Topic: Labour Thread * No Gaza *

[Dr. Beaker]

No way I let them run in the next parliament as a labour mp though. But if they have a damascene moment and we can use it to fuck the Tories over? Yes please

They'll soon be in the HoL anyway.

[LuverlyRita]

On one hand, I agree with you.

But on the other hand, people do change their minds. And that can help people who voted Tory last time change their minds too.  And if it helps fuxk up the Tories I can differ them for a few months

Both the Tory and the Labour party are very different beasts to what they were so I guess it is possible to find your political ideals being realigned. On the other hand the grand mistress of changing her mind is............Liz Truss so who knows what goes through the average politican's mind when they decide to change course!

[Libertine]

Sincerely hope this is very targeted to specific seats and doesn't involve focusing on Tory-Leb Dem marginals. Otherwise they'll just be handing seats to the Tories.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/article/2024/may/05/labour-to-target-south-of-england-at-general-election-campaign-chief-says

[oldfordie]

No way I let them run in the next parliament as a labour mp though. But if they have a damascene moment and we can use it to fuck the Tories over? Yes please

Yep, Labour have to explain how they stand on this, it would be a mistake to turn away EX Torys,  the media would spin it as Labour not welcoming ex Torys while the Torys always welcome all voters.
I would let them walk around with the Labour candidates in Tory majority seats.
This just puts more pressure on Sunak to call a election. a ripple turning into a flood of Tory MPs trying to gain some respect for the future for putting the country first. it's boll. but Labour has to be seen welcoming Torys not turning them away.

[Kenny's Jacket]

Dont think Labour should be entertaining too much of this.

I agree, Wakeford was one to cash in on, but then he got selected to run again,  we are supposed to be getting rid of Tories not harbouring them.

[Red Beret]

Sincerely hope this is very targeted to specific seats and doesn't involve focusing on Tory-Leb Dem marginals. Otherwise they'll just be handing seats to the Tories.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/article/2024/may/05/labour-to-target-south-of-england-at-general-election-campaign-chief-says

I would imagine that's what targeting will be all about. Labour isn't going to waste resources in seats where they'll only split the vote. They've not come this far only to do something so braindead.

[Red-Soldier]

Their changing their minds right at the end of this parliament when its likely Labour will win a majority. If they were that way inclined and believed in Labour, they should have made the jump a while ago.

Totally agree.

Politics is full of slippery a-holes.

[Red Beret]

on the issue of more defecting Tories, if it turns out that they have also been in talks for months then I can understand it. But if they have just made a snap decision to switch then I agree with the sentiment that it's too little, too late.

They can sit with the opposition if they wish, but Labour shouldn't be offering them the chance of re-election. They need to prove themselves.

I'm really interested to see if this VoNC goes forward.

[Kashinoda]

Sincerely hope this is very targeted to specific seats and doesn't involve focusing on Tory-Leb Dem marginals. Otherwise they'll just be handing seats to the Tories.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/article/2024/may/05/labour-to-target-south-of-england-at-general-election-campaign-chief-says

Targeting Southend and Basildon is laughable waste of energy to be honest. Southend would need a bigger swing than 1997 where Labour still missed out. Demographically it's become a lot older since then too.

If Labour manage to turn a 100 year old Tory safe seat I'll move back there and dine out on hats for a week.

[spen71]

What’s people’s opinions on Andy Burnham?    Everytime I hear him he comes across well and seems to retain his socialist beliefs

[Red Beret]

What’s people’s opinions on Andy Burnham?    Everytime I hear him he comes across well and seems to retain his socialist beliefs

Man City stooge who has tried (possibly successfully) to influence the investigation into Everton's cheating. Not fussed on him.

[Alan_X]

Some posts deleted. Please try and stay on topic.

For clarity - the deleted post was not reflective of the entire Labour Party.

[filopastry]

Targeting Southend and Basildon is laughable waste of energy to be honest. Southend would need a bigger swing than 1997 where Labour still missed out. Demographically it's become a lot older since then too.

If Labour manage to turn a 100 year old Tory safe seat I'll move back there and dine out on hats for a week.

A lot of the Essex seats feel like the last Tory heartland now

[Statto Red]

A lot of the Essex seats feel like the last Tory heartland now

Why is it all of a sudden i have the Essex Is Crap song from Spitting Image in my mind.

[killer-heels]

I tell you who i feel for in all this, Laura Kuensberg. She is the one that is going to suffer, seeing the party she loves and the contacts she has held close walk right out of office.

[Dr. Beaker]

I tell you who i feel for in all this, Laura Kuensberg. She is the one that is going to suffer, seeing the party she loves and the contacts she has held close walk right out of office.

There's always panto.

[killer-heels]

There's always panto.

Would certainly save the production on make up.

[Dr. Beaker]

Would certainly save the production on make up.

