Topic: anfield road stand

[Alan_X]

Is being on the waiting list for 19 years not loyalty?

Sorry mate but no it's not, how is it loyalty if you're not going? It's no effort to pay £5 and wait for a season ticket to come up. I see a lot of lads at the match who I know are on full credits and go to all the aways and European games but you're probably higher up the list than most of them.

The 'proper' reason for having a season ticket is that it rewards the loyalty of those who go to every home game and commit financially at the start of the season. For that guaranteed income, the club offers a discount. The reality is that the members who buy all 19 games in the two sales are effectively doing the same but without the discount and that's the kind of loyalty that should be rewarded.

I understand why you're on the list, and don't take this as having a personal go at you - I considered going on the list when I first signed up for a Fan Card a few years ago but I knew I'd be doing it for the wrong reasons (in my opinion).

[Anfield89]

I have actually. First of all I've had to get onto the waiting list in the first place and then I've had to pay for the privilege to stay on it.

So have plenty of others who are on it and go to a lot of games, home and away investing loads of time and money into the club. Do you think that is correct that someone who has paid a fiver should get one and not these others?

[whiteboots]

You want the club to pay out more money to architects, designers, consultants to redesign the proposed Anfield Road extension to fit in an extra 500 seats, just so we can say we have the biggest end stand in England?! What age are you?

No.

The exact numbers have yet to be confirmed.

It is quite possible that the ARE will already be the largest end stand in England, as it is.

[Danny Boys Dad]

Not sure about season tickets being a 'reward' for loyalty but at the very least they should be issued to people who are going to use them and not to people who are just going to sell them on.

If Owens is going to pack in playing and go to the match if he gets a ST then that's fair enough, he's going to use it.

Playing on a Saturday isn't much of an excuse for not going though, how many games to we have on Saturdays these days?

Shame they didn't bring in some new tech with these new ST's like photo-ID etc.

[Redman0151]

As somebody who's ~24,000th on the season ticket waiting list, it's always fun to read people saying the demand isn't there.

Even if they expand the anny road, I won't get close to having a season ticket. Last I read from the supporter's committee, we had >100,000 members alone.

[Anfield89]

I imagine it's more of a case of the fact he knows he won't get to all the games as doesn't have a ST so is prepared to give his time to the team he is playing for, and not letting them down the handful of times he may get a late ticket per season.

If he had a ST he'd not have to let them down, and he'd just not join the team to begin with.


I think this point is stupid anyway. He got his name on the list years and years ago, and deserves his ticket if he gets the chance as much as someone who has been lucky enough to find tickets elsewhere during the time.

The ones you want to look at are the ones who got their name on the list, will take their ticket, but will then not go and will just pass it on (or worse yet pass it on at a profit).

Membership you know exactly when you are and aren't going depending on the games you buy well in advance so you can plan for such Issues. You can't say someone just waiting on a list deserves to go as much as someone going alomost game investing so much time and money.

[Laz]

As I understand it, the new  Main Stand will take our capacity to 54,500.

The existing ARE capacity is 9,074.

I also understand the provisional capacity for the ground after ARE redevelopment is 58,500. So the ARE will need to hold 13,074, bigger than the Kop at 12,409 The biggest box stand end in England is the Holte End at 13,501, so it is doable. It would be good however to add those extra 500 seats to make it the biggest end.

Your figures are slightly out.. In the outline planning permission the ARE is slated to have 13,860 seats so the ARE capacity will be bigger than the Holte End anyway. As far as the other stands go... the new Main is 20,538. the Centenary stand is 11,762 and the Kop is 12,409. When the new Main stand opens the capacity will be 53,783. If the ARE gets built at the capacity I mentioned then Anfield's total capacity would be 58,569

[CraigDS]

Membership you know exactly when you are and aren't going depending on the games you buy well in advance so you can plan for such Issues. You can't say someone just waiting on a list deserves to go as much as someone going alomost game investing so much time and money.

