpool (821 million GBP), Crvena Zvezda (40 million GBP). That shows the financial disparity and what heart/effort did on the evening.

I echo this, the sideways passing in the second half did you in. That was the disappointment from Liverpool's perspective.

Да да. Поштовање за класу навијача Ливерпула на Маракани. Ваљда два клуба са истројим изађу из групе.  :wave

This was one of the main reasons I was cautiously optimistic for this tie. When we go ahead, we know how to defend a lead. That's probably been the biggest improvement since Milojevic came to coach us.

Cheers. Hope the two teams with history and pedigree in the competition get out of the group.

Very significant bit of text here. Our data analyst and tactical coach are known for breaking down the opposition to a tee. We did the same to Napoli here. We realized the main ways they hurt teams are diagonal long balls (one of the things they're extremely good at) when rotating the ball out of the back and when they're pressed. We did soak up pressure in that game but barring 2 excellent chances, one of which was an Insigne screamer from 30 yards that hit the cross bar, it was more of the same as in the second half today. They didn't really have a clear answer.

Again, kudos for the respect shown.

Lacked the hunger to win was one of the main themes of last night for me. It seemed like your players expect to just go over us. In this sense, this has to go down to Klopp. At the same time, I'm not sure what more he could have done to inspire. He gave Wijnaldum, Sturridge, Lallana, and Matip a chance, and in theory all of these players should have been raring to go to make an impression on the side, especially given the atmosphere. You were really lacking a presence deep from midfield, a box to box type, and that might have been Keita or Fabinho on another night. The midfield was too passive and it showed in the second half. In the first half, you at least had Lallana trying to make runs from deep, but it just didn't come off.

Spoken like a true veteran of football. The lows we've had to endure over the past 8-9 years are something I wouldn't wish on any of you. We were nearly financially ruined by club management circa 2010 when a ruthless group of businessmen grew our debt to insurmountable levels. Then they left and we were stuck just trying to play with our academy players and veterans we'd bring from abroad for their last 1-2 seasons... then we win our first title in 6 years and UEFA then decides to kick us out of Europe during the following season for breaching FFP... all the while clubs like PSG inject cash from who knows where to balance the books. We then get a manager who leads us to another title, but we make a hash of qualifying for Europe in 2016 against Ludogorets after drawing with them 2-2 away, only to lose the home return leg 3-4 all while finishing 2nd in the league. There were some highs there, in the 2 league titles pre the 2017-2018 campaign, but outside of that it's been a ton of lows, especially on the European front for us, which is hard to accept given our pedigree. Then Milojevic comes in and revives us from out of nothing. He takes our squad and goes through 4 rounds of Europa League qualifying beating much more financially strong teams in Sparta Prague and FC Krasnodar, before we make it to the final 32 after finishing 2nd in our group only to Arsenal and beating BATE Borisov and FC Cologne. Drawing Arsenal at the Emirates, a game in which we had chances to win, was one of the highlights. Us making the final 32 in the Europa league from the first round of Europe league qualifying last season made us the first side in European football history to do that.

To back that up, we're the first European side to progress through all four rounds of Champions League qualifying to make the group stage since the Champions League was introduced in 1992. I know for your perspective and what you're trying to win the last couple of sentences might not seem that impressive, but when your entire club budget for transfers, salaries, staff, the ground etc is about a third of what you spent on Allison, or maybe even less, the high we're enjoying right now is hard to describe.

I believe our win last night proved that football is not dead. I believe it proved that with heart and mind you can still make a difference in this game as bad as the financial disparity has grown. I'm not blaming Liverpool here. This is the system UEFA has created. I'm just describing the high we feel in Belgrade and Zvezda fans all over the world. For too long we've been told we don't matter, especially with this talk of the Superleague, and I'm happy for once that we've shown that money isn't everything in this game. That's what makes football beautiful in different ways.

This will be your only low of the season by the way.

Ultimately, here's an article by ESPN as a reaction to the game last night and what I'm also trying to say.

Again, kudos for the respect shown on here.

I will finish with this video from our official club Youtube channel. As you know, money can't buy this type of atmosphere. It's something that comes from the heart. The five guys at the beginning of the video are what remains of our 1973 side. They were paid their respect before the match started. Also, around the 6th minute in the video you can see what the win means to the players. Some of these guys are from Belgrade and were born into Red Star families. This type of connection with your players is something else for us.

Offline Sudden Death Draft Loser

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Re: Some quality/important posts you may have missed
« Reply #883 on: November 12, 2018, 02:37:22 PM »
This country and the world, it seems, is so fixated on allowing itself to suffer.

