Topic: リバプールへようこそ 遠藤

[kop306]

will be interesting to see if edwards and hughes can find a fabinho replacement

we definaltely missed prime fab in the last 2 matches

endo is fine as a squad option for me next season

there more worrying concern is what will happen to the forward line

apart from jota there is the case that all of them could be sold

[OOS]

Hes boss at breaking up play and not being on the ball. Today, we were giving him the ball and expecting him to do something with it. He was only the stop gap and he's had a great season, performances like today were always going to happen.

[Yorkykopite]

Hes boss at breaking up play and not being on the ball. Today, we were giving him the ball and expecting him to do something with it. He was only the stop gap and he's had a great season, performances like today were always going to happen.

I think that's fair. He was poor today of course, and so conservative on the ball. But there are some stupid comments which blame him for the goal. That was a collective failure and Endo was by no means the chief culprit. Jones was slow to close down, Mac Allister seemed oblivious to the danger and - worst of all - Konate decided to mark a space where there was little threat rather than keep close to Eze. 

[Eeyore]

I think that's fair. He was poor today of course, and so conservative on the ball. But there are some stupid comments which blame him for the goal. That was a collective failure and Endo was by no means the chief culprit. Jones was slow to close down, Mac Allister seemed oblivious to the danger and - worst of all - Konate decided to mark a space where there was little threat rather than keep close to Eze. 

Did Endo do his job?

Did he sense danger and look to snuff it out?

He got criticism for the goal because it's what he does game in game out. Fails to sense danger, fails to react and then simply doesn't have the pace to get back in and recover.

If you are a DM without pace then you have to be constantly moving anticipating danger and getting yourself in good positions. Endo switches off let's people run off him and then can't recover.

[jepovic]

Even with prime Fabinho or Mascherano, we did concede goals. It happens.
I have even heard that Chelsea and Arsenal concede goals, despite having very expensive DMs.

[Draex]

For me Endo excels when the team is firing on all cylinders, I.e. we press as a team, we keep shape. His biggest negative is he isn’t quick over 5 yards, like Mac Allister so when a game becomes frantic and open he struggles, especially when getting a little fatigued (Klopp confirmed this for both Endo and Macca). Ironically this is the same as Fabinho, once the legs of Gini and Hendo left he looked over exposed.

I really hope Bajcetic stays fit, he has everything to become an elite 6.

[Garlic Red]

Even with prime Fabinho or Mascherano, we did concede goals. It happens.
I have even heard that Chelsea and Arsenal concede goals, despite having very expensive DMs.

Of course, but let’s be serious. Fabinho and Mascherano were elite screens in front of the back 4, Mascherano could prevent almost any counter attack on his own at times and regularly taken the best 10s/forwards out the game, Fabinho manned that area of the field on his own, allowing the two 8s to fly (as Jurgen would put it) forward to counter press. Endo’s been solid, reliable and a pleasant surprise, he’s stood out at times as being the only natural defensive player of our midfielders, but the reality is having a dominant 6 takes an awful lot of pressure off the entire side.

I’d keep him for the next few seasons as a squad and utility option, he’s cheap and great value for what we’re paying, but we’ve failed in the last two summer windows to secure any of our priority targets at the position. We can’t make the same mistake this summer.

[Knight]

Hes boss at breaking up play and not being on the ball. Today, we were giving him the ball and expecting him to do something with it. He was only the stop gap and he's had a great season, performances like today were always going to happen.

He’s not very good off the ball though. People assume he is because he makes the occasional crunching tackle (which are, Tbf, very pleasing) but he’s not. None of his defensive numbers (apart from aerials won) are very good.

[Wool]

He’s not very good off the ball though. People assume he is because he makes the occasional crunching tackle (which are, Tbf, very pleasing) but he’s not. None of his defensive numbers (apart from aerials won) are very good.

Yup. If anything he goes rushing out of position too often leaving huge gaps but again it’s silly to criticise Endo because he is what he is. The blame lies elsewhere.

[Draex]

He’s not very good off the ball though. People assume he is because he makes the occasional crunching tackle (which are, Tbf, very pleasing) but he’s not. None of his defensive numbers (apart from aerials won) are very good.

He's not that bad, and it looks even worse when the team has half of it pressing high and the other half passive pressing. Our entire structure has been gash.

[Knight]

He's not that bad, and it looks even worse when the team has half of it pressing high and the other half passive pressing. Our entire structure has been gash.