I'm not talking about who deserves to go and who doesn't deserve to go. I'm talking about who should be offered a ST.

To me, the whole idea of a ST waiting list is it offers those who have been on it the longest the ability to buy a ST first when there become some available. If someone wanted one 19 years ago, and presumably would have paid for one for the last 19 years, and still wants one now then I've no problem with them having one.

The idea of the member sales is it gives you credits so you can buy those tickets first the following season. That's the benefit of that scheme. The benefit isn't you suddenly jump up above someone who may have been willing to buy a ST for the last 20 years.

[Anfield89]

I'm not talking about who deserves to go and who doesn't deserve to go. I'm talking about who should be offered a ST.

To me, the whole idea of a ST waiting list is it offers those who have been on it the longest the ability to buy a ST first when there become some available. If someone wanted one 19 years ago, and presumably would have paid for one for the last 19 years, and still wants one now then I've no problem with them having one.

The idea of the member sales is it gives you credits so you can buy those tickets first the following season. That's the benefit of that scheme. The benefit isn't you suddenly jump up above someone who may have been willing to buy a ST for the last 20 years.

There's 10s of thousands wanting one and I bet they all have a reason but they clearly aren't all showing the same commitment and loyalty. Even as far as just making an effort, which many aren't so those waiting on a list for years just because they want one should not be given one before someone like Alan discribed who devotes so much to the club, everyone  has their own life and circumstances which is understood.

[CraigDS]

There's 10s of thousands wanting one and I bet they all have a reason but they clearly aren't all showing the same commitment and loyalty. Even as far as just making an effort, which many aren't so those waiting on a list for years just because they want one should not be given one before someone like Alan discribed who devotes so much to the club, everyone  has their own life and circumstances which is understood.

They may not be, but that doesn't mean they wouldn't show that commitment and loyalty, or that if they'd of been given one when they asked nearly 2 decades ago rather than shoved on a list that they wouldn't have spent the last 20 years paying a small fortune out.

Maybe I should start thinking I deserve to get tickets to aways over those who go to a handful each season because I've had a ST for the last 25 or so years. After all, that's been a bigger commitment and show of loyalty by me than them.

[Anfield89]

They may not be, but that doesn't mean they wouldn't show that commitment and loyalty, or that if they'd of been given one when they asked nearly 2 decades ago rather than shoved on a list that they wouldn't have spent the last 20 years paying a small fortune out.

Maybe I should start thinking I deserve to get tickets to aways over those who go to a handful each season because I've had a ST for the last 25 or so years. After all, that's been a bigger commitment and show of loyalty by me than them.

You have had your opportunity to go to aways if you had wanted to having a season ticket for 25 years, like these people waiting on the list still have the opportunity to go to games bit choose not to. The ones who choose not to go and just sit on the list are showing more evidence that they wouldn't have paid out a small fortune than would because the opportunity to go is still there.

[CraigDS]

You have had your opportunity to go to aways if you had wanted to having a season ticket for 25 years, like these people waiting on the list still have the opportunity to go to games bit choose not to. The ones who choose not to go and just sit on the list are showing more evidence that they wouldn't have paid out a small fortune than would because the opportunity to go is still there.

I couldn't afford it then (or wasn't old enough seems was 5 or 6 when got my ST), but now I can afford it I should be able to go before them no? I mean by your own reasoning, the more commitment and loyalty you have shown previously means first access. So my 25 years trumps someone who has done it for the last 5 years, doesn't it?

I don't think that BTW, but it's the same line of thought as you're showing.

I honestly think it's the wrong way to go about things. It's targeting the wrong ones. There would be loads more ST's available if you targeted the ones who have them and don't use them - those are the ones who should be looked at first.

[Anfield89]

I couldn't afford it then (or wasn't old enough seems was 5 or 6 when got my ST), but now I can afford it I should be able to go before them no? I mean by your own reasoning, the more commitment and loyalty you have shown previously means first access. So my 25 years trumps someone who has done it for the last 5 years, doesn't it?

