Topic: The RAWK History Channel

[rafathegaffa83]

Just finished reading Odd Arne Westad's Cold War: A World History. An excellent, balanced overview of the topic that benefits enormously from not deifying/aggrandizing the influence of Reagan and Thatcher's Cold War policies (this is largely an issue with American historians), as well as going into detail about other areas of the world that are often crucially overlooked in these critiques (i.e. China, India etc). Highly recommended

[west_london_red]

If you want a book on the French Revolution, then Citizens by Simon Sharma is scintillating.

Fixed it for you.

All his work is scintillating.

[Nitramdorf]

Just read Max Hastings - Nemesis about the war in the far east/Pacific in 44/45. Fascinating and shocking. Even though I've read many, many books about the war there are still some facts that are surpises. I never knew that the Japanese navy never used life rafts or life belts as it was considered to be a negative. Amazing really. Interesting that Nagasaki was the second choice for the bomb that day. It was supposed to be dropped on Kokura but due to cloud cover they went for Nagasaki instead.
Also that scene in The Pacific tv series where they are flicking stones into the open rain filled skull of a Japanese machine gunner is a true story.

Just been working through the Ken Burns films on netflix as I enjoyed his Vietnam film last year. Came across a good one on prohibition. Was a great piece on there about an old lady called Carrie Nation who went around smashing up bars with an axe. Made me smile.

I mainly read historical fiction and probably the main series of books where I learned a lot was the Colleen McCullough Rome series. Seven glorious books.
I also enjoy James Michener types of sagas, with the baton being passed to Edward Rutherfurd.

Its great to read books or authors I dont know, so thanks everyone for a few tips.

[Qston]

Just read Max Hastings - Nemesis about the war in the far east/Pacific in 44/45. Fascinating and shocking. Even though I've read many, many books about the war there are still some facts that are surpises. I never knew that the Japanese navy never used life rafts or life belts as it was considered to be a negative. Amazing really. Interesting that Nagasaki was the second choice for the bomb that day. It was supposed to be dropped on Kokura but due to cloud cover they went for Nagasaki instead.
Also that scene in The Pacific tv series where they are flicking stones into the open rain filled skull of a Japanese machine gunner is a true story.

Just been working through the Ken Burns films on netflix as I enjoyed his Vietnam film last year. Came across a good one on prohibition. Was a great piece on there about an old lady called Carrie Nation who went around smashing up bars with an axe. Made me smile.

I mainly read historical fiction and probably the main series of books where I learned a lot was the Colleen McCullough Rome series. Seven glorious books.
I also enjoy James Michener types of sagas, with the baton being passed to Edward Rutherfurd.

Its great to read books or authors I dont know, so thanks everyone for a few tips.

Max Hastings books generally on WW2 are very well researched and eminently readable. His books on Churchill (The Warlord Years) and All Hell Let Loose are fantastic. The personal anecdotes throughout the latter are heartbreaking and illuminating

[Nitramdorf]

Max Hastings books generally on WW2 are very well researched and eminently readable. His books on Churchill (The Warlord Years) and All Hell Let Loose are fantastic. The personal anecdotes throughout the latter are heartbreaking and illuminating

Thanks mate, up to now I had only read his Korean War book. I have all the others now, might go for his World War 1 next, then the Churchill one. His Secret War book intrigues me also.

[afc tukrish]

Just read Max Hastings - Nemesis about the war in the far east/Pacific in 44/45. Fascinating and shocking. Even though I've read many, many books about the war there are still some facts that are surpises. I never knew that the Japanese navy never used life rafts or life belts as it was considered to be a negative. Amazing really. Interesting that Nagasaki was the second choice for the bomb that day. It was supposed to be dropped on Kokura but due to cloud cover they went for Nagasaki instead.
Also that scene in The Pacific tv series where they are flicking stones into the open rain filled skull of a Japanese machine gunner is a true story.

Just been working through the Ken Burns films on netflix as I enjoyed his Vietnam film last year. Came across a good one on prohibition. Was a great piece on there about an old lady called Carrie Nation who went around smashing up bars with an axe. Made me smile.

I mainly read historical fiction and probably the main series of books where I learned a lot was the Colleen McCullough Rome series. Seven glorious books.
I also enjoy James Michener types of sagas, with the baton being passed to Edward Rutherfurd.

Its great to read books or authors I dont know, so thanks everyone for a few tips.

