Topic: Jill's gorra boss Worcester Combi! (aka the weather thread)

[rob1966]

Various people have been messaging me.....Wirral Council spent £20m on flood defences in West Kirby. Today is the first real test of them.......and there is flooding.

You can always trust the local council to cock something up

[Qston]

They will be raging in the streets of West Kirby with some very loud tutting

[Peabee]

Various people have been messaging me.....Wirral Council spent £20m on flood defences in West Kirby. Today is the first real test of them.......and there is flooding.

You can always trust the local council to cock something up

Weren't local residents protesting against the sea wall as it would "ruin the character" of the area?

[rob1966]

They will be raging in the streets of West Kirby with some very loud tutting

To be fair though, a 10.2 m tide plus the winds is unusual and will breach sea defences

[ToneLa]

bloody hell has it rained enough yet

Have been up since about half 6, with it absolutely battering my windows

Just looked outside now after a shift in work and it's still hammering it down

well I hope the ducks in Greenbank Park are lovin it

[Red Beret]

Stopped raining around 1pm here in Toxteth, but just started lashing it down again. Bloody hell.

[Statto Red]

Stopped raining around 1pm here in Toxteth, but just started lashing it down again. Bloody hell.

Dry here in Moreton, Wirral, but still windy.

[Qston]

Weren't local residents protesting against the sea wall as it would "ruin the character" of the area?

Yup, and I think some were saying that they weren`t well designed in terms of stopping what has happened today.

Rob is right above though, particularly unusual combination of factors today, and primarily the job is to dissipate the energy of big waves. There are still a lot of pissed off locals though.

[Red Beret]

Dry here in Moreton, Wirral, but still windy.

the sun is out now, it's crazy. Probably going to get hit with intermittent heavy showers for the next few hours.

[jillcwhomever]

bloody hell has it rained enough yet

Have been up since about half 6, with it absolutely battering my windows

Just looked outside now after a shift in work and it's still hammering it down

well I hope the ducks in Greenbank Park are lovin it

The coots were loving it as I was coming home on the train, new streams everywhere and the birds making the most of it.

[ToneLa]

The coots were loving it as I was coming home on the train, new streams everywhere and the birds making the most of it.

well that's something

amazed the ring necked parakeets stick about in this weather

[rob1966]

Weren't local residents protesting against the sea wall as it would "ruin the character" of the area?

There was a bunch of idiots known as Southport 2000 back in the early 1990's, who vehemently opposed the sea wall at Southport, they delayed its construction for years, same shite as you've posted from the snobs of West Kirby. They even mentioned ruining the view, view of what, a fucking flat beach with the tide starting a mile out? The empty sea? The gas rigs out in the Irish Sea? ffs

On at least 65 days every year, the coast road had to be closed, as it was flooded due to the tide. This disrupted traffic, prevented access to the beach for everybody and stopped development. We were hiring eqpt to the company that eventually built the wall and the site agents were slagging these protesters off something rotten, one becasue it had fucked up all the work schedules and two, the wall was needed. Since it went up, the coast road hardly floods and its allowed the development of the retail and leisure facilities, so we got a cinema, Gym, bowling alley, restaurants, pubs and a hotel on a site that previously could never be developed. What always irked me though was, if they'd had worked WITH Sefton and the developers, we could have had a lot better sea wall, with better seating, access and maybe do domething different like build a cafe or such into the sea wall itself, you know, some kind of unique feature.

Some people do more harm than good.

[jillcwhomever]

well that's something

amazed the ring necked parakeets stick about in this weather

I am guessing they are used to tropical style storms. 

[Son of Spion]

Weren't local residents protesting against the sea wall as it would "ruin the character" of the area?

Many didn't want it. I think it caused a lot of resentment because it took much longer to construct than planned and it caused a lot of disruption to residents, and local businesses suffered quite badly during the project build too.

It totally failed today. Cars being washed off drives and bobbing around in the waves on the road. A business owner on the news this evening said the water that came over the wall now cannot retreat again because of the wall.

As Rob said, though, a 10.2 metre tide swept along on a strong, onshore wind is going to cause problems regardless of any wall.

Ironically, the sailing club was also flooded.

[Son of Spion]

The coots were loving it as I was coming home on the train, new streams everywhere and the birds making the most of it.

We were walking down Livingston Drive this afternoon and ducks from Sefton Park were over, swimming around in massive pools of water on the grassy areas.

