Topic: Wrestling Thread (AEW, NJPW, WWE, etc) (*)

[Jack_Bauer]

Incredible stuff.  What an unrelenting shit show that company is.

The chaotic backstage stuff is way more engaging and fun than the actual product they put on TV each week.

[Jack_Bauer]

It very much feels like with WWE that everything that happened in the last 4 months or so literally does not matter.

What was the point of Big E winning the title just to be booked like a punk, lose it, move back to Smackdown for a midcard feud, and Bobby Lashley win it back anyway just less over than before.

Why did Lesnar win the title just to lose it and win the Rumble anyway

What the fuck are they going to do with either title now - Lashely beat everyone and for Roman the only idea they seemingly have is Brock forever. Not only has he been feuding with him for years, this current run of the feud has seemingly gone on for like 6 months now.

Big E winning the belt was a moment and that's why it happened. Same with Kofi winning the belt at Mania in 2019 it was a moment. So the company can put it into a video package to show how great they are when they try to present the company to non-wrestling people. When they used to do things during WrestleMania week called the "Business Partner Summit" they would air a 5-minute hype video putting themselves over as to how great they are and things like Big E or Kofi winning the belts are the type of "moments" they like to throw into such packages.

[El Lobo]

The chaotic backstage stuff is way more engaging and fun than the actual product they put on TV each week.

That’s the really telling thing, and doesn’t reflect greatly on TNA and TNA#2

[Stockholm Syndrome]

Not followed the behind the scenes politics much.

Has Vince fallen out with Triple H and Steph?

If you ever watch Succession, that's basically what is happening with WWE - the old figurehead see's all his children as completely incompetent to run his business, along with his own outdated views and possible senility

[Jack_Bauer]

Unsurprisingly it seems it was Shane that booked the men’s Rumble.

Seemingly has been involved with the Rumble the previous 3 years.

[Stockholm Syndrome]

So AEW PPV starting to take shape a bit now, and honestly looking a real good show. Appears to be

MJF vs Hangman
Punk vs Wardlow
Moxley vs Bryan
And it appears from Rampage spoilers

Spoiler

Possibly Darby vs Sammy for the TNT title

[close]

On top of this I assume Britt vs Thunder Rosa, and something with Jericho and Kingston (I am thinking Proud & Powerful turn on Jericho to join Kingston)

Looking like a pretty strong show imho. I am expecting the two main events to swap over after this show as well, with Punk/Hangman and MJF/Wardlow, which will be two other really hot programs.

[Barefoot Doctor]

Can't believe we're being denied Shane McMahon versus Austin Theory at Wrestlemania!

[tubby]

Punk vs MJF was better than I thought it would be, going that long.  Right result too and they're doing a super slow burn with Wardlow.

The Brandi stuff was just horrid, awful segment.

[I've been a good boy]

I guess we now know that the person to take over WWE after Vince dies won't be Triple H or Shane, but Nick Khan.

[Riquende]

So AEW PPV starting to take shape a bit now, and honestly looking a real good show. Appears to be

MJF vs Hangman
Punk vs Wardlow
Moxley vs Bryan
And it appears from Rampage spoilers

Spoiler

Possibly Darby vs Sammy for the TNT title

[close]

On top of this I assume Britt vs Thunder Rosa, and something with Jericho and Kingston (I am thinking Proud & Powerful turn on Jericho to join Kingston)

Looking like a pretty strong show imho. I am expecting the two main events to swap over after this show as well, with Punk/Hangman and MJF/Wardlow, which will be two other really hot programs.

I'm not sure about that to be honest... Is MJF/Punk over? I guess we'll find out as MJF is slated to speak on Dynamite this week. He will get a title shot and probably win this year, but Double or Nothing seems more likely to me, giving Hangman one more big title defence win at Revolution. I've got a feeling now that might be against Cole, whose loss will coincide with a returning Omega and then we'll see the Bucks/Fish/O'Reilly stuff kick on too.

Moxley/Bryan... I definitely had this marked for the card but now I dunno. I think there's a lot more mileage in what Bryan was proposing. Basically calling AEW's original young stars jokes and wanting to train a dojo of the next generation to topple them - the "Pillar Killers" I guess. I suppose he doesn't need Moxley to do that though.

Britt/Thunder Rosa could well be on, with the Rampage reveal now that Britt has sent Martinez after Rosa. And certainly it'll be Kingston/Jericho in some combination. Might have more of an inkling after this week's team meeting.

[Malaysian Kopite]

Ricky vs Lethal was really good, shame crowd was spent after the even better MJF-Punk

[tubby]

Ricky vs Lethal was really good, shame crowd was spent after the even better MJF-Punk

Really nice finish too.  Big fan of Starks, he needs a proper feud to get his teeth into.

