Topic: Liverpool 0 - S'hampton 1 [0-2 Aggregate]

[Groundskeeper Willie]

Good, sometimes excellent 2nd half. Just a goal missing. Sturridge has to do better with that chance.

Question for the more knowledgable people than me: are we committing less players in  the box lately? Seems we used to just a lung to get there with 5 or even 6 players. Lately there are maybe 3. 4 at times. First half today we set up outside their are and kicked it about with no threat. Second half we populated their box with more players and looked like scoring on many occasions. 

If it is so, why is that? If not, why then, do we struggle to break park the bus team down?

[Olde Dog]

I admire your defiance, but we really didn't dominate that match at all

... perhaps not then - I'm sure I just watched a match where we fought for every ball, turned the play around and went at Southampton at every possible opportunity - played hard across the eighteen yard line to keep possession and try to prise an opening - went wide to both wings and the by line, and young Trent was totally involved - we had more space in the second half as Southampton backed off, but overall we fought for our possession and that contributed to Southampton getting deeper - purely my interpritation of course ...

[Lastrador]

Yes, the problem in midfield lies elsewhere. When we have possession - and tonight we had something like 70 per cent of the ball - we are carrying Henderson. Nothing creative emanates from him.

Except for that excellent cross with his left foot to Sturridge, that he skied. What did exactly Can create tonight?

[John C]

Klopp was spot on we had chances and did not take them, Sturridge 2015 buries that.

Absolutely mate, my 2 points remain facts though, not alternative facts 

[Ziggy09]

The team was obviously tense and couple that with the recent downturn in form and players coming back from injury and against a team that mostly played 6-3-1, it was a long shot.

Had a few chances and with a bit of luck we may have taken it to extra time. Definitely think that was handball by Long.

The passing again was too slow - even the first touch of many players was poor, again meaning more touches needed to control the ball and so slowing down the game or worse still - just gifting the ball to them. Think we had one move that involved beautiful one touch passing between players on the left and resulted in Sturridge trying to guide it in on the run but it went over. Had that gone in, Im sure we'd have clicked into gear.

Strange how the subs came so late and while I think Coutinho and Lallana were off it tonight, id have risked putting Gini on for Matip.

And so it remains one trophy in 10 years. Many finals and semi-finals in between but that aura we had around us on such occasions seems to slipped away.

[Kekule]

No we won't. Season's over....AGAIN!

The table I'm looking at says we're 4th, 1 point of 2nd, despite being in a bit of rut. It's clearly wrong though as you've said the season is over. Could you link me to the updated table that has us lying 9th and well out of the running for a European place that would demonstrate progress from the last couple of seasons?

Ta.

[Outer Mongolian Red]

Beating teams who park the bus is the biggest problem for every team who regularly comes up against that sort of approach. It's not a unique flaw we have.

I can't think of another top team in the PL era who struggles as much as we do in these type of games.

[Son of Spion]

Two banks of four and we are f*cked

I think this is what annoys me the most. The sheer simplicity of what it takes to nullify us.

Two banks of four. Stay tight, work hard. Let us have the ball all day long in benign areas then press us when we do get into more threatening areas. Make sure you have enough pace up front. Hit us on the break at every opportunity. Bingo!

To be honest, I've never been one to analyse tactics that much. But I wonder; certain sides must have had this approach used against them in the past too. Are there any notable examples of sides who have successfully overcome this approach, and if so, how did they go about it? Is it all down to just having that certain level of quality in a more gifted forward or is there more to it?

[sms1986]

And so it remains one trophy in 10 years. Many finals and semi-finals in between but that aura we had around us on such occasions seems to slipped away.

For now, anyway, still the FA Cup to try for and the league might still be gettable (a win against Chelsea next week and you never know).

