Author Topic: Dirk Kuyt  (Read 49680 times)

Offline Adeemo

  • surreally arsed
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 12,783
  • A.W.E.S.O.M.-O
Re: Dirk Kuyt
« Reply #280 on: February 27, 2012, 06:38:20 pm »
Perfect impact sub.

Said exactly the same yesterday, no defender would want to see Dirk Kuyt coming on against tiring legs.
"I love the Pope, I love seeing him in his Pope-Mobile, his three feet of bullet proof plexi-glass. That's faith in action folks! You know he's got God on his side"

Online Hazell

  • Ultimate Movie Night Draft Winner 2017. King - or Queen - of Mystery. Hyzenthlay. The 5th Benitle's sex conch.
  • RAWK Scribe
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 76,900
Re: Dirk Kuyt
« Reply #281 on: February 27, 2012, 06:39:36 pm »
Perfect impact sub.  He has some pace but his energy is what we need going into the final half hour of a game.  Love the man.

Yeah, it was exactly the same against Man Utd in the FA Cup. Him and Bellamy helped change that game as well.
We have to change from doubter to believer. Now.

Offline Gnurglan

  • The Swedish Savaloy
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 35,551
Re: Dirk Kuyt
« Reply #282 on: February 27, 2012, 06:44:27 pm »
Finally got to watch Jamie Redknapp talking about my banner, fucking love it. 26.10 minutes in

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xp2kwz_cc-lfc-vs-cardiff-post-celebration-26-02-12_lifestyle?start=5

Also love the fact that in a 17 minute cameo or whatever it was Dirk came on, raced about like a man possessed who was determined to finally win a trophy with us, chasing and pressing and fighting, played a great through ball, passed it well, burst with pace past tired defenders, hit a shit shot, then scored a blinder when it fell back to him, cleared an effort of the line, then just couldn't stop another. Then he acted like a second captain, consoling Gerrard and Adam both when they missed their pens and telling the lads we could still win, geeing them up and telling them to believe, then stepped up and as fucking ice cool as he was in the last minute of a Goodison derby or a Champions League semi-final shootout, dispatched his pivotal pen that got us back on track and punching the air got the traveling Kop back believing too. I couldn't have scripted that if I'd allowed myself to dream.

Nevermind whether it changes people's long term opinions about him, because there is no reason that one cameo should. Or whether he should or shouldn't be upgraded in the summer (personally I would like us to sign a top RW and keep Dirk as a squad player and impact sub). Yesterday he stepped up to the plate when the chips were down and that's why I love him despite all his flaws.

Now let's double his trophy haul and get back on Europe's top table where we belong!

:thumbup from me as well. Showed real leadership yesterday. Very important.

        * * * * * *


"The key isn't the system itself, but how the players adapt on the pitch. It doesn't matter if it's 4-3-3 or 4-4-2, it's the role of the players that counts." Rafa Benitez

Offline CHOPPER

  • Bad Tranny with a Chopper. Hello John gotta new Mitre? I'm Jim Davidson in disguise. Undercover Cop (Grammar Division). Does Louis Spence. Well. A giga-c*nt worth of nothing in particular. Hodgson apologist. Astronomical cock. Hug Jacket Distributor
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 52,575
  • Super Title: Not Arsed
Re: Dirk Kuyt
« Reply #283 on: February 27, 2012, 06:48:41 pm »
Made up for him more than any other of the players yesterday. Considering his run through a wall, and in some instances, having the first touch of a wall, mind set and his die for the cause mentality, I'm absolutely chuffed to bits for him. Very few better servants to the club in the last 7 years.

Just a bit gutted for him that he's only gotten the one medal with us in all his time here.
@ Veinticinco de Mayo The way you talk to other users on this forum is something you should be ashamed of as someone who is suppose to be representing the site.
Martin Kenneth Wild - Part of a family

Offline Yorkykopite

  • Misses Danny Boy with a passion. Phil's Official Biographer, dontcherknow...it's all true. Honestly.
  • RAWK Writer
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 34,489
  • The first five yards........
Re: Dirk Kuyt
« Reply #284 on: February 27, 2012, 06:50:41 pm »
dispatched his pivotal pen that got us back on track and punching the air got the traveling Kop back believing too. I couldn't have scripted that if I'd allowed myself to dream.