I don't think that BTW, but it's the same line of thought as you're showing.

I honestly think it's the wrong way to go about things. It's targeting the wrong ones. There would be loads more ST's available if you targeted the ones who have them and don't use them - those are the ones who should be looked at first.

In terms of home support yes, away and cup competitions are separate. Basically I don't think you should just be able to sit on the list waiting for a season ticket if your not going to games. We will just have to disagree on this I think. People who want a season ticket but don't want to go to games until they get one 

[whiteboots]

I honestly think it's the wrong way to go about things. It's targeting the wrong ones. There would be loads more ST's available if you targeted the ones who have them and don't use them - those are the ones who should be looked at first.

This is still a function of capacity. The reason why people are able to use ST's as an alternative currency is demand.

Only by increasing supply will this be addressed. The Main Stand, with 4000 new premium seats, won't change that much, an ARE creating an overall capacity of pushing 60k might.

[CraigDS]

This is still a function of capacity. The reason why people are able to use ST's as an alternative currency is demand.

Only by increasing supply will this be addressed. The Main Stand, with 4000 new premium seats, won't change that much, an ARE creating an overall capacity of pushing 60k might.

You're partly correct, in that if the excess demand wasn't there to such a degree then that supply would be less.

However you're ignoring the other side of things, which is there is a system in place which allows this to happen. Change the system and you will prevent a good proportion of these tickets from being handed about like they do, particularly those being touted about.

[Anfield89]

There's no planned corporate boxes for the Anfield road end is there?

[CraigDS]

There's no planned corporate boxes for the Anfield road end is there?

No, all standard seating I believe.

[Anfield89]

No, all standard seating I believe.

Possibly missing a trick there if it goes ahead.

[whiteboots]

However you're ignoring the other side of things, which is there is a system in place which allows this to happen. Change the system and you will prevent a good proportion of these tickets from being handed about like they do, particularly those being touted about.

I think that the club acquiesces in this.

They know that £870 is beyond many for a ST. However they make more money from eighteen different people using it once, than one person using it for eighteen  games, through club shop and refreshment sales .

I agree that the status quo is frustrating.

[Nessy76]

There's no planned corporate boxes for the Anfield road end is there?

Far as I remember the club did its assessment on how many corporate boxes it was likely to sell and decided to put them all into the main stand. It probably means that they don't need to have facilities duplicated across the ground, and should prevent there being too much of a "ring of silence" around the stadium. It also means that all the new seating in the Anfield Road end will be ordinary seats for ordinary fans, which is what we have been saying we needed for years.

[andy07]

No.

The exact numbers have yet to be confirmed.

It is quite possible that the ARE will already be the largest end stand in England, as it is.

Got a feeling that the Stretford End is around 14000.

[whiteboots]

Got a feeling that the Stretford End is around 14000.

Yes, but it isn't a stand alone stand which I believe is the proposal for the ARE.

I also think that the plan was (is) for an extra 4,800 seats, taking the capacity to 13,800.

[Jimmys Casey]

After the possible Anfield Rd end expansion would there be any other way to extend the capacity at anfield?
Another tier on the Cent stand?

[CraigDS]

After the possible Anfield Rd end expansion would there be any other way to extend the capacity at anfield?
Another tier on the Cent stand?

Not another tier on there no.

The next best chance would be safe standing.

[whiteboots]

After the possible Anfield Rd end expansion would there be any other way to extend the capacity at anfield?
Another tier on the Cent stand?

Apart from standing, that is it, with the Centenary and Kop already approaching a quarter of a century, and component parts older than that.

I think that history will be harsh on those who lacked the foresight to grab the opportunities which have presented themselves post Taylor.

Let's hope they do something special with the ARE.

[Redknight1892]

Apart from standing, that is it, with the Centenary and Kop already approaching a quarter of a century, and component parts older than that.

