Topic: Molly-Mae, Privilege & 'Hard Work'

[Sudden Death Draft Loser]

Hard work - totally overrated - a virtue sold to us by those making money off our backs.

If you've discovered/stumbled across a way to make money without hard work or even better no work then fair play to you.

[Kenny's Jacket]

At the same time, you can end up going down a route where you get to a point in life, with ‘responsibilities’ where you can’t just decide you’re miserable and want to start again and do something completely different

which is the point I was making about my sister, something out of her control has given her the opportunity of no responsibilities so she an re calibrate

This influencer has something of a wealthy family and good looks, shes half way there

[Kenny's Jacket]

So you end up spending too much time on RAWK to alleviate the boredom.

Or I’d that just me?

to be fair you mate, you alleviate a lot of other peoples boredom
 

[RainbowFlick]

Yeah, but if no one did their jobs then your world would likely collapse, so in that case is it worthwhile?

an investment banking office job (as an example) is not essential nor helps progress humanity at all. yet we created an economy and capitalism that basically means if we got rid of investment bankers, the world would collapse. somehow we (humans) are essentially answerable to ourselves. it goes to the heart of the issue - our priorities have always been wrong. influencers aren't the start of this.

[RainbowFlick]

Well, first is that it's often their perception of it as being easy money - they use IG, play Fortnite or whatever anyway, and think that at some point they can just flip the 'earn big pounds per post/game' switch and that's their career sorted.

The real problem comes when they don't see anything at school as being worthwhile as it won't help them with this 'dream' career. And so when the majority of them do inevitably fail to make it, they've less to fall back on than they should.

Yes there's a real problem of kids perhaps not focusing on school because of having aspirations of becoming an influencer or youtuber, but weren't older people the same to an extent? We were dreaming of being footballers, musicians etc. Some of us as kids got distracted too.

[RainbowFlick]

I'm not sure 'luck' is really a factor.

Yeah, I suppose you might be 'lucky' and get a top job and everything if you have no talent, no ability and make absolutely no effort whatsoever if your life. But the chances of that would seem to be rather remote.****

I believe strongly that you have to support people that didn't get born with a silver spoon in their mouths and that social, educational and other support should be provided to help them get along.

I suppose you could describe me as 'lucky' - came from a single parent family, lived in council estates and had no money. But I also worked as a teenage - did three papers rounds, cleaned cars in a local garage, caddied at the golf for money, did odd jobs where I could and when I had a chance at a real job, I worked my bollocks off and have continued to do so for 40 years.

Is it lucky where I am? Not sure, but without the effort and hard work and ability to do the job and know stuff and learn stuff then the luckiest person on Earth wouldn't stand a chance of replicating what I did and do.

I'd say the biggest advantage I had was my mum that believed in me, encouraged me and supported me in every way she could.

The difference between people with caring parents that those without are stark.


Interesting discussion though



**** Unless you are a feckless twat with massively rich parents that bail you out every second of your waking life to give you jobs and toys that you didn't work for or deserve - which sadly describes a fairly large swathe of society

disagree. there is luck for a lot of people, not necessarily everyone, but the vast majority have some luck involved - and i would include forms of privilege to be 'luck' as you might be born with or into them too. it doesn't downplay peoples' achievements but there is luck and/or privilege everywhere.

[Crosby Nick]

to be fair you mate, you alleviate a lot of other peoples boredom
 

I’m actually on the RAWK payroll. Influencer-in-Chief.

[CraigDS]

Yes there's a real problem of kids perhaps not focusing on school because of having aspirations of becoming an influencer or youtuber, but weren't older people the same to an extent? We were dreaming of being footballers, musicians etc. Some of us as kids got distracted too.

The thing is if that's what they're interested in then schools should utilise this to teach them valuable skills - photography, business basics, IT, marketing, etc.

Most of the influencers who make it aren't stupid and tend to have some background which has given them some skills to make it (not all like).

[HarryLabrador]

I haven't got a clue either!

Same here.

[RainbowFlick]

You've pretty much described about 99% of people that are 'famous' and rich through TV shows like Love Island. If she wasn't picked to go on that and in a relationship with Tyson Fury's brother, she wouldn't be as 'successful' as she is now.

she was successful on instagram before Love Island though via beauty pageants etc. her luck was more being attractive (to certain people) and having the means (good camera / lighting / clothes).

most love island girls tend to have sizeable instagram followings before the show - and that's mainly from the luck of being an attractive woman. you can get paid off even 50,000 followers if you play it well, have a niche and are lucky.

[killer-heels]

At the same time, you can end up going down a route where you get to a point in life, with ‘responsibilities’ where you can’t just decide you’re miserable and want to start again and do something completely different so you have to plough on regardless. So you end up spending too much time on RAWK to alleviate the boredom.

Or I’d that just me?

