Topic: James Milner - El Burro Magnifico

[Pope Dave]

Mario's thread has been smouldering like a warm turd compost for days—and who the fuck knows why that malingering git has any noise other than contempt out of us—but, in the meantime: James Motherfucking Milner, ladies and gentlemen is, every single day of his motherucking life, James Motherfucking Milner.

If I'm going to soundtrack the effect he has on me when he's on the pitch, it's Floyd, and it's Meddle.

James motherfucking-I-Shit-You-Not Milner.

[DanA]

Hadn't considered him a fullback. He might get games there.

[Gus 1855]

Granted I was drifting in and out of consciousness for some of each game, but I think it's harsh so few have complimented Milner on two very impressive outings at fullback.

First half today especially he looked very solid defensively and went forward with great effect.

[88_RED]

A model pro, in an era when player power rules the roost..

Was very honest when he said, he doesn't like playing fullback, but will do whatever the manager wants and the team needs.

[Upinsmoke]

Granted I was drifting in and out of consciousness for some of each game, but I think it's harsh so few have complimented Milner on two very impressive outings at fullback.

First half today especially he looked very solid defensively and went forward with great effect.

He was good, also the way Klopp plays don't think of yourself as a full back, because wherever you play your working in defense and attack, so a left full back has similar duties to a left winger, up and down the wing supporting and defending. Half the time we will have the ball so your playing more as an attacking player trying to create and open play for your own team.

Tbf Milner suits the role, he might not favour it but he has the attributes for it so why not play there. He can cross on his right or left whereas moreno will either whip a cross in or pass it sideways, no matter what foot Milner is on you don't know what he will do. Plus with so many teams playing wingers on the other side because they can cut in then once again that suits Milner more.

[Rattleduser]

I'd start him over moreno at Arsenal, played well

[SyukriJ]

Reminds me of when Klopp playing Kevin Großkreutz as a right back at times whilst playing for Dortmund

[bodhisattva]

His delivery yesterday was very good, in the final third he offers much more of a threat than any of our fullbacks and he has the ability to go on either foot which makes him difficult to defend, id start him at left back against Arsenal

[Tobelius]

Milner did well again,it seems you can drop him in any position on either flank and he will deliver a quality professional performance.

He's strong,has enough pace,excellent stamina,good footballing brain and has the most accurate crossing of any of our players coupled with good level of overall skill on the ball.  I like him a lot.

[LallanaInPyjamas]

Reminds me of when Klopp playing Kevin Großkreutz as a right back at times whilst playing for Dortmund

Genuinely thought this might happen when Klopp came in. Milner is a better player than Grosskreutz as well.

I still think he'd be wasted slightly at full-back on a permanent basis, and it remains to be seen how he'd fare against genuine pace running at him. But I don't think anyone doubts he has many attributes to be a success there.

And it says a lot about Moreno that many of us would feel more comfortable with Milner starting the season there...

[Joff123]

I understand Moreno is a complete liability but surely surely we will need to sign a LB even as a back up?

Milner was our highest assists last season and obviously our attacking options have drastically improved but his delivery is restricted at LB.

Also i would massively fear him vs Walcott or martial or Lanzini for the simple reason or pure pace. I know positioning is a huge factor but.. he just is a yard off the pace anyway let alone vs a pacey winger.

Do want to utilise him this season pragmatically as he can be effective is used correctly, big decision for Klopp.

[SerbianScouser]

Really hope that Klopp will persist with this and that Milner will buy into it for the long-term. The idea of having the likes of Can, Gini, Phil, Mane, Firmino and Sturridge/Origi all in the final third and then on top of all that you`d have Milner arriving late in the second phase and doing his thing by getting to the byline is a mouthwatering one. For me he can offer us much more in the final third than either of Clyne and Moreno.

He is one of the most sensible players we have in the squad and it would be a major boost to see that experience, reliability and tons of smart, sensible decisions being made in this position.

[wemmick]

Yeah, I like Milner at LB. Smart move, I think. His defensive positioning is better than Moreno's, and what weaknesses he has against pacey sides shouldn't hurt us too much once the midfield sorts out its organization. Though he was one of the best players on the pitch yesterday. Should have had at least two assists.

[apocalypse]

I still think he'd be wasted slightly at full-back on a permanent basis.

I don't understand this. Why is it a waste when he would be playing even less if he wasn't a backup for that position? The commentators were going on and on about him being wasted last night (as well as something about pregnancy...).