[007.lankyguy]

Our pressing game is still there to some degree but teams seem to be beating our press a lot easier these days. Few times tonight (and against Swansea) we tried to charge the ball down and they popped it around us and were in on the back four. Not sure if its over eagerness or what it is but we certainly dont look as compact when we go hunting. Southampton were in behind our midfield a few times tonight. Its definitely the problem area for me.

Our combination play and pressing go hand in hand. Earlier in the season, we were getting overloads in key areas around the box, meaning that when we lost the ball, we had four or five players in close proximity, allowing us to press more fluidly and consequently, keep the pressure up on the opposition. Right now we're not getting those overloads (or not in the same areas of the pitch) and so we're easier to play through.

[jillcwhomever]

The team was obviously tense and couple that with the recent downturn in form and players coming back from injury and against a team that mostly played 6-3-1, it was a long shot.

Had a few chances and with a bit of luck we may have taken it to extra time. Definitely think that was handball by Long.

The passing again was too slow - even the first touch of many players was poor, again meaning more touches needed to control the ball and so slowing down the game or worse still - just gifting the ball to them. Think we had one move that involved beautiful one touch passing between players on the left and resulted in Sturridge trying to guide it in on the run but it went over. Had that gone in, Im sure we'd have clicked into gear.

Strange how the subs came so late and while I think Coutinho and Lallana were off it tonight, id have risked putting Gini on for Matip.

And so it remains one trophy in 10 years. Many finals and semi-finals in between but that aura we had around us on such occasions seems to slipped away.

Good post mate. As for the aura it will return eventually but its not going to be easy, still a lot to do. We just have to keep at it, believe and we will improve.

[Sarge]

But lack of champions league football will affect our summer business, so this season is important.

Every Season is important.

[Outer Mongolian Red]

Yes, the problem in midfield lies elsewhere. When we have possession - and tonight we had something like 70 per cent of the ball - we are carrying Henderson. Nothing creative emanates from him.

Agree with that.

His best quality is still his athleticism, not ideal when he touches the ball more than any other player.

I'd give anything for an Alonso in that position.

[LJA]

... perhaps not then - I'm sure I just watched a match where we fought for every ball, turned the play around and went at Southampton at every possible opportunity - played hard across the eighteen yard line to keep possession and try to prise an opening - went wide to both wings and the by line, and young Trent was totally involved - we had more space in the second half as Southampton backed off, but overall we fought for our possession and that contributed to Southampton getting deeper - purely my interpritation of course ...

I saw it as Southampton letting us have the ball, getting organised and hitting us on the counter. That was their game plan.  We never looked liked scoring even when Southampton were getting deeper, they were comfortable.

[Butcher Knife Roberto]

Squad go stripped in the Summer bigtime and rightly so, Klopp knows this all too well and he is biding his time for the right player. Remember its not just about this Season.

Is absolutely correct. We spoiled ourselves with the first half of the season, but you have to ask who in their right mind would sell us a player that is vital to their own plans halfway through the season? Which is why Klopp has been at pains to say that the winter window is not the right time to get the players he wants. Sure he could probably go out and get a player or two, but I think we're shopping at a higher level now - if someone came in and tried to get one of our lads mid-season there would be an uproar. It's no different elsewhere. So anyone we get in now would either be deemed surplus to requirements at their present club or cost serious money to extract. We know Klopp doesn't work that way, so people will only end up frustrated by a perceived lack of progress. The real action will come in the summer, and I fully expect a revolving door again with serious turnover of players.

A solid top four finish would be a great outcome for this season, we can give the title a real go over the next couple of years. It's a marathon not a sprint. The most important thing is that we back the manager, back the players, even through the toughest times. .

[Sarge]

Absolutely mate, my 2 points remain facts though, not alternative facts 

That they do.

[Gerry83]

Our combination play and pressing go hand in hand. Earlier in the season, we were getting overloads in key areas around the box, meaning that when we lost the ball, we had four or five players in close proximity, allowing us to press more fluidly and consequently, keep the pressure up on the opposition. Right now we're not getting those overloads (or not in the same areas of the pitch) and so we're easier to play through.

