Topic: Preseason tour summer 2018 - sponsored by Findus (other products are available)

[afc tukrish]

Probably fitness issue, wasn't at the levels required

He wanted to be fit, his body wouldn't let him...

[Djozer]

Thought it was great that Karius got a round of applause after halftime from our fans behind the goal, he looked dead grateful and returned the gesture.

Up with this sort of thing.

[So… Howard Philips]

Up with this sort of thing.

Don't tell that gobshite Len Brennan.

[number 168]

Thought it was great that Karius got a round of applause after halftime from our fans behind the goal, he looked dead grateful and returned the gesture.

Up with this sort of thing.

Yes a real testimony to the quality of our support. Shame the idiotic jeering he got later on from the home fans has been attributed by some outlets as being from us. He is one of us and needs as much support as we can give him.

[Goalposts for Jumpers]

This was posted on Monday (what felt like hundreds of pages ago  ) but seeing as I was busy this week I decided to leave it to this weekend to address.

Jumpers, just in case you're still interested here's a touch map for Ryan & Harry. A couple of pointers:

Ball Touch - "Used when a player makes a bad touch on the ball and loses possession.
      Outcome 1 || ball simply hit the player unintentionally. Outcome 0 || Player unsuccessfully controlled the ball."

Dispossessed - Player is successfully tackled and loses possession of the ball.

Take-on - 0: Unsuccessful    1: Successful




If you would like to see them compared to any other player for reference's sake or some other event included let me know.

PS: This is all the event data for Championship and Bundesliga league games for the 207-2018 season. It does not include cup competition or U23. So that's 12 games for Harry and 16 for Ryan

Cheers JCB - this is really interesting.

So, if i'm reading this correctly, of Kent's 30 touches in his own half, he did not manage to control the ball 11 times (yellow X) and controlled it 4 times (yellow dot), was dispossessed 6 times (blue dots), and he tried to take on a player(s) 9 times, of which 8 failed (red X) and 1 was successful (red dot).

Wilson, on the other hand, had very little involvement in his own half, touching the ball 11 times. Of these he did not manage to control the ball 4 times (yellow X) and controlled it 2 times (yellow dot), was dispossessed 2 times (blue dots), and he tried to take on a player(s) 3 times, of which 2 failed (red X) and 1 was successful (red dot).

The two were clearly playing different roles, but you would struggle to trust either to retain the ball consistently. Wilson playing much further forward limits this weakness, and this is certainly something we could incorporate if he is taking Salah's role. It certainly shows why Ryan passes the eye test so well, but can't get a game at the highest level.

Interesting stuff. Cheers!!

[commando]

Funny today when one of our players getting megged by a Bury player got the biggest cheer of the day.  It was just like Everton getting a corner in an Anfield derby.

[Bobinhood]

Just watched that, clearly that was a Klopp pre-season special the guys were dead on their feet.  They must hate Kornmeyer: "Again! clapclapclap. Again! Harder his time."  Only English words he knows it seems. Every pre season under Klopp they have one or two of these where they are just basically shells of human beings, Klopp roars about it really I think he finds it amusing. All part of the plan.

Must say that Naby dangle in the box though, he sat 2 of them right down on the ground and left a 3rd flailing, it was very Mo in nature, thats your takeaway from this baby.  Maaad skills. Mad.

[deFacto please, you bastards]

Just watched that, clearly that was a Klopp pre-season special the guys were dead on their feet.  They must hate Kornmeyer: "Again! clapclapclap. Again! Harder his time."  Only English words he knows it seems. Every pre season under Klopp they have one or two of these where they are just basically shells of human beings, Klopp roars about it really I think he finds it amusing. All part of the plan.

Must say that Naby dangle in the box though, he sat 2 of them right down on the ground and left a 3rd flailing, it was very Mo in nature, thats your takeaway from this baby.  Maaad skills. Mad.