[Djimi Smicer34]

Can't really fault his performance last night, he did a job as he always does, but I don't think he's the solution to our problems at left-back this season.

[LallanaInPyjamas]

I don't understand this. Why is it a waste when he would be playing even less if he wasn't a backup for that position? The commentators were going on and on about him being wasted last night (as well as something about pregnancy...).

Because he got 11 assists in the league alone last season and there's no guarantee he'd reproduce that from full-back.

It seems to have been forgotten that he actually did well for us in central midfield last season.

[killer-heels]

Really hope that Klopp will persist with this and that Milner will buy into it for the long-term. The idea of having the likes of Can, Gini, Phil, Mane, Firmino and Sturridge/Origi all in the final third and then on top of all that you`d have Milner arriving late in the second phase and doing his thing by getting to the byline is a mouthwatering one. For me he can offer us much more in the final third than either of Clyne and Moreno.

He is one of the most sensible players we have in the squad and it would be a major boost to see that experience, reliability and tons of smart, sensible decisions being made in this position.

Maybe at right back, but left back? I think its a temporary fix and better teams would exploit him, particularly those sides with clever players. Would be scared shitless playing him against the likes of Sanchez, Mahrez, Silva, Sane, Willian, Ozil, Mkhitaryan etc.

I think people will be surprised how many games Milner will get in midfield. If we go 4-3-3, then its 3 out of him, Can, Henderson and Wijnaldum. I would fancy my chances getting into there if I were Milner.

[Funky_Gibbons]

Because he got 11 assists in the league alone last season and there's no guarantee he'd reproduce that from full-back.

It seems to have been forgotten that he actually did well for us in central midfield last season.

I wonder how many of those assists came from his delivery from wide positions?

Even when he played CM he drifted wide right to get crosses in. That's one of his strongest attributes and playing at full back is probably the best way to take advantage of it. 

[007.lankyguy]

Because he got 11 assists in the league alone last season and there's no guarantee he'd reproduce that from full-back.

It seems to have been forgotten that he actually did well for us in central midfield last season.

He didn't, he was frequently poor in central midfield - lacklustre in build up play, not knowing how to circulate the ball from deep or how to help control a game, constantly wanting to make diagonal runs from in-to-out, often isolating himself from his midfield partner(s).

A lot of his assists were crosses from positions he'd be able to get into from full back very easily (especially given how Klopp wants his full backs to play) and his other assists were generally when he just happened to be the player who played the last pass rather than him constantly picking out incisive through balls from the centre of midfield.

[Fiasco]

I'd much rather we get a left back in and have Milner play further forward, especially so in the big games. How many assists did he get last season? 15 at least I believe. He's not the most flashy at times but he's a very important player. Every team needs a Milner, and given that we have quite a youthful squad his experience is also invaluable.

[ThePeetmix]

I wonder how many of those assists came from his delivery from wide positions?

Even when he played CM he drifted wide right to get crosses in. That's one of his strongest attributes and playing at full back is probably the best way to take advantage of it.

I agree. As much as Milner may not like it, he's a very good player in the wide positions. Hence why he's seen as an optiom at left-back rather than rushing out to get a left back. For me, he plays as either a wide attacking mid or at full-back against a lesser side. He will get more assists than most full backs will get from that position.

[LallanaInPyjamas]

He didn't, he was frequently poor in central midfield - lacklustre in build up play, not knowing how to circulate the ball from deep or how to help control a game, constantly wanting to make diagonal runs from in-to-out, often isolating himself from his midfield partner(s).

A lot of his assists were crosses from positions he'd be able to get into from full back very easily (especially given how Klopp wants his full backs to play) and his other assists were generally when he just happened to be the player who played the last pass rather than him constantly picking out incisive through balls from the centre of midfield.

Wow, all of that and yet he was still preferred over Allen, Lucas and to a lesser extent Henderson. We're even worse in midfield than I feared.

There's a difference between creating overload positions - which Milner is brilliant at - and being permanently stationed in a wide position. There's simply no way he'd get as many assists from full-back. You don't get the same freedom of movement, which he has always thrived on, hence why the majority of his assists came when he started centrally.

I agree he was ill-disciplined at times, but then that's Klopp's responsibility more than Milner's. He should know each player's weaknesses and strengths and a midfield two of Can and Milner hardly screams defensive solidity. The fact that he kept picking Milner suggests to me he was probably picking him precisely for those runs.