Nah, if you'd scripted it the ball would have burst the back of the net cannoned into Rossi behind the goal, knocked him out, before ricocheting on to me and doing the same. 
"If you want the world to love you don't discuss Middle Eastern politics" Saul Bellow.

Offline Andy @ Allerton!

  • Missing an asterisk - no, wait sorry, that's his rusty starfish..... RAWK Apple fanboy. Hedley Lamarr's bestest mate. Has done nothing incredible ever.
  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 73,716
  • Asterisks baby!
Re: Dirk Kuyt
« Reply #285 on: February 27, 2012, 07:47:49 pm »
Rossi should have his named changed to Billy because he's that silly.
Quote from: tubby on Today at 12:45:53 pm

They both went in high, that's factually correct, both tried to play the ball at height.  Doku with his foot, Mac Allister with his chest.

Offline bobadicious

  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 3,231
Re: Dirk Kuyt
« Reply #286 on: February 27, 2012, 08:11:23 pm »
Dirk Kuyt

Never Give Up

Football is a lie

Offline lfc_col

  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 7,389
  • And Could He Play!
Re: Dirk Kuyt
« Reply #287 on: February 27, 2012, 08:16:37 pm »
We Won It Six Times



JFT 97

Offline rakey_lfc

  • pwned by Ronaldo...and eBay
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 9,004
  • I'm a people's man - only the people matter.”
Re: Dirk Kuyt
« Reply #288 on: February 27, 2012, 08:24:57 pm »
I love him.

He's may not be techinically the greatest, but fucking hell when we need him to step up he does it for us. Love him just fucking love him!
SUPPORT AND BELIEVE
 
You'll Never Walk Alone

Xbox 360 gamertag - TonyB1604

Offline Sar75

  • no common sents
  • RAWK Supporter
  • Kopite
  • ******
  • Posts: 509
  • We all Live in a Red and White Kop
Re: Dirk Kuyt
« Reply #289 on: February 27, 2012, 08:33:22 pm »
I love him.

He's may not be techinically the greatest, but fucking hell when we need him to step up he does it for us. Love him just fucking love him!
I was dead pleased when he came on yesterday, he was just what we needed at that point in the match. He thoroughly deserves a winners medal. His desire and drive could do with rubbing off on some others. The passion he showed when he scored showed how much the win means to him too. Personally, if he does go, I'll miss Dirk. He embodies for me someone who feels the privilege of pulling on the red shirt and representing our club.
To work hard and have our supporters behind us and believing until the end, you run a little bit more.
Rafa Benitez

Offline rakey_lfc

  • pwned by Ronaldo...and eBay
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 9,004
  • I'm a people's man - only the people matter.”
Re: Dirk Kuyt
« Reply #290 on: February 27, 2012, 08:34:50 pm »
I was dead pleased when he came on yesterday, he was just what we needed at that point in the match. He thoroughly deserves a winners medal. His desire and drive could do with rubbing off on some others. The passion he showed when he scored showed how much the win means to him too. Personally, if he does go, I'll miss Dirk. He embodies for me someone who feels the privilege of pulling on the red shirt and representing our club.

The first time I was 100% confident we would win the shoot out was from his celebration. He went fucking mental with passion!
SUPPORT AND BELIEVE
 
You'll Never Walk Alone

Xbox 360 gamertag - TonyB1604

Offline BCCC

  • Or B square
  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 13,976
  • Blessed are the Cheesemakers
Re: Dirk Kuyt
« Reply #291 on: February 27, 2012, 08:54:38 pm »
Should be our penno taker that's all.
*****LFC Purveyors of fine football tradition since 1892*****

Offline El Campeador

  • Capital of Culture's Campaign Manager...Transfer Board Veteran 5 Stars.
  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 20,721
  • The shupporters create chances, for sure, djes
Re: Dirk Kuyt
« Reply #292 on: February 27, 2012, 08:56:32 pm »
Haha, Yorky, that was funny.