Don't know, wouldn't be easy trying to make her look a bit more human - don't want to scare the kids too much.

[Kenny's Jacket]

Some posts deleted. Please try and stay on topic.

For clarity - the deleted post was not reflective of the entire Labour Party.

Some posters reaction to the deleted tweet means they should be thankful you deleted those. posts

[RedDeadRejection]

What’s people’s opinions on Andy Burnham?    Everytime I hear him he comes across well and seems to retain his socialist beliefs

I like him. If he got in as leader all those years ago, we might have spent less time in the wilderness. More centre then left though.

[LuverlyRita]

What’s people’s opinions on Andy Burnham?    Everytime I hear him he comes across well and seems to retain his socialist beliefs

Agree with Red Beret on his comments re. Burnham's support for Everton's cheating and his ability to look the other way re. the same from City - he's made a complete fool of himself on Twitter. But away from football he seems much more in touch with the electorate - locally and arguably further afield - than those at the top of the party and you could say the same about other Labour mayors.
I was listening to a discussion on the radio about Khan's victory in London. Setting aside that he won some tactical votes from Greens and Lib Dems, it was still an impressive result given the hostile campaign that was waged against him by the far right. They were discussing his policies and the consensus was that people who voted for Khan knew exactly what they were voting for - the supposedly unpopular ULEZ (for which he did not receive absolute backing from Starmer), his calls for closer ties to the EU, an end to the subject-that-cannot-be mentioned etc whereas it is all a bit less clear when it comes to what Starmer stands for.

[Kenny's Jacket]

What’s people’s opinions on Andy Burnham?    Everytime I hear him he comes across well and seems to retain his socialist beliefs

I used to really like him but heard him give an interview where he praised, when asked, the City owners. It was hard to listen too. That said his entire focus is Manchester.

I understand him sticking up for Everton, hes an Everton fan and lets not forget his help with Hillsborough, vocally at least.

[LuverlyRita]

I used to really like him but heard him give an interview where he praised, when asked, the City owners. It was hard to listen too. That said his entire focus is Manchester.

I understand him sticking up for Everton, hes an Everton fan and lets not forget his help with Hillsborough, vocally at least.

I think his help on Hillsborough was important and in stark contrast to the lamentable Jack Straw.

[Wild Romany Boy]

Agree with Red Beret on his comments re. Burnham's support for Everton's cheating and his ability to look the other way re. the same from City - he's made a complete fool of himself on Twitter. But away from football he seems much more in touch with the electorate - locally and arguably further afield - than those at the top of the party and you could say the same about other Labour mayors.
I was listening to a discussion on the radio about Khan's victory in London. Setting aside that he won some tactical votes from Greens and Lib Dems, it was still an impressive result given the hostile campaign that was waged against him by the far right. They were discussing his policies and the consensus was that people who voted for Khan knew exactly what they were voting for - the supposedly unpopular ULEZ (for which he did not receive absolute backing from Starmer), his calls for closer ties to the EU, an end to the subject-that-cannot-be mentioned etc whereas it is all a bit less clear when it comes to what Starmer stands for.

He's not my cup of tea but it's hard to disagree with Khan to be honest. He kept faith and doubled down in the face of immense pressure because he believed it was the right thing to do. And he didn't just receive less than absolute backing from Starmer, he was made the scapegoat for a close by-election loss by him. Khan persevered when he was attacked and, ultimately, I think he has been proven correct.

[jillc]

He's not my cup of tea but it's hard to disagree with Khan to be honest. He kept faith and doubled down in the face of immense pressure because he believed it was the right thing to do. And he didn't just receive less than absolute backing from Starmer, he was made the scapegoat for a close by-election loss by him. Khan persevered when he was attacked and, ultimately, I think he has been proven correct.

He gave a very good speech this morning, even finding time to have a pop at at some horrible group, via Count Binface 

[west_london_red]

He's not my cup of tea but it's hard to disagree with Khan to be honest. He kept faith and doubled down in the face of immense pressure because he believed it was the right thing to do. And he didn't just receive less than absolute backing from Starmer, he was made the scapegoat for a close by-election loss by him. Khan persevered when he was attacked and, ultimately, I think he has been proven correct.

The Uxbridge bye-election was lost because of ULEZ, I don’t think there is any doubt about that so I’m not quite sure how Starmer calling that out is scapegoating if its true?

[Sangria]

The Uxbridge bye-election was lost because of ULEZ, I don’t think there is any doubt about that so I’m not quite sure how Starmer calling that out is scapegoating if its true?

They were both right. ULEZ is effective in reducing emissions in the city. ULEZ affects polling.