[rob1966]

Many didn't want it. I think it caused a lot of resentment because it took much longer to construct than planned and it caused a lot of disruption to residents, and local businesses suffered quite badly during the project build too.

It totally failed today. Cars being washed off drives and bobbing around in the waves on the road. A business owner on the news this evening said the water that came over the wall now cannot retreat again because of the wall.

As Rob said, though, a 10.2 metre tide swept along on a strong, onshore wind is going to cause problems regardless of any wall.

Ironically, the sailing club was also flooded.

Just seen a video of a Red Corsa being moved by the water - now imagine the damage if that wall wasn't there 

[Son of Spion]

Just seen a video of a Red Corsa being moved by the water - now imagine the damage if that wall wasn't there 

I saw that too. If I were a local I'd have definitely moved my car to higher ground, maybe up by the main high street, just in case. Today's footage looked virtually the same as footage of previous storms/high tides there in the past, before the wall was built. There's one famous clip of someone's Volvo being washed off their drive and down the street.

I think it's a fact of life at West Kirby that unless the wall is ten feet tall they are always going to suffer in this kind of spring tide / storm scenario. Nature is just ruthless. West facing coast prone to westerly storms that sometimes coincide with big tides. What could go wrong?

[Red Beret]

The River Dee and West Kirby coast have a different topography from Liverpool on the Mersey, and even the dock walls and promenade here barely hold a 10 metre tide.

[jillcwhomever]

We were walking down Livingston Drive this afternoon and ducks from Sefton Park were over, swimming around in massive pools of water on the grassy areas.

There is loads of boggy land around Birkenhead North/Wallasey area as well, which always develop into these deep pools of water when there's been some heavy rain. The wild life loves it and better still they are away from people, as you can't walk there.

[Peabee]

Yup, and I think some were saying that they weren`t well designed in terms of stopping what has happened today.

Rob is right above though, particularly unusual combination of factors today, and primarily the job is to dissipate the energy of big waves. There are still a lot of pissed off locals though.

I think it was designed with input from local resident groups too. 

Given the rising seas and climate change, it may only get worse.

The jet stream has shifted too, bringing more wet and windy weather.

[kesey]

To Tony and Son of Spion .

That's all good and dead happy for them but the short cut between old nicks and the cricket pitch is a tad difficult of late which means I've got to cycle around .  Anyway we have a 18 degree heatwave to look forward to soon 

[John C]

Various people have been messaging me.....Wirral Council spent £20m on flood defences in West Kirby. Today is the first real test of them.......and there is flooding.

You can always trust the local council to cock something up

Freak circumstances today perhaps?
Extremely high tide combined with a storm.

And I think a councillor has confirmed the wall isn't there to stop the water, its to remove the energy from the waves, thus preventing significant destruction.

[Terry de Niro]

My garden has 3 lakes in it at the moment. 

[kesey]

Given the rising seas and climate change, it may only get worse.

They are just words .  Any proof , stats etc... ?  :

[Red Beret]

Saw this from Wirral Council on FB:

UPDATE 14:30 // There has been flooding at a number of locations around Wirral's coastal areas. The storm today has seen extremely high winds combined with higher than usual tides causing water to come over the flood wall at West Kirby. The flood wall in West Kirby was designed to act as a defence system to take power out of the tidal waves, to prevent higher levels of flooding and minimise potential damage in the area.
As with all significant flooding incidents we will assess the flood defences in conjunction with the Environment Agency.
While the weather conditions remain stormy it is advised to avoid the coastal areas. For updates, please tap the link in comments.
------
As you might have seen in the weather forecast, the Environment Agency has issued a flood warning for New Brighton - covering Marine Point, King's Parade and Marine Promenade areas.
There are also flood alerts - a lower grade warning with a risk of spray overtopping - covering other parts of New Brighton, West Kirby, Rock Park, and Meols Parade.

Y'see maybe I'm just a bitter cynic, but when you hear the term "flood defences" you tend to think that they're, y'know, defend against floods. When they fail at their first serious test and your council immediately turns around and says, "Oh no, no no - they're not meant to stop actual floods. They're just meant to dissipate the energy of waves and stop really big floods!"  - you kind of get the feeling your council is being a bit disingenuous.

And politicians really wonder why people look at them the way that they do?

[Son of Spion]

^
If I were a West Kirby promenade resident then I'd be seething at that Wirral Council statement. The wall was pitched to them as the answer to the the flooding problem that occurs along that stretch on the occasions were spring tides coincide with storms. The upheaval of the build itself and the financial hit local businesses took during it were supposed to be worth it in the long run because the wall would be a game changer.