I see what youre saying. In fairness all our players seemed stretched across the front line. I cant remember 2 or 3 players being with 5 yards of each other pinging it about until late on in the second half. Although i think this comes from teams setting up with , more or less, 6 across the back and another 3 screening. Makes it difficult to do anything really.

[John C]

Two banks of four and we are f*cked

Southampton were far, far more than that mate, they were actually very fluid in defending. They were brilliantly organised, as we were building Lallana would come to receive, his man would follow leaving space behind but as Coutinho dropped in to that space his marker could follow and press so he wasn't an option. I've conceded we lacked the cutting edge and pure quality, but much of it was about how successful Southampton were at their job. That's the shitty part of football

[nico 8]

We did put a lot into that 2nd half, the effort was there but not the quality. If we had of grabbed the  goal then I think a few players would of been in for praise but sometimes the results do cloud our judgment. I thought Lallana in particular gave it everything he had tonight.

There is no denying the effort but I wonder whether they are not mentally drained. Koop has been quiet on the sidelines which mirrors his team. As much as I thought Can has been extremely poor- his movement and sideway passes- I will give him kudos for his effort and drive in the 2nd half. Sadly, I think the quality or lack thereof places a question on his long term future.
The one time we played one touch football we created an opportunity for Sturridge which on another day he may have buried.
Credit to Southampton. We move on.

[clinical]

Every Season is important.

Correct yet why do we always seem to plan for the following one? Why not plan for the one we're in. Shambles

[Broad Spectrum]

Yes, the problem in midfield lies elsewhere. When we have possession - and tonight we had something like 70 per cent of the ball - we are carrying Henderson. Nothing creative emanates from him.

I think Can falls into that category as well, obviously excluding tonight.

It's a difficult one, because I think we've lacked a consistent deep lying playmaker since Gerrard left. Henderson has stepped up to fill that void to a certain extent but his performances are still plagued by inconsistency.

And I think the problem with Can is that he sits somewhere in between a CM and DM. He doesn't quite have the attributes to be the holding midfielder in a 3 man midfield for a top team like Liverpool, whilst he doesn't possess the attacking prowess to be an effective box to box centre mid.

[KevLFC]

Back from the match. The only positive is me don't have to play Man U in the final. So annoying watching us. We do miss Mane but we do need a striker and a cm who can score Gerrard Esq goals on the edge of the box. Also out corners are shocking

[007.lankyguy]

I can't think of another top team in the PL era who struggles as much as we do in these type of games.

The reason for that is because it's generally the top four or five teams that regularly come up against this approach and in the PL era, Chelsea, Arsenal and Man United, have, by and large, had better squads than us. We've been in that uncomfortable spot where teams regularly sit off against us but we've most often been two or three quality players short.

[Broad Spectrum]

Wouldn't go as far to say he had a good game but he was no worse than the other guys out there.  Thing thing for me is that him and Hendo seem to occupy the same space and I don't think our midfield has ever looked balanced when they have both started, the passing is mostly slow and sideways lacking creativity.  Our midfield has looked best with the Hendo/Lallana/Gini combo In my opinion

Discussion for a round table I think!

[jillcwhomever]

Is absolutely correct. We spoiled ourselves with the first half of the season, but you have to ask who in their right mind would sell us a player that is vital to their own plans halfway through the season? Which is why Klopp has been at pains to say that the winter window is not the right time to get the players he wants. Sure he could probably go out and get a player or two, but I think we're shopping at a higher level now - if someone came in and tried to get one of our lads mid-season there would be an uproar. It's no different elsewhere. So anyone we get in now would either be deemed surplus to requirements at their present club or cost serious money to extract. We know Klopp doesn't work that way, so people will only end up frustrated by a perceived lack of progress. The real action will come in the summer, and I fully expect a revolving door again with serious turnover of players.