Yeah I think it entertains him  he even mentioned it in his post match comments, how it's probably his fault 

[Rush 82]

Yeah I think it entertains him  he even mentioned it in his post match comments, how it's probably his fault 

He loves it.

'Had a nice holiday eh! Sun and sand eh! Pizza and beer everyday eh! We'll see about that. '

[So… Howard Philips]

Yes a real testimony to the quality of our support. Shame the idiotic jeering he got later on from the home fans has been attributed by some outlets as being from us. He is one of us and needs as much support as we can give him.

Did the jeering emanate from the Neville Neville stand by any chance?

[Hazell]

Thought it was great that Karius got a round of applause after halftime from our fans behind the goal, he looked dead grateful and returned the gesture.

Up with this sort of thing.

Nice to read that.

[JCB]

Cheers JCB - this is really interesting.

So, if i'm reading this correctly, of Kent's 30 touches in his own half, he did not manage to control the ball 11 times (yellow X) and controlled it 4 times (yellow dot), was dispossessed 6 times (blue dots), and he tried to take on a player(s) 9 times, of which 8 failed (red X) and 1 was successful (red dot).

Wilson, on the other hand, had very little involvement in his own half, touching the ball 11 times. Of these he did not manage to control the ball 4 times (yellow X) and controlled it 2 times (yellow dot), was dispossessed 2 times (blue dots), and he tried to take on a player(s) 3 times, of which 2 failed (red X) and 1 was successful (red dot).

The two were clearly playing different roles, but you would struggle to trust either to retain the ball consistently. Wilson playing much further forward limits this weakness, and this is certainly something we could incorporate if he is taking Salah's role. It certainly shows why Ryan passes the eye test so well, but can't get a game at the highest level.

Interesting stuff. Cheers!!

If you ignore the blue circles (successful take-ons) every mark on the pitch is a time the player lost the ball. Maybe I should have left them out but seeing as you were interested in where a player lost the ball I thought it best to include them as it would give you an overall idea of where a player was attempting their 'risky manoeuvres'.

The yellow symbols show where a player looses the ball whilst it's in his possession due to miscontrol of the ball, however the circles in this case represent  cases where the ball simply rebounded off of him and therefore could possibly be argued not to be his fault in the grand scheme of things

This graphic does not include passes so it does not show all touches made by a player... that unfortunately would clutter the pitch way too much and make it useless. It's simply an attempt to see where a player looses the ball. In hindsight maybe I should have simply removed all circles.

[Clint Eastwood]

Saw the round of applause for Karius, good stuff!

James Pearce's piece in the Echo is very negative, he's sounding like we just got knocked out of the League Cup or something.

[El Lobo]

Saw the round of applause for Karius, good stuff!

James Pearce's piece in the Echo is very negative, he's sounding like we just got knocked out of the League Cup or something.

He’s right though, in a way

If it wasn’t a friendly, and it wasn’t pre season, and it was the League Cup and we’d lost instead of drawn then we would be out of the League Cup. To fucking Bury!!! You might not care about trophies, but some of us do and to potentially go out of the League Cup in this manner is unacceptable.

[JCB]

He’s right though, in a way

If it wasn’t a friendly, and it wasn’t pre season, and it was the League Cup and we’d lost instead of drawn then we would be out of the League Cup. To fucking Bury!!! You might not care about trophies, but some of us do and to potentially go out of the League Cup in this manner is unacceptable.

Agree... and to do it in the presence of not one but, two Nevilles is simple unforgivable.

[Bolrick]

Wow...curtis jones really impressive yet again.

[redgriffin73]

Yes a real testimony to the quality of our support. Shame the idiotic jeering he got later on from the home fans has been attributed by some outlets as being from us. He is one of us and needs as much support as we can give him.

Although it was mostly the Bury fans, in the first half there actually were some in the South Stand that joined in the jeering. I was mortified for him. Thankfully they either got told to stfu or realised what dickheads they were.

It was probably the same few I could hear moaning throughout about how shit we were and how West Ham are gonna apparently batter us when the season starts due to how we played yesterday. Some absolute in-bred whoppers who've never set foot in Anfield were there yesterday.