We have become accustomed to allowing selfish and egocentric men dictate our lives. We yearn for strong and adamant leaders in expensive tailor made suits. Men with a firm grip, who do not yield when faced with a political opponent. Men who do not blink and men who do not stutter when they are presented the chance to baselessly undermine and humiliate their political opponents. Men who are led by corporate interests and men who spend thousands upon thousands to live lavishly, whilst food banks become the source of many people's nutrition.

Now I do not know whether our leader's are product's of our society, or vice-versa. What I do know is that for the time being , politics is driven by men and women who are not servants of the people. They are servants of themselves and the business interests which they embolden. There is no seat for Jeremy Corbyn amongst the leader's of this world. He is too good of a human being to deserve that seat. A seat kept warm by compulsive liars, by dictator's, by ultra-nationalist's, by war-criminals. They would devour him, and his soul.

JC is not a perfect human being. Nor is any other person in this world. But one thing that no-one can take away from his is his honourable service towards his fellow men and women. And his vision to make this world, just a slightly better place.

don't know how to cross quote from different threads, but this is a cracker from Poet
"The greatest argument against democracy is to have a five minute conversation  with the average voter. "

Offline PoetryInMotion

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Re: Some quality/important posts you may have missed
« Reply #884 on: December 24, 2018, 12:06:51 AM »
It all comes down to the principles of attack and defence, and for team shape, defence more than attack

The principles of attack are (generally - there some slight federation/coaching school differences):


Penetration is the objective. There are three ways to penetrate - shooting, passing forward, or dribbling/attacking space with the ball. If penetration at the ball is not possible, then you need depth. Depth is usually created (and by "usually", I mean almost always has been), by the striker playing on the shoulder of the last defender, and traditionally by the sweeper, but with the advent of zonal defending and sweeper-keepers, that role has been taken up by the man in the nets. The next principle is Width, which can come from either the fullbacks and wingers, wingbacks, wingers only, fullbacks only, or a combination of winger and fullback on opposite sides. The purpose of width is to open up the middle of the field. The next principle is Mobility, which is basically players leaving their position and moving diagonally in and out of the field, or else players overlapping from front to back. The last main principle of attack is Surprise/Counter-attack, which is self-explanatory - using speed to transition from defence to attack to catch a defence in a disorganised state.

The defensive principles, then, are:

Pressure/Contain - slowing down the penetration attempts at the ball. This is ALWAYS performed by the nearest defender to the ball when it is lost
Cover - this covers the attacking players attempting to create depth
Balance - Covering players who are attempting to create width, also, creating the offside line
Compactness - keeping spaces between defenders tight vertically and horizontally to reduce the effects of mobility
Consolidation - dropping back to the penalty area in a compact shape to reduce the danger of a counter-attack.

So in graphic terms, a team-shape in attack should follow the lines below:

Defensively, the lines of movement would ultimately look like this:

If you could create a Venn diagram of the overlapping principles of attack and defence, you would basically get the word "Shape", because both your attacking and your defensive shape have to be closely linked in order to make transition from one to another phase as economic as possible. This is partly why man-to-man marking was overcome by zonal defending, because zonal defending gives you a better shape to transition in both directions without losing shape.

So what about formations?

Formations let you place players in optimal positions to effect the principles of attack and defence as best as possible. For example, in a true 4-3-3, the attacking depth is handled by the #9, the width by the #7 and #11 (wingers), defensive depth by the central defenders, defensive mid and keeper, and mobility by the fullbacks, the #8 and the #10:

In a 4-4-2, there's one less player for mobility in midfield, but there is better defensive depth in the square base (as Houllier once called it on a coaching course) of the 4, 5, 6 and 8.

In 5-back systems, the roles are almost more explicit, as the central defender becomes the defensive depth, the wingbacks supply the width, the striker provides attacking depth, and the midfield 3 (either a 1-2 or a 2-1) provide the mobility as well as the defensive overloads providing a great springboard for Surprise/Counterattack.

So when we're saying things like "we don't really play a 4-3-3", it's important to make that statement, because it allows us to talk about the roles the players are actually playing, so we don't  get into a situation of measuring them up against roles they aren't actually playing. For example, saying that Firmino doesn't score enough goals would be unfair to him, as he's been playing the role of the #10, which means he doesn't get into as many goalscoring positions as often as, say, Salah would. Similarly, calling Salah a "winger" belies the fact that he is our "outball", even if he starts off to the side rather than purely central. These anomalies allow us to see what Klopp is actually doing, and it's better to talk about what's actually happening in the system and formation, than it is to superimpose a "symmetrical", "media" view of the system and formation and forget the jobs the players are actually being asked to do. That's why we drill down, so that we don't look at players and the jobs they do from the wrong perspective, and then we can actually appreciate the jobs they ARE doing, rather than, say, expecting Alonso to be winning tackles, and Mascherano to be spraying the ball onto the toes of the attackers. 4-4-2, 4-3-3 etc, are okay for shorthand, but you could have 10 teams playing a 4-4-2, and all 10 would be playing it a different way. That's why precision is important.