[classycarra]

I was listening to a discussion on the radio about Khan's victory in London. Setting aside that he won some tactical votes from Greens and Lib Dems, it was still an impressive result given the hostile campaign that was waged against him by the far right. They were discussing his policies and the consensus was that people who voted for Khan knew exactly what they were voting for - the supposedly unpopular ULEZ (for which he did not receive absolute backing from Starmer), his calls for closer ties to the EU, an end to the subject-that-cannot-be mentioned etc whereas it is all a bit less clear when it comes to what Starmer stands for.

Outside of staying with ULEZ despite a vocal minority, did Khan mention anything to do with London or nah?

All very easy to have a view on a conflict and on the EU, particularly when you know your soundbite is never going to be burdened by being put to the test - but neither are his job.

[LuverlyRita]

The Uxbridge bye-election was lost because of ULEZ, I don’t think there is any doubt about that so I’m not quite sure how Starmer calling that out is scapegoating if its true?

Starmer tried to get him to rethink ULEZ didn't he but later backed Khan's commitment to clear air? That's the problem - it makes Starmer look like he's blowing with the wind and hard to pin down on policies.

[Sammy5IsAlive]

Outside of staying with ULEZ despite a vocal minority, did Khan mention anything to do with London or nah?

All very easy to have a view on a conflict and on the EU, particularly when you know your soundbite is never going to be burdened by being put to the test - but neither are his job.

The EU and in particular the rights of EU nationals to live and work in the UK are very much the business of the mayor of the city with the largest concentration of those people (as well as the largest concentration of young and mobile UK nationals who would benefit from freedom of movement being reintroduced).

I'm not sure I would trumpet his win as anything particularly impressive in contrast to Starmer and the rest of the Labour Party. Against a Tory candidate who was anywhere near electable he might have struggled. In the event he's maintained his vote in a wider context of large swings elsewhere from Tory to Labour.

[west_london_red]

Starmer tried to get him to rethink ULEZ didn't he but later backed Khan's commitment to clear air? That's the problem - it makes Starmer look like he's blowing with the wind and hard to pin down on policies.

I don’t think there’s any debate on that, some of its his fault and could have been avoided, some of it because the Tories have stolen the policy or salted the earth such that Labour won’t be able to deliver the policy.

[classycarra]

I'm not sure I would trumpet his win as anything particularly impressive in contrast to Starmer and the rest of the Labour Party. Against a Tory candidate who was anywhere near electable he might have struggled. In the event he's maintained his vote in a wider context of large swings elsewhere from Tory to Labour.

Same here

The EU and in particular the rights of EU nationals to live and work in the UK are very much the business of the mayor of the city with the largest concentration of those people (as well as the largest concentration of young and mobile UK nationals who would benefit from freedom of movement being reintroduced).

Yep, no doubt. Have many friends here who've had to do all the indefinite leave to remain/citizenship type hoops, and being the EU wellbeing champs at their workplaces etc. I'm just a little confused what Khan's doing on the EU in 2024 and beyond? Constituency MPs help those in their locality during local surgeries with (for one example) migration/visa related issues. Don't know what exactly he's prioritising here.

[Kashinoda]

A lot of the Essex seats feel like the last Tory heartland now

I grew up there and can't quite articulate why Labour never gets a sniff.

A lot of my family were in unions and voted Labour having worked as tradesmen or in the postal service, that seemed common growing up and it's a largely working class area. They have gravitated towards Reform and the like now but the percentage splits each GE don't seem to budge.

The areas are very diprived, Southend alone has 25% of people living in the worst 20% of diprived areas in England. I'm not sure what the Tories have ever really done that's ever really made a difference.

[Sangria]

I grew up there and can't quite articulate why Labour never gets a sniff.

A lot of my family were in unions and voted Labour having worked as tradesmen or in the postal service, that seemed common growing up and it's a largely working class area. They have gravitated towards Reform and the like now but the percentage splits each GE don't seem to budge.

The areas are very diprived, Southend alone has 25% of people living in the worst 20% of diprived areas in England. I'm not sure what the Tories have ever really done that's ever really made a difference.

Thatcher is their model of what a politician should be. Start with that understanding.

[Red-Soldier]

I grew up there and can't quite articulate why Labour never gets a sniff.

A lot of my family were in unions and voted Labour having worked as tradesmen or in the postal service, that seemed common growing up and it's a largely working class area. They have gravitated towards Reform and the like now but the percentage splits each GE don't seem to budge.

The areas are very diprived, Southend alone has 25% of people living in the worst 20% of diprived areas in England. I'm not sure what the Tories have ever really done that's ever really made a difference.

As Sangria said, many of them loved/love Thatcher..

[LuverlyRita]

I grew up there and can't quite articulate why Labour never gets a sniff.

A lot of my family were in unions and voted Labour having worked as tradesmen or in the postal service, that seemed common growing up and it's a largely working class area. They have gravitated towards Reform and the like now but the percentage splits each GE don't seem to budge.

