Topic: FA Cup: Wolves 2 v Liverpool 1 Jimenez ‘37 Neves ‘55 Origi ‘50

[jepovic]

Part of the reason the FA cup is irrelevant nowadays is that the top teams don't field their best players, so last night was just another nail in that coffin. It doesn't have any prestige anymore. Can't be arsed though, there are way too many games and FA has done nothing to make the cup more attractive. The injury on Lovren just proves Klopp right in using the squad players.

[deFacto please, you bastards]

We're not Man City is just a cop-out.

We can compete with City on the pitch, we can compete with them so far in the league results wise, but what we can't compete is with their ability to have the quality of squad as they do. That's not a cop out, that's a matter of truth.

In this particular instance , the actual draw itself for both the FA cup and the league cup was a massive disadvantage in comparison to everyone else. [We were thoroughly better than Chelsea and should have gone through]

[deFacto please, you bastards]

Part of the reason the FA cup is irrelevant nowadays is that the top teams don't field their best players, so last night was just another nail in that coffin. It doesn't have any prestige anymore. Can't be arsed though, there are way too many games and FA has done nothing to make the cup more attractive. The injury on Lovren just proves Klopp right in using the squad players.

and the injury to Henderson,Lallana and whatever issue Van Dijk is having, as he was supposed to play. The injuries and lack of options at the back for this game was an issue for us going forward, we couldn't risk to be more open as we were trying to maintain shape, due to the weaknesses at the back

For depth to work, the players that come in need to perform, and in this instance they didn't. Between Keita,Milner,Sturridge,Shaqiri there was enough quality to perform better than what they did.

[Caligula?]

Ok please tell me are you saying we need 25 players who no matter who we play in whatever competition we should be beating a good PL side?

No squad is perfect. Look at City with Fernandinho.

I'm not saying that. City probably have the squad to fight for the title, the Champions League, and get all the way to the final of the FA Cup and probably even win it. Sadly, we don't. But I just think that progressing ONE more round, or even two wouldn't have made all that much difference to our season in the grand scheme of things. In other words, playing Stoke or Shrewsbury in the next round wouldn't have in itself scuppered our title bid. It's the 4th time in a row we've gone out in January. Saying "We're not City" after every defeat and cup exit makes everything rather pointless, no? No one is City, but that shouldn't stop anyone from competing.

Again, circumstances are such that we've got bigger things to focus on and look forward to so this will be easily forgotten. I'm not too fussed myself, and if we do go on to win the league this season this match will be wiped from all existence for pretty much all eternity. But I understand the sentiment of some on here, particularly those who have fond memories of us regularly reaching the latter stages of this competition back in the day and regularly winning trophies, no matter what they were.

[deFacto please, you bastards]

I'm not saying that. City probably have the squad to fight for the title, the Champions League, and get all the way to the final of the FA Cup and probably even win it. Sadly, we don't. But I just think that progressing ONE more round, or even two wouldn't have made all that much difference to our season in the grand scheme of things. In other words, playing Stoke or Shrewsbury in the next round wouldn't have in itself scuppered our title bid. It's the 4th time in a row we've gone out in January. Saying "We're not City" after every defeat and cup exit makes everything rather pointless, no? No one is City, but that shouldn't stop anyone from competing.

Again, circumstances are such that we've got bigger things to focus on and look forward to so this will be easily forgotten. I'm not to fussed myself, and if we do go on to win the league this season this match will be wiped from all existence for pretty much all eternity. But I understand the sentiment of some on here, particularly those who have fond memories of us regularly reaching the latter stages of this competition back in the day and regularly winning trophies, no matter what they were.

We were in a league cup final in Klopp's first season. We've been in two European cup finals recently. Some on here make it sound like the club the manager and players can't be arsed winning or trying to win.

Competing in four competitions even three is extremely difficult. This same City side got knocked out by Wigan last year.

If it were easy, you'd have sides winning the treble on a consistent basis  yet it's happend 3 times [in variations] in the last 19 years.

[killer-heels]

I'm not saying that. City probably have the squad to fight for the title, the Champions League, and get all the way to the final of the FA Cup and probably even win it. Sadly, we don't. But I just think that progressing ONE more round, or even two wouldn't have made all that much difference to our season in the grand scheme of things. In other words, playing Stoke or Shrewsbury in the next round wouldn't have in itself scuppered our title bid. It's the 4th time in a row we've gone out in January. Saying "We're not City" after every defeat and cup exit makes everything rather pointless, no? No one is City, but that shouldn't stop anyone from competing.