Yeah that doesn’t help. But in terms of defensive output MacAllister does a lot more than him at 6 and not many are saying MacAllister is great off the ball. Although as it happens he’s really quite good off the ball! I’m pretty convinced at this point that we can’t carry as many unathletic players as we have been. Perhaps it’ll be different with a new manager but Mac and Endo in one Klopp midfield just doesn’t work. Means we can’t start Elliot in midfield also, which isn’t ideal. When you combine that with a few ageing players and Gapko who mostly doesn’t use his athletic gifts (although his cameo Sunday was encouraging) we sometimes seem quite one paced. It’s no where near as bad as last season but it’s still there.

[Eeyore]

For me Endo excels when the team is firing on all cylinders, I.e. we press as a team, we keep shape. His biggest negative is he isn’t quick over 5 yards, like Mac Allister so when a game becomes frantic and open he struggles, especially when getting a little fatigued (Klopp confirmed this for both Endo and Macca). Ironically this is the same as Fabinho, once the legs of Gini and Hendo left he looked over exposed.

I really hope Bajcetic stays fit, he has everything to become an elite 6.

The role of an elite 6 though is to bail the team out when other players make mistakes. To sense danger and drop in and cover areas that get exposed. To snuff out counterattacks either legitimately or by taking one for the team. Endo can't do that usually because he gets himself the wrong side of the ball or because he is already on a yellow after charging towards the ball and getting their late.

He gets yellows because of his own mistakes. The likes of Rodri or Fernandinho committed fouls to cover up other players mistakes. For me he should be doing the job Milner did coming on late in games when we are ahead and stiffening up the midfield. Almost playing as a closer coming on as a dual six and getting people's faces and above all adding aerial ability when we are defending set pieces late on. He should be starting the early Cup games and being the experienced pro.

In short he simply isn't good enough to be the starting 6 for as side that should be looking to compete for the title and Champions League next season.

[Draex]

Yeah that doesn’t help. But in terms of defensive output MacAllister does a lot more than him at 6 and not many are saying MacAllister is great off the ball. Although as it happens he’s really quite good off the ball! I’m pretty convinced at this point that we can’t carry as many unathletic players as we have been. Perhaps it’ll be different with a new manager but Mac and Endo in one Klopp midfield just doesn’t work. Means we can’t start Elliot in midfield also, which isn’t ideal. When you combine that with a few ageing players and Gapko who mostly doesn’t use his athletic gifts (although his cameo Sunday was encouraging) we sometimes seem quite one paced. It’s no where near as bad as last season but it’s still there.

Mac and Endo did play well together, but they look to be shattered which on slow players isn't good!

[Eeyore]

Mac and Endo did play well together, but they look to be shattered which on slow players isn't good!

We were still conceding too many chances though even when they were playing well. We still had runners being allowed to run off the back of them. We weren't being punished though. The likes of Ali and Kelleher were pulling off 1v1's.

It started in the FA Cup game versus United. 1st goal runner gets in behind the right-hand side of our defence. There is a scramble and United score. Second goal Anthony gets the wrong side of Endo and they score. They were the things we were getting away with.

Atalanta Kelleher makes a great save keeps us level. Then makes a mistake for the first goal after they get in behind the left side of our defence. Time and time again we get carved open by 3rd man runs that don't get tracked. They have been happening all season we were just getting away with them. When we pus the full backs up or they go to press then either the 6 drops into the space or the 6 drops between the centrebacks and one of the centrebacks drops into the space.

Look at the first Atalanta goal Endo watches the left side press the ball leaving a player free on their wide right. He then ambles back and simply remains passive. He either has to drop into the space or drop between the centrebacks. Same with the second goal Virgil has been dragged out to the space behind the full back. Endo has to sprint and get in between the centrebacks. He doesn't he goes from being almost level with VVD to ten yards behind the play.

He doesn't sense danger and he doesn't think like a 6. He plays the game like he is a deep 8 and not a defensive midfield player. He thinks someone else is going to do his job for him. 

[BCCC]

The role of an elite 6 though is to bail the team out when other players make mistakes.

He's not an elite 6 so why the fuck do you continue to compare him against what he's not? He's come to the club and given his best and that's all you can ask. Not only that he's given the team far more than anyone expected of him so what more can he do and why is it his fault?

I can understand calling out players for not giving 100%, maybe a kick up the backside when they're way off form but this lad knows he isn't first on the list of Liverpool's transfer targets but he's took the challenge, backed himself and by no measure disgraced himself yet you are on some sort of crusade to put the spotlight on him and call him out if he so much as farts at the wrong time.

