Author Topic: Comolli and Bruckner leave by mutual consent (Read 343106 times)

bclfc · « **Reply #3040 on:** April 13, 2012, 06:30:19 am »

There may be more machinations behind the scenes than we know, but I think this was perhaps inevitable with the new owners. They were newcomers to the sport, and had to bring on board knowledgeable people. They are now more certain of themselves in their position, and are shuffling the decks a bit. Whether this is due to personalities, results, or a combination of the two is probably at best speculation unless some concrete evidence/anecdotes come out.

Time to move on, this will sort itself out, always does. Hopefully for better than for worse.

Upinsmoke · « **Reply #3041 on:** April 13, 2012, 06:31:33 am »

It is slightly worrying I have to admit. Something just doesn't seem right. The timing, are they setting dalglish up for a fall? Brukner is just a weird one, everyone seems to be sackable bar Kenny. No I don't want Kenny sacked yet he comes across in interviews as always taking responsibility for liverpools poor performances. Either Kenny is fronting, he secretly didn't appreciate comollis work and see eye to eye with brukner, but no...it doesn't add up. Kenny has more class than that to put on a front.

eirwen · « **Reply #3042 on:** April 13, 2012, 06:32:54 am »

It does seem to show how new the owners are at football. I mean, a while ago they were saying how great the Arsenal model is and hired Comolli. Now it seems to be all about Barcelona.

kcbworth · « **Reply #3043 on:** April 13, 2012, 06:33:23 am »

Anyway, if this means we'll never see (imho) major fuckups like Aquilani (paying ~75% of his wage to play for AC Milan ffs, after clearly playing heads and shoulders above the majority of the rest our squad in preseaon), Meireles (selling one of our best performers of the previous season shortly after losing the aforementioned Aquilani and knowing Gerrard was out for half the season), and Pacheco (loan with option to buy deal for one of our most promising youngsters... absolutely ludicrous), then this is a good day imho.

I'm none too happy about the Insua treatment either (although this was mitigated by Enrique).

bclfc · « **Reply #3044 on:** April 13, 2012, 06:34:13 am »

Quote from: Upinsmoke on April 13, 2012, 06:31:33 am

It is slightly worrying I have to admit. Something just doesn't seem right. The timing, are they setting dalglish up for a fall? Brukner is just a weird one, everyone seems to be sackable bar Kenny. No I don't want Kenny sacked yet he comes across in interviews as always taking responsibility for liverpools poor performances. Either Kenny is fronting, he secretly didn't appreciate comollis work and see eye to eye with brukner, but no...it doesn't add up. Kenny has more class than that to put on a front.

You do wonder if Kenny already knows he is gone after this season as manager, and is taking the credit/blame to deflect blame from other people/players. But maybe not. Who knows.

smurfinaus · « **Reply #3045 on:** April 13, 2012, 06:36:19 am »

Quote from: frosty on April 13, 2012, 03:42:29 am

Why is there no explanation why Bruckner was sacked

Injuries injuries?.

rocco · « **Reply #3046 on:** April 13, 2012, 06:37:47 am »

Quote from: eirwen on April 13, 2012, 06:32:54 am

It does seem to show how new the owners are at football. I mean, a while ago they were saying how great the Arsenal model is and hired Comolli. Now it seems to be all about Barcelona.

now seems to be all about Barcelona?

ziggyy · « **Reply #3047 on:** April 13, 2012, 06:39:25 am »

Quote from: kcbworth on April 13, 2012, 06:33:23 am

Anyway, if this means we'll never see (imho) major fuckups like Aquilani (paying ~75% of his wage to play for AC Milan ffs, after clearly playing heads and shoulders above the majority of the rest our squad in preseaon), Meireles (selling one of our best performers of the previous season shortly after losing the aforementioned Aquilani and knowing Gerrard was out for half the season), and Pacheco (loan with option to buy deal for one of our most promising youngsters... absolutely ludicrous), then this is a good day imho.