Very much echo the merits of Masters of Rome by McCullough, her author's notes contain historical sources and discussions of influences on her fictional narrative choices. She comes across as very well read in the Classics...

[Sarge]

You invaded us, left but kept some of our Courtry and now you have to put up with The DuUP, serves you right.

[So… Howard Philips]

You invaded us, left but kept some of our Courtry and now you have to put up with The DuUP, serves you right.

Can't agree with that. The DUP are a cruel and unusual punishment.

[Sarge]

Can't agree with that. The DUP are a cruel and unusual punishment.

We've had them for decades.

[Mutton Geoff]

And that's probably why so many on here are self taught, picking up periods of history from novels or documentaries and then reading around the subject.

Exactly; mind you when i had history lessons as a lad we still had an empire.

However I always loved the period from the Tudors right through to the Civil War.

[So… Howard Philips]

Exactly; mind you when i had history lessons as a lad we still had an empire.

However I always loved the period from the Tudors right through to the Civil War.

As I've got older I've realised the period from the Tudors to the Civil War and on to the Restoration of the Stuarts (including William) was the foundation of modern Britain. Parliamentary Sovereignty (haha), global trade and the rise of the Royal navy and the roots of empire, the consolidation of modern banking.

The various branches of the Plantagenets were just the template for the Lannisters, Boltons and Starks and seemed to spend most of their time finding increasingly cruel ways to bump off unwanted relatives.

[jillcwhomever]

As I've got older I've realised the period from the Tudors to the Civil War and on to the Restoration of the Stuarts (including William) was the foundation of modern Britain. Parliamentary Sovereignty (haha), global trade and the rise of the Royal navy and the roots of empire, the consolidation of modern banking.

The various branches of the Plantagenets were just the template for the Lannisters, Boltons and Starks and seemed to spend most of their time finding increasingly cruel ways to bump off unwanted relatives.

It's interesting you mention GOT, it is definitely based on certain parts of history the most obvious one being the War of the Roses which GRR Martin has a fascination for (Starks verses Lannisters). On one of the extras think it was series 5, they had some experts on who were identifying who the various characters were based on. It's quite interesting who they came up with.

[jillcwhomever]

I wanted to point to some really good documentaries on catch up TV at the moment. I have just seen a documentary on BBC4 called The Downfall of Charles the I, really interesting and well made. Another well made one was on Channel 5 about Henry the VIII and his wives, which taught me things I wasn't aware off.

[So… Howard Philips]

I wanted to point to some really good documentaries on catch up TV at the moment. I have just seen a documentary on BBC4 called The Downfall of Charles the I, really interesting and well made. Another well made one was on Channel 5 about Henry the VIII and his wives, which taught me things I wasn't aware off.

I thought it was excellent they way they analysed the poloitical tactics used by, I suppose, the Opposition.

Pym was a master politician, Charles merely an entitled King by Divine Right who prorogued Parlaiment.

Remind you of someone? 

[Nobby Reserve]

I thought it was excellent they way they analysed the poloitical tactics used by, I suppose, the Opposition.

Pym was a master politician, Charles merely an entitled King by Divine Right who prorogued Parlaiment.

Remind you of someone? 

Not the 'master politician' bit. Not these days.

[So… Howard Philips]

Not the 'master politician' bit. Not these days.

It wasn't the master politician I was referring to.

[jillcwhomever]

I thought it was excellent they way they analysed the poloitical tactics used by, I suppose, the Opposition.

Pym was a master politician, Charles merely an entitled King by Divine Right who prorogued Parlaiment.

Remind you of someone?

It certainly did, highly appropriate for today's situation. 

[bradders1011]

Really enjoyed the Charles I doc, having understood relatively little about how the Civil Wars actually started, but did we really need the Brexit/Trump allusions? Sometimes I just want to switch off and enjoy the hindsight of political turbulences of another age.

[So… Howard Philips]

Really enjoyed the Charles I doc, having understood relatively little about how the Civil Wars actually started, but did we really need the Brexit/Trump allusions? Sometimes I just want to switch off and enjoy the hindsight of political turbulences of another age.

Certainly the political furore around Brexit and the obvious tactical similarities were the reason the documentary makers and the BBC commissioned it now.

Otherwise it probably wouldn't have been made.

[Nitramdorf]

Theres a wonderful two part show on More 4 at the moment -

Life after WW1 in colour.