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Re: Some quality/important posts you may have missed
« Reply #885 on: December 28, 2018, 02:02:38 PM »
In the immortal words of Virgil Van Dijk: “who cares?”

The man of the moment, Mauricio Pochettino, surely on his way to leading Spurs to quadruple glory before wrestling the Old Trafford reins away from the baby-faced managerial legend next summer, once said of diving that itֹ’s “a small detail” after two of his players, one of them English and the best striker in the world according to at least one half of the Neville school for special pundits, had blatantly dived for two penalties at Anfield. There was no major wringing of hands at that point, as far as I recall, so the moral outrage in the aftermath of yesterday’s game has me at a loss. Morals?? In this fucking sport?? Do me a favour. Hypocrisy, on the other hand...

Which is, of course, to say nothing of the factual reality that this was clearly a foul. Clearly. Paul Dummett himself knew better than anyone — his sheepish acceptance of the referee’s decision was writ large across his face for all to see. We all know that your typical footballer loves a good argument with a match official, often over something as mundane as the award of a throw, but the Newcastle United man said nothing.

He took a calculated risk, you see, the kind you too might feel fully justified in taking if the team you were playing against hadn’t been awarded a penalty at home in the Premier League in over a year. He attempted to slow the rapid forward progress of Liverpool’s Egyptian genius by sneakily and momentarily grabbing his arm, thereby hoping to throw him off balance and give his teammate a better chance to clear the ball. In the process, he dared the referee to make a decision where so many before him had failed to do so, most recently when Victor Lindelof barged Salah in the back with arm and shoulder at 0-0 against Manchester United a couple of weeks back.

Bear in mind, too, that Salah is a player who has recently felt the full, considerable bulk of Steve Cook raking his studs down his Achilles tendon at Bournemouth and stayed on his feet to score. Even more recently, he failed to collapse at the Kop end at 1-0 during the second-half of the crucial Champions League decider against Napoli when David Ospina came haring off his line and made contact with him, instead trying (and failing) to chip the Colombian in a move that had yours truly wondering aloud why our players are so stupid. You won’t hear about these moments as the witch-hunt gathers pace over the coming weeks and months, but they are important points to note in order to understand Dummett’s mental process for the penalty incident yesterday, because he would have no doubt felt hugely confident at the prospect of his opponent trying to stay on his feet and score despite the foul.

He couldn’t have known that on this occasion: (a) Salah would also dare the referee to make a decision, and (b) even more shockingly, Mr. Scott would make the correct call. Hey, sometimes it happens. Sometimes it doesn’t and you get away with it. That’s football. What mystifies me, though, quite aside from what was going through the Newcastle defender’s head taking such a risk when it was only “one-season wonder” Mo Salah that was bearing down on his penalty area, was why a legendary former defender like Phil Neville was so reticent to give Dummett due credit later that night for as good a tactical foul as you’ll see on a purely technical level, given that he even cleverly shielded the action from the view of the linesman with his body in the process.

Phil knows the dark arts of defending. This is a man who has scored an own-goal, given away a (winning) penalty and been sent off (twice) in Merseyside derbies, a terrifying trifecta matched only by the time he gave away a penalty in the dying seconds against Romania to knock England out of Euro 2000. Surely he, of all people, knows better than to sacrifice praise for the cunning, old-school and, above all, manly goddammit exploits of a fellow member of the left-back club at the altar of labelling Johnny Foreigner a cheat for the millionth time. Surely to God we’re past that now? Surely to God we’ve been past that since Michael Owen played the Argies at their own game in 1998, falling like a little feather at the attentions of Roberto Ayala? Weep for Paul Dummett, brothers and sisters — unappreciated in his own time, even by his own kind. An unholy future union with Sean Dyche surely awaits.

Joking aside...Phil Neville knows fuck all about anything, and if he does, he’s a gifted actor. This is a man who for many years plied his trade at Goodison Park, a place where any opposition contact with the ball above shinpad-level results in a chorus of “HANDBALL!!!” and “PENALTY!!!” from the stands. His perspective on penalties should therefore be afforded much the same regard as the rage-filled screams of your average Bluenose round Goodison way of a Saturday afternoon.

Speaking of Nevilles, earlier this year Phil’s brother Gary stated in commentary for Sky that Erik Lamela’s aforementioned Defoe-in-Platoon-style collapse at the merest touch of Van Dijk’s knee at Anfield was a definite penalty. To be fair, for the entirety of Neville’s playing career under Alex Ferguson at Manchester United it probably would have been a stonewall penalty for any player wearing red at Old Trafford, certainly lest the referee be forced to run for his life with eleven psychopaths at his heels. So maybe his opinion, and that of every click-baiting, hot-taking pundit on this subject and many others, should be taken with a grain of salt too?