A solid top four finish would be a great outcome for this season, we can give the title a real go over the next couple of years. It's a marathon not a sprint. The most important thing is that we back the manager, back the players, even through the toughest times. .

Totally agree. Buying the right player out of sheer desperation can totally shoot everything down, say nothing of wasting what money you have. Klopp works well with players and I am sure he will be able to turn them around.

[lgvkarlos]

In what way? Attracting players or budget?

Attracting the better players, especially from better teams. Probably why we constantly pick up players from clubs like Southampton because we are a step up and their not used to champions league  anyway.

[John C]

Romeu was superb for them over the two legs. Like a mini Masch.

Kudos to the twat, he was popping up everywhere for them, taking balls off our fucking feet and everything

[klobutruck]

That was pretty shit. They deserved to go through over 2 legs. Atkinson was horrific, that non corner and not getting a penalty were absolutely ridiculous, how we did or didn't perform is irrelevant, he should do his job properly.

Also fucked up how many can't handle a bad run, qutting on the season, loads of players thrown under the bus, ridiculous. It's disappointing but plenty to play for yet. Our internet "supporters" are the worst anywhere. If there was a down side to Istanbul, attracting these c*nts was it.

I completely agree with you. I really wanted to see us progress to the final but we didn't get the goals we needed.

I thought Karius and Can were our best players today.

[Sarge]

Is absolutely correct. We spoiled ourselves with the first half of the season, but you have to ask who in their right mind would sell us a player that is vital to their own plans halfway through the season? Which is why Klopp has been at pains to say that the winter window is not the right time to get the players he wants. Sure he could probably go out and get a player or two, but I think we're shopping at a higher level now - if someone came in and tried to get one of our lads mid-season there would be an uproar. It's no different elsewhere. So anyone we get in now would either be deemed surplus to requirements at their present club or cost serious money to extract. We know Klopp doesn't work that way, so people will only end up frustrated by a perceived lack of progress. The real action will come in the summer, and I fully expect a revolving door again with serious turnover of players.

A solid top four finish would be a great outcome for this season, we can give the title a real go over the next couple of years. It's a marathon not a sprint. The most important thing is that we back the manager, back the players, even through the toughest times. .

Amen Brother, Amen.

[Son of Spion]

I saw it as Southampton letting us have the ball, getting organised and hitting us on the counter. That was their game plan.  We never looked liked scoring even when Southampton were getting deeper, they were comfortable.

That's how I saw it too.
They played to their strengths perfectly, and on our weaknesses perfectly too.
Clearly a well rehearsed gameplan that was executed in both legs. We gave them the odd rare scare, but other than that they had us held comfortably at arms length.

[Sammy5IsAlive]

Thought we played well tonight but missed too many chances early on second half. One of those goes in and we would have got another comfortably.

The worry for me is that it is yet another game where we have lost all direction in the last 15 mins. It might be one weakness stacked up against a whole sea of strengths but Klopp seems to find it difficult to reshuffle the players already on the pitch to try something different tactically. With that in mind he is looking to the bench and at the moment there is nothing there apart from kids.

I think it is desperately important that the board backs him with serious money in the summer. If we fanny around and don't improve the squad I don't think he is the kind of personality to sit treading water.

[GreatEx]

Is absolutely correct. We spoiled ourselves with the first half of the season, but you have to ask who in their right mind would sell us a player that is vital to their own plans halfway through the season?

Hull have just sold Snodgrass, so I guess some clubs can be encouraged to hit the self-destruct button for a few dollars more.

[wemmick]

Our pressing game is still there to some degree but teams seem to be beating our press a lot easier these days. Few times tonight (and against Swansea) we tried to charge the ball down and they popped it around us and were in on the back four. Not sure if its over eagerness or what it is but we certainly dont look as compact when we go hunting. Southampton were in behind our midfield a few times tonight. Its definitely the problem area for me.

