Topic: The Anfield Wrap

[Iska]

What was wrong with it? The points were fair.

I don't think there was anything wrong with it as such.  I said I found it a depressing listen*, but I've got no right not to be depressed by a podcast.  That said, if I was finding it depressing regularly then I wouldn't listen, so I understand the practical benefit to inquisitorial hosting a little better now.

* for reasons of my own, as I felt something like it undermined the foundation of what we're signed up to here.  But this is my problem - I might or might not be right about what I believe, and I sure as hell don't want people stopped from prodding at it.  But I do want to be able prod at them (by proxy) in return.

[Raaphael]

Not to interrupt the other discussion, but if Timo Tierney reads this: The Tea Street Band is really great. Would love to watch them live.

[Alan_X]

Can we keep on topic please. If one of the lads from the Anfield Index wants to start a thread feel free to do so. This one was started by Andy and it's good to share direct feedback on here.

Thanks

[Crosby Nick]

The fact that there's been this level of debate about one show feels faintly ridiculous but I guess it's a back handed compliment given the sheer quality and quantity of TAW in general.

If there's a show you don't agree with or enjoy it shouldn't be a drama, there'll be another one you like along in a minute.

I say this as a current non-subscriber! Finally landed a new job so will set up once I'm back up and running!

[newterp]

Respectfully, that's not true. TAW is looking for listeners and now subscribers, and the presence and quality of providers of a similar service will be an important determinant of how well it does in that regard. That's competition.

agenda alert.

[TepidT2O]

Respectfully, we don't have 'competitors', it's not a competition.

Yeah, I like that.

You're just doing what interests you guys.

If it interests others, great.   If you try to start chasing what you think others might like, then you lose the value of it.

[Wyl]

Just wanted to say that, in contrast to a couple of above posters, I really enjoyed the latest unwrapped. I think it is an interesting discussion to have regarding our ambitions and capabilities as a club. You just have to look at the range of responses in the "What constitutes a good 16/17 season in your view?" thread to see it's a big talking point.

Frankly, the whole Pro FSG, everything is rosy in the garden and thou shalt not question the club RAWK narrative stinks. 

[Don Vito Corleone]

Yeah, I like that.

You're just doing what interests you guys.

If it interests others, great.   If you try to start chasing what you think others might like, then you lose the value of it.

Thank you!! 

[Alan_X]

Anfield Index discussion split out here:

http://www.redandwhitekop.com/forum/index.php?topic=329314.0

[Libertine]

If there's a show you don't agree with or enjoy it shouldn't be a drama, there'll be another one you like along in a minute.

I've never understood why people only want to listen to or read things they agree with. I'm much more interested in hearing other opinions - I already know what I agree with.....

TAW should always strive to have a multitude of opinions on every topic.

Anyway, listened to AFQ on the commute today - great return to form. Always helps to have NYT's finest along.....

[Chief Brody]

I listened to the podcast, as I do all of them (except the Rider), I remember thinking it was a bit downbeat, but elsewhere on TAW you'll no doubt find the other side of the coin.

I judge the content and pay my subscription based on ALL of the podcasts on offer and I've always found there to be a good spread of opinions and voices, some I enjoy more than others, thats the same with all outlets isn't it? I'm not going to jibb off 5-Live because I don't like what Savage and Mills say for example.

So to be honest I was suprised to see some of the comments in here. Just seems like a bit of a non-issue.

[adamski29]

I like Guttman and his involvement, I even enjoy his unabashed desire for transfer tattle, but there was absolutely loads of points in that chat that needed someone not to say "I agree with you mate" but rather "OK, you are dissatisfied with policies X, Y and Z. What do you suggest?" "You say we haven't made any big signings, who do you suggest we sign that would satisfy you?", the idea that the Main Stand extension was a "fudge" - please explain?

There was also an inherent, unquestioned idea running through the show that basically, all other clubs are getting everything right all the time and will necessarily perform to their maximum, while clueless, doddering Liverpool just careen from fuck-up to fuck-up... which again isn't true at all.

There was plenty of food for thought on it, I'm just trying some constructive criticism.

To be fair one of the contributors ( was it Jay Mac Kenna?) did offer views on ways the club could spend more money on individual players without being reckless, and they all sounded perfectly sensible to me.  As for the "what players do you suggest we sign"  that is a ridiculous question that people who will have no criticism of the club trot out all the time and it's just pure infantile bullshit. They are not commenting on any individual players we may or may not be targeting they are discussing a policy over multiple seasons. To discuss individual players given the fact that for any one window those player names would change like the wind would be ridiculous and bog the conversation down with details that don't ultimately matter on the large scale, for the purposes of the topic.