There is also a three part show on the same channel called Living in the Shadow of WW2, haven't seen it yet but looks great.

[jillcwhomever]

There have been a number of docs I've seen recently on all sorts of channels about Ancient Egypt. Endlessly fascinating they are.

[So… Howard Philips]

Just watched the BBC documentary about Joan of Arc.

Fascinating that a full transcript of her interrogation and trial have survived, as have the French  trial records of the Templars.

[jillcwhomever]

Just watched the BBC documentary about Joan of Arc.

Fascinating that a full transcript of her interrogation and trial have survived, as have the French  trial records of the Templars.

I would like to see that, what was it called?

[Nitramdorf]

I would like to see that, what was it called?

I think, Joan of Arc: Gods Warrior, am just downloading it now

[jillcwhomever]

I think, Joan of Arc: Gods Warrior, am just downloading it now

Thanks will look at that tomorrow.

[Sangria]

Just watched the BBC documentary about Joan of Arc.

Fascinating that a full transcript of her interrogation and trial have survived, as have the French  trial records of the Templars.

There's a series on Joan on the Extra Credits youtube channel. It mostly concentrates on gaming issues, but it also branches out into history (sometimes obscure) and mythology.

[KillieRed]

If you are into WW2 history is advise "The Rise and Fall of the 3rd Reich" by William L.Shirer. He was an american correspondent based in Nazi Germany until Hitler declared war on America. I always say to people it reads like a novel. It`s really accessible as long as you can keep track of all the characters. One of my 'favourites' being Otto Skozerny who popped up from time to time in the oddest places. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Otto_Skorzeny He was implicated in the false flag operation that kickstarted the invasion of Poland.

As for history in general, i studied it as part of my degree and it focussed mainly on the 20th Century. At secondary school in the eighties we were taught British & European History, which pretty much amounted to the history of the British Empire and rarely touched on Scottish issues; i knew nothing about the Darien, the process of joining the union or anything about the Scottish monarchy (which is at times hilarious)etc until after i left uni! There`s now a great informal push to educate people on Scottish history that is, no doubt, politically motivated. Magnus Magnusson's "Scotland:The Story of a Nation" https://www.amazon.co.uk/Scotland-Story-Nation-Magnus-Magnusson/dp/0006531911 is another very accessible book.

[Sangria]

If you are into WW2 history is advise "The Rise and Fall of the 3rd Reich" by William L.Shirer. He was an american correspondent based in Nazi Germany until Hitler declared war on America. I always say to people it reads like a novel. It`s really accessible as long as you can keep track of all the characters. One of my 'favourites' being Otto Skozerny who popped up from time to time in the oddest places. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Otto_Skorzeny He was implicated in the false flag operation that kickstarted the invasion of Poland.

As for history in general, i studied it as part of my degree and it focussed mainly on the 20th Century. At secondary school in the eighties we were taught British & European History, which pretty much amounted to the history of the British Empire and rarely touched on Scottish issues; i knew nothing about the Darien, the process of joining the union or anything about the Scottish monarchy (which is at times hilarious)etc until after i left uni! There`s now a great informal push to educate people on Scottish history that is, no doubt, politically motivated. Magnus Magnusson's "Scotland:The Story of a Nation" https://www.amazon.co.uk/Scotland-Story-Nation-Magnus-Magnusson/dp/0006531911 is another very accessible book.

There's an extremely right wing youtube historian called TIKhistory who hugely despises the basis of leftist politics, but whose historiography on WWII is utterly impeccable. Overlook his tracts on socialism and everything pertaining to the left, and he takes apart dodgy narratives based on memoirs whose purpose is to cover up the truth. He notably demolished the established narrative of the Third Battle of Kharkov in 1943 by demonstrating how Manstein bends the truth in his memoirs and how the mainline narrative accepts his word without double checking the sources. He's also fairly savage on Halder, the coverer up in chief who was granted full access to German archives based on the fact that Hitler took a dislike to him.

Complementary to this is Military History Visualised/Unvisualised, another youtube channel, who is arguably even more rigorous on cross checking reliable sources, but who may be less easy to go through (as TIK notes, the best and most reliable historians tend to be dry as fuck). Between them, they are hugely educational on the view of WWII history based on cross checking with newly available information that is now becoming more mainstream among respected historians.