[killer-heels]

Talking about how good or poor he may there, i very much doubt he will be too happy there for any extended period of time. He hated playing there for City.

[ThePeetmix]

Wow, all of that and yet he was still preferred over Allen, Lucas and to a lesser extent Henderson. We're even worse in midfield than I feared.

There's a difference between creating overload positions - which Milner is brilliant at - and being permanently stationed in a wide position. There's simply no way he'd get as many assists from full-back. You don't get the same freedom of movement, which he has always thrived on, hence why the majority of his assists came when he started centrally.

I agree he was ill-disciplined at times, but then that's Klopp's responsibility more than Milner's. He should know each player's weaknesses and strengths and a midfield two of Can and Milner hardly screams defensive solidity. The fact that he kept picking Milner suggests to me he was probably picking him precisely for those runs.

This isn't the end of Milner either in midfield  or further forward. It's just that may think he's an asset in that posittion as well and wants to give him time there. He did do well against Salah who is a dangerous wide player himself, so we'll see how well he does get tested there.

[SlowRap]

Yeah, I like Milner at LB. Smart move, I think. His defensive positioning is better than Moreno's, and what weaknesses he has against pacey sides shouldn't hurt us too much once the midfield sorts out its organization. Though he was one of the best players on the pitch yesterday. Should have had at least two assists.

Another thing the lads an aboslute tank, no one is getting around him easily

[LallanaInPyjamas]

This isn't the end of Milner either in midfield  or further forward. It's just that may think he's an asset in that posittion as well and wants to give him time there. He did do well against Salah who is a dangerous wide player himself, so we'll see how well he does get tested there.

I agree, just find it strange that people are writing him off there when, across the course of the season, he was probably our best performing central midfielder. Which isn't saying a huge amount, granted.

Reminds me of the Gerrard snobbery.

[BER]

He's the English Zanetti.

[007.lankyguy]

There's a difference between creating overload positions - which Milner is brilliant at - and being permanently stationed in a wide position. There's simply no way he'd get as many assists from full-back. You don't get the same freedom of movement, which he has always thrived on, hence why the majority of his assists came when he started centrally.

Freedom of movement has nothing to do with whether he'll get assists or not. It's just about whether he gets the space to cross from the same positions and that comes down to us not leaving the flanks isolated of support. I don't see him playing a great deal at full back anyway so it's not a debate about him there the whole season. The issue is more whether he can do a covering job.

The reason he played in central midfield wasn't really anything to do with his actual skill-set in operating as a central midfielder; it was much more about him rotating with Lallana on the right. That's ok if the game is being played in the opposition's defensive third but when it isn't, he's an enormously limited CM.

[wah00ey]

This may not be a popular view but I really don't think he should be anywhere near the team at left back.  We HAVE to buy in and strengthen this position.  It'll be as bad as going into 14/15 without a recognised striker if we don't.

Milner is also not a starter in midfield in my opinion.  Never has been, never will be.  He provides cover for many positions, absolutely, but he's no starter unless injuries or suspensions dictate.

[Djozer]

This may not be a popular view but I really don't think he should be anywhere near the team at left back.  We HAVE to buy in and strengthen this position.  It'll be as bad as going into 14/15 without a recognised striker if we don't.

Milner is also not a starter in midfield in my opinion.  Never has been, never will be.  He provides cover for many positions, absolutely, but he's no starter unless injuries or suspensions dictate.

I'm not sure that it's that bad, but yeah, it's not good. I'm fairly happy with the rest of the squad options other than at left back, could do with more quality in midfield maybes, but it's hard to attract the level of talent we want without European football.

As for Milner, fair play to him. He evidently doesn't fancy it, but is willing and apparently able. A potential worry for me is that I have a Toon-supporting mate who said Milner's crossing was shit when he played on the left for them (I don't think it was left back, more left midfield or wide forward) and his crossing when on the move is one of his best assets and led to a fair few goals last season. His crossing when stationary is mostly as bad as anyone else in this squad, but I don't think you're allowed to sign for us these days if you're decent at corners so hey ho.

Otherwise though, at least for now, Klopp seems happy for Milner to be backup left back and Milner seems content to do the job. Moreno seems to have a fairly good injury record so he probably won't play there that often anyway, especially given the smaller number of games we'll be playing this season. Maybe Milner knows he may not get that many games in central midfield so he's happy to get on the pitch when and where he can. He strikes me as the type who'd rather play than sit about on the bench. Hopefully he does well wherever he plays.

