Author Topic: Labour Thread * No Gaza *  (Read 219860 times)

Offline Jshooters

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Re: Labour Thread * No Gaza *
« Reply #4560 on: July 6, 2024, 03:34:27 pm »
Lammy has started to lay the ground work in hisrelationship with the United States. On a trip to Washington last month, Lammy spoke at the Hudson Institute where he described  himself as a "good Christian" and "small-c conservative" who had common cause with the U.S. Republican Party.


Yeah who wants the head of the FCO to display skills in diplomacy with the potential US president’s party?

Much better to call them all racist backwards thinking c*nts
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Re: Labour Thread * No Gaza *
« Reply #4561 on: July 6, 2024, 03:41:37 pm »
Yeah who wants the head of the FCO to display skills in diplomacy with the potential US president’s party?

Much better to call them all racist backwards thinking c*nts
'
Brilliant post full of nuance
when is he going to Beijing to express his admiration for one party states ?
As I've said before, the Full English is just the base upon which the Scots/Welsh/NI have improved upon. Sorry but the Full English is the worst of the British breakfasts.

Offline Red Beret

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Re: Labour Thread * No Gaza *
« Reply #4562 on: July 6, 2024, 03:57:55 pm »
 ::)
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Re: Labour Thread * No Gaza *
« Reply #4563 on: July 6, 2024, 04:04:03 pm »
The focus is on Starmer but I am so glad the deputy PM is a working class woman who said Torys are scumbags

I'm giving this govt a chance. We all should. Because reversing decline takes time and energy.

Judge it on actions, not presumptions

That said, I ain't gonna stop reading London Playbook twice a day and Private Eye to soak up all the government news I can. I don't want to feel betrayed (even though following politics = betrayal)

Offline filopastry

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Re: Labour Thread * No Gaza *
« Reply #4564 on: July 6, 2024, 04:38:05 pm »
Ignoring the policy stuff which is largely still to come anyway, and a lot of that will flow from what Labour is able to do on taxation on the autumn, but the one thing which I do think Starmer very much means and is very much needed is the focus on standards in office.

We have had far too much corruption in office and had govt scrambling around trying to protect the offenders, so that it felt like it was tolerated, if that can stop it is a massive step forward.

Offline Jshooters

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Re: Labour Thread * No Gaza *
« Reply #4565 on: July 6, 2024, 04:46:26 pm »
'
Brilliant post full of nuance
when is he going to Beijing to express his admiration for one party states ?

Ok so how should he have played it? He’s clearly making some initial diplomatic inroads with the Republican Party in the knowledge that he was going to be appointed sec of state and that Trump has, unfortunately, a decent chance of winning in November. So he’s pandered to them a bit saying that he’s a Christian and he shares some unnamed values with the Republican Party.

Surely that’s diplomacy 101 with such an important ally on the world stage? In all likelihood he despises them (he certainly does trump as his past comments attest to) but needs to attempt to find some common ground. Or at least give the impression that he thinks there is
Believer

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Re: Labour Thread * No Gaza *
« Reply #4566 on: July 6, 2024, 05:00:41 pm »
Ok so how should he have played it? He’s clearly making some initial diplomatic inroads with the Republican Party in the knowledge that he was going to be appointed sec of state and that Trump has, unfortunately, a decent chance of winning in November. So he’s pandered to them a bit saying that he’s a Christian and he shares some unnamed values with the Republican Party.

Surely that’s diplomacy 101 with such an important ally on the world stage? In all likelihood he despises them (he certainly does trump as his past comments attest to) but needs to attempt to find some common ground. Or at least give the impression that he thinks there is

It’s easy to cherry pick points that support disdain for the Government but when to read the whole article you could also choose to pick out he following;

“ And I share something deep with millions of Americans because if I have the privilege to be the next UK foreign secretary, I will be the first to be able to trace my lineage back through the Atlantic slave trade.”.

