Topic: Liverpool confirm decision to redevelop Anfield

[The Lord Admiral]

Lets hope we get some serious info on this over the next few weeks. Just been looking on Google Earth and the triangle website. Lothair Road and Alroy Roads are a mess. Wouldnt want to be the last remaining residents on those roads!

Say if we were to redevelop the main stand to replicate the centenary stand for arguments sake how many rows of houses would have to go to allow this to happen.

Been hearing a lot of stuff on right to light ect

There's loads of room to build something a lot bigger than the Centenary if they get the go ahead. Going to be really interested to see what they do.

[TepidT2O]

There's loads of room to build something a lot bigger than the Centenary if they get the go ahead. Going to be really interested to see what they do.

Really?

That's not going to be a priority though surely?

Annie road and main stand surely....


Hospitality in the main stand is surely a big revenue driver for the expensive seats, and it's so cramped in there that the club has had to move out!

I get vertigo at the top of the centenary all ready, any higher and I'd want crampons.

[Peter McGurk]

Lets hope we get some serious info on this over the next few weeks. Just been looking on Google Earth and the triangle website. Lothair Road and Alroy Roads are a mess. Wouldnt want to be the last remaining residents on those roads!

Say if we were to redevelop the main stand to replicate the centenary stand for arguments sake how many rows of houses would have to go to allow this to happen.

Been hearing a lot of stuff on right to light ect

The better (for redevelopment) of council's three proposals clears the side of Lothair Road (odd numbers) closest to the Main Stand and proposes refurbish or change of use (hence the rumours of commercial use/hotel) of the other side of Lothair Road and odd numbers of Alroy Road. Subject to detailed ROL calculations, that should be enough.

There's loads of room to build something a lot bigger than the Centenary if they get the go ahead. Going to be really interested to see what they do.

Yes, the club owns the even numbers side of Skerries Road but then why do that when there's enough room elsewhere?

Really?

That's not going to be a priority though surely?

Annie road and main stand surely....


Hospitality in the main stand is surely a big revenue driver for the expensive seats, and it's so cramped in there that the club has had to move out!

I get vertigo at the top of the centenary all ready, any higher and I'd want crampons.

Yes, a lot of space but the Centenary is not the easiest option.

There will be plenty of room in the Main Stand. More than enough. Even room for parking (see image above).

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[conman]

If the are to redevelop more than one stand, are they likely to do it all in one go or stand by stand? Would we need to play elsewhere for a while?

[TepidT2O]

If the are to redevelop more than one stand, are they likely to do it all in one go or stand by stand? Would we need to play elsewhere for a while?

j
They'll either close a stand for a season, or they'll build behind the existing stand (most likely I think)

[Peter McGurk]

Would it really take 2 years each Peter, that's a lot longer than I thought? I suppose if they are smart about it they'll build in a way so as to limit the disruption to attendances as much as possible. Will be interesting how they do it.

If you can build and fit this out in under two years, you can have the job...


anfield_mainsection1highlight by Peter McGurk, on Flickr

If the are to redevelop more than one stand, are they likely to do it all in one go or stand by stand? Would we need to play elsewhere for a while?

j
They'll either close a stand for a season, or they'll build behind the existing stand (most likely I think)

First job is build up to first floor slab level as a crash/protection deck. Thenceforth 24 hours a day, seven days a week if you like. Roof done in closed season. No loss of revenue. No playing somewhere else.

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[scouse29]

Why throw away the value of 12,000 seats (and the whole structure that supports them) in the Main Stand? That's daft. There's nothing there that would stop anyone doing what we need to do.

The current access to the paddock is terrible. It's just re-organised and more exits added (plus a row of DDA boxes and wheelchair platform) to give access to some decent bars etc underneath. The rake etc is as is. I have to say there's a bit of photoshop going on to catch up with updates but the paddock is as per the 3D model.

Like i tried to explain i was not being offensive but the current pitchside view looking into the main stand and paddock to me is outdated in modern stadia. The paddock has around 10 rows and adding a further tier to the main stand and a new roof would still give me the feel of a make shift solution. Whilst i understand the logistics i would much prefer a fresh start.