[Carra-ton]

I would play Milner, on the wing. He gives some much needed protection to the midfield from the wing. His crossing is important too.

[TheTeflonJohn]

Granted I was drifting in and out of consciousness for some of each game, but I think it's harsh so few have complimented Milner on two very impressive outings at fullback.

First half today especially he looked very solid defensively and went forward with great effect.

Milner will never get the praise he deserves, he was excellent last season whilst taking stick for apparently being shit.

He`s an essential player that every squad needs, bags of experience, won titles, very versatile, very athletic and also very composed in the final third with the ability to put it on a plate for someone.

Think back to that moment in the dying stages of the Dortmund game when he laid it on for Lovren to score the winner.

We need defensive stability and I would give him a decent run at left back to see if he can improve the defense over Moreno, as good as Moreno is going forward, he`s an accident waiting to happen at the back. I can`t see Milner having such moments of defensive stupidity that Moreno brings.

Fucking great player.

[ricen]

I wonder how many of those assists came from his delivery from wide positions?

Even when he played CM he drifted wide right to get crosses in. That's one of his strongest attributes and playing at full back is probably the best way to take advantage of it. 

this. even when he was at man city his willingness to run down the flank and put a little chip or cross in is what led them to a title over us. we lacked that little extra near the touchline that a willian or salah would have done for us had chelsea not interfered and snapped them right out of our grasp.

[crabfootlong]

I do not see him doing a job for us in the defence. Not consistently at the least. He is a model pro and I would love to use him as a squad player to cover positions, including LB but he cannot start there. Doing a decent job in pre-season is very different to making it work in the league on a consistent basis.

[groove]

Don't think he's suited to a deeper midfield role where he lacks the awareness and his decision making fails him with time on the ball... but was really impressive in the second half of the season as a forward thinking midfielder. Love his wall passes/give-and-gos in and around the area, always mobile. Can see why him and Zabaleta worked with Silva as they'd just pivot around Silva, looking for openings to be slipped in behind to the byline. He's a very good never-say-die, one-touch, give-and-go, perpetual-motion footballer and fuck me can he dig out a cross when it looks lost. Just keep him out of the actual midfield bit.

[peachybum]

I would play Milner, on the wing. He gives some much needed protection to the midfield from the wing. His crossing is important too.

By playing as a full back he's going to get many more opportunities to cross. He could be a real offensive weapon. Just watching against Roma he got in advanced positions to put a ball in time and time again.

[fewmin' bedwetter]

I would play Milner, on the wing. He gives some much needed protection to the midfield from the wing. His crossing is important too.

Exactly. It's so obvious, and it was obvious before he even arrived with all that silly talk of playing centrally.
He gives lovely balance from the right wing, excellent crosses, linkup play, getting to the byline - everything really.
He would be my first choice there without a doubt (Mane should play central in my opinion).
How Milner is NOT our first choice to line up on the right of midfield every game, I don't understand.

[ThePeetmix]

Exactly. It's so obvious, and it was obvious before he even arrived with all that silly talk of playing centrally.
He gives lovely balance from the right wing, excellent crosses, linkup play, getting to the byline - everything really.
He would be my first choice there without a doubt (Mane should play central in my opinion).
How Milner is NOT our first choice to line up on the right of midfield every game, I don't understand.

Because we have Coutinho, who scores goals. We have Firmino who scores goals and Mane who scores goals, playing behind a striker who scores goals. That's the way Klopp has gone this summer by putting more goalscorers in the side. Milner certainly is a great creator but he's not going to be first choice in that front 4.

If we play a 4-3-3 then of course Milner could come in no problem.

[Weytske]

Because we have Coutinho, who scores goals. We have Firmino who scores goals and Mane who scores goals, playing behind a striker who scores goals. That's the way Klopp has gone this summer by putting more goalscorers in the side. Milner certainly is a great creator but he's not going to be first choice in that front 4.

If we play a 4-3-3 then of course Milner could come in no problem.

Also, Klopp likes his attacking midfielders to come inside so they leave the wing open for their fullbacks. Playing central thus allowed Milner to drift out wide behind the fullbacks, where he contributes most.

[fewmin' bedwetter]

I dunno lads, all fair enough - I just think he gives the team lovely balance from right mid. Seems it's not going to happen though, to be fair.