Topic: Coutinho

[LFC UNTIL THE MANAGER IS NO LONGER DESERVING OF MY SYMPATHY]

De Gea has been the best player this season for me.  When Man U were really struggling he was the one making the difference with his saves.  He had more impact on his team than any player IMO.

Coutinho has been great the last two or three months.  Certainly our best player in that time.  But over the course of the season?  I'm not sure he's been our best player.  For me it has probably been Sterling.  I think he was the player who changed our season when we were really struggling both defensively and even creating chances in attack.  When Sterling went upfront vs Man U, instead of seeing Balotelli or Lambert, we went from a side that couldn't create chances to one which was creating many.  His finishing needs to improve, as shown in that Man U game.  But the timing of his runs, the energy, the willingness to always run behind oppositions defences as well as drop off - gave the opposition nightmares and suddenly Coutinho / Lallana and Henderson had movement for their passes to hit. 

I know everyone seems to be down on Sterling at the moment given his contract situation, amongst other things such as being in the front of papers today.  But at 20 he is frightening good and for him to change our season by playing out of position getting our side from being a non threat to one where we look a real threat shows what a special young player he is.

[sattapaartridge]

I am not fussed about assist stat's. Henderson's stats look great but I wouldn't have him in many, if any of the top sides in this league. But my point was that Coutinho is made to look shitter due to our lack of goals. He and his play will never really be fully appreciated until our team is regularly scoring because the stuff he does and the space he creates is only really looked at as productive if we actually score.

Anyone who plays the game will appreciate what Coutinho can do with a football. Some of the touches, the flicks, the dribbles are what makes kids want to be footballers. Dirk Kuyt has more assists and goals than John Barnes, but every kid would rather be John Barnes wouldnt they? Or is that just me.

Coutinho isnt being made to look shit. He's been made to look top class with vital goals for us in the FA Cup and some glorious skill. Appreciate him while you can.

[rickardinho1]

The thread title has forgotten to specify "2015-2016 season"

[kkjellquist]

I'm more worried about a massive offer on the table for Coutinho than anyone else.  It's obvious he could boss midfield for a big money team w/ star forwards needing passes fed forward.

[slaphead]

He's honestly the only player I can think of in the league that actually makes me laugh watching him play at times, like last night when he done that flick.
Theres a ton of players I enjoy watching, but there's only been a few in the last years that make me laugh when watching them play

[Redman0151]

I'm more worried about a massive offer on the table for Coutinho than anyone else.  It's obvious he could boss midfield for a big money team w/ star forwards needing passes fed forward.

He just signed a new contract, hard to imagine us selling him unless somebody puts in an absolutely ridiculous offer. Chelsea have Fabregas, City want to focus on English players apparently, Real have Isco, and Barca are banned.

Hard to imagine anybody serious coming for him

[Shaved Crossbar]

I'm more worried about a massive offer on the table for Coutinho than anyone else.  It's obvious he could boss midfield for a big money team w/ star forwards needing passes fed forward.

Luckily for us, 'creative attacking midfielder' is probably the position blessed with the most quality players in world football, and at the top teams as well. Also luckily for us, he signed a new contract with no fuss at all, being paid probably less than he should be. And I believe he wouldn't move to another team in England. That means to take a step up, he'd have to move abroad, and there's not too many options available to him; he's already flopped in Italy, and PSG don't play with a playmaker; look at how Pastore has been marginalised despite playing well (and Cout wouldn't be ahead of Pastore or Moura anyway). He probably doesn't fit into Atleti's ethos either.

That means he has to displace Messi, James and Isco, or a whole host of versatile players better than him at Bayern, though mainly Mario Gotze.

Quite frankly, he's nowhere near the quality of those players right now, just because he doesn't have the end product. We're probably not at risk for another few seasons.

[Dubred]

Luckily for us, 'creative attacking midfielder' is probably the position blessed with the most quality players in world football, and at the top teams as well. Also luckily for us, he signed a new contract with no fuss at all, being paid probably less than he should be. And I believe he wouldn't move to another team in England. That means to take a step up, he'd have to move abroad, and there's not too many options available to him; he's already flopped in Italy, and PSG don't play with a playmaker; look at how Pastore has been marginalised despite playing well (and Cout wouldn't be ahead of Pastore or Moura anyway). He probably doesn't fit into Atleti's ethos either.