Tell you what, the Mrs was chuffed to bits. I had to practically peel her off the ceiling, tears of joy and all. She was annoyed he didn't start - "Big game, why isn't he out there? - and it made her day to see him score and lift the cup.

Offline bobadicious

  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 3,231
Re: Dirk Kuyt
« Reply #293 on: February 27, 2012, 08:59:17 pm »
Why does everyone say he'll be off in the summer? Why would Kenny want to loose this man? He may be 31 but hes fit as fuck, can play many positions, is a model professional, a good guy to have around the club and has giant balls of steal. Offer him a contract Kenny fucksake, players with Dirks undefeatable warrior spirit dont come along every day.
« Last Edit: February 27, 2012, 09:01:19 pm by bobadicious »
Football is a lie

Offline koolkamal

  • There's a kind of hush
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 6,440
  • Our dreams are what make us who we are.
Re: Dirk Kuyt
« Reply #294 on: February 27, 2012, 09:49:09 pm »
Don't believe he'll be sold next season - he "may" not start as many games but he's a great player to have in the squad.
"All our dreams can come true, if we have the courage to pursue them". Walt Disney

Online redtel

  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 3,298
  • Sir Roger-Scored first goal ever on MOTD.
Re: Dirk Kuyt
« Reply #295 on: February 27, 2012, 09:50:43 pm »


Tell you what, the Mrs was chuffed to bits. I had to practically peel her off the ceiling, tears of joy and all. She was annoyed he didn't start - "Big game, why isn't he out there? - and it made her day to see him score and lift the cup.

My missus is the same. Doesn't understand the game but knows a fighter when she sees one.

 Fantastic cameo yesterday.

As Sabu Pundit said:

BUT BOY this Dutchy got bigger balls than one what chased Patrick McGoohan , he greater professional ass Bogie & Doyle

 ;)
We are definitely believers and we’ve won the fucking lot!

Offline Sangria

  • In trying to be right ends up wrong without fail
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 19,113
  • We all Live in a Red and White Kop
Re: Dirk Kuyt
« Reply #296 on: February 27, 2012, 10:20:36 pm »
Why does everyone say he'll be off in the summer? Why would Kenny want to loose this man? He may be 31 but hes fit as fuck, can play many positions, is a model professional, a good guy to have around the club and has giant balls of steal. Offer him a contract Kenny fucksake, players with Dirks undefeatable warrior spirit dont come along every day.

I think he'll be off because of Dalglish's selection policy. Not that he'll seek to leave because of that policy, but because from evidence it seems probable that Dalglish tends to pick players he's planning the future with, whether or not others may offer more right now, with Kuyt and Maxi missing out. It's arguable either way whether this is a good policy or not, but the policy itself seems clear enough.
"i just dont think (Lucas is) that type of player that Kenny wants"
Vidocq, 20 January 2011

http://www.redandwhitekop.com/forum/index.php?topic=267148.msg8032258#msg8032258

Offline steveeastend

  • Learnt to play them drums
  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 15,853
Re: Dirk Kuyt
« Reply #297 on: February 27, 2012, 10:23:21 pm »
Don't believe he'll be sold next season - he "may" not start as many games but he's a great player to have in the squad.


He has to stay, we will need him for sure with the europe-two-games-a-week routine coming back next season.
One thing does need to be said: in the post-Benitez era, there was media-led clamour (but also some politicking going on at the club) to make the club more English; the idea being that the club had lost the very essence of what it means to be ‘Liverpool’. Guillem Ballague 18/11/10

Offline Mutton Geoff

  • 'The Invigilator'
  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 32,663
  • Life is a journey, not a destination.
Re: Dirk Kuyt
« Reply #298 on: February 27, 2012, 10:38:15 pm »
You weren't the 'bore' I was referring to (genderswapping Geoffstrong/Monica whatever the fuck he calls himself). On the contrary I always usually enjoy our exchanges.

