Topic: UEFA Women's Euro 2022 6th - 31st July

[lamonti]

By and large everyone should avoid using one game of football to represent either the men’s game or the women’s game. It’s football. All part of the the great tapestry that is the world’s most popular sport.

The men’s final was in many ways a dog, but hugely dramatic and pulsating too. The men’s tournament also included that day of Spain vs Croatia and France vs Switzerland — two of the best tournament games of my lifetime.

[Jm55]

Yeah it's wrong. Saw the interviewer on the BBC say to one of the players about 56 years of hurt being over, its fuck all to do with the men's game. We've got all the ladies in this thread telling us how they weren't allowed to play football, this tournament I've read only started 40 years ago, this is for them, not the men.

To be fair I doubt the women particularly mind being crowned with the title of ending 56 years of hurt.

If the two sports were treated on an equal platform then I’d agree with you, but the women’s game still needs all the support and publicity it can get as I suspect once the aftermath from the Euros passes it will be largely forgotten about again, especially with the men’s World Cup coming up in December.

I do agree with your point though generally.

[Red-Soldier]

Great tournament to watch and to see the enjoyment. Credits to the organisers and home crowds.

At the same time; too bad to see the timewasting and injury faking is creeping into the womens' game as well - but I guess that had to come with the money and the high stakes

Yeah, it's bollocks.

They are two different sports and should be celebrated as such!  I don't understand why the always put them in the same bracket.

[Crosby Nick]

I take the lot that the men had to work hard to get where they did too. That’s a given, and there will always be great stories of hard work and dedication there too. Fair to say that the women feel a lot more relatable though. Felt a lot more like cheering on Olympic success or something like that, where you don’t know too much about the people involved which invariably leads to you wanting them to do well.

Even before the cracking ball for the goal I was thinking that Walsh is the type of deeper midfielder that we never seem to be able to produce in England in the men’s game, despite always wanting to.

[Elzar]

Just to take a look from the "other" side for a moment, Germany will be absolutely gutted this morning that Popp got that late injury in the warm up. Not only does losing a player in the warm up ruin all prep you have done for the game, but to lose a player such as Popp is even worse. The German attack never looked fully functioning as a result. I reckon they would have got the win had she been on and keeping the 2 England defenders busy.

The bits of luck you need at times to win a tournament, and England got theirs at the best time!

[Jm55]

Just to take a look from the "other" side for a moment, Germany will be absolutely gutted this morning that Popp got that late injury in the warm up. Not only does losing a player in the warm up ruin all prep you have done for the game, but to lose a player such as Popp is even worse. The German attack never looked fully functioning as a result. I reckon they would have got the win had she been on and keeping the 2 England defenders busy.

The bits of luck you need at times to win a tournament, and England got theirs at the best time!

A bit like Thiago for us in Paris, granted he did play but when you compare his performance to what we saw on Saturday you do wonder what the result would have been had we got that version of him. Again similar with the Caraboa Cup Final which we obviously eventually won but I think it would have been done in normal time if he doesn’t get that injury.

It’s absolutely terrible luck ahead of a final and incredibly hard to deal with, if they’re going to get injured you’d rather it be a week before and make the decision at that point that they’re not playing so you can make plans to mitigate the loss.

[Red-Soldier]

Just to take a look from the "other" side for a moment, Germany will be absolutely gutted this morning that Popp got that late injury in the warm up. Not only does losing a player in the warm up ruin all prep you have done for the game, but to lose a player such as Popp is even worse. The German attack never looked fully functioning as a result. I reckon they would have got the win had she been on and keeping the 2 England defenders busy.

The bits of luck you need at times to win a tournament, and England got theirs at the best time!

Agree.

If they didn't win it now, you would start to wonder if they ever would.  Everything was set up for them to win and they came through.

[redtel]

Of course the men have earned it, we know the stories of people like Mo Salah who used to do an 8 hour round trip every day to play for his club. But I bet there hasn't been a single moment in Mo's life where the idea of playing football professionally seemed literally impossible to him. There won't have been a moment, as a child, where the other kids wouldn't let him play with them because he's a boy. He won't have been told as a teenager that playing the sport he loves must mean he's gay. His knowledge of the game won't have ever been questioned. I bet nobody's ever laughed or sneered at him when he said he plays football.

He would have been able to join a team from an early age, or go out every lunchtime at school and play. I bet his ability meant he was hero-worshipped by the other boys in his class and his parents proudly boasted about his talent.