[Riquende]

I think Starks has got three problems (none of which are related to his own ability):

1 - He was associated early with Team Taz, who seem to just get involved in feuds that last ages ("Give us an answer Hobbs!"), against people they're never going to beat.

2 - His obvious breakout spots in the roster are aready taken by people who were around before him and who seem to be featured in some long-term planning, maybe since day 1 of AEW.

3 - His neck injury last year kept him from doing much of interest in the rest of 2021.

He could absolutely be doing far more than he is, and hopefully 2022 is his year. I enjoy him and Jericho needling each other at the Rampage desk and would love for that to develop into something.

I want to see Hook drop the rest of the group (maybe over the FTW title) and Taz go with him, then Starks take proper control, rename themselves and recruit a few more (my ideal group here is Starks, Hobbs, the Acclaimed and maybe a 5th to eat the pins).

[tubby]

Yeah agree with all that and like the idea of him leading a group, he doesn't need Taz to talk for him, but it would work for Hook.

[Stockholm Syndrome]

I'm not sure about that to be honest... Is MJF/Punk over? I guess we'll find out as MJF is slated to speak on Dynamite this week. He will get a title shot and probably win this year, but Double or Nothing seems more likely to me, giving Hangman one more big title defence win at Revolution. I've got a feeling now that might be against Cole, whose loss will coincide with a returning Omega and then we'll see the Bucks/Fish/O'Reilly stuff kick on too.

Moxley/Bryan... I definitely had this marked for the card but now I dunno. I think there's a lot more mileage in what Bryan was proposing. Basically calling AEW's original young stars jokes and wanting to train a dojo of the next generation to topple them - the "Pillar Killers" I guess. I suppose he doesn't need Moxley to do that though.

Britt/Thunder Rosa could well be on, with the Rampage reveal now that Britt has sent Martinez after Rosa. And certainly it'll be Kingston/Jericho in some combination. Might have more of an inkling after this week's team meeting.

Rampage throws a bit of a spanner in the works but Cole doesn't feel anywhere near as hot as MJF. I could more likely see Punk vs Wardlow, and MJF vs Hangman with MJF losing because of a fuck up between him and Wardlow, leading to MJF shouting at him and Wardlow snapping and starting that feud. MJF and Punk I feel can still bubble on in the background

I definitely feel there is milage with that idea from Bryan but I feel you need Face Moxley for a bit and that Bryan/Moxley match. Have the match and then make the stable

I think with Hangman he should drop to MJF, but not yet, not for a while. I think there's still a few matches in his title run I think we should get - him vs Punk, him vs Moxley, possibly a rematch with Kenny, and as I have said above a match where he beats MJF before losing it to him later.

[Stockholm Syndrome]

I think Starks has got three problems (none of which are related to his own ability):

1 - He was associated early with Team Taz, who seem to just get involved in feuds that last ages ("Give us an answer Hobbs!"), against people they're never going to beat.

2 - His obvious breakout spots in the roster are aready taken by people who were around before him and who seem to be featured in some long-term planning, maybe since day 1 of AEW.

3 - His neck injury last year kept him from doing much of interest in the rest of 2021.

He could absolutely be doing far more than he is, and hopefully 2022 is his year. I enjoy him and Jericho needling each other at the Rampage desk and would love for that to develop into something.

I want to see Hook drop the rest of the group (maybe over the FTW title) and Taz go with him, then Starks take proper control, rename themselves and recruit a few more (my ideal group here is Starks, Hobbs, the Acclaimed and maybe a 5th to eat the pins).

From what has been mentioned in interviews by Tony Khan, he has big things for Starks and Hobbs this year. I certainly hope so at least

[tubby]

So Tony Khan has been on the charlie again and has been Twitter hyping a debut this week, think in a match against Kassidy...?  He's gone overboard with the hype as usual, and it really could be anyone.

Smart money is on Keith Lee, but I'm not sure he's the kind of guy you want to build this much.  Could also be any one of Gargano, Samoa Joe, Hardy, Wyatt or someone like Jay White (who would be more interesting at least).  Would LOVE it to be Ospreay, but not sure what his contract situation is with New Japan.

Some folks are hoping for HHH or Shane, but that's not happening in a million years.

[Sheer Magnetism]

Almost certainly Jeff, though I wouldn't be shocked if it was Gargano. Neither are game changers though.

[gazzalfc]

The Shane McMahon shouts are crazy, not matter what happened with the booking of the Rumble

[tubby]

Yeah I can see why he's so excited if it's Jeff, that's his era of fandom, same as the Christian reveal.  Feels like there have been too many Hardy hints though, and I think his non-compete is still yet to run out.

[El Lobo]

Would be cool to see Jeff back in the Impact zone

[gazzalfc]

Yeah I can see why he's so excited if it's Jeff, that's his era of fandom, same as the Christian reveal.  Feels like there have been too many Hardy hints though, and I think his non-compete is still yet to run out.