[TepidT2O]

Like i tried to explain i was not being offensive but the current pitchside view looking into the main stand and paddock to me is outdated in modern stadia. The paddock has around 10 rows and adding a further tier to the main stand and a new roof would still give me the feel of a make shift solution. Whilst i understand the logistics i would much prefer a fresh start.

You are right maybe, but that "makeshift feel" would also make the stadium unique... And that isn't necessarily a bad thing..

[scouse29]

You are right maybe, but that "makeshift feel" would also make the stadium unique... And that isn't necessarily a bad thing..

Unique, possibly but every time i look at the upper tier of the Anny Road the more it strikes me though there has been no thought process, just lash another tier on.

There are some clever architects out there so hopefully we end up with all the boxes ticked.

[CraigDS]

Unique, possibly but every time i look at the upper tier of the Anny Road the more it strikes me though there has been no thought process, just lash another tier on.

There are some clever architects out there so hopefully we end up with all the boxes ticked.

The Upper Anny wasn't just a tier added on IIRC, it looks like their was no thought process because their probably wasn't!

[ultimatewarrior]

If you can build and fit this out in under two years, you can have the job...


anfield_mainsection1highlight by Peter McGurk, on Flickr


First job is build up to first floor slab level as a crash/protection deck. Thenceforth 24 hours a day, seven days a week if you like. Roof done in closed season. No loss of revenue. No playing somewhere else.

.

If it took 2 years 6 months and 9 days , from foundations to handover of the 70000 seater Allianz Arena, how does it take 2 years to add approx 8000 seats to the Main stand?

[Peter McGurk]

If it took 2 years 6 months and 9 days , from foundations to handover of the 70000 seater Allianz Arena, how does it take 2 years to add approx 8000 seats to the Main stand?

I imagine because they started on all four sides at once.

Unique, possibly but every time i look at the upper tier of the Anny Road the more it strikes me though there has been no thought process, just lash another tier on.

There are some clever architects out there so hopefully we end up with all the boxes ticked.

It's quite easy to tick all the boxes of a flash and slick... and soulless stadium. There are plenty about. Character is a different matter. Anfield is a football ground - not a soulless bowl.

The 'logistics' - the financial feasibility, is one thing and that (including greater affordability for the fans) is why we should stay but keeping the spirit of Anfield is another. You could produce a design that superimposes a bowl on to Anfield (see option B) but that is defeating at least an important part of the exercise - to have an intimidating and 'atmospheric' stadium that says something about the values of the club (and the 'brand') - and our greatness.

It has to be a balance - between remembering where we've come from (why we are who we are) and looking forward to where we're going but if we iron out all the wrinkles, we'd be left with a featureless and anonymous bowl. If it wasn't for the money side, we might as well move.



anfield_11022504 by Peter McGurk, on Flickr

(Spot the flagpole)

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[scouse29]

If it took 2 years 6 months and 9 days , from foundations to handover of the 70000 seater Allianz Arena, how does it take 2 years to add approx 8000 seats to the Main stand?

Surprised it took the Germans that long, in al. Honesty though I would not expect anything less from them.

[ttnbd]

the main stand and paddock will be completely redeveloped if the stadium is indeed redeveloped.  There is no way they can just add another tier to it as the facilities under the stand are shockingly bad.  They will want to turn what is a very cramped area into something aking to under the 100 blocks of the kop so people can actually get to the kiosks and be served etc.

[Peter McGurk]

the main stand and paddock will be completely redeveloped if the stadium is indeed redeveloped.  There is no way they can just add another tier to it as the facilities under the stand are shockingly bad.  They will want to turn what is a very cramped area into something aking to under the 100 blocks of the kop so people can actually get to the kiosks and be served etc.

Each of the existing levels can be extended into the new build section behind it. Complete strip and re-fit necessary yes. Demolition and rebuild, no.

http://www.mcgurkmcgurk.com/_pps/anfield/xtra/anfield_buildmain.html
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[Liamski-la]

I think its a fucking ugly stadium but the Expansion over the Leazes End and the Milburn Stand at St James Park took 2 years to complete WITHOUT closing the stand. On home match weeks they had 3 day shut downs to prepare for the games so as to lose minimal seating.

Even the roof was built over the top of the original roof which was pretty much then, the last thing to be removed.

Just an example of what can be done without boarding up one side of the stadium.