There are absolutely no barriers that prevent men from playing football at an amateur level. Making it professionally is an incredibly difficult job for anyone but those England women will have had to fight just to be able to play football at all. That's really doing it the hard way.

Excellent summary.

I can’t imagine not being able to play football from a very young age. It’s a sobering message.

[Kenny's Jacket]

One thing I thought watching the celebrations etc later is how much I now hate ‘Sweet Caroline’…can we just send Neil Diamond his royalty cheque and forget playing it. And I used to quite like the song.

If it takes away airtime from David 'black up' Baddiel, then its good.

[rob1966]

To be fair I doubt the women particularly mind being crowned with the title of ending 56 years of hurt.

If the two sports were treated on an equal platform then I’d agree with you, but the women’s game still needs all the support and publicity it can get as I suspect once the aftermath from the Euros passes it will be largely forgotten about again, especially with the men’s World Cup coming up in December.

I do agree with your point though generally.

They haven't ended 56 years of hurt though, same as someone else said, we can't say we didn't go 30 years without winning the league because our women's team won their league in between our titles , the men's team haven't won anything since 5 months before I was born, and for those who follow the men's team, this doesn't change anything .

Just let them enjoy the fact that they are the first England team to win a major tournament.

[Jm55]

They haven't ended 56 years of hurt though, same as someone else said, we can't say we didn't go 30 years without winning the league because our women's team won their league in between our titles , the men's team haven't won anything since 5 months before I was born, and for those who follow the men's team, this doesn't change anything .

Just let them enjoy the fact that they are the first England team to win a major tournament.

To be clear I didn’t give a shit either way in terms of it being the end of any hurt for England, it’s zero years of hurt for me as I’m not remotely arsed whether England win anything or not.

I don’t disagree with you, I’m just making the point that I doubt that tag of ending 56 ‘years of hurt’ or whatever it is is a particularly unwelcome one to most of them, they are all bouncing round singing it’s coming home yesterday.

[lobsterboy]

Didn't end any hurt for me.
Couldn't give a toss about the men's side. Full of players I hate, usually managed by a snide and followed by the very worst examples the nation has to offer.
I never sing the national anthem and would happily boo and whistle all the way through it because its a painful dirge celebrating our servitude to a bunch of scumbags ruling by right of a god I don't believe in.

Made up for the women's team though, fair play to them.

[rushyman]

I said the same to my wife. Much better behaviour; but a little bit of needle up to a certain point is an essential ingredient.

Oh I agree, a little bit

The right amount of needle was left behind in the early 90’s though

It’s completely toxic now.

[B0151?]

Oh I agree, a little bit

The right amount of needle was left behind in the early 90’s though

It’s completely toxic now.

I mean before the 90s I would say it was worse than it is now, hooliganism and racism rampant and all that.

[has gone odd]

cannot stand international football at any level, but congrats to the lionesses, well played.

[B0151?]

Congrats to the women's team. Have a lot of contempt for the people who chat shit about women's football considering what the FA did to the game. Hopefully inspires generations to come and they can make further impact in next World Cup.

[gerrardisgod]

I think Sadiq Khan thinks he’s at a political rally.

[Nitramdorf]

Have tried to watch bits and pieces when not working over the last few weeks and have really enjoyed it. Certainly watched a lot more than I have of the England mens team over the last 20 years or so. Loved the finish for the German goal yesterday, top class.

Seeing the genuine joy on the girls faces yesterday was heartwarming. The number of young girls, supporting and loving the game is fantastic. Fingers crossed they will have easier access to teams in the very near future.

Well done ladies.

[Black Bull Nova]

To be clear I didn’t give a shit either way in terms of it being the end of any hurt for England, it’s zero years of hurt for me as I’m not remotely arsed whether England win anything or not.

I don’t disagree with you, I’m just making the point that I doubt that tag of ending 56 ‘years of hurt’ or whatever it is is a particularly unwelcome one to most of them, they are all bouncing round singing it’s coming home yesterday.

I'm not bothered much, like you. The only plus point is that if they keep going on about it then we might not have to put up with that crap expression any more and they can bin that song for ever. For a large part it was quite fun, call me a traitor but I absolutely loved it when Iceland stuffed Hodgson's England, I felt no hurt at all, only humour. I quite liked New Order and Bobby Robson (not Gazza though) but all the way through Revie, McLaren, Hodgson, Venables, Hoddle, Barnes, Crouch, Eriksen, Taylor, Pearce, Capello, Allardyce. I've not been bothered, International football just gets in the way of supporting LFC and the hype pisses me off no end. I have less problems with the Women's game but can't pretend I'm all that bothered, probably will get annoyed with the hype now though, I always am.  Grumpy Git.

