Topic: Space exploration thread - Unexpected Rapid Disassembly in the launch area.

[TepidT2O]

Well, if there were any lingering doubt, finding a conglomerate rock pretty much nails there being lots of water on mars at some time.

[farawayred]

Geology? Shouldn't we call it Marsology?  .

[Ginamos]

Geology? Shouldn't we call it Marsology?   

Never thought about that before, but you're right.

Amazing times, all in the same week we play the youngest first team player. My head's spinning.

[Red Beret]

Well, if there were any lingering doubt, finding a conglomerate rock pretty much nails there being lots of water on mars at some time.

I don't think the volume of water on Mars has been in dispute for a great many years.  Indeed, there is still massive quantities of water on the planet.  The arguments these days focus on how and when the water has existed on the planet's surface.  There's a strong argument for a Mars that's always been cold and desolate, but with these occasional outbursts of liquid water (in Mars' low atmospheric pressure, zero Celsius is around the 'triple point' of water, where it can exist in all three states, but that's only certain areas and then only briefly).

What this finding might resolve is whether Mars was warmer and wetter in the past, with a thicker atmosphere; that would allow the sedimentary rock to build up over time.  Or has it been deposited in a sudden outpouring of water that quickly (a year?  Decade?) froze or evaporated away?  Meteorite impacts could probably generate that kind of heat...

EDIT:  Latest nav-cam raw image:

[Trada]

A fortuitous orbit of the International Space Station allowed the astronauts this striking view of Sarychev Volcano (Kuril Islands, northeast of Japan) in an early stage of eruption on June 12, 2009

[Red Beret]

Dunno if I've posted this before but I find it oddly relaxing.  It's the journey of a space shuttle SRB back to Earth.

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/FVUcW-4C18U&amp;list=FLDmUp4GiY3LTXLeEUGzaP1A&amp;index=61&amp;feature=plpp_video" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer" class="bbc_link bbc_flash_disabled new_win">http://www.youtube.com/v/FVUcW-4C18U&amp;list=FLDmUp4GiY3LTXLeEUGzaP1A&amp;index=61&amp;feature=plpp_video</a>

[StokieSteve]

Dunno if I've posted this before but I find it oddly relaxing.  It's the journey of a space shuttle SRB back to Earth.

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/FVUcW-4C18U&amp;list=FLDmUp4GiY3LTXLeEUGzaP1A&amp;index=61&amp;feature=plpp_video" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer" class="bbc_link bbc_flash_disabled new_win">http://www.youtube.com/v/FVUcW-4C18U&amp;list=FLDmUp4GiY3LTXLeEUGzaP1A&amp;index=61&amp;feature=plpp_video</a>

Enjoyed that mate thanks. At around four minutes in you could still see the trail from take off. That was great, until it ended and Scrubs started. 

[Trada]

Mars Streambed

Curiosity science team member Sanjeev Gupta explains how rounded pebbles spotted by the rover are convincing evidence of an ancient streambed on Mars.

http://www.nasa.gov/multimedia/videogallery/index.html?collection_id=18895&media_id=153008151

[Red Beret]

Nice little article on the Curiosity website:

http://mars.jpl.nasa.gov/blogs/index.cfm?FuseAction=ShowBlogs&BlogsID=264

And what's wrong with Scrubs?? 

[Uhoh AureliOs]

Hmm can't get the embed to work on this one.

http://channel.nationalgeographic.com/channel/videos/space-dive/embed/?vWidth=640&vHeight=391


Felix Baumgartner is going for a record 23 mile high sky dive attempt, which was postponed from today until tomorrow due to high winds, but above is his test he did at 30km. It's almost like that SRB video. So peaceful until he steps off the edge. Good luck to him.

[farawayred]

Space flight is not easy... Space-X successfully launched the first cargo mission last Sunday and they had the first anomaly:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y6zsZiVa998

OFFICIAL from SpaceX: "Engine 1 lost pressure suddenly and an engine shutdown command was issued immediately. We know the engine did not explode, because we continued to receive data from it. Our review indicates that the fairing that protects the engine from aerodynamic loads ruptured due to the engine pressure release, and that none of Falcon 9’s other eight engines were impacted by this event."

If you ask me, that's a nozzle blow out, but what do I know...

[farawayred]

And there is the first curious event with Curiosity... The rover started scooping dirt for sieving. Everything was going smoothly, the dirt settled in nicely, there was no clumping, etc., and all was dandy until someone noticed a shiny object on the ground... I hope it's a weirdly illuminated rock, but it looks like a screw... We'll know more tomorrow after some more pictures come back.

[farawayred]

Sorry for the level of ignorance I'm about to display but is the thinking that the 'screw' is off the Curiosity, or was discovered in what was excavated?

It may be just weird lighting of an off-focus object (e.g., sharp rock); the focus was on the scoop sample, not on the ground. But if it is indeed a screw, it must be from Curiosity. Then it will be a hard work to identify where it came from and what risk that poses to using the equipment. You know, when you take things apart and put them back together, there are always a few screws left; I'm hoping that's the case here...

