Topic: The Klopp Template

[Sonofthewind]

Does anyone have any idea why our counter attacking has become so hopeless. Anytime we have a man advantage on the break more often than not we waste it. Is it players? Tactics? So painful to watch with plenty of examples on display again tonight.

[Suareznumber7]

Bad decision making

[mattD]

Does anyone have any idea why our counter attacking has become so hopeless. Anytime we have a man advantage on the break more often than not we waste it. Is it players? Tactics? So painful to watch with plenty of examples on display again tonight.

Firmino and Mane have gone. Insane levels there in countering. And Díaz and Nunez not nearly as good, Diaz particularly slows the play down when he gets it. So frustrating but I guess some players are better built and equipped for it.

[Eeyore]

Salah is no longer a freak.

The major part of our counterattacks was that Salah was unplayable 1v1. He would just run away from defenders. Now you play Mo in and half the time he is looking to play someone else in.

[amir87]

Salah is no longer a freak.

The major part of our counterattacks was that Salah was unplayable 1v1. He would just run away from defenders. Now you play Mo in and half the time he is looking to play someone else in.

We shouldn’t rely on any one man to be able to successfully counter attack. A much bigger reason is bad decision making or execution. We’ve had two clear examples at Old Trafford where we either played the pass at the wrong time with Gakpo or didn’t play the pass at all with Nunez.

[Draex]

We need to do some training on these situations, stop trying to walk the fucking ball into the net, bang bang bang three quick passes and shoot.

[killer-heels]

We shouldn’t rely on any one man to be able to successfully counter attack. A much bigger reason is bad decision making or execution. We’ve had two clear examples at Old Trafford where we either played the pass at the wrong time with Gakpo or didn’t play the pass at all with Nunez.

Mane, Firmino and Salah were special forwards. That includes the ability to play on instinct but also play the right pass at the right time. That image shows Szobozslai, Nunez and Diaz alongside Salah and they very much play on instinct and are not as good with time, a bit too frantic.

[Chris~]

We need to do some training on these situations, stop trying to walk the fucking ball into the net, bang bang bang three quick passes and shoot.

We do training on it. I mean this was ultimately just poor decision making by Diaz and Nunez and a bit of a poor pass from Salah.

I don't think we score much less of these types of goals than we did, they're going to not make up many of our league goals say 10+ in any given season I imagine,, we just have a couple high profile misses this year and people foeget the times we fucked it 3-4 years ago

[MonsLibpool]

We do training on it. I mean this was ultimately just poor decision making by Diaz and Nunez and a bit of a poor pass from Salah.

I don't think we score much less of these types of goals than we did, they're going to not make up many of our league goals say 10+ in any given season I imagine,, we just have a couple high profile misses this year and people foeget the times we fucked it 3-4 years ago

We tend to get these chances when we're one ahead. Taking them more often means we're killing games off and winning more points.

Against Arsenal, we had a clear counter at 1-1 and we didn't score. That could have easily be 2 extra points.

[Draex]

We do training on it. I mean this was ultimately just poor decision making by Diaz and Nunez and a bit of a poor pass from Salah.

I don't think we score much less of these types of goals than we did, they're going to not make up many of our league goals say 10+ in any given season I imagine,, we just have a couple high profile misses this year and people foeget the times we fucked it 3-4 years ago

We consistently scored these under Bobby, Mane, Salah, we now don't. Infact I can't recall the last we finished one of these types of chances and we do get them regularly.

[Chris~]

We consistently scored these under Bobby, Mane, Salah, we now don't. Infact I can't recall the last we finished one of these types of chances and we do get them regularly.

Statistical evidence or just going of memory though?

[Draex]

Statistical evidence or just going of memory though?

Memory of course although I'm 99% sure we faffed a similar chance in the last few games.

[Funky_Gibbons]

Just looking at WhoScored (I know), they have our counter atatck goals as the following over the last five seasons;

23/24 - 6 (and counting)
22/23 - 7
21/22 - 4
20/21 - 5
19/20 - 10

[Sonofthewind]

Just looking at WhoScored (I know), they have our counter atatck goals as the following over the last five seasons;

23/24 - 6 (and counting)
22/23 - 7
21/22 - 4
20/21 - 5
19/20 - 10

Interesting. It certainly doesn't feel that way. Maybe some people have seen yesterday to confirm biases (me included).

I suppose with all stats, there's greater context, and when we're needing 3 points it's just extra frustrating to not take advantage, because apparently according to those stats this season we are quite capable!

[Funky_Gibbons]

Interesting. It certainly doesn't feel that way. Maybe some people have been seeing yesterday to confirm biases (me included).

I suppose with all stats, there's greater context, and when we're needing 3 points it's just extra frustrating to not take advantage, because apparently according to those stats this season we are quite capable!

Unfortunately the stat doesn't give us all the information we require to see whetehr we;ve got worse at counter attacks. I think a 'number of counter attacks' and 'number of failed/successful counter atatcks' would help add some context.

[Eeyore]

Unfortunately the stat doesn't give us all the information we require to see whetehr we;ve got worse at counter attacks. I think a 'number of counter attacks' and 'number of failed/successful counter atatcks' would help add some context.

How many of those counter attack goals though were just Mo getting the wrong side of a defender and just running away from them. That doesn't really happen as much now.

[The_Nomad]

All this will be the new coach’s problem next season. As for the rest of this one, there isn’t much time in between all the remaining fixtures to train on some radically new approach to fix these shortcomings. We’ll just have to hope that something clicks soonish.