The areas are very diprived, Southend alone has 25% of people living in the worst 20% of diprived areas in England. I'm not sure what the Tories have ever really done that's ever really made a difference.

Had a chat with someone who you'd expect to be a Labour voter but who regards Thatcher as a hero and it was down to one reason - the great council house sell-off. He freely admitted that he'd never have been able to afford his own home if he'd not been given the opportunity to purchase one at below market value. I pointed out to him that his council house had been there for him when he needed somewhere decent at an affordable rent in which to bring up his young family and that such properties were no longer available to the next generation but he just shrugged his shoulders. Sadly what Thatcher did was to target the selfish streak in the population and she appears to have bought their souls lock, stock and barrel

[classycarra]

Some posters reaction to the deleted tweet means they should be thankful you deleted those. posts

think it's fair to say that you might be being unfair to the poster who pointed out that the weirdos circulating that video in a coordinated way might have had ulterior motives - as it happens, they did. slurring the Labour party and whipping up hatred and threats against a teacher out canvassing - fucking scumbags

think it's worth sharing details about the false claim (see article below), and the consequences of it for the poor woman - who was out trying to get the midlands a Labour mayor - if only as a reminder that you shouldn't take everything you read on social media. especially within a little bubble of people affirming one another unquestioningly, like those Newham numpties

Teacher's 'life blown apart' in onslaught of hate as false racism claim goes viral
https://www.birminghammail.co.uk/news/midlands-news/teachers-life-blown-apart-onslaught-29128108

By the way, that fucking prick Yakoob (the one who thinks violence against women is funny) has left this on his social media after doxxing her and the school she works at, to whip up threats and disruption. Prick shouldn't be near any democratic positions.

[Kashinoda]

Had a chat with someone who you'd expect to be a Labour voter but who regards Thatcher as a hero and it was down to one reason - the great council house sell-off. He freely admitted that he'd never have been able to afford his own home if he'd not been given the opportunity to purchase one at below market value. I pointed out to him that his council house had been there for him when he needed somewhere decent at an affordable rent in which to bring up his young family and that such properties were no longer available to the next generation but he just shrugged his shoulders. Sadly what Thatcher did was to target the selfish streak in the population and she appears to have bought their souls lock, stock and barrel

Probably a large swathe of those now bemoan millenials as not working hard enough to get a mortgage.

Found a good Wiki article on the Essex thing https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Essex_man

Adds some context to some Spitting Image sketches from back in the day

Moved to Brighton last year, has it's problems and rent takes the piss but think I'll be here long term.

[cornishscouser92]

think it's fair to say that you might be being unfair to the poster who pointed out that the weirdos circulating that video in a coordinated way might have had ulterior motives - as it happens, they did. slurring the Labour party and whipping up hatred and threats against a teacher out canvassing - fucking scumbags

think it's worth sharing details about the false claim (see article below), and the consequences of it for the poor woman - who was out trying to get the midlands a Labour mayor - if only as a reminder that you shouldn't take everything you read on social media. especially within a little bubble of people affirming one another unquestioningly, like those Newham numpties

Teacher's 'life blown apart' in onslaught of hate as false racism claim goes viral
https://www.birminghammail.co.uk/news/midlands-news/teachers-life-blown-apart-onslaught-29128108

By the way, that fucking prick Yakoob (the one who thinks violence against women is funny) has left this on his social media after doxxing her and the school she works at, to whip up threats and disruption. Prick shouldn't be near any democratic positions.

Him and that Lowkey on twitter are the same. Lowkey was calling out "Labour supporters who drove into campaigners from Galloway's Workers Party" despite there being no evidence of their political affiliations. The hard left are absolutely vile.

[Lisan Al Gaib]

think it's fair to say that you might be being unfair to the poster who pointed out that the weirdos circulating that video in a coordinated way might have had ulterior motives - as it happens, they did. slurring the Labour party and whipping up hatred and threats against a teacher out canvassing - fucking scumbags

think it's worth sharing details about the false claim (see article below), and the consequences of it for the poor woman - who was out trying to get the midlands a Labour mayor - if only as a reminder that you shouldn't take everything you read on social media. especially within a little bubble of people affirming one another unquestioningly, like those Newham numpties

Teacher's 'life blown apart' in onslaught of hate as false racism claim goes viral
https://www.birminghammail.co.uk/news/midlands-news/teachers-life-blown-apart-onslaught-29128108

By the way, that fucking prick Yakoob (the one who thinks violence against women is funny) has left this on his social media after doxxing her and the school she works at, to whip up threats and disruption. Prick shouldn't be near any democratic positions.

Its the bitterness of people who hate that Labour are now an electable force again after years of being of no use whatsoever just jumping on absolutely anything and everything they can to criticise them.