I think that history will be harsh on those who lacked the foresight to grab the opportunities which have presented themselves post Taylor.

Let's hope they do something special with the ARE.

Like make it a 20.000+ single tier

[Peter McGurk]

Yes.

Since the inception of the PL the UK population has grown by 7m, about 8%. The Merseyside conurbation has grown by 5% in the past decade. That growth provides a significant pool of new support.

Since its inception, PL attendances have grown by 38%. Ours has grown by 20%. LFC has missed the boat, to date.

The growth in PL attendances, and football attendances generally, since the PL, is the material manifestation of the growth in popularity of football. However pretty much any other indicator you choose, ST numbers, subscription to pay tv, hospitality commercial, underscores that.

If you take attendances at the inception of the PL as year zero ( I hate it as much as anyone, but it is very useful as the PL inception coincided with the post Taylor stadium building boom), then take them now, you can compare the increase in attendances both in terms of percentage increase , and simple numbers. By both measures, we are at around the bottom of both tables. That reflects again how we have missed the boat.

Historic average home attendance is not meaningless. It is a fact. We are second. That reflects our relative strength of home support over the history of our club. It is something we have failed to capitalise on.

The gap between all the above favourable elements, and the status quo, is the slack.

The new main stand dwarfs the Kop. A new ARE that took capacity to 58,500 would have to be bigger than the Kop. The Kop used to be the signature defining element of Anfield, it has been usurped in terms of capacity and physical presence by several other rival grounds. Its facilities are soon to be a quarter of a century old. That is what I meant by its downgrading. A new, imaginatively constructed ARE could become a new part of our history.

The closed, 25k ST waiting list is a guide to demand, but not an exhaustive one. Our current ST count is, I think, now around 27,000. There are 4000 hospitality tickets (boxes and packages). The away allocation is 3000. That only leaves around 11,000 “match day” tickets. If everyone on the waiting list took a ticket ( which I don’t think is anything like true) that would still leave 14,000. And that is before you allow for the supporter who isn’t on the ST list.

The problem that the Club, and some fans, have had in assessing potential support growth is to view it through the eyes of existing, converts. Sunderland, prior to moving to the SOL, struggled to average more than 20,000. After the move attendances lifted by 60%, last season they were more than double. That is about attracting new support for a club spectacular for being spectacularly average.

To become a new supporter you need to be able to come to the games, and we have not offered that opportunity to nearly enough people.

The only valid statement there is in the last sentence.

The rest is a mixed bag of conjecture and unconnected assumptions. In the very first sentence for example, there is no established connection between national or local population growth and the whole of that growth being available as a 'pool of new support'.

Even so, I’m not sure what point you’re trying to make because if you accept the growth in attendance as 38% since forming the PL, the capacity at Anfield should be between 51k and 48k depending on whether it's based on the PL or all competition home games.

Sorry for the misunderstanding mate - I was replying to your line about you not being sure we will fill the new Main Stand.


Though I do think the ST waiting list is a decent barometer of their being a demand there for an increase in capacity. That list has been closed for 8 years now, the first 28,000 all paid a fiver 4 years back to stay on it (and thousands after that weren't kept on it).

As you say, there may be a few thousand on that list that go to games now as Members  - but no-one really knows whether they'd prefer to carry on as Members or get a season ticket (my own preference would not to pay the annual £30 membership and have to go through the time and hassle of online sales processes and/or phonelines - and have a ST) - but equally imagine some now may want to stay as Members too.

Plus we do have 100,000 Members in total (?) (though many may not want to come to every game) that's still a decent amount - not forgetting the youngsters we've priced out over the years - and only now starting to make an effort to attract more of them.


edit for clarity - * increase in capacity as in building a likely new Anfield Road End.

There may or may not be 100,000 who go to the match (or more if you add those who get tickets from members or ST holders) but this would be no more than you would expect. After all many, many people only get to a handful of games. Some just one a season. A fiver is neither here nor there for staying on a list. No indication of demand there.