Hark at you Mr Sensitive ;D

Bit prickly mate seems to me the biter doesn't like getting bit. What was that about Mr Sensitive Rossi?
A world were Liars and Hypocrites are accepted and rewarded and honest people are derided!
Who voted in this lying corrupt bastard anyway

Offline Gnurglan

  • The Swedish Savaloy
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 35,551
Re: Dirk Kuyt
« Reply #299 on: February 27, 2012, 10:51:48 pm »
I think he'll be off because of Dalglish's selection policy. Not that he'll seek to leave because of that policy, but because from evidence it seems probable that Dalglish tends to pick players he's planning the future with, whether or not others may offer more right now, with Kuyt and Maxi missing out. It's arguable either way whether this is a good policy or not, but the policy itself seems clear enough.

That's how I see it. It's not as if we actively try to play him, like we do with Downing and Henderson and lately with Carroll. It's the opposite. We place him outside the team as soon as there is a chance to. Would be very surprised to see Kuyt in the squad when next season starts.

        * * * * * *


"The key isn't the system itself, but how the players adapt on the pitch. It doesn't matter if it's 4-3-3 or 4-4-2, it's the role of the players that counts." Rafa Benitez

Offline Mutton Geoff

  • 'The Invigilator'
  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 32,663
  • Life is a journey, not a destination.
Re: Dirk Kuyt
« Reply #300 on: February 27, 2012, 10:58:36 pm »
The guy has scored almost as many vital goals as Stevie not bad for a player who cannot trap a sack of spuds, sometimes the unconventional players are a great asset to the team, like an artisan to an artist!
A world were Liars and Hypocrites are accepted and rewarded and honest people are derided!
Who voted in this lying corrupt bastard anyway

Offline farawayred

  • Whizz For Atomms. Nucular boffin. A Mars A Day Helps Him Work, Rest And Play
  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 26,782
  • Oh yes, I'm a believer!
Re: Dirk Kuyt
« Reply #301 on: February 27, 2012, 11:41:28 pm »
The guy has scored almost as many vital goals as Stevie not bad for a player who cannot trap a sack of spuds, sometimes the unconventional players are a great asset to the team, like an artisan to an artist!
This season - as many goals as Skrtel, one a piece at the final too. I know, Skrtel played more minutes...
Cruyff: "Victory is not enough, there also needs to be beautiful football."

Pheeny

  • Guest
Re: Dirk Kuyt
« Reply #302 on: February 27, 2012, 11:43:39 pm »
Fucking Kaaskop. :P Love him to bits...

Offline Strummer77

  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 3,624
  • @AlexDavis90
Re: Dirk Kuyt
« Reply #303 on: February 28, 2012, 12:17:49 am »
Changed the game. Scored a great goal. Stopped a goal on the line. Stopped a second then was fouled. First to console Gerrard and Adam. Then scored a belter o a pen when we needed it. Exccellent stuff.

Spot on. A credit to this football club is our Dirk.

Offline jckliew

  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 9,269
Re: Dirk Kuyt
« Reply #304 on: February 28, 2012, 12:29:47 am »
Hes fast becoming our impact player- SUpa Sub!
My 12yr old son asked me: Is Blackburn a Racist name?

Offline Gifted Right Foot

  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 5,389
Re: Dirk Kuyt
« Reply #305 on: February 28, 2012, 04:14:46 am »
you could see how much this meant to him.  when he had his arms out with suarez on his back and screaming at the crowd after his goal i felt like i could have taken tyson on he fired me up that much.  he injected so much grit and determination into the team once he came on and was the change we needed.  it tells you something when he was the only person i wasnt nervous about when everyone stepped up to take a penalty kick.  the man is a machine. 

Offline rowan_d

  • boat. Señor Paolo de Souza-Farquharson :)
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 18,309
  • JFT96
Re: Dirk Kuyt
« Reply #306 on: February 28, 2012, 08:13:39 am »
When he leaves, some people will think 'good riddance.'