I'm none too happy about the Insua treatment either (although this was mitigated by Enrique).

And leaving the squad thread bare in the process....

Carlos: Very Kickable · « **Reply #3048 on:** April 13, 2012, 06:45:28 am »

AQUILANI!

Of course! it all makes sense now - remember John Henry's tweet about him? He's a big Aqua fan! He couldnt work out our crazy deal to flog him off either!

ziggyy · « **Reply #3049 on:** April 13, 2012, 06:46:03 am »

Quote from: eirwen on April 13, 2012, 06:32:54 am

It does seem to show how new the owners are at football. I mean, a while ago they were saying how great the Arsenal model is and hired Comolli. Now it seems to be all about Barcelona.

At least they are not following the RM/Cheski model. By highlighting the Arsenal and/or Barcelona models, it shows that they rather groom our own talents and giving quality youth players more chances.

Again, in theory sounds good but I do hope they remember that Barca and Arsenal kept and brought in older players too to help groom and support the young players...

ziggyy · « **Reply #3050 on:** April 13, 2012, 06:48:06 am »

Quote from: Carlos Qiqabal on April 13, 2012, 06:45:28 am

AQUILANI!

Of course! it all makes sense now - remember John Henry's tweet about him? He's a big Aqua fan! He couldnt work out our crazy deal to flog him off either!

It'll be so much more fun here if Aquilani is brought back;)

surfer. Fuck you generator. · « **Reply #3051 on:** April 13, 2012, 06:50:47 am »

Helen of Troy has nothing on Aquilani. Nothing.

Alan_X · « **Reply #3052 on:** April 13, 2012, 06:51:16 am »

Quote from: Sissoko78 on April 13, 2012, 01:47:15 am

But any microeconomist/econometrician worth their salt from academia, government or private industry should be able to go in and get some modelling results quickly. You can always think of more research questions, but it wouldn't take long to get some preliminaries, especially as Comolli has presumably got some guys who have already readied the data and done at least some work.
.

Sorry but I just don't agree. There's a great quote by Pierre Luigi Nervi, the Italian engineer and architect. He said that creativity is not just about calculations, it's about knowing intuitively what calculations to use.

If you have no appreciation of the game then then you're going to end up with the Reep/Hughes type of long-ball crap. My own observation of Comolli's reported statistical analysis, was that the things being measured were useless. Getting someone new in to analyze the wrong data is not going to yield useful results.

Red Crown · « **Reply #3053 on:** April 13, 2012, 06:55:10 am »

Quote from: surfer on April 13, 2012, 06:50:47 am

Helen of Troy has nothing on Aquilani. Nothing.

As someone who views the Aquilani fiasco a complete balls up buy us, I have to say that was brilliant!

eirwen · « **Reply #3054 on:** April 13, 2012, 06:56:24 am »

Quote from: rocco on April 13, 2012, 06:37:47 am

now seems to be all about Barcelona?

Cruyff and Begiristain? And the talk of assessing the academy. Not that I disagree. I do think the Barca model is great and we should focus more on bringing up academy players. I just hope this isn't just one of the projects and they move on to another model if this fails.

subroc · « **Reply #3055 on:** April 13, 2012, 06:58:04 am »

Quote from: kcbworth on April 13, 2012, 06:28:06 am

It could have been a balance thing actually. I'm sure Brukner's philosophy is quite all encompassing, and it could just confuse players if they arent getting an identical message from everyone and upset the balance. If we retain our current team, and can consult with Brukner, I'm not too uncomfortable with this...

IF however, the management fundamentally disagreed with using modern sport science techniques, then I'd be very worried.

That is precisely what I am worried about - his dismissal seems to hint at this, and I just can't understand that especially coming from American owners well versed with sports management and therefore they should be accepting of modern sports science.