You've got your opinion but micro analysis of a player for every mistake then comparing him to players in a different talent bracket is fucking boring. As the old saying goes, if you've not got anything constructive to say, then say fuck all.

[classycarra]

As the old saying goes, if you've not got anything constructive to say, then say fuck all.

feels valid in the context of you repeatedly writing appraisals about posters who dare to have an opinion about a footballer on that footballers thread on an opinion forum.

at least you might now stop telling people off, and saying people should apply for the managers job (for doing the same things you do), for thinking that he's one of our best midfielders or makes Mac better

[Knight]

He's not an elite 6 so why the fuck do you continue to compare him against what he's not? He's come to the club and given his best and that's all you can ask. Not only that he's given the team far more than anyone expected of him so what more can he do and why is it his fault?

I can understand calling out players for not giving 100%, maybe a kick up the backside when they're way off form but this lad knows he isn't first on the list of Liverpool's transfer targets but he's took the challenge, backed himself and by no measure disgraced himself yet you are on some sort of crusade to put the spotlight on him and call him out if he so much as farts at the wrong time.

You've got your opinion but micro analysis of a player for every mistake then comparing him to players in a different talent bracket is fucking boring. As the old saying goes, if you've not got anything constructive to say, then say fuck all.

Could some of your anger towards micro analysis of a player's mistakes be taken to Nunez's thread please. He gets far more micro analysis than Endo on here and unlike Endo he's actually elite and yet still gets huge criticism.

[Eeyore]

He's not an elite 6 so why the fuck do you continue to compare him against what he's not? He's come to the club and given his best and that's all you can ask. Not only that he's given the team far more than anyone expected of him so what more can he do and why is it his fault?

I can understand calling out players for not giving 100%, maybe a kick up the backside when they're way off form but this lad knows he isn't first on the list of Liverpool's transfer targets but he's took the challenge, backed himself and by no measure disgraced himself yet you are on some sort of crusade to put the spotlight on him and call him out if he so much as farts at the wrong time.

You've got your opinion but micro analysis of a player for every mistake then comparing him to players in a different talent bracket is fucking boring. As the old saying goes, if you've not got anything constructive to say, then say fuck all.

If he isn't an elite 6 then why a couple of weeks ago were you posting this.

You're preaching to the converted here, Endo makes Mac Allister better as far as I'm concerned. A few pages back I said my midfield of choice is Endo, Mac Allister +1 other.

Would've won it earlier if Endo was behind him as he'd have played higher up the park.

Missed the lad tonight

The best one though was that Modric wouldn't get a game ahead of him.

[BCCC]

If he isn't an elite 6 then why a couple of weeks ago were you posting this.

The best one though was that Modric wouldn't get a game ahead of him.

There's nothing in there saying I think he's an elite 6 and yes he makes Mac Allister better because he allows him to occupy the 8 position and Endo at his best for us gets in ahead of Modric who no longer starts for Madrid and isn't the best 6 anyway like Mac Allister. And let's be clear, I'm not comparing him to Modric at his best unlike you.

Easy to spin by pulling quotes which is what you get off on, I stand by what I said and unlike you don't go on player witch hunts.

That'll give you something to "research" from my legacy posts or you could do something positive.

[jepovic]

Poor first half, but came out as a different player in second half.
Would not trade him for Pailinha, thats for sure

[MonsLibpool]

Good performance from a good pro.

[Draex]

Poor first half, but came out as a different player in second half.
Would not trade him for Pailinha, thats for sure

He's been really weird last few games, played within himself, once he started taking the ball on the turn and pushing forward we started making things happen.

[JP!]

Yeah thought he was great 2nd half, needed to be really to get us moving.

[Eeyore]

He's been really weird last few games, played within himself, once he started taking the ball on the turn and pushing forward we started making things happen.

It's not weird it's pretty normal. He isn't quick enough at the start of games but gets better as the game opens up and his endurance comes to the fore.

[Knight]

Does he pass forward, ever? I want to see his pass map from today, not sure if it was just my perception.

[Draex]

Does he pass forward, ever? I want to see his pass map from today, not sure if it was just my perception.

The pass to Salah which he overhit the simple assist for Nunez? Pretty sure that was forwards.

[JP!]

Does he pass forward, ever? I want to see his pass map from today, not sure if it was just my perception.