That means he has to displace Messi, James and Isco, or a whole host of versatile players better than him at Bayern, though mainly Mario Gotze.

Quite frankly, he's nowhere near the quality of those players right now, just because he doesn't have the end product. We're probably not at risk for another few seasons.

Would agree.

He's perfect for our team right now but I'm not sure he'd make it at one of the bigger teams at the moment.

Looks like he's happy to stay here for now anyway.

[slaphead]

Luckily for us, 'creative attacking midfielder' is probably the position blessed with the most quality players in world football, and at the top teams as well. Also luckily for us, he signed a new contract with no fuss at all, being paid probably less than he should be. And I believe he wouldn't move to another team in England. That means to take a step up, he'd have to move abroad, and there's not too many options available to him; he's already flopped in Italy, and PSG don't play with a playmaker; look at how Pastore has been marginalised despite playing well (and Cout wouldn't be ahead of Pastore or Moura anyway). He probably doesn't fit into Atleti's ethos either.

That means he has to displace Messi, James and Isco, or a whole host of versatile players better than him at Bayern, though mainly Mario Gotze.

Quite frankly, he's nowhere near the quality of those players right now, just because he doesn't have the end product. We're probably not at risk for another few seasons.

Bit unfair, but I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and assume that was just a figure of speech rather than him really being a flop 
Didn't he leave Italy at 19 or something ?  cant really call someone a flop at that stage in their career.

[Ron]

De Gea has been the best player this season for me.  When Man U were really struggling he was the one making the difference with his saves.  He had more impact on his team than any player IMO.

Yeah, have to agree with that.

[kkjellquist]

Luckily for us, 'creative attacking midfielder' is probably the position blessed with the most quality players in world football, and at the top teams as well. Also luckily for us, he signed a new contract with no fuss at all, being paid probably less than he should be. And I believe he wouldn't move to another team in England. That means to take a step up, he'd have to move abroad, and there's not too many options available to him; he's already flopped in Italy, and PSG don't play with a playmaker; look at how Pastore has been marginalised despite playing well (and Cout wouldn't be ahead of Pastore or Moura anyway). He probably doesn't fit into Atleti's ethos either.

That means he has to displace Messi, James and Isco, or a whole host of versatile players better than him at Bayern, though mainly Mario Gotze.

Quite frankly, he's nowhere near the quality of those players right now, just because he doesn't have the end product. We're probably not at risk for another few seasons.

Good points indeed, except the flop in Italy part...I recall the knowledgeable Inter fans being upset with the sale. 

[Shaved Crossbar]

Bit unfair, but I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and assume that was just a figure of speech rather than him really being a flop 
Didn't he leave Italy at 19 or something ?  cant really call someone a flop at that stage in their career.

Yeah, not an actual flop. Although it's been commented before that he suits England much more, the emphasis on slower build up and nuanced play and positional rigidity and twin DMs and generally better defences etc in Italy didn't suit him or his development as much. The only club there that's a step up from us currently is Juve and they probably wouldn't be able to sign him for a few years, even if they did want to, imo.

[Coolie High]

Coutinho would start ahead of Pastore and Moura in number 10.

[houkura]

Yeah, not an actual flop. Although it's been commented before that he suits England much more, the emphasis on slower build up and nuanced play and positional rigidity and twin DMs and generally better defences etc in Italy didn't suit him or his development as much. The only club there that's a step up from us currently is Juve and they probably wouldn't be able to sign him for a few years, even if they did want to, imo.

He barely played, mostly as a sub and was 18 years old. He went to Espanyol and had a successful loan there and then was sold to Liverpool. Not even close to a flop in Italy. I think he would be excellent in Italy now--of course I hope he never plays there again unless it's with Liverpool in a European match.

[markedasred]

Several outlets now reporting John Terry has nominated Couthino as PFA Player of the Year.

John Terry POTY mouth.

[CHOPPER]

John Terry is POTY, for me.

[SlowRap]

He just signed a new contract, hard to imagine us selling him unless somebody puts in an absolutely ridiculous offer. Chelsea have Fabregas, City want to focus on English players apparently, Real have Isco, and Barca are banned.

Hard to imagine anybody serious coming for him

There were rumours that he was Pep's first choice signing last summer at Bayern. That's the one I'm worried about.

[Redman0151]

There were rumours that he was Pep's first choice signing last summer at Bayern. That's the one I'm worried about.