[Peter McGurk]

I think its a fucking ugly stadium but the Expansion over the Leazes End and the Milburn Stand at St James Park took 2 years to complete WITHOUT closing the stand. On home match weeks they had 3 day shut downs to prepare for the games so as to lose minimal seating.

Even the roof was built over the top of the original roof which was pretty much then, the last thing to be removed.

Just an example of what can be done without boarding up one side of the stadium.

I've posted this before but just to show again that there really is no reason to get too wound up about building and playing at the same time...



centen10 by Peter McGurk, on Flickr

[TepidT2O]

The first question will be about how long the planning permission will take.... I assume that they will do the main stand first, could take years... (but is there any reason why it shouldn't take just a few months?)

[Peter McGurk]

The first question will be about how long the planning permission will take.... I assume that they will do the main stand first, could take years... (but is there any reason why it shouldn't take just a few months?)

As ever, who knows. But with council keen to crack on perhaps and a lot of preparatory work in the can from the previous consent... if council would accept an application for outline consent, that would cross a lot of bridges.

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[reddazforever]

Peter - think there's any truth in what the stadium tour guide has said?  is this just someone guessing or have you heard anything similar? - 68,000 seems a big number given what Ayre has said in past so am guessing it's just bullshit

[Peter McGurk]

Peter - think there's any truth in what the stadium tour guide has said?  is this just someone guessing or have you heard anything similar? - 68,000 seems a big number given what Ayre has said in past so am guessing it's just bullshit

No idea mate. Wasn't there. Don't know the man. But I imagine if it's general knowledge at that level, we'd have heard more about it.

60k supposed to be the limit of infrastructure. But why worry? Club said 60k to 65k. I would stick with that.

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[NOTBORNIN1982]

Iv'e got some of the original drawings from the stadium that never got built... would they be worth anything?

[Liamski-la]

Iv'e got some of the original drawings from the stadium that never got built... would they be worth anything?

35 million apparently. 

[gorgepir]

No idea mate. Wasn't there. Don't know the man. But I imagine if it's general knowledge at that level, we'd have heard more about it.

60k supposed to be the limit of infrastructure. But why worry? Club said 60k to 65k. I would stick with that.

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Would 68k even be viable according to your redevelopment plans? I remember you mentioning that 70k was possible but very expensive?

[TepidT2O]

Would 68k even be viable according to your redevelopment plans? I remember you mentioning that 70k was possible but very expensive?

It could be couldn't it...

You could certainly redevelop up to 60k and have the option to extend to 68k.

Not the same as the Hicks bowl where the idea was to build a 70000k stadium and just not put alll the seats in..... Possibly the least cost effective way of building a stadium there is.

[The Lord Admiral]

If you can build and fit this out in under two years, you can have the job...

Hod and wheel barrow at the ready.....

 

[The Lord Admiral]

Really?

That's not going to be a priority though surely?

Annie road and main stand surely....


Hospitality in the main stand is surely a big revenue driver for the expensive seats, and it's so cramped in there that the club has had to move out!

I get vertigo at the top of the centenary all ready, any higher and I'd want crampons.

Ah sorry didn't make myself clear, I meant in terms of building a new main stand, I expect it to be a lot bigger in scale that the current Centenary. I don't think they'll touch the Centenary at this point, they'll get it up to 60-68K with just the Anny Road and the Main Stand and then maybe look to increase the Kop/Kemlyn if the demand is there.
 

[ultimatewarrior]

I wonder if we'll have a 68000 seats my arse thread now 

[Torpedo Tommy]

If it took 2 years 6 months and 9 days , from foundations to handover of the 70000 seater Allianz Arena, how does it take 2 years to add approx 8000 seats to the Main stand?

Live environment
Residential area
Poor access
Working restrictions due to residents
Numerous issues with health and safety - congested working
Work would be in numerous phases
Many crane phases / relocation / re-rigs
Increase on incoming stat capacity?
Working with / tying into existing buildings and building levels is complex - unforeseen items, getting critical dims correct is harder
Risk of damaging existing stand which would be disastrous
Road closures, service diversions etc

....and that's after the Planning Dept have been satisfied

As Peter McGurk says
New stadium....
Potential to attack all four stands at once ( four different piling contractors, groundworkers, steel contractors etc)
Most likely packages would be phased so the pilers finish the first and leave for the groundworks etc - bit like phased housebuilding....but the options are far more open.