DutchRed · « **Reply #3056 on:** April 13, 2012, 06:59:13 am »

It's a sign of ambition to get Johan Cruijff but it won't work. He'll try to turn us into the English Barcelona and will walk away everytime he's not having it his way.

subroc · « **Reply #3057 on:** April 13, 2012, 06:59:20 am »

Quote from: eirwen on April 13, 2012, 06:32:54 am

It does seem to show how new the owners are at football. I mean, a while ago they were saying how great the Arsenal model is and hired Comolli. Now it seems to be all about Barcelona.

Not a bad model though.

eirwen · « **Reply #3058 on:** April 13, 2012, 07:00:02 am »

Quote from: DutchRed on April 13, 2012, 06:59:13 am

It's a sign of ambition to get Johan Cruijff but it won't work. He'll try to turn us into the English Barcelona and will walk away everytime he's not having it his way.

I wouldn't mind being the English Barcelona.

regnaD kciN · « **Reply #3059 on:** April 13, 2012, 07:04:10 am »

Quote from: subroc on April 13, 2012, 06:58:04 am

That is precisely what I am worried about - his dismissal seems to hint at this, and I just can't understand that especially coming from American owners well versed with sports management and therefore they should be accepting of modern sports science.

I can't understand it either...which is why I suspect there is more to the story than the explanations we've seen in the press so far.

regnaD kciN · « **Reply #3060 on:** April 13, 2012, 07:05:33 am »

Quote from: eirwen on April 13, 2012, 07:00:02 am

I wouldn't mind being the English Barcelona.

...as long as we don't have to wear day-glo pink or turquoise away kit. ;-)

rocco · « **Reply #3061 on:** April 13, 2012, 07:07:51 am »

Quote from: eirwen on April 13, 2012, 06:56:24 am

Cruyff and Begiristain? And the talk of assessing the academy. Not that I disagree. I do think the Barca model is great and we should focus more on bringing up academy players. I just hope this isn't just one of the projects and they move on to another model if this fails.

Thought FSG had said something

Melbred · « **Reply #3062 on:** April 13, 2012, 07:11:30 am »

Quote from: eirwen on April 13, 2012, 06:56:24 am

Cruyff and Begiristain?

Just rumours though aren't they?

Didi_ram · « **Reply #3063 on:** April 13, 2012, 07:16:34 am »

Quote from: Melbred on April 13, 2012, 07:11:30 am

Just rumours though aren't they?

BBC also mentioning the interest in Cryuff,Txiki and Van Gaal. Sounds credible.And looks like these are the ones we're after/possible candidates.

DutchRed · « **Reply #3064 on:** April 13, 2012, 07:16:53 am »

Quote from: eirwen on April 13, 2012, 07:00:02 am

I wouldn't mind being the English Barcelona.

Neither would I but you won't turn Downing into Messi or Henderson into Iniesta overnight.

alfonso · « **Reply #3065 on:** April 13, 2012, 07:18:14 am »

Quote from: DutchRed on April 13, 2012, 06:59:13 am

It's a sign of ambition to get Johan Cruijff but it won't work. He'll try to turn us into the English Barcelona and will walk away everytime he's not having it his way.

If it stops us buying over priced, over rated British players, then I am all for it.

eirwen · « **Reply #3066 on:** April 13, 2012, 07:21:44 am »

Quote from: DutchRed on April 13, 2012, 07:16:53 am

Neither would I but you won't turn Downing into Messi or Henderson into Iniesta overnight.

Well sure. But those 11 and 12 year olds at the club might have a chance yet.

If we are following Barca's model, it would have to be a long term project.

Liverbird 2010 · « **Reply #3067 on:** April 13, 2012, 07:24:51 am »

Quote from: DutchRed on April 13, 2012, 06:59:13 am

It's a sign of ambition to get Johan Cruijff but it won't work. He'll try to turn us into the English Barcelona and will walk away everytime he's not having it his way.