The only real test is sales. The club believes it can justify just under 60k compared to the cost of building it. It has the numbers and the research.

However, if "to become a new supporter you need to be able to come to the games, and we have not offered that opportunity to nearly enough people", it would be better to have more access ie., more people going to fewer games. There’s a balance between guaranteeing income and pre-selling the whole stadium. Too many season tickets means better access for the minority who’ve got season tickets and less access for the many who haven’t.

[oojason]

There may or may not be 100,000 who go to the match (or more if you add those who get tickets from members or ST holders) but this would be no more than you would expect. After all many, many people only get to a handful of games. Some just one a season. A fiver is neither here nor there for staying on a list. No indication of demand there.

The only real test is sales. The club believes it can justify just under 60k compared to the cost of building it. It has the numbers and the research.

However, if "to become a new supporter you need to be able to come to the games, and we have not offered that opportunity to nearly enough people", it would be better to have more access ie., more people going to fewer games. There’s a balance between guaranteeing income and pre-selling the whole stadium. Too many season tickets means better access for the minority who’ve got season tickets and less access for the many who haven’t.

This was my first reply to BarrowRed:-

I'm still sceptical that we can even fill the extra capacity for the Main stand, never mind an increased capacity Annie Road end. It was easy to pick up late tickets for every game this season so I'm not sure where we are going to get the extra 3000(?) every home game.

Unless the team is regularly competing for the league & cups I just can't see there being the interest to fill the extra capacity regularly enough to warrant the outlay of building another new stand. There is also the issue of ticket prices. Many people struggle to afford to go now and I can only see the ticket prices becoming more expensive, unfortunately.

(my reply to him) "If the games fail to attract tickets sold to Members (and there are quite a few of them) or General Sale then the club have a season ticket waiting list of 26,000 they could offer tickets to if need be mate.

There's also the 1000 tickets to youngsters thing the club announced last season - it'll be interesting to see the details on that - and if popular with the kids if they expand it if games aren't selling out (for me they should be expanding it anyway and cater to a larger younger crowd).

Like you say, tickets are far too expensive - hopefully we'll see something along the lines of what has happened with a £30 cap for away tickets across the Premier League occur for home fans soon (though I imagine if it did it happen it'd be more than £30 a ticket).

Plus, Klopp should have the team playing good attacking footy again this season - that'll help put bums on seats "



what you quoted was my 2nd reply to him. Basically I said that if the club didn't sell out the new Main Stand we could use the ST waiting list to do that - and also with a new likely new ARE stand too.

Afterall, we've just sold 2,000 new ST fairly easily without making a dent in the ST list - I suppose that could be an indication
of demand, no? Though as you say the real test is the sales - and looks like the percentage of take-up of 2000-odd new STs from the STWL has been pretty high.

It may not be desirable to have so many STs (as already stated I'd prefer a ticketing strategy which got a lot more younger people in the ground - and also had the club finally giving disable people better access, facilities and a fair number of seats ahead of even more STs sold) - but it's not too difficult to imagine the club would opt for the easier route and just sell more ST from to the waiting list.

[Peter McGurk]

This was my first reply to BarrowRed:-

(my reply to him) "If the games fail to attract tickets sold to Members (and there are quite a few of them) or General Sale then the club have a season ticket waiting list of 26,000 they could offer tickets to if need be mate.

There's also the 1000 tickets to youngsters thing the club announced last season - it'll be interesting to see the details on that - and if popular with the kids if they expand it if games aren't selling out (for me they should be expanding it anyway and cater to a larger younger crowd).

Like you say, tickets are far too expensive - hopefully we'll see something along the lines of what has happened with a £30 cap for away tickets across the Premier League occur for home fans soon (though I imagine if it did it happen it'd be more than £30 a ticket).