[thaddeus]

cannot stand international football at any level, but congrats to the lionesses, well played.

Pretty much my feelings, too.  The England team seem a good bunch and even the Pickford vibes from the goalkeeper weren't too irritating  .  I don't think that's a gender thing either as I found the USA team at the last world cup as irritating as any men's team.

It's a nice feel-good story and, from what I've seen, without the "two world wars and one world cup" nonsense that would have come with the men's team beating the German men's team.  I suspect the overlap between the nationalistic Neanderthals and those that think women's football isn't a proper sport is very large so that toxicity should remain distant to the women's game.

[Son of Spion]

Are these the new Unbearables now? 🤔

It seems celebrating victories is actually ok now.

[RainbowFlick]

quality. really enjoyed that. it turns out international football is a lot more enjoyable when the stands aren't packed with gammons. i guess womens' football automatically filters out misogynists, incels and homophobes so i'm all for it. hoping to get to a few LFC women's fixtures off the back of this. would highly recommend anyone who can to do similar. if you're local, an adult season ticket is only £70 for the season and even cheaper for kids. seems a bargain to me in relative terms against the mens' game.

[Wilmo]

Of course the men have earned it, we know the stories of people like Mo Salah who used to do an 8 hour round trip every day to play for his club. But I bet there hasn't been a single moment in Mo's life where the idea of playing football professionally seemed literally impossible to him. There won't have been a moment, as a child, where the other kids wouldn't let him play with them because he's a boy. He won't have been told as a teenager that playing the sport he loves must mean he's gay. His knowledge of the game won't have ever been questioned. I bet nobody's ever laughed or sneered at him when he said he plays football.

He would have been able to join a team from an early age, or go out every lunchtime at school and play. I bet his ability meant he was hero-worshipped by the other boys in his class and his parents proudly boasted about his talent.

There are absolutely no barriers that prevent men from playing football at an amateur level. Making it professionally is an incredibly difficult job for anyone but those England women will have had to fight just to be able to play football at all. That's really doing it the hard way.

Superb post, nailed it

[dai_bonehead]

Didn't end any hurt for me.
Couldn't give a toss about the men's side. Full of players I hate, usually managed by a snide and followed by the very worst examples the nation has to offer.
I never sing the national anthem and would happily boo and whistle all the way through it because its a painful dirge celebrating our servitude to a bunch of scumbags ruling by right of a god I don't believe in.

Amen! Right on!

[Johnny Foreigner]

everybody happy and no-one discussing the clear penalty that germany didn't get ? i guess that sums it up

[Elzar]

everybody happy and no-one discussing the clear penalty that germany didn't get ? i guess that sums it up

winning teams classically reflect on decisions they got away with after a match.

[reddebs]

Any sort of competitive sport for women has been frowned upon for decades.

We were banned by the IOC from running the 800mtrs in 1928 due to it being "too exhausting" and it wasn't reinstated until 1960.

We were only allowed to run marathons from 1972 and the 10,000mtrs in 1988.

I can only imagine how empowering this is to my granddaughter's, especially the eldest at 12yrs old who already plays for a girls team.

She was inspired to take up trampolining and gymnastics after the Rio Olympics but realised her body had outgrown it during covid and swapped to football last year.

[Johnny Foreigner]

winning teams classically reflect on decisions they got away with after a match.

I could be be wrong but my impression is that it has been a fairly even split between praising the lionesses (fair that) and what a wonderful tournament it has been (fair enough). No mentioning about the fact that UEFA didn't bother about putting up enough cameras to have a good VAR-setup and germany lost the most blatant penalty you could ever imagine.. home nation winning and everybody happy..

And if the womens football should be judged in its own merits, its pretty strange that no-one is discussing the game in general.. Its pretty bad that the home nation has been given huge advantages.. It was supposed to come home and who cares about fair play

[WhereAngelsPlay]

You got a clip of this penalty ?

[Linudden]

Fair play to them to get that high of turnout to the matches. Like I've always said, for women's football to succeed and be a lucrative business for the players, this would need to be replicated at a weekly club level. It's the women's game and belongs to the girls so if you build it the money will come. If being able to fill Anfield week in and out for the LFC Ladies for a decent ticket revenue then the game will rapidly progress since more young girls will see football as a career opportunity.