Well I along with thousands of others wouldnt mind that one bit what so ever

Quote from: alfonso on April 13, 2012, 07:18:14 am

If it stops us buying over priced, over rated British players, then I am all for it.

Indeed

GBF · « **Reply #3068 on:** April 13, 2012, 07:25:37 am »

He doesn't know how crap the world permitted system here when he will try to get non EU players

Alan_X · « **Reply #3069 on:** April 13, 2012, 07:26:50 am »

Quote from: subroc on April 13, 2012, 06:58:04 am

That is precisely what I am worried about - his dismissal seems to hint at this, and I just can't understand that especially coming from American owners well versed with sports management and therefore they should be accepting of modern sports science.

His dismissal (if it was actually a dismissal) doesn't do anything of the kind. If FSG completely disbanding the sports science department at Liverpool makes no sense whatsoever, then it's probably a pretty good indication that it's not going to happen.

The reports are that Bruckner is leaving at the end of the season having established the sports science group and his work is being taken on by others with Burgess as the main man.

eirwen · « **Reply #3070 on:** April 13, 2012, 07:28:42 am »

Quote from: Alan_X on April 13, 2012, 07:26:50 am

His dismissal (if it was actually a dismissal) doesn't do anything of the kind. If FSG completely disbanding the sports science department at Liverpool makes no sense whatsoever, then it's probably a pretty good indication that it's not going to happen.

The reports are that Bruckner is leaving at the end of the season having established the sports science group and his work is being taken on by others with Burgess as the main man.

I don't get the timing of the announcement though. They could have left it at the end of the season. Why announce it on the day Comolli was fired?

nicholasanthony · « **Reply #3071 on:** April 13, 2012, 07:31:15 am »

Quote from: eirwen on April 13, 2012, 07:28:42 am

I don't get the timing of the announcement though. They could have left it at the end of the season. Why announce it on the day Comolli was fired?

Take out the trash day.

Fordy · « **Reply #3072 on:** April 13, 2012, 07:36:05 am »

Quote from: eirwen on April 13, 2012, 07:28:42 am

I don't get the timing of the announcement though. They could have left it at the end of the season. Why announce it on the day Comolli was fired?

The club hasn't announced anything about Brunker - as yet.

pewithree3 · « **Reply #3073 on:** April 13, 2012, 07:40:04 am »

End of financial tax year and when their P60`s were made out,
it was "fuck me" are we paying them that much!

MiserableP15 · « **Reply #3074 on:** April 13, 2012, 07:45:43 am »

Quote from: Fordy on April 13, 2012, 07:36:05 am

The club hasn't announced anything about Brunker - as yet.

They have now.

http://www.liverpoolfc.tv/news/latest-news/peter-brukner-to-leave-liverpool-fc

Fenway Sports Group and Liverpool FC confirmed today that Head of Sports Medicine and Sports Science, Dr Peter Brukner will leave the Club by the end of the season.

Peter Brukner to leave Liverpool FC

Managing Director Ian Ayre said: "We are grateful to Peter who has been the catalyst for the transformation of our Sports Medicine and Sports Science capability at the Club since he joined two years ago. He has been instrumental in re-defining our requirements and bringing first class people into the team, providing us with a great platform to move forward. We wish him all the best for the future."

First team Manager Kenny Dalglish added: "The framework Peter has established has allowed us to see some very real results in relation to our overall levels of fitness and a reduction in injury levels. Peter acted as the key advisor to the club in this regard, and we wish him well in the future."