That wouldn’t go down so well with some of the Republican audience.

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Re: Labour Thread * No Gaza *
« Reply #4567 on: July 6, 2024, 05:15:07 pm »
Ok so how should he have played it? He’s clearly making some initial diplomatic inroads with the Republican Party in the knowledge that he was going to be appointed sec of state and that Trump has, unfortunately, a decent chance of winning in November. So he’s pandered to them a bit saying that he’s a Christian and he shares some unnamed values with the Republican Party.

Surely that’s diplomacy 101 with such an important ally on the world stage? In all likelihood he despises them (he certainly does trump as his past comments attest to) but needs to attempt to find some common ground. Or at least give the impression that he thinks there is

Something like common values, special relationship etc, etc
but he's declared himself a conservative who shares values with an awful group of people.   



As I've said before, the Full English is just the base upon which the Scots/Welsh/NI have improved upon. Sorry but the Full English is the worst of the British breakfasts.

Offline oldfordie

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Re: Labour Thread * No Gaza *
« Reply #4568 on: July 6, 2024, 05:36:30 pm »
It’s easy to cherry pick points that support disdain for the Government but when to read the whole article you could also choose to pick out he following;

“ And I share something deep with millions of Americans because if I have the privilege to be the next UK foreign secretary, I will be the first to be able to trace my lineage back through the Atlantic slave trade.”.

That wouldn’t go down so well with some of the Republican audience.
Shouldn't Labour invite Trump to visit Parliament as a guest, we have to talk to people we disagree with they are our friends after all.
« Last Edit: July 6, 2024, 05:43:48 pm by oldfordie »
@AndyDavidson14
On reflection, it was a brilliant move of Clacton to make Frottage their MP. They’re the only town in the UK unlikely to ever see the f*cker.

Offline Red Beret

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Re: Labour Thread * No Gaza *
« Reply #4569 on: July 6, 2024, 06:09:53 pm »
Shouldn't Labour invite Trump to visit Parliament as a guest, we have to talk to people we disagree with they are our friends after all.

We have no choice but to deal with Republicans in general. Shouldn't deal with Trump until we have to though.

Sad fact is that being outside the EU leaves the UK vulnerable to being strong armed on trade talks and other policies. Some amount of pants dropping and bending over is going to be inevitable.
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Offline classycarra

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Re: Labour Thread * No Gaza *
« Reply #4570 on: July 6, 2024, 06:12:28 pm »
Maybe we need a separate "Lefties who hate Labour" thread, seeing as all they see are Red Tories?
labour and the country have just done a great job of disassociating from them already ;)

everyone else can enjoy the new change in government while they whinge in their bubble about vote shares, 'winning the argument' and crowing about Islington North

Offline oldfordie

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Re: Labour Thread * No Gaza *
« Reply #4571 on: July 6, 2024, 06:29:27 pm »
We have no choice but to deal with Republicans in general. Shouldn't deal with Trump until we have to though.

Sad fact is that being outside the EU leaves the UK vulnerable to being strong armed on trade talks and other policies. Some amount of pants dropping and bending over is going to be inevitable.
  :) Yeah. Labour have no choice,  just a reminder of others who did have a choice meeting people who wanted to harm us using the excuse of we have to talk to people we disagree with.
@AndyDavidson14
On reflection, it was a brilliant move of Clacton to make Frottage their MP. They’re the only town in the UK unlikely to ever see the f*cker.

Offline Sangria

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Re: Labour Thread * No Gaza *
« Reply #4572 on: July 6, 2024, 06:45:22 pm »
It’s easy to cherry pick points that support disdain for the Government but when to read the whole article you could also choose to pick out he following;

“ And I share something deep with millions of Americans because if I have the privilege to be the next UK foreign secretary, I will be the first to be able to trace my lineage back through the Atlantic slave trade.”.

That wouldn’t go down so well with some of the Republican audience.