It's hard to ask male supporters to do this though. It's only natural that men will mostly follow the game where other men play because it's more relateable. It's not meant as disrespect at all, but just the sociological reality of group dynamics. If women's football grow, likewise a lot more females will watch and follow that. Football as a sport is very much oversaturated and hard to find time to watch everything as it is. Even Scottish male football struggle to make ends meet due to the English market being much larger. That's the challenge, to even get women's football to organically make more money than mid-sized males' leagues. So, the greater interest in sports among a female audience there is, the more women's football will grow. Championships are a part of that, but the weekly business is what is going to be making or breaking the deal.

Most women I know would say 'women don't like sport' and say it's impossible to get a wide female audience for weekly events, but I'd dismiss that. It can happen but the cultural shift must go further from young ages to get more girls involved in different sports as participants. It probably won't happen in Southern Europe and Latin America though. I don't think we'll ever see Spain, Italy and Brazil be proper powerhouses in the ladies' game. Except at a club level. It's actually a surprise it's taken England so long to catch up to Germany in women's football to me, since both countries are very progressive when it comes to parents encouraging daughters participating in sports. As the game grows in the United States, England, Germany and France, it will further go away from Scandinavia though because Sweden, Denmark and Norway just won't have the same numbers to compete anymore.

If we can get to a situation where the best female players make more from club wages (excluding endorsements/national team bonuses) than the lads playing in the Championship in the next 20 years I'd still be surprised. That being said, I wish them good luck

[Johnny Foreigner]

You got a clip of this penalty ?

home nation england got lucky in the final and in the semi vs the swedes (2nd goal) by (missing) VAR. embarrassing decisions by the officials, it's googable

[Barneylfc∗]

home nation england got lucky in the final and in the semi vs the swedes (2nd goal) by (missing) VAR. embarrassing decisions by the officials, it's googable

If it's the one Williamson batted off the line that was indeed an incredible decision. I don't remember seeing it live but I was out and about so didn't watch from start to finish. Reminded me of Reece James against us at the start of last season.

[Yorkykopite]

germany lost the most blatant penalty you could ever imagine..

At the moment I'm having to imagine it. Have you got a clip you can show us?

[WhereAngelsPlay]

home nation england got lucky in the final and in the semi vs the swedes (2nd goal) by (missing) VAR. embarrassing decisions by the officials, it's googable

A simple no would've done.

[oojason]

There is a clip of it here - I think this is the incident that VAR decided was not a penalty? (unless there is another incident?):-

https://twitter.com/_Schulli07_/status/1553831722202152960 (with video)


a couple of still images:-

[KevLFC]

Yeah, it's bollocks.

They are two different sports and should be celebrated as such!  I don't understand why the always put them in the same bracket.

Like Tennis. They don't start mixing the two unless it's mixed doubles

[Yorkykopite]

There is a clip of it here - I think this is the incident that VAR decided was not a penalty? (unless there is another incident?):-

https://twitter.com/_Schulli07_/status/1553831722202152960 (with video)


a couple of still images:-

Thanks Jason.

It's really difficult to say isn't it? It looks like it was the shoulder rather than the arm or hand, but impossible to say with any finality. It was interesting that no German player appealed for a penalty at the time, not that that is conclusive either.

PS the stills are no help at all, but they rarely are in football. They can be incredibly misleading, as anyone who remembers newspaper captions to footy photos in the 70s and 80s will remember.

[oojason]

No worries mate - the still images are really just there to make sure I got the right incident. There was a similar goal-line scramble where the England gk did well and smothered the ball (?) - wasn't sure if that was the issue you guys were talking about, or something else.

[Johnny Foreigner]

thanks oojason; its close but I am leaning towards a penalty... interesting that VAR didn't get involved.. similarly interesting that VAR did not get involved in the 2-0 and the match point in the semis which looks to be an offside.. home nation getting goals in the semi and the final... yes, it was meant to come home

[Crosby Nick]

thanks oojason; its close but I am leaning towards a penalty... interesting that VAR didn't get involved.. similarly interesting that VAR did not get involved in the 2-0 and the match point in the semis which looks to be an offside.. home nation getting goals in the semi and the final... yes, it was meant to come home

VAR did get involved. There was a pause while they reviewed it and came back and said no penalty.

What was the issue with the 2nd goal against Sweden? Was that the header that went past everyone and in? Was someone offside impeding the keeper’s view? Ultimately it was the 2nd goal in what turned out to be a fairly comfortable 4-0.