That thought makes me sad

Offline Pistolero

  • BELIEVE. My bad. This. Lol. Bless. Meh. Wow just wow. Hate on. The Ev. Phil.
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 19,892
  • A serpent's tooth...
Re: Dirk Kuyt
« Reply #307 on: February 28, 2012, 08:21:50 am »
In the era of ludicrously wealthy, stroppy, selfish, arrogant lazy-arsed footballers...Dirk is a breath of fresh air...real old school, 100%, never say die, fuckin grafter...with balls of steel for good measure....won't go down as a legend, but he's the kind of rock that the club was built on.
They have life in them, they have humour, they're arrogant, they're cocky and they're proud. And that's what I want my team to be.

Offline Mutton Geoff

  • 'The Invigilator'
  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 32,663
  • Life is a journey, not a destination.
Re: Dirk Kuyt
« Reply #308 on: February 28, 2012, 08:27:59 am »
In the era of ludicrously wealthy, stroppy, selfish, arrogant lazy-arsed footballers...Dirk is a breath of fresh air...real old school, 100%, never say die, fuckin grafter...with balls of steel for good measure....won't go down as a legend, but he's the kind of rock that the club was built on.

will go down as a legend for me, given how many important goals he scored in vital games. Give me a worker to a prima donna anyday
A world were Liars and Hypocrites are accepted and rewarded and honest people are derided!
Who voted in this lying corrupt bastard anyway

Offline -RedTilDead-

  • RAWK Supporter
  • Kopite
  • ******
  • Posts: 653
Re: Dirk Kuyt
« Reply #309 on: February 28, 2012, 08:35:20 am »
In the era of ludicrously wealthy, stroppy, selfish, arrogant lazy-arsed footballers...Dirk is a breath of fresh air...real old school, 100%, never say die, fuckin grafter...with balls of steel for good measure....won't go down as a legend, but he's the kind of rock that the club was built on.

Sadly these traits are vastly undervalued by so many fans who can't see very far past a sublime touch. We WILL miss him when he's gone whether you like it or not.

Was equally made up for him and Kenny on Sunday.
"I'm a white male, age 18 to 49. Everyone listens to me, no matter how dumb my suggestions are." - Homer Simpson

Offline Botswana Red

  • Kopite
  • *****
  • Posts: 634
  • Title Chasin'
Re: Dirk Kuyt
« Reply #310 on: February 28, 2012, 08:42:39 am »
Dirk has to be kept @ the club for as long as possible.  Great player who goes the extra mile.
Sign megastars...

Offline mysterio_86

  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 1,102
  • We all Live in a Red and White Kop
Re: Dirk Kuyt
« Reply #311 on: February 28, 2012, 08:43:16 am »
When he leaves, some people will think 'good riddance.'

That thought makes me sad
Fuck them douches !!

Remember the last penalty in Champions League Semi against Chelsea when his perfectly legal goal in extra time was discarded  :no He scores the final penalty and runs into absolute oblivion ? and realizes ! Wait ! WTF ! Where are Others ? Ohh That WAY !!  ;D ;D ;D ;D

He is our Legal Blondie made out of Titanium and guts of Kenyan Marathon runner !! He has to stay and will stay, let the fancy trick pony love cry !! dont give a sh!t !
Sebastion Coates, Suso, Sterling, Shelvey, Samed Yesil, SinclairSama, Smichael Ngoo, Sryan McLaughlin, Sjordan Ibe, - The S Law

_____________________________________________
Amy Lawerence is John Terry's Bitch

Offline HariLFC

  • Kopite
  • *****
  • Posts: 614
  • Walk on with hope in your heart.
Re: Dirk Kuyt
« Reply #312 on: February 29, 2012, 01:51:25 am »
I want him to end his career here, he's our duracell bunny. My God, he's popped up with some big goals over the years, a real fighter.