Liverpool and Manchester absolutely adored the first Republican ex-President to visit these shores. In particular with regard to the history of slaves.
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Offline Hark the Howard Angels Sing

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Re: Labour Thread * No Gaza *
« Reply #4573 on: July 6, 2024, 06:54:08 pm »
Liverpool and Manchester absolutely adored the first Republican ex-President to visit these shores. In particular with regard to the history of slaves.

Who was that?

I take it he didn’t visit the Confederacy consul’s office in Rumford Place or Camell Lairds when they building the CSS Alabama? ;D

Offline Red Beret

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Re: Labour Thread * No Gaza *
« Reply #4574 on: July 6, 2024, 07:04:50 pm »
  :) Yeah. Labour have no choice,  just a reminder of others who did have a choice meeting people who wanted to harm us using the excuse of we have to talk to people we disagree with.

I'm lucky. I get to call a gobshite a gobshite. But then I never aspired to public office either. I'd have to stick forks in my leg dealing with some of these bastards :D
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Offline west_london_red

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Re: Labour Thread * No Gaza *
« Reply #4575 on: July 6, 2024, 07:12:47 pm »
Sad fact is that being outside the EU leaves the UK vulnerable to being strong armed on trade talks and other policies. Some amount of pants dropping and bending over is going to be inevitable.

What do you mean? We hold all the cards!
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Offline Sangria

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Re: Labour Thread * No Gaza *
« Reply #4576 on: July 6, 2024, 07:19:25 pm »
Who was that?

I take it he didn’t visit the Confederacy consul’s office in Rumford Place or Camell Lairds when they building the CSS Alabama? ;D

Ulysses Grant. The settling of the Alabama issue was one of the highlights of his presidency, pioneering multi-lateral negotiations to settle disagreements between 2 countries (he extrapolated from that to dream of an international body that would have the authority to settle such disputes). The extremely cordial relations between the US and the UK resulting from that may be argued to be the beginnings of the "Special Relationship", especially as Grant described it in terms of the relationship between the Anglophonic countries.

Grant defined his presidency mainly in terms of defending his Republican party's liberation of the southern slaves (achieved under Lincoln), and making them equal to whites (the dominant direction of his presidency), defending them against the efforts of the Democrats to roll this back. It's arguable that no US president was as much an defender and advancer of civil rights as Grant until Lyndon Johnson, nearly a century later. And as such, he was idollised when he came over here.
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Offline Red Beret

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Re: Labour Thread * No Gaza *
« Reply #4577 on: July 6, 2024, 07:41:59 pm »
What do you mean? We hold all the cards!

And they're all jokers!
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Offline oldfordie

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Re: Labour Thread * No Gaza *
« Reply #4578 on: July 6, 2024, 07:44:45 pm »
I'm lucky. I get to call a gobshite a gobshite. But then I never aspired to public office either. I'd have to stick forks in my leg dealing with some of these bastards :D
  At least your not one of those all Politicians are Gobshites all the samers  :)
@AndyDavidson14
On reflection, it was a brilliant move of Clacton to make Frottage their MP. They’re the only town in the UK unlikely to ever see the f*cker.

Offline Hark the Howard Angels Sing

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Re: Labour Thread * No Gaza *
« Reply #4579 on: July 6, 2024, 07:47:39 pm »
Ulysses Grant. The settling of the Alabama issue was one of the highlights of his presidency, pioneering multi-lateral negotiations to settle disagreements between 2 countries (he extrapolated from that to dream of an international body that would have the authority to settle such disputes). The extremely cordial relations between the US and the UK resulting from that may be argued to be the beginnings of the "Special Relationship", especially as Grant described it in terms of the relationship between the Anglophonic countries.

Grant defined his presidency mainly in terms of defending his Republican party's liberation of the southern slaves (achieved under Lincoln), and making them equal to whites (the dominant direction of his presidency), defending them against the efforts of the Democrats to roll this back. It's arguable that no US president was as much an defender and advancer of civil rights as Grant until Lyndon Johnson, nearly a century later. And as such, he was idollised when he came over here.