I think Tony teased that he doesn't care about the 90 day and was open to challenging that.

[tubby]

I think Tony teased that he doesn't care about the 90 day and was open to challenging that.

Would be amazed if he actually did challenge that, could open the door for a whole bunch of people trying to get out of their 'independent contractor' contracts.

[Stockholm Syndrome]

So Tony Khan has been on the charlie again and has been Twitter hyping a debut this week, think in a match against Kassidy...?  He's gone overboard with the hype as usual, and it really could be anyone.

Smart money is on Keith Lee, but I'm not sure he's the kind of guy you want to build this much.  Could also be any one of Gargano, Samoa Joe, Hardy, Wyatt or someone like Jay White (who would be more interesting at least).  Would LOVE it to be Ospreay, but not sure what his contract situation is with New Japan.

Some folks are hoping for HHH or Shane, but that's not happening in a million years.

Yeah Big Tone has been partying since last Wednesday again that's for sure.

Keith Lee I see being in San Antonio in a few weeks but sounds like he is coming for sure. I don't think it's this week, not least because he just got married so I would reckon he is on his honeymoon perhaps.

Most likely this will be Jeff, but I could see Samoa Joe perhaps. You got to remember that along with ECW, Tony was a big fan of early days TNA, hence why Christian was so hyped up, as he was legitimately one of Tony's favourite wrestlers from the time. Both Joe and Jeff fall into that bracket again, perhaps why his excitement.

I don't expect NJPW talent just because they are seemingly all still working together and I don't think any of the talent are up particularly soon. Would love Jay White or Ospreay but I doubt it, but I do think they'll be on AEW TV at some point relatively soon.

[OsirisMVZ]

All that happens when you get work in the middle of your 90-day clause is WWE stop paying you. I think Zach Ryder got immediately involved on the indies whilst he was still in the news for being released, so he didn't miss out on much. Bookings, buzz & t-shirt sales beat sitting on your arse for 3 months tweeting about "big things to come".

CM Punk's lawyer debunked it as it is unconstitutional to deny someone the right to work in the US.

[Stockholm Syndrome]

All that happens when you get work in the middle of your 90-day clause is WWE stop paying you. I think Zach Ryder got immediately involved on the indies whilst he was still in the news for being released, so he didn't miss out on much.

CM Punk's lawyer debunked it as it is unconstitutional to deny someone the right to work in the US.

I think everyone and their dogs know that WWE contracts aren't even worth wiping your arse with, they can fire you anytime and their rules about 3rd party income, non-compete, and contract freezing are complete bullshit. You get the income of course but the job security and lasting control of your labor rights are non-existent. I mean technically they seem you are not even employed, just an Independent Contractor.

But WWE are very good at drowning you in litigation until you can't afford to proceed any further and drop it settle, rather than actually winning the case. That's how their Independent Contractor contracts work.

Tbf we don't know if AEW contracts are similar or not, and we know TNA contract were drawn together by idiots, so there's a chance this isn't evil WWE and just par for the course in the carny industry

[tubby]

Difference is that AEW talent are fine to work elsewhere (if Tony OKs it) and use Twitch, etc.  Plus they have the security of knowing they'll get paid the length of their contract, as opposed to WWE who just cut wrestlers independent contractors on a whim.

[Stockholm Syndrome]

Difference is that AEW talent are fine to work elsewhere (if Tony OKs it) and use Twitch, etc.  Plus they have the security of knowing they'll get paid the length of their contract, as opposed to WWE who just cut wrestlers independent contractors on a whim.

Well so far seems that way, which I would say is good but honestly should just be the bare minimum. But relatively speaking, that's good

But just to the purposes of balance, just wanted to point out a carny business might always screw people over, and so AEW could easily do that. Just because I like one and dislike the other, I don't want to discount anyone in wrestling being a scumbag somewhere at some point.

Also on the AEW Mystery Man, seems that no the consensus is that it is Keith Lee. Probably not a name worth the hype on his name power, but his is someone I want AEW to sign because motivated Keith Lee is fucking awesome in the ring.

[tubby]

If Keith Lee can still go and has got over all his health issues, then he's a no-brainer.  They need more black guys at the top of the card and he's someone who can easily and convincingly main event (providing they curb his turbo dweeb tendencies).

[Stockholm Syndrome]

So that was some Dynamite that

So Tony basically admitted he was too coked up when he made Fridays tweets and misused Fobbiden Door, but he did then go out and get Jay White to turn up. Not much more than a Cameo but I assume/hope that this is just the start, because there is a lot they can do with White (me I would have him facing Hangman maybe at DON, and then lead to a White/Omega match).