The main stand was said to be a fudge because when FSG came in it was promised as part of that, that they would look at building  this fabled new stadium as part of their new ownership. Now we decided to stay at anfield, which I am really delighted about and applaud them for, but the then went all conservative and decided to just do the main stand and see how it goes rather than going for a stadium wide increase, or even to just do the anfield road end which I believe there was a plan to do existing somewhere.
He'll they could increase the size of the Kopp while still keeping it a single tier stand whilst improving facilities for those three sides of the ground.

I would say that fsg are not a million miles out of the ballpark in the way they run the club versus what the I see as matches the size and ambitions that a club like Liverpool should have, but they are very conservative I would say.

[LallanaInPyjamas]

I like Adam Lallana but even with our current injury concerns it is reasonably straightforward to write down an eighteen for Arsenal and not have him in it. You can make a plausible argument for that; it may not be correct.

You don't like Adam Lallana if you think this, Neil

But this is the point: it's perfectly fine not to rate a player, or a manager, or a set of owners as highly as others do. Personally I'd rather hear people's genuine opinions than 'group think' or, even worse, being scared into a neutral position just because people think that's what journalists or broadcasters should do.

Same reason I'll listen to The Times with Rory Smith and Marcotti every day of the week ahead of Football Weekly. The former promotes excellent discussion, even if I disagree with some of it (or a lot of it if a certain journalist is on); the latter doesn't entertain me, it just feels like a mundane round-up show which does a job if you've completely missed football at the weekend.

[vivabobbygraham]

I didn't take offence, I pointed out that it's bollocks, which it is.

So you're suggesting, overtly, that we now try to temper or shape peoples opinions? Isn't that going down the 'agenda' route or promoting a 'narrative'? Bit confused 'ere.

It's only confusing if you're being obtuse of which you have previous. Save the Tony Evans style grandstanding for when your with him, lad. Not impressed or arsed with your pov on the matter tbf.

[vivabobbygraham]

Quickly - it didn't *attempt* to do that. I emailed Sean that morning, said what do you fancy talking about, he said that Unwrapped was interesting, can we touch on it, I said sound, yeah, sure, we'll do that in Part Two. He said great. I had no idea what he was going to say before he said it. There was no attempt. There was people in a room talking about Liverpool FC. Sean and Paul had been down to do that show a couple of weeks ago.

Righto.......

[Iska]

Same reason I'll listen to The Times with Rory Smith and Marcotti every day of the week ahead of Football Weekly.

Cheers for that.  FW's been doing my head in - overreliance on Barry Glendinning, who seems to know very little about football despite that being his job - so I was in the market for a general football replacement.  Will give The Game a try, thanks.

[LallanaInPyjamas]

Cheers for that.  FW's been doing my head in - overreliance on Barry Glendinning, who seems to know very little about football despite that being his job - so I was in the market for a general football replacement.  Will give The Game a try, thanks.

No worries mate, I don't think you'll regret it. Just a much better standard of journalists on there (with one or two exceptions, you'll find out quickly), with a host in Marcotti who is interested in debate, not just going through the motions and picking up his pay packet seemingly...

Off topic anyway, let the TAW talk recommence.

[lamonti]

To be fair one of the contributors ( was it Jay Mac Kenna?) did offer views on ways the club could spend more money on individual players without being reckless, and they all sounded perfectly sensible to me.  As for the "what players do you suggest we sign"  that is a ridiculous question that people who will have no criticism of the club trot out all the time and it's just pure infantile bullshit. They are not commenting on any individual players we may or may not be targeting they are discussing a policy over multiple seasons. To discuss individual players given the fact that for any one window those player names would change like the wind would be ridiculous and bog the conversation down with details that don't ultimately matter on the large scale, for the purposes of the topic.

The main stand was said to be a fudge because when FSG came in it was promised as part of that, that they would look at building  this fabled new stadium as part of their new ownership. Now we decided to stay at anfield, which I am really delighted about and applaud them for, but the then went all conservative and decided to just do the main stand and see how it goes rather than going for a stadium wide increase, or even to just do the anfield road end which I believe there was a plan to do existing somewhere.
He'll they could increase the size of the Kopp while still keeping it a single tier stand whilst improving facilities for those three sides of the ground.