Honestly, I think a lot of it is down to Can. His positioning is really poor sometimes when he closes down player. Too often runs straight at the player rather than closing down the passing angle first. Leaves massive holes to play the ball into.

[Ziggy09]

I think this is what annoys me the most. The sheer simplicity of what it takes to nullify us.

Two banks of four. Stay tight, work hard. Let us have the ball all day long in benign areas then press us when we do get into more threatening areas. Make sure you have enough pace up front. Hit us on the break at every opportunity. Bingo!

To be honest, I've never been one to analyse tactics that much. But I wonder; certain sides must have had this approach used against them in the past too. Are there any notable examples of sides who have successfully overcome this approach, and if so, how did they go about it? Is it all down to just having that certain level of quality in a more gifted forward or is there more to it?

It can come down to having a gifted forward(s) who can carry the ball and take on and commit two or three players to free up space and pull the banks of four apart. Coutinho, Lallana and Firminio can do that but then they actually make a pass to their own team mate!! It helps.

Otherwise, its quick one touch passing with purpose so youre in between their two banks before they can reshape. Alternatively, bypass the midfield totally with direct balls/crosses to forwards who can either hold it up or are good in the air. We dont have that so it has to the first one!

[Sarge]

Correct yet why do we always seem to plan for the following one? Why not plan for the one we're in. Shambles

My name is not shambles.

[Advil]

Can I know what the actual fuck do our scouting team and Director of Football do? They must be a player from any of Mexico, Honduras, Indonesia, Saudi Arabia, Finland, Iceland, Turkey, Ecuador, Colombia, Brazil,New Zealand or the 200 other countries who can run like Mane and be at least 50% as good as Mane.

Why cant they find any such player who are available? The only player who we have that can do Mane's role is Ojo but Klopp doesn't seem to rate him.

[RedForeverTT]

Our pressing game is still there to some degree but teams seem to be beating our press a lot easier these days. Few times tonight (and against Swansea) we tried to charge the ball down and they popped it around us and were in on the back four. Not sure if its over eagerness or what it is but we certainly dont look as compact when we go hunting. Southampton were in behind our midfield a few times tonight. Its definitely the problem area for me.

Tired legs and tired minds. Uncoordinated pressing also tire the players unnecessarily.

Tonight feels extremely depressing.

[Ziggy09]

For now, anyway, still the FA Cup to try for and the league might still be gettable (a win against Chelsea next week and you never know).

I so desperately wanna believe but everytime I get my hopes up they get shattered! At 37 years of age - its getting too much!! lol!

But my gut says if we can get that first trophy with Jurgen, especially if its the league, we will kick on big time. Ahh there its - belief coming back!

[Yevgeny]

The twats that think our season is over because we won't win the league can fuck off. As if any of them thought we were going to win it before the season started. This team (and squad) is a work in progress and certain people need to come to terms with that and grow the fuck up. 2nd or 3rd would be a very good season for us, and anyone who doesn't see that is clueless. Enjoy watching the evolution of the team and accept that we will have disappointing results along the way. We need to be in the Champions League to make ourselves more attractive to signings. Yes, I know we're not going to sign Griezmann or the like, but even a highly coveted young talent like Brandt is unlikely to come here without CL, in my opinion. We need to raise our profile outside of England and re-establish our European identity. We do that by playing in the Champions League. If we fall short in the league after xmas every year then the moaning might be justified. This time it isn't.

[Yorkykopite]

I think Can falls into that category as well, obviously excluding tonight.

It's a difficult one, because I think we've lacked a consistent deep lying playmaker since Gerrard left. Henderson has stepped up to fill that void to a certain extent but his performances are still plagued by inconsistency.

I think he is fairly consistent. His game is steady - and it was tonight. But it's so slow and predictable. The room for improvement in that position is enormous. Which I think is a very encouraging thought.