Keith Lee also joins and oh fucking hell if they carry on with how they presented him here, they've got the no-brainer Keith Lee. Still looked athletic (made a point to do some high moves), still looks strong (put him with a tiny guy to really show it off and bump like crazy for him), great presence - yeah if they keep this up they've got a real real star there.

Moxley and Punk vs FTR was a lot of fun, and a real no brainer in terms of putting two mega over faces together for a one off. I wasn't sure how they worded it though if Punk gets MJF rematch or Wardlow rematch (MJF said he gets a rematch whenever he likes if he won, and Punk said he wanted a rematch against Wardlow because he was really the one who beat him, but that may be just mindgames - I think it is against MJF)

Inner Circle break up is in full effect, hopefully with Santana and Ortiz joining Kingston. In it all though, I hope they do a tiny niche thing only I would enjoy, which is have them still be mates with Sammy despite leaving - even if the whole group dynamic doesn't work anymore doesn't mean they can't be mates. That's just a tiny detail for me but I hope they do it 

Hangman vs Archer was fucking brutal and brilliant to, absolutely great. Cole/Hangman should be fantastic too, and while I am still not 100% sold on Cole as a current challenger, the inclusion of White and I assume Kenny Omega means there's a lot of interesting directions this can go from the title match.

[Barefoot Doctor]

Great debut for Keith 'Bearcat' Lee.

[Stockholm Syndrome]

Also as a note, how Matt Hardy jumped the guardrail and walked away, with commentators calling it "Pretty erratic behavior"

Wonder what that's alluding to ....

[tubby]

Didn't think Keith Lee looked all that amazing, but he was sick for ages and will be super rusty so we'll see.  Kassidy is a very promising young wrestler.

Someone who doesn't look rusty anymore, is Punk.  He's right into his groove now.

[Riquende]

You can really tell they're kicking into 'PPV build' mode now. Overall really good show and there is just so much happening up and down the card.

One small negative was the end of Jade's match. When I watched it this morning, it seemed like both women lose their place in the run to the finish sequence, and since then I've read about, and heard, broadcast-audible direction from the ref as to how they should get things back on track. It's not the most obvious thing, but it is there, and shouldn't be happening on TV in match involving a champion.

Anyway, it's probably time for Jade to take a back seat as we roll back around to Britt/Rosa, whilst also still resolving Statlander/Hirsch and maybe even finding time to have an established talent 'Tay-ke' exception to Deeb bullying jobbers in less than a minute.

[Stockholm Syndrome]

Even though I do think they are improving, I don't need to see as much Gunn Club as I do. Having said that, I do find it stupidly amusing when they get refered to as Billy Ass and the Ass Boys 

[tubby]

Even though I do think they are improving, I don't need to see as much Gunn Club as I do. Having said that, I do find it stupidly amusing when they get refered to as Billy Ass and the Ass Boys 

Think they getting this big push off the back of the Ass Boys stuff and one of them being in a reality show at the moment.  Crazy how over Danhausen got the whole Ass Boys thing but they've done the right thing for themselves and leaned into it massively.

[Stockholm Syndrome]

Think they getting this big push off the back of the Ass Boys stuff and one of them being in a reality show at the moment.  Crazy how over Danhausen got the whole Ass Boys thing but they've done the right thing for themselves and leaned into it massively.

I just lost it at Dark last week when the Acclaimed used the Assboys line, and you have Austin and Colten proper annoyed, and then there's Billy with a massive smile on his face clapping like mad, loving it. As well as it being a funny, silly name, I just like this dynamic of a dad adding to the embarrassment of his son's through the nickname.

That and Billy Gunn legitimately losing it over the line "Danhausen will come to thee Ass Ranch with you" in Danhausen's vlog

[Riquende]

I just lost it at Dark last week when the Acclaimed used the Assboys line, and you have Austin and Colten proper annoyed, and then there's Billy with a massive smile on his face clapping like mad, loving it.

Loved that whole section just after the rap - suddenly they had a finger-gun Mexican standoff in the ring (probably should note to anyone not aware that the two teams were on the same side in an 8 man tag), before turning it into all 4 of them doing the Acclaimed finger-scissoring.

Mark Henry: "They made it weird!"

Then the match itself was a fun multi-man thing.

It's the exact sort of main event Dark (or I guess Elevation? The one taped pre-Dynamite) needs to get the crowd hyped up for the start of the TV time.

[Barefoot Doctor]

Apparently they're trying to get Stone Cold back for a Mania match, since it's in Texas. Kevin Owens is doing an anti-Texas thing at the moment and since he uses the Stunner, it's a fair bet that he'll be on the receiving end of one in April. Really don't think it needs to be an official match though, what's the point? Think it'll just be KO doing a promo, glass shatters and he gets stunnered. Like has happened at about half the Mania's since Stone Cold retired.

[tubby]

Austin is a big fan of Owens so I can see he'd be tempted, but this is some real desperation from WWE again.