But, the main benefit would be that whilst the new stadium is being built you can chose working patterns which meets your financial needs whilst maintaining the current arena utilisation. You could have pretty much any working patterns in an open field near a motorway. Not so at Anfield with the residents in close proximity.

T'would be a tricky project.

[Peter McGurk]

Live environment
Residential area
Poor access
Working restrictions due to residents
Numerous issues with health and safety - congested working
Work would be in numerous phases
Many crane phases / relocation / re-rigs
Increase on incoming stat capacity?
Working with / tying into existing buildings and building levels is complex - unforeseen items, getting critical dims correct is harder
Risk of damaging existing stand which would be disastrous
Road closures, service diversions etc

....and that's after the Planning Dept have been satisfied

As Peter McGurk says
New stadium....
Potential to attack all four stands at once ( four different piling contractors, groundworkers, steel contractors etc)
Most likely packages would be phased so the pilers finish the first and leave for the groundworks etc - bit like phased housebuilding....but the options are far more open.

But, the main benefit would be that whilst the new stadium is being built you can chose working patterns which meets your financial needs whilst maintaining the current arena utilisation. You could have pretty much any working patterns in an open field near a motorway. Not so at Anfield with the residents in close proximity.

T'would be a tricky project.

It would. And would come with a premium as a result.

On the face of it half the cost of a new stadium seems a lot of money for only a quarter of the number of seats - but this would be a big part of the reason why.

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[Ryan M]

Drove down Lothair yesterday, nothing special to add apart from two drug users had each other in headlocks while two police officers were trying to seperate them.

[TepidT2O]

Drove down Lothair yesterday, nothing special to add apart from two drug users had each other in headlocks while two police officers were trying to seperate them.

Hicks and Gillettes final argument?

[Zeb]

Not sure whether Mr.Neville will appreciate it, but interesting developments in Manchester. Kind of highlights how clubs are looking to expand into commercial developments associated with the stadium.

http://menmedia.co.uk/manchestereveningnews/news/s/1580943_manchester-united-plan-city-style-fanzone-at-old-trafford

[rhylred]

Not sure whether Mr.Neville will appreciate it, but interesting developments in Manchester. Kind of highlights how clubs are looking to expand into commercial developments associated with the stadium.

http://menmedia.co.uk/manchestereveningnews/news/s/1580943_manchester-united-plan-city-style-fanzone-at-old-trafford

good idea would love to share a bud and a hot dog with them when we play there

[Peter McGurk]

good idea would love to share a bud and a hot dog with them when we play there

You could invite him back for a pint in the Albert...



anfield_120512plan69 by Peter McGurk, on Flickr

[Ben S]

Ah sorry didn't make myself clear, I meant in terms of building a new main stand, I expect it to be a lot bigger in scale that the current Centenary. I don't think they'll touch the Centenary at this point, they'll get it up to 60-68K with just the Anny Road and the Main Stand and then maybe look to increase the Kop/Kemlyn if the demand is there.

Logically if they do anything the main stand will be done last given it holds the most, you don't want to have your biggest stand out of action without something bigger to replace it.

[CraigDS]

Ah sorry didn't make myself clear, I meant in terms of building a new main stand, I expect it to be a lot bigger in scale that the current Centenary. I don't think they'll touch the Centenary at this point, they'll get it up to 60-68K with just the Anny Road and the Main Stand and then maybe look to increase the Kop/Kemlyn if the demand is there.

Given the Main Stand holds 12,277 and the Anny Rd holds 9,074, I can't see how they could add 22,478 extra seats in just those two stands to make 68,000. Not without them being WAY out of proportion with the rest of the place anyway.

[RedPross]

I dont think it will end up being 68,000....... Its more likely to be between 55-60,000!!! Because of the surrounding area and because we would need to invest in the transport i.e. REopen th nearby train station for anything over 60,000.

[reddazforever]

Peter - have sent you a PM

[CraigDS]

I dont think it will end up being 68,000....... Its more likely to be between 55-60,000!!! Because of the surrounding area and because we would need to invest in the transport i.e. REopen th nearby train station for anything over 60,000.

Not just reopen - it NEEDS a train station and the line changing from a goods line to a passenger (not sure what work this entails exactly).