[rob1966]

Saw one last week about the JFK assasination, not sure when it was first aired, where they debunked the usual theories. In this one, they also worked out where the missing bullet went from the first shot. It also explained the locations of the shell casings on the floor where Oswald shot him from. They found Oswald took his first shot just after the car turned left into Deley Plaza- eye witnesses at the time spoke of hearing a shot at this time - but couldn't figure out how he had missed. From looking back at the re-creation the Secret Service did at the time, they realised the shot had hit the traffic light as the car passed under it, fragmenting the bullet.

The casings on the floor, two can be seen to be clearly together, this is the second and third shot and one on its own



Grainy pictures, but daylight can be seen through the hole in the bottom left.

[Indomitable_Carp]

Today marks 80 years since Germany invaded Poland to help spark the bloodiest conflict in human history.

[Nitramdorf]

An interesting show on BBC4 this week and next. Lost films of WW2. All clips from homemade films made before and during the war. There is quite a bit about a place for evacuees near Liverpool called Yealand Manor.

[jillcwhomever]

This thread has been too quiet recently. Anyone seen any good documentaries or read any interesting books? I recommend Britain's Bloody Crown on Channel 5, five episodes on the Battle of the Roses a well made documentary.

[Nitramdorf]

Have been engrossed in a documentary on BBC4 this week - Korea: The Never Ending War.

Well worth a look.

[Nitramdorf]

This thread has been too quiet recently. Anyone seen any good documentaries or read any interesting books? I recommend Britain's Bloody Crown on Channel 5, five episodes on the Battle of the Roses a well made documentary.

I have really enjoyed Sam Neill's 6 part series about Captain Cook and his various voyages of discovery around the Pacific. It is on the History channel in the UK. One episode to go.

[jillcwhomever]

I have really enjoyed Sam Neill's 6 part series about Captain Cook and his various voyages of discovery around the Pacific. It is on the History channel in the UK. One episode to go.

Sounds interesting may look that one up. Thanks .

[jillcwhomever]

I saw the film The King last night on Netflix which is based on the Battle of Agincourt and was quite impressed with it. I didn't really do much on this at School, so its always fascinating seeing something like this. The number of men who died in the mud was almost reminiscent of the first World War and it certainly did a good job at showing the awfulness of dying is such a terrible way. It was also fascinating to see how Henry struggled in his initial time as King, in knowing who to trust. It's made me want to look at more about this time now.

[Sangria]

I saw the film The King last night on Netflix which is based on the Battle of Agincourt and was quite impressed with it. I didn't really do much on this at School, so its always fascinating seeing something like this. The number of men who died in the mud was almost reminiscent of the first World War and it certainly did a good job at showing the awfulness of dying is such a terrible way. It was also fascinating to see how Henry struggled in his initial time as King, in knowing who to trust. It's made me want to look at more about this time now.

He also nearly died in battle as a 16 year old, both with the initial injury and the subsequent surgery (that would be highly precarious even with today's technology and skills). IIRC he was also the first King to set English as the working language of the English government, as part of his reforms of government. Even aside from Agincourt, Henry V would have ranked highly as an effective ruler.

[So… Howard Philips]

He also nearly died in battle as a 16 year old, both with the initial injury and the subsequent surgery (that would be highly precarious even with today's technology and skills). IIRC he was also the first King to set English as the working language of the English government, as part of his reforms of government. Even aside from Agincourt, Henry V would have ranked highly as an effective ruler.

Was the injury an arrow in the face?

There was a documentary a few tears ago which showed how the surgeon had a device made by a blacksmith to help getting the arrow head out. All whilst Henry was lying there in pain and no doubt looking forward to anaesthetic free surgery!

[jillcwhomever]

He also nearly died in battle as a 16 year old, both with the initial injury and the subsequent surgery (that would be highly precarious even with today's technology and skills). IIRC he was also the first King to set English as the working language of the English government, as part of his reforms of government. Even aside from Agincourt, Henry V would have ranked highly as an effective ruler.

I wasn't aware of any of that, thanks. As you say he seems a very interesting and also forward thinking man. It was fascinating in the film where he started from ie, messing about with drinking and the way he just grew into his life as a King. I was especially impressed with how he didn't just go rushing in against the French but was prepared to think about it and make it clear he wasn't going to be pushed around by any of those court advisers before he got to know what they were like.

[Nitramdorf]

Theres an interesting 3 part docudrama on iplayer at the moment. Charles 1st: Downfall of a King.