[CraigDS]

I'm sure he's aware it's something he will have to live with for the short term until he puts in a run of good (mistake free) games. Hopefully he is of the mindset where he wants to prove those people wrong and uses it as motivation rather than lets it get on top of him. He appears to be doing the former so hopefully he'll move on from this.

[steingmo]

Wow...curtis jones really impressive yet again.

yes he looks really good

[deFacto please, you bastards]

Saw the round of applause for Karius, good stuff!

James Pearce's piece in the Echo is very negative, he's sounding like we just got knocked out of the League Cup or something.

He can do one along with the Echo

[BabuYagu]

Everton have scored 22 goals in their first pre-season game.

We can’t score 1 past Bury.

#KloppOut.

Idea pitch for a TV series - Take a pro-team, ref, two bags of kits with you on a bus. Find a group of people in a park and challenge them to a game of footy. Don't tell them it's being filmed or who they are playing. Destroy them!

What? What do you mean it's already been done?

[Hazell]

Idea pitch for a TV series - Take a pro-team, ref, two bags of kits with you on a bus. Find a group of people in a park and challenge them to a game of footy. Don't tell them it's being filmed or who they are playing. Destroy them!

What? What do you mean it's already been done?

A worse idea than Jet from Gladiators hosting a Millennium barn dance at Yeovil Aerodrome.

[killer-heels]

I absolutely understand that its pre-season but does Solanke need to show a bit more in the same way Origi needs to? I know he is in a safer position than Origi but I do get the feeling he could do with a good pre-season on the pitch.

[jillcwhomever]

I absolutely understand that its pre-season but does Solanke need to show a bit more in the same way Origi needs to? I know he is in a safer position than Origi but I do get the feeling he could do with a good pre-season on the pitch.

I'm not worrying about anyone after just three games. I think they all know they need a good pre-season, the youngsters especially. I am feeling positive that he will make a step up this season.

[deFacto please, you bastards]

Mane and Mo will fly out with the rest of the lads for the US tour but Klopp says they won't take part until the United game.

[Clint Eastwood]

He’s right though, in a way

If it wasn’t a friendly, and it wasn’t pre season, and it was the League Cup and we’d lost instead of drawn then we would be out of the League Cup. To fucking Bury!!! You might not care about trophies, but some of us do and to potentially go out of the League Cup in this manner is unacceptable.

took me a minute to realise you were joking.

[BigTroubleInLittleChina]

So its actually Karius parents fault for him making mistakes in the final as everyone named Loris/Lloris does it in finals..   I think this wc shows the human side of the game, Pogba missing two sitters, but hey, he has a gold medal now so no biggie. De Gea, Thibaut, muslera, Subotic today almost let a backpass slip under his feet.. (also, none of these played with a concussion)

[BabuYagu]

I absolutely understand that its pre-season but does Solanke need to show a bit more in the same way Origi needs to? I know he is in a safer position than Origi but I do get the feeling he could do with a good pre-season on the pitch.

I do think your expectations need managing here. They are 100% focused on fitness not performance at the moment. Their legs are probably like rubber and Klopp won't care about poor individual performances at the moment if people are working their ass off in training. Given the running numbers Solanke put up last season in games he started, I imagine he is one of the hard workers in training too.

I also doubt Solanke has anything to prove to Klopp, even if that isn't true with some fans.

[deFacto please, you bastards]

I do think your expectations need managing here. They are 100% focused on fitness not performance at the moment. Their legs are probably like rubber and Klopp won't care about poor individual performances at the moment if people are working their ass off in training. Given the running numbers Solanke put up last season in games he started, I imagine he is one of the hard workers in training too.

I also doubt Solanke has anything to prove to Klopp, even if that isn't true with some fans.

Spot on, and there are also 6 pre-season games left.

[So… Howard Philips]

Spot on, and there are also 6 pre-season games left.