I mean, football supporters are, to a greater or lesser extent, all hypocrites when it comes to this kind of stuff, aren’t we? We normally couldn’t be objective to save our lives, although I recall the vast majority of us readily admitting that the foul which most closely resembles Dummett’s that I can think of (Dirk Kuyt grabbing Aleksandr Hleb’s arm in a very similar manner against Arsenal during the first leg of the Champions League quarter-final at the Emirates in 2008) was a stonewall penalty, just like Saturday, and how relieved we were that the ref missed it. But, and it feels stupid even saying it at this point, the entire point of this football analysis business is supposed to be objectivity. Newcastle were on a hiding (to nothing, plus just a hiding) either way yesterday. It’s ridiculous that an already-truncated show like Match of the Day wasted precious seconds discussing it at all.

The fear for the Nevilles and all the rest must now be that it really doesn’t matter anymore. The referee could have waved Dummett’s foul away or Salah could have dived for twenty more penalties, it simply wouldn’t have mattered, not really. Newcastle were beaten yesterday once Lovren’s screamer nearly ripped the back of the Kop-end net off. The game could have ended 1-0, 2-0 or 3-0, 10-0, it doesn’t matter. Like 12 of the other 19 Premier League teams this season, Newcastle were never scoring in this game. Neither would Manchester United or Leicester City had it not been for goalkeeping errors. The rest of the current top-5, also second-to-fifth on the scoring charts (Arsenal, Chelsea, Manchester City and Spurs), have managed 3 goals in 360 minutes against us so far. Burnley’s goal was offside and involved a foul on the goalkeeper. Cardiff’s was a mere consolation in a 4-1 defeat.

Prior to yesterday, over 400 days had passed since a referee last gave Liverpool a home penalty in the Premier League, during which time the media persisted with the risible party line, the utter delusion, that the Anfield crowd influences officials, in the face of all available evidence to the contrary. After a disgraceful decision against Stoke towards the end of last season (a blatant handball), for example, one that could have ultimately cost Liverpool Champions League football, it was Klopp’s opposite number Paul Lambert who complained about the officials. The German merely blanked the linesman on the post-match handshake and said very little more about it. Liverpool — players, manager, coaches, supporters — don’t intimidate officials, they don’t even try, and if they do, they’re terrible at it. Truly.

Me, I think we should be tormenting officials at every turn, just like every successful team of the past three decades — e.g. Ferguson’s Manchester United, every side coached by Guardiola and Mourinho, Real Madrid regardless of manager, Chelsea under multiple managers, Spain — have done, because it’s an edge that we will continue to be unable to avail of while Klopp’s outbursts are limited to ear-bashing the fourth official during the 90 minutes and his players’ influence limited to Hendo or Milner having a quiet word with the referee. Needless to say, had Dejan Lovren driven Cristiano Ronaldo’s head and shoulder into the Kiev turf last May, there would have been a second Spanish inquisition in the NSC Olimpiyskiy Stadium.

Whatever Liverpool achieve under Klopp, they're going to do it the honest way, or at least as honest as anyone gets these days. Translation: they're going to do it the hard way. So fuck tainting any of our players as cheats, especially when we're getting no rewards for it on the pitch.

So under the circumstances, I’m sure the boys will forgive me if I don’t give two shits whether Mo Salah embellished his fall yesterday, but I will say that it’s just good manners to wait until a player has actually cheated before wringing your hands in moral outrage, like that time another utter fool accused Luis Suárez of kissing the tattoos of his family’s names on his wrist as a means of rubbing Mansfield Town’s noses in his fiendishness after a goal that came off his hand. Now that the Uruguayan’s accursed jockstrap has passed to the Egyptian King, we can but hope that he at least washed it first.

In the meantime, let us acknowledge that without a single penalty in over a year of home games, all the more incredible given the speed and precision of their attack, Liverpool were still good enough to secure a top-4 finish in May and sit undefeated at the top of the table in late-December. Imagine how good they’d be if they actually got their share of penalties? Maybe Phil, Kevin, Dion and the rest are scared that we’re about to find out?

Referees giving penalties for fouls, though, eh? The game is fucked.

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Re: Some quality/important posts you may have missed
« Reply #887 on: May 16, 2019, 07:35:47 PM »
'Fan" touts should be named, shamed then taken out and shot....but put UEFA first in line.

@ Veinticinco de Mayo The way you talk to other users on this forum is something you should be ashamed of as someone who is suppose to be representing the site.
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Re: Some quality/important posts you may have missed
« Reply #888 on: May 20, 2019, 08:17:03 PM »
As I've said before, Spurs are in for a shock when they enter the stadium and discover that Anfield is portable.  They wont be playing this game in even a relatively neutral stadium.