[El_Pistolero]

i.e. not off the rover and therefore rather difficult to explain

Left by the set construction crew. Useless bastards.

[farawayred]

Left by the set construction crew. Useless bastards.

Don't be so harsh on them, eh?! The old guys from the Apolo program are either retired or no longer among us. Who could pass the experience?

BTW, that's what I was laughing at the other day... Before they scooped, they drove the rover around in circles and looked at the track to make sure the top soil is loose. On the picture that came back, you could see the wheel, and in the top left corner there was a wheel imprint with parallel lines, and I was joking that it looked too much like Neil Armstrong footprint on the moon...

[Red Beret]

The shiny object in question...

[J-Mc-]

The little thing at the bottom in the middle?

Looks like a rock.

[PeterJM]

I don't know if it can be classed as space exploration but i've just been reading about Felix Baumgartners attempt today and the highest skydive.It looks and sounds completely bonkers.

[djphal]

I don't know if it can be classed as space exploration but i've just been reading about Felix Baumgartners attempt today and the highest skydive.It looks and sounds completely bonkers.

yep, you can watch it here

http://www.youtube.com/redbull

apparently everyone who has tried it has died

[farawayred]

The little thing at the bottom in the middle?

Looks like a rock.

We hope it is. But look at the shadow, the object almost looks like sticking up.

[J-Mc-]

We hope it is. But look at the shadow, the object almost looks like sticking up.

Hhmmm you're right, just zoomed in on the ipad and you can slightly see the shadow now.

Looks more like it's shooting out of the ground, surely if a screw had fell off the rover then it wouldn't land straight up? Also, it looks slightly bent, as if it's wilting....

You may have found the entrance to the martian base!

[djphal]

What about Joseph Kissinger? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph_Kittinger

He's the only guy who'll be talking to FB on his way back down to earth.

Not sure to be honest, thats the link I was sent

Its starting now on there anyway

[djphal]

cancelled til tomorrow!

[cim-pim-param]

Shame, hopefully I won't miss it tomorrow.

[Red Beret]

We hope it is. But look at the shadow, the object almost looks like sticking up.

I think it's lying flat... perhaps partially buried under the regolith?  Difficult to be sure on that resolution but what are the odds that a screw would not only fall but land perfectly vertical?  I mean, yeah sure the gravity's only about a third of Earth's but still...

[clacke]

The latest image of the mysterious object. The rover team's assessment is that the bright object is something from the rover, not Martian material. It appears to be a shred of plastic material, likely benign, but it has not been definitively identified.

[Stevie-A]

The latest image of the mysterious object. The rover team's assessment is that the bright object is something from the rover, not Martian material. It appears to be a shred of plastic material, likely benign, but it has not been definitively identified.

Looks like a Babel fish.

[TepidT2O]

Looks like a Babel fish.

Must have a towel somewhere too.

[bobadicious]

The latest image of the mysterious object. The rover team's assessment is that the bright object is something from the rover, not Martian material. It appears to be a shred of plastic material, likely benign, but it has not been definitively identified.

Its obviously been dropped by one of the camera crew.

[farawayred]

The latest image of the mysterious object. The rover team's assessment is that the bright object is something from the rover, not Martian material. It appears to be a shred of plastic material, likely benign, but it has not been definitively identified.

The object on the big picture above (not requoted to save space) has been named "Darth Vader". We now have two other shiny objects that got engineers looking at the ground instead of the scoop... That's got to be epoxy from the rover (my current guess). Some say that may be debris from the reentry.

[Red Beret]

Well the rover was lowered from the sky crane by cables right?  Those cables were then cut before the sky crane flew off?  Could it be something to do with that?

[Red Beret]

It was expected to be just another lump of dull basalt, but the first rock examined up close by Nasa's Mars rover proved to be a little more interesting.

The pyramidal object, nicknamed "Jake Matijevic" after a recently passed mission engineer, had a composition not seen on the planet before. Scientists have likened it to some unusual but well known rocks on Earth.

These form from relatively water-rich magmas that have cooled slowly at raised pressures, said Edward Stolper.

"[The rock is] widespread on Earth, on oceanic islands such as Hawaii, and St Helena, and the Azores; and also in rift zones like the Rio Grande and so forth. So, again, it's not common, but it's very well known," the mission co-investigator from the California Institute of Technology, Pasadena, told reporters.

The Curiosity rover examined Jake Matijevic three weeks ago. At the time, the dark rock was not anticipated to have high science value; it was merely an early opportunity to use the robot's survey instruments in unison.

Jake Matijevic also had an interesting, weathered appearance that drew attention.

The rover first zapped the rock from a distance with its ChemCam laser, and then moved in close to study it with its X-ray spectrometer known as APXS. The latter device is held on the end of the rover's robotic arm; the laser is mounted on its mast.

Jake Matijevic was found to be high in elements consistent with the mineral feldspar, such as sodium and potassium, and low in elements such as magnesium and iron.