Ha, yeah. Yes thats always possible but again its whether you enjoy doing that or not and whether you can class it as successful or not. I understand completely having to work to live and thats what most people do, but whether that can be classed as a successful career, not sure.

[RainbowFlick]

The thing is if that's what they're interested in then schools should utilise this to teach them valuable skills - photography, business basics, IT, marketing, etc.

Most of the influencers who make it aren't stupid and tend to have some background which has given them some skills to make it (not all like).

I agree. We should be pivoting our education to give these kids skills that may be useful and also transferable to other things as a 'back up'. The world is digital now - learning how to code, how to take photos, how to run a business, how to graphic design etc are way more important than algebra.

[Mumm-Ra]

A lot of it is who you know and luck.

Typo?

[Kenny's Jacket]

Typo?

 

[Nobby Reserve]

If you're a top-level influencer you have to put in a huge amount of work even if your career is essentially vacuous and meaningless, but this attitude is something you see so often with Tories. People have to justify their privilege and/or luck to themselves so they tell themselves they got where they are because of hard work. The obvious next step is that everyone who hasn't managed it must be lazier than you, and needs to be encougared/punished to work harder or blamed for their misfortune.

The truth is that if you're on a lower level there's often no way in without a huge slice of luck, or even a vision of where the door might be. Having grown up going to lower middle class schools and mixed with posher people since, there seemed to be a notion for them that everything they dreamed of was within reach, whereas with us there was a subtle message that success or infliuence was 'for other people'.

Great post, and makes some of the points I wanted to make.

[redbyrdz]

I agree. We should be pivoting our education to give these kids skills that may be useful and also transferable to other things as a 'back up'. The world is digital now - learning how to code, how to take photos, how to run a business, how to graphic design etc are way more important than algebra.

Hard to learn how to code or run a business without knowing algebra though.

Also knowing how to code is not really needed in most jobs anymore.


To be fair, schools do teach these things - I did learn how to code and also basics of photography and graphic design (but not digital, that didn't exist) in school, for example. The debate about a financial classes has been ongoing for decades.

[RainbowFlick]

Hard to learn how to code or run a business without knowing algebra though.

Also knowing how to code is not really needed in most jobs anymore.


To be fair, schools do teach these things - I did learn how to code and also basics of photography and graphic design (but not digital, that didn't exist) in school, for example. The debate about a financial classes has been ongoing for decades.

you can create your own business from learning to code - people are more entrepreneurial now, but in any case it was just a random example.

you went to a decent school it seems  . briefly had some graphic design stuff and some very rudimentary html lessons but it was nothing more than creating a title and a body lol

[Riquende]

We were dreaming of being footballers, musicians etc. Some of us as kids got distracted too.

Certainly. The main difference is we didn't have 24/7 access to (a curated version of) all of these people's private lives though.

It's just a different world now.

[12C]

The wife was flicking through the iPlayer menus the other night and landed on a program about the rich people who live in Dubai.
Apart from the obscene amounts of money being spent on handbag collections etc. one character they showed was a billionaire and still a teen. He was perhaps the ultimate influencer.
Born to incredible wealth, with a car collection before he was a teenager, his idea of work was increasing his wealth via his YouTube channel.
Basically he was showing off his wealth in videos which people then paid to watch. Unboxing his latest Ferrari, or his latest watch seems to be a form of entertainment for some. In the programme he was filmed having his Rolls Royce, vinyl wrapped in electric blue, at obscene cost, and his posse/production team filmed him as he picked it up from the body shop and were hanging out of the car windows filming reactions to it.
It was truly depressing watching such a self absorbed little boy making out that he was working hard.
Some of the other characters were also deeply unpleasant, but thought that they were lovable because they were wealthy. They interviewed the Filipino “help” who worked for one of the wealthy “expats” and they were, as one would expect fulsome in their praise of their employer. What was heartbreaking was that one of them said she was working are to put her son through university. He was 20. She had worked in Dubai since he was a baby, and saw him once a year. She worked 6 days a week.
The employer (the millionaire’s wife) thought there was nothing wrong with shelling out £60k for a private jet to get to the “other home” in Jersey.
Hard work?

It’s a bit like when Lord Bethel tells us he wasn’t academic but he was able to make his way in the world as a businessman.