Peter Brukner commented: "It has been an honour to work at Liverpool Football Club. I am very proud of what we have achieved over the past two years, as can be seen by the reduced injury rate and improved fitness levels. With a world class staff now in place, I feel I have accomplished what I was asked to do by LFC in 2010 and the Club is in good hands. I wish the Club every success in the future."

subroc · « **Reply #3075 on:** April 13, 2012, 07:47:12 am »

Quote from: something awful on April 13, 2012, 06:11:45 am

Think you misread mate,

Right, sorry then.

subroc · « **Reply #3076 on:** April 13, 2012, 07:48:50 am »

Quote from: MushyP15 on April 13, 2012, 07:45:43 am

They have now.

http://www.liverpoolfc.tv/news/latest-news/peter-brukner-to-leave-liverpool-fc

Fenway Sports Group and Liverpool FC confirmed today that Head of Sports Medicine and Sports Science, Dr Peter Brukner will leave the Club by the end of the season.

Peter Brukner to leave Liverpool FC

So he is moving on because he has done all that he set out to do? No problem normally - but why now of all times, on th same day as the dismissal of Comolli and according to one report, the goalkeeping coach as well?

Managing Director Ian Ayre said: "We are grateful to Peter who has been the catalyst for the transformation of our Sports Medicine and Sports Science capability at the Club since he joined two years ago. He has been instrumental in re-defining our requirements and bringing first class people into the team, providing us with a great platform to move forward. We wish him all the best for the future."

First team Manager Kenny Dalglish added: "The framework Peter has established has allowed us to see some very real results in relation to our overall levels of fitness and a reduction in injury levels. Peter acted as the key advisor to the club in this regard, and we wish him well in the future."

Peter Brukner commented: "It has been an honour to work at Liverpool Football Club. I am very proud of what we have achieved over the past two years, as can be seen by the reduced injury rate and improved fitness levels. With a world class staff now in place, I feel I have accomplished what I was asked to do by LFC in 2010 and the Club is in good hands. I wish the Club every success in the future."

But why now, of all the days and times, and on the same day as two dismissals?! The reason does nto compute...

ziggyy · « **Reply #3077 on:** April 13, 2012, 07:48:52 am »

Quote from: pewithree3 on April 13, 2012, 07:40:04 am

End of financial tax year and when their P60`s were made out,
it was "fuck me" are we paying them that much!

Now that you mention it... this is the time where we are given our performance bonuses...

So maybe Bruckner's PB is too low and he decided to throw in his letter;)

Alan_X · « **Reply #3078 on:** April 13, 2012, 07:49:45 am »

Quote from: eirwen on April 13, 2012, 07:28:42 am

I don't get the timing of the announcement though. They could have left it at the end of the season. Why announce it on the day Comolli was fired?

Why not? Why over-complicate things? They are in town and making decisions and announcements about staff.

Let's face it, if they announced it at the end of the season there would be moans along the lines of '...why leave it to the end of the season?... how can we go into the transfer window without a director of sports science in place?..."

People just love a moan and a reason to believe that everything is going to shit. It's sad really. If you believe every story hides some hidden agenda and that there always 'must be more to it...' then the world ceases to have any meaning whatsoever and you lose touch with reality.

What we know is that Comolli has gone and that they are looking for a replacement.

It's understood but not formally announced that Bruckner will be leaving at the end of the season and his replacement will be Darren Burgess who is already at the club.

And err.... that's it.

Reading through some of the hundred odd pages posted in the last twenty-four hours, you'd think the club was in crisis, Kenny's on his last warning, FSG are abandoning sports science and handing medical treatment over to Kenny, who wants a 'jumpers-for-goalposts' retro style attitude with the players eating steaks before the game washed down with a couple of pints, David Dein is taking over as CEO, MD, DOF or some other set of initials, Moneyball is being abandoned (if it s ever actually used), all the players will be devastated by Comolli going and unable to play and so on, and so on ad fucking infinitum...

sideshowme · « **Reply #3079 on:** April 13, 2012, 07:49:45 am »

i find it astonishing that anybody here truly believes the statements released have any bearing on what the actual reasons for these changes might be. we are a good few years and several ghostwriters away from ever getting even the faintest inkling of what's happened at the club over the last 12 months.

football is a lie.