He definitely hit some that I can think of (one wide to Gakpo sticks in the mind).  He was frustrating in the first half though. It's strange as until the last few games I think he's been pretty forward-thinking.

[Knight]

He definitely hit some that I can think of (one wide to Gakpo sticks in the mind).  He was frustrating in the first half though. It's strange as until the last few games I think he's been pretty forward-thinking.

Yeah it was my surprise with him, worse off the ball but better at progressive passing than I thought he'd be. He's one of the reasons we're so ponderous in possession right now though, no progressive intent at all. Not the only one obviously.

[Dree]

Teams know to press him as he’s slow and we’ll give him the ball in isolation. Need Mac back as the 6 or change shape slightly.

[JP!]

Yeah it was my surprise with him, worse off the ball but better at progressive passing than I thought he'd be. He's one of the reasons we're so ponderous in possession right now though, no progressive intent at all. Not the only one obviously.

He upped his game 2nd half and we looked much better so I'd agree with that.

[MonsLibpool]

Teams know to press him as he’s slow and we’ll give him the ball in isolation. Need Mac back as the 6 or change shape slightly.

We got around that by playing Trent. He didn't need to try passes he can't play.

All he had to do was to give it to Trent who could then play if forward. I prefer that to him forcing passes.

[jepovic]

I think our midfield problems are bigger further forward than 6.
Our 8s often hide and wait for some miraculous pass from Endo or o Trent
 Only Mac has shown a consistent high level

[Eeyore]

He definitely hit some that I can think of (one wide to Gakpo sticks in the mind).  He was frustrating in the first half though. It's strange as until the last few games I think he's been pretty forward-thinking.

He is much better coming on to the ball when he is facing the opposition goal. He has good technique and hits vertical passes with great authority. His problem is when he is facing our goal. He hasn't got the speed to dart away from a marker and ping a pass off and doesn't have the strength to hold off an opponent.

That means he can't play on the half turn or play it around the corner so ends up just playing it backwards.

[DHRED]

He is much better coming on to the ball when he is facing the opposition goal. He has good technique and hits vertical passes with great authority. His problem is when he is facing our goal. He hasn't got the speed to dart away from a marker and ping a pass off and doesn't have the strength to hold off an opponent.

That means he can't play on the half turn or play it around the corner so ends up just playing it backwards.

Did Endo piss in your cereal at some point in life?

[PEG2K]

I think he has good games and bad games, just like most players do. His strengths and weaknesses are all there to see. No need to overanalyse or repeat things over and over again.

And this season he has been good more than bad. 

[Eeyore]

Did Endo piss in your cereal at some point in life?

Why would a post giving praise and criticism in equal measure result in that kind of response.

I forgot it its the Endo thread in which hyperbole rules.

[Kashinoda]

I think he has good games and bad games, just like most players do. His strengths and weaknesses are all there to see. No need to overanalyse or repeat things over and over again.

And this season he has been good more than bad. 

Then Al would have no reason to exist.

[Fromola]

I think he's mostly just knackered at this point. He's not played in Europe before and used to middle-of-the table Bundesliga seasons with a long winter breaks. No break this season plus the Asia Cup in the middle. He might not be anything like a Rodri or Rice but he's a solid performer. We don't make it easy for our 6.

I'd probably sit him out on Wednesday and put him back in Saturday.

[classycarra]

I think our midfield problems are bigger further forward than 6.
Our 8s often hide and wait for some miraculous pass from Endo or o Trent
 Only Mac has shown a consistent high level

it's like we're watching different sports, if you genuinely think either of  those two things!

Al took so much stick for pointing out a game when Endo wasn't comfortable receiving possession, so didn't make himself available in his usual ways - and those who follow him rode that inside 'joke' for months. this on the other hand is just entirely made up!

probably haven't had a set of 8s more comfortable receiving the ball (and keen to - sometimes to a fault) under Klopp and maybe even going back to the 80s.

and I don't think you need to watch more than a couple of games to see that our team absolutely do not "wait"/hope for/expect Endo to make miraculous passes. on the contrary, if in a period of possession the CBs and midfielders have left a more difficult pass to Endo - demanding enough to stretch the limits of his range (which pretty good but not great, but most importantly not close to the rest of theirs) - it's evident we haven't been playing to our gameplan. it's not what he's been brought to do, and he's smart enough to mostly not force long passes that arn't on

[red vinyl]

Early on today he got caught or played a bad pass and that’s the movement up top. He is improving all aspects of his game week by week.