Thanks for that.

And didn’t Grant send Federal troops back into the Southern states to prevent attacks on freed slaves after Andrew Johnson had basically abandoned them?

Not bad for an ex shop owner with an alcohol problem. ;D

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Re: Labour Thread * No Gaza *
« Reply #4580 on: July 6, 2024, 07:48:04 pm »
What do you mean? We hold all the cards!

My cup, it runneth over, I'll never get my fill

Offline Sangria

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Re: Labour Thread * No Gaza *
« Reply #4581 on: July 6, 2024, 08:26:12 pm »
Thanks for that.

And didn’t Grant send Federal troops back into the Southern states to prevent attacks on freed slaves after Andrew Johnson had basically abandoned them?

Not bad for an ex shop owner with an alcohol problem. ;D

Yup. White men with hoods and masks obscuring their features (aka the KKK) were murdering blacks and reconstructers, and southern civil authorities weren't inclined to stop them, so he sent in troops and military governers to enforce federal laws allowing blacks to vote free from threats and prosecute the mobs' ringleaders.

Realised something when reading about that period. An "unreconstructed racist" is someone who rejects Reconstruction's efforts to recognise blacks as equal to whites. And that my understanding of what "carpetbaggers" were was defined by southern writers. Although Grant's memoirs gave me an early definition of what "poor white trash" (sic) was, which was white southerners who worked the land and were too poor to afford slaves to work it for them. And his bewilderment at why they were so militant in defending the slavery status quo, when it contributed to their impoverished state. Which is roughly equivalent to how we on the left are bewildered by the working class's fondness for privileged right wing leaders.
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Offline TSC

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Re: Labour Thread * No Gaza *
« Reply #4582 on: July 6, 2024, 08:38:47 pm »
Got so much of a majority Labour can do to whatever it chooses.   Bring It on

Offline killer-heels

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Re: Labour Thread * No Gaza *
« Reply #4583 on: July 6, 2024, 08:57:20 pm »
Got so much of a majority Labour can do to whatever it chooses.   Bring It on

Important that they use it. There are loads they can change without spending any money.

Offline Red-Soldier

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Re: Labour Thread * No Gaza *
« Reply #4584 on: July 6, 2024, 08:59:37 pm »
Important that they use it. There are loads they can change without spending any money.

Yep.  Be interesting to see, what they do.

Offline classycarra

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Re: Labour Thread * No Gaza *
« Reply #4585 on: July 6, 2024, 09:22:53 pm »
Yep.  Be interesting to see, what they do.
Already achieved more in a day - killing Rwanda bill - than many of their critics on the left said they would achieve in their time in government. Good start

Offline oldfordie

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Re: Labour Thread * No Gaza *
« Reply #4586 on: July 6, 2024, 09:29:45 pm »
Owen Jones 4pm Friday.  Labour have a massive majority, they can do as they please, we are watching.

Owen Jones, 4pm Saturday. Love the new Labour Cabinet. some real talent. gives you confidence for the future.

Sorry correction, that was Ewan Jones from Wallasey who said that. :)
« Last Edit: July 6, 2024, 09:34:39 pm by oldfordie »
@AndyDavidson14
On reflection, it was a brilliant move of Clacton to make Frottage their MP. They’re the only town in the UK unlikely to ever see the f*cker.

Offline Red Beret

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Re: Labour Thread * No Gaza *
« Reply #4587 on: July 6, 2024, 09:43:32 pm »
Already achieved more in a day - killing Rwanda bill - than many of their critics on the left said they would achieve in their time in government. Good start

The Rwanda bill was passed into law, yes? Will Labour table legislation to nullify it, or just leave it on the books as a dead law?
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Offline Ernie Clicker

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Re: Labour Thread * No Gaza *
« Reply #4588 on: July 6, 2024, 10:00:48 pm »
Something like common values, special relationship etc, etc
but he's declared himself a conservative who shares values with an awful group of people.   
I don't know the full background to all of this but I do know Lammy is the 'go to' person for commentary on UK politics from the fully left leaning Pod Save America podcast crew. He's appeared on their show many times, anyone in the US following UK politics will be aware of it, so whatever he's said I suspect he's playing politics.

