Topic: Elections in Europe

[child-in-time]

Reports that the Melenchon camp will hold a "consultation" on whether to give his supporters a clear voting indication for the second round. It would be beyond shameful if a supposed leftist didn't show his support to the only alternative to a neo-fascist presidency.

There's a lot of common ground between the far-left and the far-right.

[Libertine]

Reports that the Melenchon camp will hold a "consultation" on whether to give his supporters a clear voting indication for the second round. It would be beyond shameful if a supposed leftist didn't show his support to the only alternative to a neo-fascist presidency.

Shameful? Yes. But not surprising given how much they have in common with Le Pen.

Lots for the left in France to ponder in this result.

[Caligula?]

She's going to win. It's inevitable.

[Johnny B. Goode]

The absolute majority of Melenchon voters will not vote for Le Pen, or so all polls have reported. They will abstain in large numbers though.

If Le Pen gets anything less than 22% in the final count that will be very underwhelming for her and she knows it. She got 18% in 2012 on a higher turnout.

[Libertine]

She's going to win. It's inevitable.

It really isn't. There is absolutely no evidence to suggest she has even a small chance of winning.

[B0151?]

Shameful? Yes. But not surprising given how much they have in common with Le Pen.

Lots for the left in France to ponder in this result.

It's crazy there are some on the left moaning about Macron.

This election was meant to be between Le Pen and another right winger. He stopped that. We can talk about Fillon's scandals but Macron was there to sweep up his voters who were never going to Melenchon.

[Libertine]

"Obstacles were put in my path" says Fillon.

Yeah, totally not self-inflicted Francois.

[Djozer]

It really isn't. There is absolutely no evidence to suggest she has even a small chance of winning.

I hope you're right, and all polling suggests you are, but I can't get over the spectre of last year. I'm praying that the French aren't as thick and narrow-minded as us and the States.

We could do with a proper victory over the right to remind everyone that racist cuntdom isn't the only political path.

[cloggypop]

She's going to win. It's inevitable.

You were convinced that Geert Wilders would win the Dutch election.

[Giono]

The "Trump effect" is a bit of a myth, honestly. There seems to be a hard ceiling of sort in Europe for extreme right or neo-fascist movements, as we've also seen in the Netherlands last month.

Reports that the Melenchon camp will hold a "consultation" on whether to give his supporters a clear voting indication for the second round. It would be beyond shameful if a supposed leftist didn't show his support to the only alternative to a neo-fascist presidency.

Agree. It is a media construction. But it is good that it is extinguished as an idea that is peddled out there by pundits.

Trump did support LePen openly and it is good that his ally is trumped...

[Giono]

The absolute majority of Melenchon voters will not vote for Le Pen, or so all polls have reported. They will abstain in large numbers though.

If Le Pen gets anything less than 22% in the final count that will be very underwhelming for her and she knows it. She got 18% in 2012 on a higher turnout.

They wanted 30% to project having a legitimate chance. This is a failure.

[Libertine]

I hope you're right, and all polling suggests you are, but I can't get over the spectre of last year. I'm praying that the French aren't as thick and narrow-minded as us and the States.

We could do with a proper victory over the right to remind everyone that racist cuntdom isn't the only political path.

In both of last year's (grim) votes, the polling was either almost spot on or off by 2-3 points. Macron has a 25-30 point lead over Le Pen. There aren't enough Russian trolls on the internet to overcome that.

[Libertine]

Pretty decent response by Fillon though you'd have to say:



Despite all my efforts, my determination, I have not succedded in convincing my fellow countrymen and women. The obstacles in my path were too numerous and too cruel. This defeat is mine, I accept the responsibility, it is mine and mine alone to bear.

We have to choose what is best for our country. Abstention is not in my genes, above all when an extremist party is close to power. The Front National is well known for its violence its intolérance, and its programme would lead our country to bankruptcy and Europe into chaos.

Extremism can can only bring unhappiness and division to France. There is no other choice than to vote against the far right. I will vote for Emmanuel Macron. I consider it my duty to tell you this frankly. It is up to you to reflect on what is best for your country, and for your children.

[Sarge]

Emmanuel Macron v Marine Le Pen it is, interesting thing is that Fillon has asked his supporters to support Mcron, thats curtains for Le Pen I would think/hope?

[Giono]

In both of last year's (grim) votes, the polling was either almost spot on or off by 2-3 points. Macron has a 25-30 point lead over Le Pen. There aren't enough Russian trolls on the internet to overcome that.

And the FN came up flat despite all the efforts of terrorists too.

French elections always make me revisit this anti-FN gem from Berurier Noir from back in 89:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FpH0gre8AQw

[Djozer]

In both of last year's (grim) votes, the polling was either almost spot on or off by 2-3 points. Macron has a 25-30 point lead over Le Pen. There aren't enough Russian trolls on the internet to overcome that.

I'd seen his projected lead was big, but I didn't know it was that big. Cheers man, you've made me feel a fair bit better. Always liked the French!

[Trev20]

  Macron.

[Libertine]

Melenchon refuses to accept defeat yet, says wait for the actual results.

[B0151?]

I hope you're right, and all polling suggests you are, but I can't get over the spectre of last year. I'm praying that the French aren't as thick and narrow-minded as us and the States.

We could do with a proper victory over the right to remind everyone that racist cuntdom isn't the only political path.

I mean while Trump definitely got there on a wave of anti-establishment, he ultimately only won because Hillary was as disliked as she was. Obama or Biden (a direct continuation of the status quo) would have swiped the floor with him I think.

Maybe you could make the same argument for Brexit. It was more the dislike for the EU that won than the alternative being offered I'd suggest, more people disliked it than liked it really.