And in the past pre season matches were played in Scandinavia, the result would be published in the Echo and the players were quietly allowed to work of their ale acquired flab. And we would regularly lose to an unknown Norwegian team who played their matches on a frozen fjord.

With every game now televised and analysed on social media no wonder incorrect conclusions are drawn.

[robgomm]

Christ, Curtis Jones was born in 2001.

Hold me.

[Groundskeeper Willie]

And in the past pre season matches were played in Scandinavia

Ah, good times. I remember going to one in Örebro when I was 14. Managed to get quite a few autographs. I remember Rushie scoring, getting Kenny's signature.

[Crouchy]

Are we expecting any of the players involved in the World Cup (eliminated early) back this week?

[dudleyred]

Are we expecting any of the players involved in the World Cup (eliminated early) back this week?

Yes to training but not to play until USA. Think mo is in Thursday and flying out Saturday with the squad?

[Barefoot Doctor]

Are we expecting any of the players involved in the World Cup (eliminated early) back this week?

Mane, Salah and Grujic will be flying out to the US with the squad this weekend.

Shaqiri, assuming a three-week holiday from the date Switzerland were knocked out, would join up a week tomorrow. But perhaps he'll fly out with the squad to the US a few days early?

Then Firmino joins up immediately after the US tour for the French training camp.

Finally, Lovren, Trent and Henderson should join up around August 5/6 - one week before our league campaign starts.

[dudleyred]

Mane, Salah and Grujic will be flying out to the US with the squad this weekend.

Shaqiri, assuming a three-week holiday from the date Switzerland were knocked out, would join up a week tomorrow. But perhaps he'll fly out with the squad to the US a few days early?

Then Firmino joins up immediately after the US tour for the French training camp.

Finally, Lovren, Trent and Henderson should join up around August 5/6 - one week before our league campaign starts.

a much more comprehensive answer that i gave haha!

with Lovren, Trent and Henderson are we thinking they are highly unlikely to play against West Ham, Palace or Brighton. maybe be in contention for Brighton?

Assuming they will need a week to blow the dust off after 3 weeks away and then a week or so to get up to speed with the plans etc.

If the above is right its worked out great for Clyne and trent to be honest. the former gets a full pre season and is a shoo in to start the first match fitness permitting and the latter gets a chance to ease back in without being rushed for our sake.

[Barefoot Doctor]

a much more comprehensive answer that i gave haha!

with Lovren, Trent and Henderson are we thinking they are highly unlikely to play against West Ham, Palace or Brighton. maybe be in contention for Brighton?

Assuming they will need a week to blow the dust off after 3 weeks away and then a week or so to get up to speed with the plans etc.

If the above is right its worked out great for Clyne and trent to be honest. the former gets a full pre season and is a shoo in to start the first match fitness permitting and the latter gets a chance to ease back in without being rushed for our sake.

I just don't see how Trent, Lovren or Henderson even make the bench against West Ham. Think they perhaps begin to feature on the bench from the Palace game - likely Trent, who should require less of a rest than the other two who played the bulk of the tournament.

Firmino's the interesting one for me. He'll probably feature in the final two friendlies, against Napoli and Torino. Think there's an outside chance of him starting the West Ham game, but he should definitely be on the bench at minimum.

[Barefoot Doctor]

Klopp's just confirmed that Mignolet, Trent, Lovren and Henderson will report for pre-season on Sunday August 5.

https://www.liverpoolfc.com/news/first-team/307266-henderson-alexander-arnold-lovren-mignolet-liverpool-fc-pre-season

[daggerdoo]

Firmino should be ok to start the West Ham game shouldn't he? Didn't play much for Brazil, he's a monster of an athlete and he's our attacking focal point. Hope he starts.

[sms1986]

Firmino should be ok to start the West Ham game shouldn't he? Didn't play much for Brazil, he's a monster of an athlete and he's our attacking focal point. Hope he starts.

I would be surprised if he isn't at least on the bench. One of the advantages of him being a super sub for Brazil!