Offline Terry de Niro

  • Cellar dweller fella, ya know
  • RAWK Scribe
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 53,447
  • Are you talkin' to me or chewin' a brick?
Re: Dirk Kuyt
« Reply #313 on: February 29, 2012, 02:09:19 am »
will go down as a legend for me, given how many important goals he scored in vital games. Give me a worker to a prima donna anyday
You and me both mate.
Sadly, most people on here don't remember the likes of Joey Jones and Alan Kennedy.

Online Alonso_The_Assassin

  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 9,208
    • Just Words
Re: Dirk Kuyt
« Reply #314 on: February 29, 2012, 02:55:48 am »
Like the unfashionable girlfriend who you don't just realise how important she was until she's gone. In football terms, that's Dirk Kuyt.


Offline abs-ibs

  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 1,444
Re: Dirk Kuyt
« Reply #315 on: February 29, 2012, 03:22:05 am »
Dirky boy is a STAR. I really hope we dont get rid of him. Big game player n half. I know he hasn't been fantastic this year , but I think we need to play him more right now with the games we've got coming up. Need his duracellness

Offline Dr. Beaker

  • Veo, to his mates. Shares 50% of his DNA with a banana. Would dearly love to strangle Frankengoose. Lo! Be he not ye Messiah, verily be he a child of questionable conduct in the eyes of Ye Holy Border Guards.
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 16,803
  • I... think I am, therefore...I....maybe.
Re: Dirk Kuyt
« Reply #316 on: February 29, 2012, 03:46:25 am »
The first touch of a ping-pong table but you'd have him in your team for every game - I'd have him as captain meself. I love Dirk.
NAKED BOOBERY

Rile-Me costed L. Nee-Naw "The Child" Torrence the first jack the hat-trick since Eon Rush vs Accursed Toffos, many moons passed. Nee-Naw he could have done a concreted his palace in the pantyhose off the LibPole Gods...was not was for the invented intervention of Rile-Me whistler.

Offline kapil08

  • Kopite
  • *****
  • Posts: 858
Re: Dirk Kuyt
« Reply #317 on: February 29, 2012, 07:29:50 am »
You and me both mate.

Make it the three of us.

Duck Kite. Cant possibly love the man more.
"If Bob Paisley had been on the continent or in America, in whatever capacity or field he worked, and achieved what he achieved, I think he’d be rated higher than the President, the Lord Mayor, the King or the Queen or whatever"

Ron Atkinson

Offline opsteo

  • Kopite
  • *****
  • Posts: 688
Re: Dirk Kuyt
« Reply #318 on: February 29, 2012, 08:04:47 am »
If ManU can keep 2 very senior (read old) players and depend on them for vital games or rally team, I would very much like Kenny to keep Kuyt who is 31 years young around.  When I see him replace Carroll, I did not see that we are weakened as a team (by replacing Carroll with Kuyt)  but rather trying other options.  If Liverpool wants to play in Europe and do well in league, it need to hold on to Kuyt because unlike Arsenal,  we need a few senior players to lead the team and to embarass/scold others into greater effort.  To be frank without Kuyt and Maxi, who is going to play the sweet 1-2s and triangles with Suarez.   We have only Gerrard left with the mind set, movement, understanding and goal scoring mentality to blend with Suarez so far, Downing/Henderson/Carroll or Adam does not synch with Suarez well.

Offline Dentron

  • Eastenders Sci-Fi Spinoff
  • Kopite
  • *****
  • Posts: 815
  • We all Live in a Red and White Kop
Re: Dirk Kuyt
« Reply #319 on: February 29, 2012, 09:48:40 am »
As a player that comes on at the end of matches and pressure and runs at already tired defenders, I like him. A lot of people seem to be fooling themselves into thinking he'd be just as effective from the opening whistle. Every single match that he starts his lack of touch is exposed, and he breaks up attack after attack. Almost every single match that he comes off the bench for, he makes a positive impact.

I'm praying that we keep using him the way we did against Cardiff, where his positive attributes will be useful, and his negative attributes won't be so exposed.