Offline Circa1892

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Re: Labour Thread * No Gaza *
« Reply #4589 on: July 6, 2024, 10:18:16 pm »
Owen Jones 4pm Friday.  Labour have a massive majority, they can do as they please, we are watching.

Owen Jones, 4pm Saturday. Love the new Labour Cabinet. some real talent. gives you confidence for the future.

Sorry correction, that was Ewan Jones from Wallasey who said that. :)


A period of silence from that boring c*nt is so far overdue

Offline Red-Soldier

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Re: Labour Thread * No Gaza *
« Reply #4590 on: July 6, 2024, 10:35:28 pm »
Already achieved more in a day - killing Rwanda bill - than many of their critics on the left said they would achieve in their time in government. Good start

Did you manage to volunteer at the election, to help your local CLP?
« Last Edit: July 6, 2024, 10:43:02 pm by Red-Soldier »

Offline classycarra

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Re: Labour Thread * No Gaza *
« Reply #4591 on: July 6, 2024, 11:53:50 pm »
Did you manage to volunteer at the election, to help your local CLP?
as it happens i'm not allowed to go out publicly campaigning in my job, so no i didn't in my incredibly safe labour seat. however given the brilliant election campaign Labour just ran to near perfection, my understanding from friends is that they wouldn't have wanted me to and instead they'd have sent me to the next key battleground constituency. they 'twinned' safe seats with battlegrounds and so shared the activists and resources between them.

this is part of how they've just so successfully won such a gigantic majority - and in doing so, how they afforded certain types of vocal 'i want labour to do x and y, because thats what i think labour should do.. but no i don't and won't vote labour why do you ask' the luxury of voting green or independent or one of the mad commie/tankie acronym ones. (paging Nobby ;) ) they managed to successfully appeal to a broad range of people, rather than stacking up tens of thousands of votes in metro cities or posh university towns like the last couple of elections.

were you out volunteering locally, or is your area a battleground itself? well done on the result getting labour MP elected!

it's been a great long weekend!
« Last Edit: July 7, 2024, 12:00:03 am by classycarra »

Offline oldfordie

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Re: Labour Thread * No Gaza *
« Reply #4592 on: July 7, 2024, 12:07:02 am »
 :)

Marina Purkiss reposted
Will Sebag-Montefiore | Edinburgh Fringe

Disgusting that Keir is holding a meeting here when he knows full well these rooms are traditionally reserved for parties.
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@AndyDavidson14
On reflection, it was a brilliant move of Clacton to make Frottage their MP. They’re the only town in the UK unlikely to ever see the f*cker.

Offline west_london_red

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Re: Labour Thread * No Gaza *
« Reply #4593 on: July 7, 2024, 12:29:00 am »
I was channel surfing and ended up watching a repeat of Have I Got News For You on Dave and they were talking about this story:

Robert Jenrick admits approving funds for town in Jake Berry’s constituency

https://amp.theguardian.com/politics/2020/oct/11/robert-jenrick-admits-approving-funds-for-town-in-jake-berrys-constituency

So ministers can’t approve grants to their own constituency so Jenrick approved money for Berry’s constituency and guess who approved the grant for Jenricks constituency…

Labour called for an investigation but it didn’t happen and I don’t remember this story getting much coverage but maybe everyone was busy with Covid.