Again, circumstances are such that we've got bigger things to focus on and look forward to so this will be easily forgotten. I'm not too fussed myself, and if we do go on to win the league this season this match will be wiped from all existence for pretty much all eternity. But I understand the sentiment of some on here, particularly those who have fond memories of us regularly reaching the latter stages of this competition back in the day and regularly winning trophies, no matter what they were.

Even City dont have that depth. They lost in the 4th round of the cup last season.

Circumstances is the key word. No one can say that City absolutely win that game with 10 or 11 changes. But they got Rotherham and we got Wolves.

[Ravishing Rick Dude]

Maybe but we have done that. Lets not forget that the likes of Mignolet, Moreno, Matip, Lallana etc. have dropped out the side.

We were missing Matip, Gomez, Lallana as well as the regular lads. I am not really sure how many sides we need that can twat Wolves at their place.

If we had lost to Rotherham at home we could say the club needs more squad players. But we lost to a good PL team at their place.

We needed to start Alisson, VVD and one of our three main strikers. Even City who played a much weaker opponent, started Sterling, Ederson and Stones.

[killer-heels]

We needed to start Alisson, VVD and one of our three main strikers. Even City who played a much weaker opponent, started Sterling, Ederson and Stones.

We started Lovren but he got injured. So really we should have started Alisson and Salah.

We are just short of City in terms of depth. We need another attacker but short of that its not far off.

[ScubaSteve]

We needed to start Alisson, VVD and one of our three main strikers. Even City who played a much weaker opponent, started Sterling, Ederson and Stones.

I’d say yes to Allison but not the other two. Imagine if it VVD getting injured opposed to Lovren all because we started him in a cup we’re just not arsed about

Our next match can’t come soon enough now and it HAS to be a win. If we lose or draw the wheels are defo coming off

[Craig_Bellamy]

We needed to start Alisson, VVD and one of our three main strikers. Even City who played a much weaker opponent, started Sterling, Ederson and Stones.

and that is their decision - I'm fully comitted to LFC and couldn't give a rats arse about what City is up to - they have a WAY different set of 2. and 3. range players - hopefully they will go far, VERY far in this tournament.

normally i'd want os to do well i every cup we're playing, but normally we aren't in this great position considering our league + Cl ambitions.

for me it's a matter of game manegemnt and priorities; we fielded the right team (i'd personally had kept Lovren out of it since he has a history, but otherwise) and had we gone through great, now we didn't oh well NEXT !

[jepovic]

Even if we could afford a bigger squad of good players, we couldn't keep them motivated to stay just for the FA and league cup games. Top players want to play against other top players in games that matter.

Take someone like Clyne. We could have played him yesterday,and if we would have won we could have used him in the next round. But in a cup final he would still not play. That's not very motivating for a senior player in hist best years.

[Frank Becton]

We needed to start Alisson, VVD and one of our three main strikers. Even City who played a much weaker opponent, started Sterling, Ederson and Stones.

They also brought in Mahrez, Walker, Jesus , De Bruyne and others from the team that started against us.
Whether it’s Rotherham or Wolves, we don’t have that depth in reserve. Nobody does.

[deFacto please, you bastards]

We needed to start Alisson, VVD and one of our three main strikers. Even City who played a much weaker opponent, started Sterling, Ederson and Stones.

Van Dijk is injured. What City do is irrelevant to what we do pertaining to fitness and injury issues. City made 9 changes since they played us.

[killer-heels]

Van Dijk is injured. What City do is irrelevant to what we do pertaining to fitness and injury issues. City made 9 changes since they played us.

The argument here is that people are pissed off that our squad isnt as good as City’s. However, the idea that City beat Wolves away no matter what side they play is wrong.

[deFacto please, you bastards]

The argument here is that people are pissed off that our squad isnt as good as City’s. However, the idea that City beat Wolves away no matter what side they play is wrong.

This in a nutshell. Wolves have given every full strength top side problems this season [we fought hard for a 2-0 win weeks ago].

I guarantee that had we gone full strength and one of the key players got injured on top of the injuries we already have, there would have been outrage.

Damned if you do, damned if you don't.

[killer-heels]

This in a nutshell. Wolves have given every full strength top side problems this season [we fought hard for a 2-0 win weeks ago].

I guarantee that had we gone full strength and one of the key players got injured on top of the injuries we already have, there would have been outrage.

Damned if you do, damned if you don't.

When people have deduced and accepted that fact then the only question left is should we have played our strongest side or not. If we had done then quite simply that is you telling me that the FA Cup is as important as the league and CL in this current circumstance.

Well, it isnt. It might be if we are out of the CL and 3rd, 4th or below in the league. But we are not.