I would say that fsg are not a million miles out of the ballpark in the way they run the club versus what the I see as matches the size and ambitions that a club like Liverpool should have, but they are very conservative I would say.

Re: "what players do you suggest we sign?" – I didn't mean that someone should say that as a defence, but rather an actual inquiry. As in, clearly Wijnaldum and Mané do not excite the fanbase in a general way in a way that, for example, Dahoud, Hector, Sané or the mythical specialist DM would have.

Re: the stadium being a fudge – I was under the impression that FSG promised stadium extension or a new stadium, not specifically the latter, and decided on the former after due diligence. I could be wrong, I certainly wasn't under the impression that it was gospel that they promised a whole new stadium and fudged the deal.

Either way, the points themselves are incidental. What I was criticising was that the show would have benefited massively from a more impartial host who would make the guests explore their opinions under a bit of cross examination.

[lamonti]

Same reason I'll listen to The Times with Rory Smith and Marcotti every day of the week ahead of Football Weekly.

Me too, although Rory Smith's joined the New York Times (and Tony Barrett has also left The Times to join joe.co.uk, though I don't think he's on it much) so if it's Marcotti, Scowcroft and Julien Laurens I'll probably listen much less.

[Shambles.....with a capital S!]

It was one pod that people are raising issues with out of how many that have been absolutely fantastic and have raised excellent points/discussions.

[LallanaInPyjamas]

Me too, although Rory Smith's joined the New York Times (and Tony Barrett has also left The Times to join joe.co.uk, though I don't think he's on it much) so if it's Marcotti, Scowcroft and Julien Laurens I'll probably listen much less.

Blimey, I had no idea about Rory. Wonder what they meant on AFQ about the new job (brilliant AFQ again by the way). That's a big shame as him and Marcotti dovetail well.

I'd imagine Henry Winter will be on a lot more this season, as much as he's a bit dry he knows what he's talking about. Laurens provides good humour and Scowcroft is alright for a bit of player's insight (it's quite funny how much him and Marcotti clash as well). Just keep Alyson Rudd off it!

[Don Vito Corleone]

It's only confusing if you're being obtuse of which you have previous. Save the Tony Evans style grandstanding for when your with him, lad. Not impressed or arsed with your pov on the matter tbf.

Hardly obtuse, one second you're saying we're peddling a narrative, and then following that by saying we should make sure everyone has a different opinion.

Fairly clear, lad.

[Raaphael]

Anywhere I can buy the TAW coffee mug?

[Phil M]

Can't we all just agree the Wrap is boss and full credit to all involved for continually innovating and creating consistent output of top material.

Have yet to sit down and listen to the Klopp interview, I remember the lads had Brendan in the studio early doors aswell which is a great coup and says a lot about the Wrap's emergence / media presence.

[Don Vito Corleone]

Anywhere I can buy the TAW coffee mug?

More on sale soon! They keep selling out.

[Raaphael]

More on sale soon! They keep selling out.

Ok. Any plans on t-shirts? I`d wear them.

[Don Vito Corleone]

Ok. Any plans on t-shirts? I`d wear them.

Yeah, we've had some done, will be online shortly, will post the link in here when they're up.

[vivabobbygraham]

Hardly obtuse, one second you're saying we're peddling a narrative, and then following that by saying we should make sure everyone has a different opinion.

Fairly clear, lad.

Now, I'm contradicting myself by being arsed about what you say- but nowhere have I said the above, lad. When you overload, and I concede, it is impossible to know what guests are going to say-though you can have an idea if they are regulars- all the more reason to have 'a firm hand on the tiller' is what I said.

I heard Klopp called out personally, by yourself on one show, Peter Hooton on another and John, Jay, et al on the podcast in question as 'fitting the FSG model' or not really meaning what he say's, or alluding to that. You were called on it, as was Peter, but on the recent show, all they were subjected to was 'Devils Advocate' by Rob; whom I'm a big fan of as this thread will testify, who prefaced that by saying he agreed with them? I took that to confirm there were misgivings about the boss and I challenged it. Nothing more, nothing less. On you came and accused me of being 'disrespectful' to you and TAW, nothing of which could be further from the truth.

Alright, 'narrative' was too strong a word; I never mentioned the A word, you did, I did listen to the three shows consecutively, as I mentioned, but you interviewed Klopp. Does he seem like a guy who would be influenced by FSG? Would he act as their mouthpiece as some have claimed? Does he say things we might just want to hear? Listen to the podcasts again, as I have.