What I'm saying is that Macron is untainted by and large, doesn't even have an established party. He's new. I can't see the same thing happening.

[killer-heels]

She's going to win. It's inevitable.

Not now.

[Gods_Left_Boot]

Emmanuel Macron v Marine Le Pen it is, interesting thing is that Fillon has asked his supporters to support Mcron, thats curtains for Le Pen I would think/hope?

This is consistent with what happened in the French regional elections December 2015. Under a similar system, FN was the first party in 6 of the 12 mainland regions in the first round but ended up empty handed after the runoff.

There is a proud, consistent history of tactical voting to keep neo-fascists out of power, going back at least to the 2002 Presidential election, when the older Le Pen shockingly made it to the runoff and Chirac (centre-right) won the second round with over 82% of the vote and winning over 25M votes compared to the 5.5M he had won in the first round.

[killer-heels]

I hope you're right, and all polling suggests you are, but I can't get over the spectre of last year. I'm praying that the French aren't as thick and narrow-minded as us and the States.

We could do with a proper victory over the right to remind everyone that racist cuntdom isn't the only political path.

The Dutch didnt vote far right. Macron will win now and the far right wont get anywhere near the German election. As you were.

[Libertine]

Far-left candidate Arthaud rejects front-runners
Leftist Nathalie Arthaud says she will cast a blank vote in the second round.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/world-europe-39683594

A "leftist" candidate refused to vote against a fascist. Morally bankrupt.

[Djozer]

The Dutch didnt vote far right. Macron will win now and the far right wont get anywhere near the German election. As you were.

True, but I think this will be a far more powerful kick in the teeth for the far right than Rutte's victory, if for no other reason than France is a far bigger player on the world stage*. But yeah, I've probably been more worried about the current political climate than I should have been. Brexit really fucked up my job though, so I have an excuse...

*No disrespect to the Dutch intended, they're a generally awesome bunch.

[B0151?]

Doesn't sound like Melenchon is backing Macron. c*nt.

Well he hasn't conceded yet.

[Red-Soldier]

Nice to see that Macron is there for the second round, he should win it from here 

[ShakaHislop]

If Melanchon had gotten through instead of Le Pen, would that have been a harder fight for Macron? Would the French public have been more tempted to rally around the far left than the far right, or does Macron have a (touch wood) similarly comfortable time against either?

[Libertine]

If Melanchon had gotten through instead of Le Pen, would that have been a harder fight for Macron? Would the French public have been more tempted to rally around the far left than the far right, or does Macron have a (touch wood) similarly comfortable time against either?

Polls suggest it would have been closer between Macron and Melenchon, but Macron would still have won. I think Melenchon is less toxic than Le Pen though, even if his policies are almost as extreme.

[Giono]

This is consistent with what happened in the French regional elections December 2015. Under a similar system, FN was the first party in 6 of the 12 mainland regions in the first round but ended up empty handed after the runoff.

There is a proud, consistent history of tactical voting to keep neo-fascists out of power, going back at least to the 2002 Presidential election, when the older Le Pen shockingly made it to the runoff and Chirac (centre-right) won the second round with over 82% of the vote and winning over 25M votes compared to the 5.5M he had won in the first round.

¸
I remember that. And Chirac was less appealing to the left than Macron will be to the right. The lefties plugged their noses and voted. Macron, with no party and a reformist agenda should have more appeal.

I`m more doubtful that the left will all vote for Macron. I think some of them will abstain.

[Ray K]

Far-left candidate Arthaud rejects front-runners
Leftist Nathalie Arthaud says she will cast a blank vote in the second round.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/world-europe-39683594

A "leftist" candidate refused to vote against a fascist. Morally bankrupt.

I am Jack's complete lack of surprise.

[Sarge]

French conservatives, Socialists say will back Macron for president

[Libertine]

Melenchon going to ask his supporters who to support in order to tell his supporters who to support.

Leadership.

[Cliff Bastin]

French President doesn't have any power. But I think Le Pen will probably win. It's just the way things are going now.

[Johnny B. Goode]

French President doesn't have any power. But I think Le Pen will probably win. It's just the way things are going now.

On the contrary, the French presidency is the actual powerful office.

[Ray K]

French President doesn't have any power. But I think Le Pen will probably win. It's just the way things are going now.

She's 22 points down in a 2 horse race with 2 weeks left. How on earth do you think she'll win?

[Gods_Left_Boot]

French President doesn't have any power. But I think Le Pen will probably win. It's just the way things are going now.

2 clueless statements out of 2. Not bad. 

The French Presidency is actually a very powerful office. Not on par with the USA one but with a much larger scope of action than presidential roles in other continental European countries, which are largely ceremonial (Germany, Italy, Austria).

Also, all projected polls done for a Macron-Le Pen runoff have Macron anywhere between 60% and 67%. Incidentally, polls have proven to be remarkably accurate concerning tonight's first round results.

[Libertine]

On the contrary, the French presidency is the actual powerful office.

She's 22 points down in a 2 horse race with 2 weeks left. How on earth do you think she'll win?

But aside from that, the post was spot on.

[GreatEx]

After the Liverpool shit-show and the Burnley-ManU result, this one came as a relief. Macron with a 4-0 win in the home tie, hopefully he isn't PSG and Le Pen isn't Barcelona (fat chance, they're foreign!)

[BobPaisley3]

Melanchon is a socialist, he's refusing to endorse an investment banker. He's not endorsing Le Pen either. 

[Libertine]

Melanchon is a socialist, he's refusing to endorse an investment banker. He's not endorsing Le Pen either. 

He's refusing to endorse a centrist, moderate liberal. And refusing to condemn a fascist.

It's a despicable stance to take.