[rob1966]

The argument here is that people are pissed off that our squad isnt as good as City’s. However, the idea that City beat Wolves away no matter what side they play is wrong.

People need to remember City were lucky to get a draw at Molyneux just a few months ago.

The only change I would have made last night was Alisson for Mignolet. Swap them over and that first doesn't get scored and I'm not sure about the second, I feel he left far too much of his right side open.

[killer-heels]

People need to remember City were lucky to get a draw at Molyneux just a few months ago.

The only change I would have made last night was Alisson for Mignolet. Swap them over and that first doesn't get scored and I'm not sure about the second, I feel he left far too much of his right side open.

Yesterday we had Lovren and Fabinho that are probably nailed on first choices. But we were then missing the rest of our best side plus Gomez, Matip, Lallana and Oxlade-Chamberlain.

Definitely we need to look at the durability of the likes of Lallana, Lovren and Matip. We also need another attacker in my opinion who is closer to Salah and Mane’s level. But bloody hell I dont know how many more players people expect us to have that can beat Wolves and who are 2nd and 3rd choices.

[jillcwhomever]

The same posters on here who told everyone that we now have a squad to cope with 3-4 competitions will then just revert and say "But we don't have the squad depth" and "But, but... Manchester City!" when we're knocked out or out of the running in 2-3 of those competitions.

I don't recall anyone saying we can fight for four competitions. As long as the FA run football the way they do, City are probably the only team who can do that, and even they struggle with it from time to time. But it seems some of our fans expect that. I've said all along we need just one domestic cup competition. Putting the FA Cup right after Christmas forces managers to prioritise more. Have just one Cup competition move it to another part of the season, then you will get stronger teams. But I am not going condemn the manager for resting players especially after losing yet another CB on the night. But apparrently some on here want us to slog the whole team out. Do that and we clearly won't win anything.

[Zoomers]

Missed the game but that goal from Origi was beautiful.

[Alan_X]

The argument here is that people are pissed off that our squad isnt as good as City’s. However, the idea that City beat Wolves away no matter what side they play is wrong.

Man City only managed a draw at Wolves earlier this season with a line-up of Sterling, Aguero, both Silvas, Fernandinho, Gundogan, Mendy, Laporte, Kompany, Walker and Moraes in goal.

[Cheesehead]

It seems as tho I’m in the minority with w wanting to go through and being gutted at being out. What have we become as a club and fan base? 

[Funky_Gibbons]

Anyone found out yet where Milner was running too when Wolves scored their first?

[spider-neil]

It seems as tho I’m in the minority with w wanting to go through and being gutted at being out. What have we become as a club and fan base? 

Everyone wanted us to go through but there has to be perspective and context.

[Cheesehead]

Anyone found out yet where Milner was running too when Wolves scored their first?

May as well have been running back to Liverpool as it seems no one wanted to be there!

[jillcwhomever]

It seems as tho I’m in the minority with w wanting to go through and being gutted at being out. What have we become as a club and fan base? 

Or maybe others are being more realistic taking into account how the game is being run. It's the manager who will get bashed, but you know what it's the way the game is run currently which needs to be in the spotlight more. But instead more managers will be put under pressure for something that can be put right if those at the top of the game used their imagination and were less greedy.

[Cheesehead]

Everyone wanted us to go through but there has to be perspective and context.

That isn’t true at all. Even those who would rather we go through aren’t arsed. Says it all really, so sad.

[Funky_Gibbons]

Everyone wanted us to go through but there has to be perspective and context.

You didn't read the pregame thread? Quite a few people were saying they hope we lose.

[Cheesehead]

Or maybe others are being more realistic taking into account how the game is being run. It's the manager who will get bashed, but you know what it's the way the game is run currently which needs to be in the spotlight more. But instead more managers will be put under pressure for something that can be put right if those at the top of the game used their imagination and were less greedy.

Why are you being cryptic? What’s this about how the game is being run? We’ve virtually thrown the FA Cup. That’s not on. Or are we above it now?

[Funky_Gibbons]

May as well have been running back to Liverpool as it seems no one wanted to be there!

Milner had a bad game, but he at least looked arsed and didn’t hide at all.

[spider-neil]

You didn't read the pregame thread? Quite a few people were saying they hope we lose.

Okay, fair enough. I not one of those people but I definitely understand why there was rotation and when you bring in so many different players and lots of players who have barely had a kick all season then you are likely to have a disjointed display.

[jillcwhomever]

Why are you being cryptic? What’s this about how the game is being run? We’ve virtually thrown the FA Cup. That’s not on. Or are we above it now?