Plus, Klopp should have the team playing good attacking footy again this season - that'll help put bums on seats "



what you quoted was my 2nd reply to him. Basically I said that if the club didn't sell out the new Main Stand we could use the ST waiting list to do that - and also with a new likely new ARE stand too.

Afterall, we've just sold 2,000 new ST fairly easily without making a dent in the ST list - I suppose that could be an indication
of demand, no? Though as you say the real test is the sales - and looks like the percentage of take-up of 2000-odd new STs from the STWL has been pretty high.

It may not be desirable to have so many STs (as already stated I'd prefer a ticketing strategy which got a lot more younger people in the ground - and also had the club finally giving disable people better access, facilities and a fair number of seats ahead of even more STs sold) - but it's not too difficult to imagine the club would opt for the easier route and just sell more ST from to the waiting list.

You can't just dip into the waiting list to sell more. Most of them will be going already and if they're not, it'll be because they can't go to that particular game or they're actually happy watching in the pub/ at home/ on the internet or they've just paid a fiver a few years ago for whatever reason.

[oojason]

You can't just dip into the waiting list to sell more. Most of them will be going already and if they're not, it'll be because they can't go to that particular game or they're actually happy watching in the pub/ at home/ on the internet or they've just paid a fiver a few years ago for whatever reason.

The club may do just that if it didn't sell out new Man Stand or likely new Anfield Road End to Members or General Sales etc.

You'll find a lot of people in the ST Waiting List thread on here in the Ticket Section (which is only a fraction of the people on the ST waiting list in the 'real world') would snap an ST if offered one by the club. Many of us on there already go to the game (whether occasionally or regularly) - and many would likely trade in our Membership or Fan Card for a ST.

Yes, of course some may not - for some circumstances may have changed in the past 4 years - yet seemingly the take-up is high as to people on the STWL when they are offered one by the TO - and it likely won't affect Members that much other than giving 98,000 Members more of a chance at getting tickets instead of 100,000 members.

I find this circular and repetitive - whilst it's great that we all have differing opinions et al - the facts speak for themselves on the high take-up of STs offered.

Personally, I think the club will likely sell out regardless before resorting to having to do this - so this is all a moot point anyway, and I feel I'm wasting time to discuss this further. You feel free to carry on though.

[Peter McGurk]

The club may do just that if it didn't sell out new Man Stand or likely new Anfield Road End to Members or General Sales etc.

You'll find a lot of people in the ST Waiting List thread on here in the Ticket Section (which is only a fraction of the people on the ST waiting list in the 'real world') would snap an ST if offered one by the club. Many of us on there already go to the game (whether occasionally or regularly) - and many would likely trade in our Membership or Fan Card for a ST.

Yes, of course some may not - for some circumstances may have changed in the past 4 years - yet seemingly the take-up is high as to people on the STWL when they are offered one by the TO - and it likely won't affect Members that much other than giving 98,000 Members more of a chance at getting tickets instead of 100,000 members.

I find this circular and repetitive - whilst it's great that we all have differing opinions et al - the facts speak for themselves on the high take-up of STs offered.

Personally, I think the club will likely sell out regardless before resorting to having to do this - so this is all a moot point anyway, and I feel I'm wasting time to discuss this further. You feel free to carry on though.

With respect, you are making the same point - people on the waiting list likely to go to the match, already go to the match.

[whiteboots]

The only valid statement there is in the last sentence.

The rest is a mixed bag of conjecture and unconnected assumptions. In the very first sentence for example, there is no established connection between national or local population growth and the whole of that growth being available as a 'pool of new support'.

Even so, I’m not sure what point you’re trying to make because if you accept the growth in attendance as 38% since forming the PL, the capacity at Anfield should be between 51k and 48k depending on whether it's based on the PL or all competition home games.

Your opinion is entertaining. Your grasp of detail woeful.

[Peter McGurk]

Your opinion is entertaining. Your grasp of detail woeful.