Don't think he's that good consistently yet to play for Bayern, and Pep is probably leaving in 2016

[SerbianScouser]

In the grand scheme of things I wonder where Coutinho`s best position is.

Yesterday was a perfect example of where he is as a player. He really looked inspired to play - and truth be told he`s playing on this level in terms of being bright on the ball for months - it was like watching Messi in the way he was making opposition players look like fools. It was an absolute pleasure to watch and he stood out on the pitch but for all his endeavor and effort he had no goals or assists to show for.

He is without the doubt one of the brightest talents in the league which makes his stats of 4 goals and 4 assists even that much more baffling. And that makes me wonder if he`ll be good enough to play for us between the lines in the coming years as he still screams to me being a creator rather than goalscorer.

But then in a deeper position question is does he have the stamina and physicality to cope as in that position you`ll be asked at times to put in a last ditch tackle, sprint back to recover and things like that.

He`s practically the only midfielder we have that can pass early and precisely from a halfway line when we win the ball there and want to launch quick attack against disorganized opposition; and we also have more than few very quick players who can get on the end of that pass and make some damage - Sterling, Ibe, Markovic, Sturridge, Henderson even Moreno. Personally I`m not convinced he can physically cope with demands of playing in central midfield area over the course of the season  - though he certainly proved he can do it at times.

Wonder how people here see him in the long run and do they believe he can do the job for us as an attacking midfielder and get within double digits in both goals and assists columns.

[Kopenhagen]

There were rumours that he was Pep's first choice signing last summer at Bayern. That's the one I'm worried about.

I don't believe that for a second.

[CHOPPER]

Cash in now. Moneyball.

[Sat1]

I'm hoping next yr

[Coolie High]

Don't think he's that good consistently yet to play for Bayern, and Pep is probably leaving in 2016

He is.

[Redman0151]

He is.

Hardly. There's a ton of great attacking midfielders right now and Coutinho's was poor in many games first half of the season

We are his level right now

[Chakan]

Hardly. There's a ton of great attacking midfielders right now and Coutinho's was poor in many games first half of the season

We are his level right now

Think he meant Pep leaving Bayern.

[Kopenhagen]

Think he meant Pep leaving Bayern.

I don't think he did. 

[Chakan]

I don't think he did. 

Oh, ummm i'll just step out of the discussion then ...

[princeoftherocks]

Well, he's definitely liverpool player of the year.  he's got the personality (on the pitch) that more than makes up for the loss of suarez.

[Coolie High]

Hardly. There's a ton of great attacking midfielders right now and Coutinho's was poor in many games first half of the season

We are his level right now

Who? Gotze for example hasn't been better than Coutinho this season?

[Redman0151]

Who? Gotze for example hasn't been better than Coutinho this season?

If we're talking about just Bayern, then Gotze and Muller (who plays as a forward more) can both play there. Gotze has 15 goals this season compared to Coutinho's 6 and is the same age. Hard to imagine them replacing either of them with Coutinho, in terms of consistent output of goals and assists they're both ahead of him.

I haven't seen any links putting him with Bayern, and he seemed pretty happy to sign a contract here a couple months back. Just seems like the usual pants wetting whenever one of our players has a good run of form

[clinical]

De Gea has been the best player this season for me.  When Man U were really struggling he was the one making the difference with his saves.  He had more impact on his team than any player IMO.

Coutinho has been great the last two or three months.  Certainly our best player in that time.  But over the course of the season?  I'm not sure he's been our best player.  For me it has probably been Sterling.  I think he was the player who changed our season when we were really struggling both defensively and even creating chances in attack.  When Sterling went upfront vs Man U, instead of seeing Balotelli or Lambert, we went from a side that couldn't create chances to one which was creating many.  His finishing needs to improve, as shown in that Man U game.  But the timing of his runs, the energy, the willingness to always run behind oppositions defences as well as drop off - gave the opposition nightmares and suddenly Coutinho / Lallana and Henderson had movement for their passes to hit. 

I know everyone seems to be down on Sterling at the moment given his contract situation, amongst other things such as being in the front of papers today.  But at 20 he is frightening good and for him to change our season by playing out of position getting our side from being a non threat to one where we look a real threat shows what a special young player he is.

kept them in when rest of team were out of form. without him they'd be where spurs are at best. But they have him, just like we had Suarez and I hated people saying well without him they'd be so and so.