Finally, I came on this thread to make an observation about one show, which did not have Neil at the helm. He is, without doubt, the best football frontman in the media. I'm not blowing smoke up his arse, it's a fact. It's one show amongst many that are brilliant and the quality of journalists you attract epitomises your rise. Far from being a gang of lads having a chat or whatever, these people have bought into your style and content as have we as subscribers. I can disagree with some of the content without being accused of talking bollocks, full stop. There are many on here who will contend that is all I talk but that's bollocks.....

[Spezialo]

Subscribed last week. Boss.

[Raaphael]

Yeah, we've had some done, will be online shortly, will post the link in here when they're up.

 

[Don Vito Corleone]

Subscribed last week. Boss.

👍

[redgriffin73]

Only just got around to listening to the piece on pre-season with Neil Mellor and Chris Kirkland, thought it was brilliant, really interesting stuff.

[conman]

Just wanted to say that, in contrast to a couple of above posters, I really enjoyed the latest unwrapped. I think it is an interesting discussion to have regarding our ambitions and capabilities as a club. You just have to look at the range of responses in the "What constitutes a good 16/17 season in your view?" thread to see it's a big talking point.

I'd agree.

Sometimes you need a stoic stance to get the wider debate happening, as has been clearly happening since it aired.
If every episode was so evenly balanced, we'd not progress our thinking too much. We'd just accept both sides and do fuck all.

It's a podcast run by a group of mates. They don't get everything right, but they have our interests and our club interests are heart. So most of what they say is said with loads of heart & little narrative. We are not obliged to listen to them, but we do and for good reason too.

[Brunswickred]

Felt the need to log in to my long dormant account on here to add my tuppence given some of the views expressed over the past couple of pages of the thread. Can't really be arsed getting into a specific discussion on the Unwrapped show but rather wanted to give my views on TAW as a long time listener.

I've been a listener since the beginning and as much as I loved listening to TAW when there were only two shows, I wasn't really convinced that the move to produce more content would work but subscribed nonetheless so that I could make my decision after a month or two of trying it out. How wrong I was and massive respect and thanks must go to each of you who have not only made the initial decision to 'go full time' but then continued to push out exceptional quality shows month after month even throughout the summer months. Pretty much all the shows are well worth a listen but special mentions for the following;

Midnight Caller - My only criticism would be that it would be great if it were longer - say 45 minutes to an hour! I assume that it is generally curtailed by the availability of the guest but really do think it brings out some extremely interesting topics that aren't often covered elsewhere. Would be interested to know if the lads have thought about doing a longer record on this one?

Wildcards - Another one that throws up some really good, not necessarily mainstream topics - or things that wouldn't be covered on the 'main' pods but are still worthy of discussion. Really like the format and the guests tend to be very well chosen for the type of show that it is.

AFQ - Just a great laugh from start to finish. Love the anarchic nature of it. Steve Graves, Ben Johnson, Kate Forrester, Gibbo, Rob Gutmann, Timo, Neil Docking (who is also top class on Ban This Filth) and several others have all had me laughing my tits off while listening to it through headphones in bed at one point or another and then hooked to an interesting debate (e.g. the Liverpool/Tory thing, misogyny, the changing face of Kenny as an area) the next minute.

The Gutter - Glad that it isn't taken too seriously yet at the same time is taken 100% seriously by Rob, if that makes sense. Have seen some critical words for Melissa Reddy in this thread but genuinely don't get that. Hugely knowledgable, great links with the club and genuine insight into areas that would be off limits to most.

I could go on but you get the picture. If anyone is weighing up whether to subscribe or not, please give it a go. You won't be disappointed. Props to all who contribute.

[Mactavish]

Felt the need to log in to my long dormant account on here to add my tuppence given some of the views expressed over the past couple of pages of the thread. Can't really be arsed getting into a specific discussion on the Unwrapped show but rather wanted to give my views on TAW as a long time listener.

I've been a listener since the beginning and as much as I loved listening to TAW when there were only two shows, I wasn't really convinced that the move to produce more content would work but subscribed nonetheless so that I could make my decision after a month or two of trying it out. How wrong I was and massive respect and thanks must go to each of you who have not only made the initial decision to 'go full time' but then continued to push out exceptional quality shows month after month even throughout the summer months. Pretty much all the shows are well worth a listen but special mentions for the following;

Midnight Caller - My only criticism would be that it would be great if it were longer - say 45 minutes to an hour! I assume that it is generally curtailed by the availability of the guest but really do think it brings out some extremely interesting topics that aren't often covered elsewhere. Would be interested to know if the lads have thought about doing a longer record on this one?