Prof Stolper compared the signatures with a catalogue containing thousands of Earth rocks, and determined the nearest match to be an igneous type, the formation of which he likened to the production of colonial apple jack liquor.

This saw barrels of cider left outside in winter to partially freeze. As the barrels iced up, it would concentrate the apple-flavoured liquor.

A similar process was occurred in the liquid magma several kilometres underground that gave rise to alkalic rocks like Jake Matijevic, said Prof Stolper.

"In the case of the apple jack, you take out water and concentrate alcohol; in this case you take out particular minerals - olivines, pyroxenes and some feldspars - and you generate a liquid that is very different to what you started with," he explained.

"So, the composition of Jake Matijevic is a very close match to highly crystallised or fractionated magmas that occur in particular places on Earth."

Curiosity landed in Mars' equatorial Gale Crater in August, and has driven eastwards almost 500m since then.

It is currently stationed just short of a point called Glenelg, where satellite images have revealed a juxtaposition of three different types of terrain.

Scientists expect this location to be a good starting point to begin characterising the geology of Gale.
Scoop The rover is scooping dirt to scrub its system for handling and sorting samples

The mission is going through something of a lull presently while the rover spends a few days preparing its sample handling system.

It is running dirt through this equipment to scrub surfaces free of any residual contamination from Earth.

This is necessary to avoid skewing the analyses of rock and soil samples delivered to the rover's onboard laboratories later in the mission.

Curiosity's goal is to try to determine if Gale ever supported environments that might have allowed microbial life to flourish.

In the short time it has been on the ground, it has already identified rocks that were clearly deposited in fast running water. The theory is that the rover is sitting at the head of an ancient alluvial fan where a network of streams cut across the crater floor billions of years ago.

[farawayred]

Well the rover was lowered from the sky crane by cables right?  Those cables were then cut before the sky crane flew off?  Could it be something to do with that?

Yes, there is growing support for the hypothesis that this might be something from the descent stage because we are finding more pieces around. Here is a cut off of the latest image:

[Trada]

Virtual Astronomer ‏@VirtualAstro

Tomorrows incredibly bright ISS pass over the UK is at 19:56 Don't miss it!

[farawayred]

Hmmm... The Curiosity web page hasn't updated yet, but here is the lowdown. The second scoop went great too in mechanical sense, but a little spec of something shiny was found laying on top of the freshly scooped surface... It's ours, and we have to figure out where it's coming from. They are holding scooping activities until a decision is made.

P.S. The rover wakeup song for was "I love trash" (Oscar the Grouch from Sesame Street):

[Uhoh AureliOs]

Do they think this new bit is still possibly from the descent or are they thinking it's come off the rover itself again?

[farawayred]

Do they think this new bit is still possibly from the descent or are they thinking it's come off the rover itself again?

Considering the fact that the particle is sitting on the freshly scooped surface, it's highly unlikely that it is fallout from the descent. That never seemed probable to me, because there are too many particles per unit area... The arm is also a shaker - it vibrates to pass material samples from the scoop or the drill bit into the tunnels and to sieve a sample with a certain grain size. It's possible that bits from materials (like epoxy) may fall off. Maybe we should just shake it off and move to a new place to scoop. (At least one more throw-away sample has to be processed anyway.) 

[Red Beret]

Just an aside, but interesting to note how the 'soil' looks like moist sand.

[cim-pim-param]

A planet with four suns has been identified by two "armchair astronomers".

The bright new world, just under 5,000 light years away, is believed to be six times the size of Earth.

It orbits one pair of stars and is in turn circled by a second pair. As a result, a total of four stars light up its skies.

A handful of planets are already known to orbit pairs of binary stars, but the new find is said to be unique.

"It's fascinating to try and imagine what it would be like to visit a planet with four suns in its sky, but this new world is confusing astronomers - it's not at all clear how it formed in such a busy environment," said Dr Chris Lintott, from Oxford University.

The planet was discovered by two US volunteers using the planethunters.org website operated by scientists including Dr Lintott. The website allows visitors to identify dips in the output of stars caused by their light being blocked by "transits" of orbiting stars.

Kian Jek, from San Francisco, and Robert Gagliano, from Cottonwood, Arizona, spotted the effect as the new planet passed in front of its suns.

A team of professional astronomers confirmed the find using the Keck telescopes on Mauna Kea, Hawaii. The planet has been named PH1 after the planethunters website.

Dr Arfon Smith, from Adler Planetarium in Chicago, another member of the planethunters team, said: "It's an amazing discovery, but what's even more exciting is that, with more data currently being added to planethunters.org for anyone to explore, we really don't know what our armchair astronomers will discover next."

Details of the discovery were presented at the Division for Planetary Sciences meeting in Reno, Nevada.




http://uk.news.yahoo.com/planet-four-suns-discovered-154014489.html

[Tomaldinho]

How does that work then? Does it orbit one of the smaller suns which orbits the larger one? Or can suns not orbit other suns?