So when people say things won’t change under a Labour government and they are all the same, putting an end to shit like this will be a huge step forward.
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Offline LFC_R_BOSS

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Re: Labour Thread * No Gaza *
« Reply #4594 on: July 7, 2024, 04:00:05 am »
I’m not sure about the “vast majority” but some form of practical measures to help the alcohol and drug addicted rather than jail would be a good start.

A third . He thinks a 3rd of them in jail shouldn’t be in there and I agree . Talking to my cousins feller about this tonight who ended up locked up recently. He was saying some come out homeless and literally get locked straight back up for somewhere to sleep.
Should be more community programs with training. Nobody should leave jail homeless. Getting James Timpson on board just fills me with hope that the people in power are actually governing and not just using their position as a lobbyist.  Fingers crossed for the future

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Re: Labour Thread * No Gaza *
« Reply #4595 on: July 7, 2024, 06:51:46 am »
I was channel surfing and ended up watching a repeat of Have I Got News For You on Dave and they were talking about this story:

Robert Jenrick admits approving funds for town in Jake Berry’s constituency

https://amp.theguardian.com/politics/2020/oct/11/robert-jenrick-admits-approving-funds-for-town-in-jake-berrys-constituency

So ministers can’t approve grants to their own constituency so Jenrick approved money for Berry’s constituency and guess who approved the grant for Jenricks constituency…

Labour called for an investigation but it didn’t happen and I don’t remember this story getting much coverage but maybe everyone was busy with Covid.

So when people say things won’t change under a Labour government and they are all the same, putting an end to shit like this will be a huge step forward.
I agree to a degree, but I think we will benefit a lot more from labour focussing on what's good for the country, rather than the party. Helping people rather than chasing votes. 
"All the lads have been talking about is walking out in front of the Kop, with 40,000 singing 'You'll Never Walk Alone'," Collins told BBC Radio Solent. "All the money in the world couldn't buy that feeling," he added.

Offline Hark the Howard Angels Sing

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Re: Labour Thread * No Gaza *
« Reply #4596 on: July 7, 2024, 09:19:42 am »
I was channel surfing and ended up watching a repeat of Have I Got News For You on Dave and they were talking about this story:

Robert Jenrick admits approving funds for town in Jake Berry’s constituency

https://amp.theguardian.com/politics/2020/oct/11/robert-jenrick-admits-approving-funds-for-town-in-jake-berrys-constituency

So ministers can’t approve grants to their own constituency so Jenrick approved money for Berry’s constituency and guess who approved the grant for Jenricks constituency…

Labour called for an investigation but it didn’t happen and I don’t remember this story getting much coverage but maybe everyone was busy with Covid.

So when people say things won’t change under a Labour government and they are all the same, putting an end to shit like this will be a huge step forward.

Not the least of Jenrick’s dodgy dealing either. In fact at least some local communities may have benefited there but only a multi millionaire Tory donor benefited here;
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/robert-jenrick-richard-desmond-housing-tory-donor-westferry-a9631876.html

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Re: Labour Thread * No Gaza *
« Reply #4597 on: July 7, 2024, 10:12:01 am »
I’m not sure about the “vast majority” but some form of practical measures to help the alcohol and drug addicted rather than jail would be a good start.

The 'traditional' methods of reducing crime, do not work.

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Re: Labour Thread * No Gaza *
« Reply #4598 on: July 7, 2024, 10:14:01 am »
<a href="https://www.youtube.com/v/IhxlJgWxU9U" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer" class="bbc_link bbc_flash_disabled new_win">https://www.youtube.com/v/IhxlJgWxU9U</a>

Labour mean business.

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Re: Labour Thread * No Gaza *
« Reply #4599 on: July 7, 2024, 10:21:51 am »
<a href="https://www.youtube.com/v/IhxlJgWxU9U" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer" class="bbc_link bbc_flash_disabled new_win">https://www.youtube.com/v/IhxlJgWxU9U</a>

Labour mean business.

Great to see Vallance and Timpson, in there.

Nice to have a serious, grown up, government, for a change.