Wildcards - Another one that throws up some really good, not necessarily mainstream topics - or things that wouldn't be covered on the 'main' pods but are still worthy of discussion. Really like the format and the guests tend to be very well chosen for the type of show that it is.

AFQ - Just a great laugh from start to finish. Love the anarchic nature of it. Steve Graves, Ben Johnson, Kate Forrester, Gibbo, Rob Gutmann, Timo, Neil Docking (who is also top class on Ban This Filth) and several others have all had me laughing my tits off while listening to it through headphones in bed at one point or another and then hooked to an interesting debate (e.g. the Liverpool/Tory thing, misogyny, the changing face of Kenny as an area) the next minute.

The Gutter - Glad that it isn't taken too seriously yet at the same time is taken 100% seriously by Rob, if that makes sense. Have seen some critical words for Melissa Reddy in this thread but genuinely don't get that. Hugely knowledgable, great links with the club and genuine insight into areas that would be off limits to most.

I could go on but you get the picture. If anyone is weighing up whether to subscribe or not, please give it a go. You won't be disappointed. Props to all who contribute.

Great post mate and agree that the subscription shows have been nothing short of marvelous.

Now, I don't want this to look like I am suggesting anybody needs any sort of advice regarding selling the show but I'm seeing that there is a six minute snippet of the Carra pod from a few months back out for free. After just listening to yesterday's Gutter on the treadmill, as a man who runs a business himself, I just could not get away from it screaming to me: "Put all of me out for free". In the month of August when everybody is going mad for transfer gossip and ITK stuff I'd be showing that weekly Pod right off.

Fantastic stuff.

[tmsneil]

Felt the need to log in to my long dormant account on here to add my tuppence given some of the views expressed over the past couple of pages of the thread. Can't really be arsed getting into a specific discussion on the Unwrapped show but rather wanted to give my views on TAW as a long time listener.

I've been a listener since the beginning and as much as I loved listening to TAW when there were only two shows, I wasn't really convinced that the move to produce more content would work but subscribed nonetheless so that I could make my decision after a month or two of trying it out. How wrong I was and massive respect and thanks must go to each of you who have not only made the initial decision to 'go full time' but then continued to push out exceptional quality shows month after month even throughout the summer months. Pretty much all the shows are well worth a listen but special mentions for the following;

Midnight Caller - My only criticism would be that it would be great if it were longer - say 45 minutes to an hour! I assume that it is generally curtailed by the availability of the guest but really do think it brings out some extremely interesting topics that aren't often covered elsewhere. Would be interested to know if the lads have thought about doing a longer record on this one?

Wildcards - Another one that throws up some really good, not necessarily mainstream topics - or things that wouldn't be covered on the 'main' pods but are still worthy of discussion. Really like the format and the guests tend to be very well chosen for the type of show that it is.

AFQ - Just a great laugh from start to finish. Love the anarchic nature of it. Steve Graves, Ben Johnson, Kate Forrester, Gibbo, Rob Gutmann, Timo, Neil Docking (who is also top class on Ban This Filth) and several others have all had me laughing my tits off while listening to it through headphones in bed at one point or another and then hooked to an interesting debate (e.g. the Liverpool/Tory thing, misogyny, the changing face of Kenny as an area) the next minute.

The Gutter - Glad that it isn't taken too seriously yet at the same time is taken 100% seriously by Rob, if that makes sense. Have seen some critical words for Melissa Reddy in this thread but genuinely don't get that. Hugely knowledgable, great links with the club and genuine insight into areas that would be off limits to most.

I could go on but you get the picture. If anyone is weighing up whether to subscribe or not, please give it a go. You won't be disappointed. Props to all who contribute.

Is right Gibbo.

[Crosby Nick]

Is right Gibbo.

Haha

[Andy Hunter]

Loving TAW Player taster week thus far, good move with the season starting

[Don Vito Corleone]

Loving TAW Player taster week thus far, good move with the season starting

Got a belter dropping at 6pm

[Notfromaroundhere]

Great to have The Review back. It means we're done messing around. Business time. Only five more sleeps now..