[Coolie High]

If we're talking about just Bayern, then Gotze and Muller (who plays as a forward more) can both play there. Gotze has 15 goals this season compared to Coutinho's 6 and is the same age. Hard to imagine them replacing either of them with Coutinho, in terms of consistent output of goals and assists they're both ahead of him.

I haven't seen any links putting him with Bayern, and he seemed pretty happy to sign a contract here a couple months back. Just seems like the usual pants wetting whenever one of our players has a good run of form

Stats.. Di Maris has better stats than Coutinho has as well, who's had a better season? Gotze hasn't had a better season than Coutinho regardless of what stats tell you.

[Gnurglan]

No chance of Coutinho winning player of the year. But if he keeps playing like he has, he will have a shot at it next season. He's adding up some points, but he's also getting to a stage now where he can add energy to the side with a couple of touches. I like that. We need a couple of players who can inject energy. Vs Newcastle he had one of those moments that made everyone wonder how he did it. Keep performing like this, add a few more goals and assists and he can be a special player. Up there with Silva and Hazard.

[Miltonred]

He's not going to win that, and rightly so. He started slow and hasn't had enough of a personal impact in games like Bale did when he picked up his to awards to merit it. However anybody who watches us, and has seen him progress over the last three years, know that we have a player of absolute world class in the team, and if we can get a few more players of a good enough quality around him to finish of moves, then he will be a crucial part of a successful team.

I think in the next couple of years he will cement a permanent role on the field for Brazil too. 

If I had to guess which team might want to spend a fortune on him it would be Barcelona once the ban is over. Imagine Coutinho with Suarez, Messi and Neymar making runs for him?  Frightening. We need Sturridge, Ibe and Sterling to be a cut price version of those three next year.

[ThePoolMan]

As long as Coutinho helps us get top 4, the pFA award does not matter at all.

[Dubit10]

No stand out player this season to be honest. Hazard will get it but the league is missing a Suarez type player an absolute force of nature that man was.

Think Mignolet deserves a huge mention for club player of the year after the way he's turned things around. Fair play to him.

[rocco]

Has the votes gone in and if so when ?

[Cid]

Hardly. There's a ton of great attacking midfielders right now and Coutinho's was poor in many games first half of the season

We are his level right now

I honestly thought he struggled due to a lack of movement and outlets earlier in the season.

When your 'striker' won't make any runs or receive the ball in good spots, your wingers are constantly pegged back trying to help a shambolic defense and your midfield sitters can't cover worth a damn there's only so much a creative attacker can do. It's no coincidence that Coutinho improved when Sturridge returned.. While studge has struggled by his own lofty standards he's at least done the basics correctly and made opposition back lines move around.

If we sign a top striker in the summer it'll be Coutinho who feeds him.

[LFC UNTIL THE MANAGER IS NO LONGER DESERVING OF MY SYMPATHY]

In the grand scheme of things I wonder where Coutinho`s best position is.

I think he's best deeper.

For me he's our Iniesta.  You give him the ball and he makes things happen, the team tick. 

I don't think he is a regular match winner and his goal / assist record shows that.  Iniesta doesn't get loads of goals or assists either, but he's often the player that makes the pass before the assist.

Last season Coutinho showed he can play in midfield.  Sterling, Suarez and Sturridge were the front three and he played in midfield alongside Henderson and Gerrard.  He has the energy for that role, he also isn't not scared to put his foot in despite his size - he's similar to Modric in that respect.

Having his deeper will allow us to play another match winner ahead in the front three and we need it because I think this team is short of goals.

I'd like to see this tried:

-------------------------------Can----------------------------------

-----------Henderson--------------------Coutinho---------------

--------------------------------Ibe----------------------------------

--------------Sturridge-----------------Sterling-------------------


In the summer hopefully we have another striker to play with Sturridge and then Sterling can go in Ibe's role, who can compete for that spot.

If we play the diamond formation at the moment, it is probably more likely Allen would be in Coutinho's role.  But I don't see why.  Coutinho has the same amount of energy, will put his foot in like Allen, but just offers far more in possession.

I don't think we should be expecting Coutinho to be a regular match winner, just like Barca don't with Iniesta.  Play him deeper and have three match winners ahead of him... just like we did last season when we were at our best.

[Ciara (with a capital "C")]

I was hoping he was going to vote for Lampard.