Yet here the residents are. Waves washing their cars away and smashing against their homes just as they did in previous years before £20m was spent and well over a years' disruption was caused to their lives. It would appear that the only major difference the wall has made is it's now created a barrier stopping the water that overtopped it retreating back to the sea as the tide recedes.

I know nothing is perfect and nature is ruthlessly powerful, but I can see why residents might be upset with that statement from the council. It would appear that on this occasion the situation was just as bad as in previous pre-wall years, with the new problem of water not now being able to retreat back out again once it's overtopped the wall. You could forgive them for wondering if the upheaval and loss of business was worth it. And it was a lot of upheaval too. We go there fairly regularly, but we stopped going for much of the build because the entire front was a massive building site and fenced off. The wall isn't high, but a hell of a lot of piling work was done all along the stretch to secure the wall. It was a hell of a job, and you only see the tip of the iceberg with the finished product.

As I said, we, and many, many other people stopped going over there during much of the building period. Of course, this affected local businesses greatly. The cafe that was flooded yesterday is somewhere we'd spend money in when over there. They lost ours and many other people's custom during the build. Today they are faced with a bigger clean-up than in previous storms due to the water not being able to retreat due to the wall. I can understand their frustration.

[Red Beret]

^^^

Aye. The line about "higher than usual tides" is particularly galling. It's not like 10 metre tides in the Mersey/Dee area are unheard of - the Mersey has the second highest tidal range in the entire country ffs. There's a whole Wikipedia article on tidal bores, for example.

Whilst most of the tides might indeed be much much lower, I would have thought in an era of rising sea levels you might actually want to future proof your flood defences - especially if you're going to be spending £20m on them.

You don't build flood defences for the usual tides - you build them for the exceptional tides. That's the whole fucking point.

[Son of Spion]

I was at Burbo Bank for the 10m tide this afternoon. No problems today due the southerly wind direction. Yesterday was a westerly, blowing the tide onshore. Today it was pushing the water towards the north.

Yesterday must have been fun because a set of railings on the slipway were completely destroyed and the RNLI cabin, which is basically a 40ft shipping container used as an office had been ripped from the concrete supports it stands on and moved along the prom so it's facing in a completely different direction. 

[rob1966]

I see that a cannon from a kids play thing at New Brighton washed up on Crosby beach

[Lee1-6Liv]

Nice day today, I even went out in a t-shirt and didn't come back freeing and wet!

[Son of Spion]

It was quite nice earlier. It actually felt a bit warm. I was enticed enough to clean the car. It's now raining. 

[Crosby Nick]

I see that a cannon from a kids play thing at New Brighton washed up on Crosby beach

Are we being invaded?

[ToneLa]

It was quite nice earlier. It actually felt a bit warm. I was enticed enough to clean the car. It's now raining. 

 was 18 degrees as I walked to Aldi for lunch!

Raining now...

[rob1966]

Are we being invaded?

By Albanians according to some

[ToneLa]

It's my birthday tomorrow, so I'm planning to go out in white jeans and a white hoodie, maybe even shades. I don't drink, so I want to look like the coolest / wankerst 0% sober drinker around

Checked the weather. Cold and drizzly

 

[rob1966]

It's my birthday tomorrow, so I'm planning to go out in white jeans and a white hoodie, maybe even shades. I don't drink, so I want to look like the coolest / wankerst 0% sober drinker around

Checked the weather. Cold and drizzly

 

Modern John Travolta

[rob1966]

Fucking sick of this now, it's fucking freezing again, dull grey and starting to rain. It's 5 months til Autumn for fucks sake and it still feels like winter.

[Crosby Nick]

Fucking sick of this now, it's fucking freezing again, dull grey and starting to rain. It's 5 months til Autumn for fucks sake and it still feels like winter.

21 degrees in London yesterday and today! But then back to about 14 tomorrow so will enjoy it while I can!

[rob1966]

21 degrees in London yesterday and today! But then back to about 14 tomorrow so will enjoy it while I can!

We're in London 11th May, hope its nice that weekend.

[kesey]

Fucking sick of this now, it's fucking freezing again, dull grey and starting to rain. It's 5 months til Autumn for fucks sake and it still feels like winter.

There was a day about a week or so when I said to my mate about 4.30pm. I keep on expecting it to go dark soon as it feels like late October.