Attendance in the first season of PL, uplifted by 38% is 48k to 51k depending on number of games in season. Sufficient detail, simple enough for you to grasp.

You are Xerxes and I claim my £5.

[Nessy76]

Apart from standing, that is it, with the Centenary and Kop already approaching a quarter of a century, and component parts older than that.

What lovely nonsense this phrase is. Emre Can is also "approaching a quarter of a century" - in other words he's a little over twenty years old. Or not very old. And he's a person. Buildings last longer, as a rule.

[tgwj77]

What lovely nonsense this phrase is. Emre Can is also "approaching a quarter of a century" - in other words he's a little over twenty years old. Or not very old. And he's a person. Buildings last longer, as a rule.

[Shankly84]

I had been on the waiting list for about 16 - 18 years. I finally got my ticket this summer. For the time I was waiting I have been going every home game for at least the last twelve years. First of all on single tickets. Then the last six or so years I've had someone else's season ticket. I know a lot of people on the list who are doing this sort of thing. So every time a new season ticket is issued, it's not necessarily a new person attending. Its could be someone who is already going every week now on their own ticket. It would be interesting to know how many people on the waiting  list who don't actually go now who would be willing to take the ticket on.

[Peter McGurk]

I had been on the waiting list for about 16 - 18 years. I finally got my ticket this summer. For the time I was waiting I have been going every home game for at least the last twelve years. First of all on single tickets. Then the last six or so years I've had someone else's season ticket. I know a lot of people on the list who are doing this sort of thing. So every time a new season ticket is issued, it's not necessarily a new person attending. Its could be someone who is already going every week now on their own ticket. It would be interesting to know how many people on the waiting  list who don't actually go now who would be willing to take the ticket on.

The reality of the season ticket list in a nutshell.

Why on earth would anyone put their names on the waiting list if they're not already committed enough to be going to the match already?

[Big Red Richie]

I had been on the waiting list for about 16 - 18 years. I finally got my ticket this summer. For the time I was waiting I have been going every home game for at least the last twelve years. First of all on single tickets. Then the last six or so years I've had someone else's season ticket. I know a lot of people on the list who are doing this sort of thing. So every time a new season ticket is issued, it's not necessarily a new person attending. Its could be someone who is already going every week now on their own ticket. It would be interesting to know how many people on the waiting  list who don't actually go now who would be willing to take the ticket on.

Which is exactly where I am.

I can count on one hand, the amount of home games I've missed in the last 30+ years (in all competitions)  Yet I've been on the list since 1999/2001.

(they 'lost' my 1999 application, and I reapplied in 2001) 

Since the early/mid 90s I've been going the match on a series of other peoples season tickets.  I've had the current one since 2002, when my best mate stopped going, and got out of the habit.


I'm currently in the 2800 region on the list, so if they ever do the Anny Road, and offer 3000 new seasies, I'm in.

If not, I'll hang on to my mate's.

On a side note, I also have several family members who go every game, who are also on the list, but further down, and in reality probably have no chance of being offered one through official channels.

If I was to get my own seasie, then my mates current one would probably go to one of them anyway.

[Nessy76]

The reality of the season ticket list in a nutshell.

Why on earth would anyone put their names on the waiting list if they're not already committed enough to be going to the match already?

Because they know how long the list is and assume that they might be able to afford it in a decade or so?

In reality, it's clear that most people on the list will be match goers, at least occasionally. Very hard for the club to assess demand when all the data of who is buying tickets and attending matches is so unreliable, though.

Getting tickets into the correct names is an important first step in working all this out. But since most tickets sell for most games, there's not much urgency to open that can of worms.

[Peter McGurk]

The other thing is... that the more season tickets (and people who can afford a whole season) there are, the fewer kids (who can only afford a few games a season) can get to the match.

Also, farming out tickets stops the natural churn and unlimited numbers of season tickets are both a bad thing for new blood, enthusiasm and the atmosphere that comes with it.