[Kashinoda]

Just looking at WhoScored (I know), they have our counter atatck goals as the following over the last five seasons;

23/24 - 6 (and counting)
22/23 - 7
21/22 - 4
20/21 - 5
19/20 - 10

I imagine that corresponds to possession.

[crewlove]

Second half was something else, especially our build-up play. Just no ideas and it was even worse with them realizing they can press us very high up with no consequences.

Had really high hopes for 23/24 Klopp's template, but it is what it is now. We really need a rethink. It can go both ways without JK, but I'm looking forward anyway.

[Wool]

It’s broken.

[disgraced cake]

It’s broken.

Considering his clear loss of energy perfect time for a change. Very sad.

[6BigCups]

Completely outsmarted against Atalanta. Didn’t have a clue what to change

[djschembri]

A weakness of Klopp's time, exposed today unfortunately.

When our Plan A is good, its very good.
But it is fragile, and there is no allowance for a Plan B.

The last twenty minutes of this game was crying out for a different, more direct approach yet we kept passing ourselves backwards and getting nowhere.

Big 6 to go but its a shame it seems to be ending with a whimper.

[y2w902]

That’s the worst attempt at a comeback I’ve seen, we were fucking clueless in that second half, they dealt with us so easily. Players had no idea what to do, extremely poor showing.

[Fromola]

Second half was something else, especially our build-up play. Just no ideas and it was even worse with them realizing they can press us very high up with no consequences.

Had really high hopes for 23/24 Klopp's template, but it is what it is now. We really need a rethink. It can go both ways without JK, but I'm looking forward anyway.

I wouldn't mind if the tactic was to at least stay in the game and then up the ante last 20 minutes or whatever, but we were just out of ideas.

[HeartAndSoul]

Is the template now to pass between the centre backs and goalkeeper?

[Phineus]

Pretty clear that behind the scenes for last few years it’s been too messy - listening to what Klopp wants the team to do, been tough to play against etc, and then looking at the recruitment over last 2-3 seasons (or lackthereof in some windows) it’s not been synced up at all.

Gets you performances like that.

[PEG2K]

Surprised no one has pointed out that we as a team are really bad at playing out of a press with passing and movement. We couldn't build up through the midfield at all in that half. Alisson just stood there for ages looking for options, then he had to go long. People are trying to pin the problem to this player or that player but the real problem is the whole team and their coaching.

Said this in the HT thread and oh my, the second half was even more brutal.

Alisson made 94 passes (highest in the team) is all you need to know. Klopp is many things but beating a press with passing is not one of his.

Thoroughly outplayed and outcoached by Atalanta.

[ScubaSteve]

We start fast, we score an early goal and then slow right down.

Why does Jürgen persist with making a 60+ min sub. Those subs could’ve come on gradually from the start of the second half when the game was already drifting away.

Not sure why Gakpo played on the left too when in the first leg they had to switch him and Nunez as he can’t play that position.

Last game in Europe….very sad

[Oldskoolcool]

Hate to say it but we look totally shot, looks like Klopp and by proxy the team have lost their edge - fair play to Klopp he has said as such, he is tired and drained. We need a new philosophy of how we play, technically we need better players too, gegenpressing is a sure fire way of fatiguing your squad to the point of injury. Love Klopp and he is a bonafide legend, but time to look forwards now. I know a lot of people will hate to hear this and think it’s disrespectful, nothing could be further from the truth of the love I have for what this team has achieved under the helm of Klopp, but times move on.

[Johnny Foreigner]

I fell in love with liverpool watching steve heighway. Good move but the years under klopp have been the best i have ever seen. yes, we look a bit lost now and lack the energy, but pls behave people..

[rawcusk8]

Fuck the title, going to enjoy Klopp for the remaining 6 games.

[Draex]

Our plan A is Trent making things happen, when he doesn't play we look utterly clueless.

Fuck to go back to 433 with fullbacks bombing on and attackers playing at pace.

[Stockholm Syndrome]

I love how a bad run of form and suddenly it's a little Arsenal and Wenger "It's his time to go now"

[Caps4444]

Absolutely fair play to Jurgen….you can clearly tell he’s tired and fed up.
The club needs a refresh, which is happening from the top and likely all the way to the players.

[Caps4444]

Our plan A is Trent making things happen, when he doesn't play we look utterly clueless.

Fuck to go back to 433 with fullbacks bombing on and attackers playing at pace.

Trent needs to stop these first time half volley crosses or outside of the foot low passes with pace.

[In the Name of Klopp]

A weakness of Klopp's time, exposed today unfortunately.

When our Plan A is good, its very good.
But it is fragile, and there is no allowance for a Plan B.

The last twenty minutes of this game was crying out for a different, more direct approach yet we kept passing ourselves backwards and getting nowhere.

Big 6 to go but its a shame it seems to be ending with a whimper.

100%. We keep repeating the same thing, hoping it'll work.

[elkun]

Said this in the HT thread and oh my, the second half was even more brutal.

Alisson made 94 passes (highest in the team) is all you need to know. Klopp is many things but beating a press with passing is not one of his.

Thoroughly outplayed and outcoached by Atalanta.

Agree with 100% with you

[djschembri]

Our plan A is Trent making things happen, when he doesn't play we look utterly clueless.

Fuck to go back to 433 with fullbacks bombing on and attackers playing at pace.

In our peak, our players were younger, stronger and had more energy. Also, they could press really well.
This side has evolved, but a lot of players look like Gini looked towards the end of his time. Out of energy, goosed by the age of 30.

[Stockholm Syndrome]

The vibe I am getting is if he hadn't said he was leaving people would be asking for him to leave. Looking over the other threads here I have no doubt about it actually