We have too many cup competitions. We only need one, fold the League Cup put the FA Cup earlier n the season, managers won't be forced into changing teams in the same way. It's because the cup follows on from the most intense part of the season we get these issues.

[redk84]

I have 2 different conversations going on in my mind about last night..

1) "Going out the FA Cup means we can concentrate on the league/CL"

The above I usually don't agree with. It's been a while since we won silverware, I believe that winning brings about a winning mentality and in seasons whereby we are realistically nowhere near winning the League I would say that this is a shit mentality to have.

But this season is different. We are 4 points clear at the top, if having some extra time off for our squad means it will benefit us in the league then I guess so be it....
Whether warm weather training camps and a week off from competitive matches helps this then fine

2) The performance last night from the players that were on the pitch.

Ok, so you put a bunch of players together that hardly play against a team that are quite good at home and you are already on the backfoot.

The pitch was definitely shit but it was for both teams.

But there were some rubbish performances out there last night and the fact that it came from some players that were not youth, but players possibly angling for a move elsewhere or trying to establish themselves higher up the pecking order in the squad was inexcusable. Where was the hunger? Aggressiveness?....the want to show Klopp he should be paying more attention to you as a player?

The fact that Wolves did not need to play that well to beat us is very disappointing. I don't like losing, let alone losing without trying that hard and I don't think some of the players applied themselves in the best way

Positives - Hoever and the fact a lot of our first 11 were rested
Negatives - the performance, being out another cup and Lovren being injured

Not a good night for the club, but yes we can make positives out of this situation....starting on the weekend against Brighton

[ChaChaMooMoo]

Everyone wanted us to go through but there has to be perspective and context.

Arent they sort of mutually exclusive?

Sadly, with 2 domestic cup competitions, the league and Europe, it is impossible to compete with a standard crop of 18 players. So we look at the reserve team, youth teams and players seeking to regain fitness and/or game time to prove their worth.

If we bow out of a cup competition, sad it may seem that we only see them as a second class trophy, but nevertheless, it reflects on the quality of the reserve team, youth teams and players seeking to regain fitness and/or game time to prove their worth.

In an ideal world, it should be the case. If its a trophy, we compete for it from the first round until the final whistle in the final game. This is the reason why we have

FA CUP WINNERS. 7 times.
LEAGUE CUP WINNERS. 8 times.
CHARITY SHIELD WINNERS. 15 times.

Because, in my opinion, the league and the champions league arent the only trophies around. Lucrative they are. But they are not the only trophy.

Our aim should be to have a team of players, with mix of experience and youth from all teams under LFC's umbrella with the philosophies - if you are good enough, you are old enough. If you are in a competition, then play to win it.

Sadly some fans overlook the latter.

[redk84]

We have too many cup competitions. We only need one, fold the League Cup put the FA Cup earlier n the season, managers won't be forced into changing teams in the same way. It's because the cup follows on from the most intense part of the season we get these issues.

Absolutely this.
Times have changed and the league cup is in its own merit a fantastic competition, would be sad to see it go but how many other leagues have 2 domestic cup competitions?

[PhilV]

comments like this are VERY evertonian.... 

[Andy @ Allerton!]

So  are you advocating fielding a weakened team in the Champions League too Andy ?

I'd expect a stronger team, but if it came to a decision between a chance at the league or the 'Champions' League then it's league every single time for me.

Although cup games are great and I go to home and some aways and finals and the like - we haven't won the league for nigh on thirty years. If Klopp won 5 'Champions' Leagues in a row and still we didn't win the league then I'd count that as failure. We didn't bring in Klopp to win more cups. We brought him in to challenge for the league.

If we did win 5 'Champions' Leagues, 4 FA Cups, 4 League Cups, 3 Super Cups, 3 World Club Cups and zero leagues - would you see that as 'success'?

I wouldn't. We're a cup team. When we last won the league all those years ago, I certainly didn't think we'd be here with zero leagues under our belt. We might as well be Spurs. We've come close to winning the league on a few occasions, but it's not good enough.

When push comes to shove, we need to win the league. No ifs. No buts.

That's just my personal opinion though and no one can say I'm not a 'proper fan that doesn't go to Cup games' either.

[WillG.LFC]

These decisions can't really be truly analysed till the end of the season. If we win the league or champions league it will be vindicated. If we went full strength and injured some key players or then lost v brighton fans would ask why did we go full strength v wolves. Klopp is paid to make these decisions and has us going where we want to be. Trust in his decisions.

[clinical]

is Nathaniel Phillips injured?

[Djimi Smicer34]

is Nathaniel Phillips injured?

Yes.