[Nobby Reserve]

Her Wiki page got changed (sadly changed back now)

[redgriffin73]

The wife was flicking through the iPlayer menus the other night and landed on a program about the rich people who live in Dubai.
Apart from the obscene amounts of money being spent on handbag collections etc. one character they showed was a billionaire and still a teen. He was perhaps the ultimate influencer.
Born to incredible wealth, with a car collection before he was a teenager, his idea of work was increasing his wealth via his YouTube channel.
Basically he was showing off his wealth in videos which people then paid to watch. Unboxing his latest Ferrari, or his latest watch seems to be a form of entertainment for some. In the programme he was filmed having his Rolls Royce, vinyl wrapped in electric blue, at obscene cost, and his posse/production team filmed him as he picked it up from the body shop and were hanging out of the car windows filming reactions to it.
It was truly depressing watching such a self absorbed little boy making out that he was working hard.
Some of the other characters were also deeply unpleasant, but thought that they were lovable because they were wealthy. They interviewed the Filipino “help” who worked for one of the wealthy “expats” and they were, as one would expect fulsome in their praise of their employer. What was heartbreaking was that one of them said she was working are to put her son through university. He was 20. She had worked in Dubai since he was a baby, and saw him once a year. She worked 6 days a week.
The employer (the millionaire’s wife) thought there was nothing wrong with shelling out £60k for a private jet to get to the “other home” in Jersey.
Hard work?

It’s a bit like when Lord Bethel tells us he wasn’t academic but he was able to make his way in the world as a businessman.

I watched that out of some kind of morbid curiosity. It was just depressing how some people act. Really bizarre way of life in Dubai as well for non-nationals. Felt so sorry for the Filipino home helps too.

[BarryCrocker]

Life is about timing. Being in the right bar to meet the right girl/boy, being in a classroom with a teacher who's peaking in their passion for education, working for a company that currently innovating in a new technology, being stuck in a city in the middle of a cultural revolution, bumping into a guitarist at band camp who ends up being the best of all time, selling your portfolio just before the market collapses, etc, etc.

As with all of these thing the other important ingredient is, action.

[I've been a good boy]

Is it possible that she (or her handlers) are really quite smart and this is top bit of trollling to keep the clicks coming?

Most things people do these days is to gain more attention and clicks on their profile or website. Like Garth Crooks excluding Salah from his team of the season, it's just a ploy to get people talking. Such is the state of the world these days, where any airhead can come out with dumb statements and claim that any publicity is good publicity.

[CraigDS]

to be honest if this came from her management company and I was her they'd be getting fired. It's tarnished her image and the age old saying of "no publicity is bad publicity' is a load of shite.

It's come from her anyway by the looks of it.

[Clint Eastwood]

I hate the emergence of influencers.

She’s deluded. There are clips of her being baffled at the idea of a 12 hour shift, and many others where she’s waking up at lunch time/sleeping all day. Her job role is a farce, she’s a face for a company that pay sweatshop workers £3.50 an hour. She does fuck all but pick out clothes for her range.

She does not know what hard work is. She’s 22 and has spent the last 4 years earning ridiculous money for simply posting images on Instagram. If she saw what an NHS nurse or a paramedic did, she’d be shocked.

Anyway - she’s a symptom of much of what is wrong with the modern World.

[Kenny's Jacket]

I hate the emergence of influencers.

She’s deluded. There are clips of her being baffled at the idea of a 12 hour shift, and many others where she’s waking up at lunch time/sleeping all day. Her job role is a farce, she’s a face for a company that pay sweatshop workers £3.50 an hour. She does fuck all but pick out clothes for her range.

She does not know what hard work is. She’s 22 and has spent the last 4 years earning ridiculous money for simply posting images on Instagram. If she saw what an NHS nurse or a paramedic did, she’d be shocked.

Anyway - she’s a symptom of much of what is wrong with the modern World.

the people shes trolling, The working class, I assume, are the ones making her rich by following her on Social media and raising her profile. Its quite perverse

[CraigDS]

I hate the emergence of influencers.

She’s deluded. There are clips of her being baffled at the idea of a 12 hour shift, and many others where she’s waking up at lunch time/sleeping all day. Her job role is a farce, she’s a face for a company that pay sweatshop workers £3.50 an hour. She does fuck all but pick out clothes for her range.

She does not know what hard work is. She’s 22 and has spent the last 4 years earning ridiculous money for simply posting images on Instagram. If she saw what an NHS nurse or a paramedic did, she’d be shocked.

Anyway - she’s a symptom of much of what is wrong with the modern World.

Honestly I think you probably undersell the amount of work she does - even if you may not consider it work. People who aren't around the whole social media marketing thing tend to think these people take a few pics a day and that's it. They work a hell of a lot harder than that, but they sell the idea that their life is some idyllic thing. That dream is part of their marketing, but for 99% of them (her included) what you see in the pics is 100% not what her life is like.

This isn't me defending her either, she's a lot of what you have said, and she'd certainly be shocked if she had to work what an NHS nurse or paramedic did (so would 90% of us btw).

[WhereAngelsPlay]

Dammit,I thought that was the title of her autobiography.

Anybody know when that's coming out & when can you pre-order ?

[WhereAngelsPlay]

Honestly I think you probably undersell the amount of work she does - even if you may not consider it work. People who aren't around the whole social media marketing thing tend to think these people take a few pics a day and that's it. They work a hell of a lot harder than that, but they sell the idea that their life is some idyllic thing. That dream is part of their marketing, but for 99% of them (her included) what you see in the pics is 100% not what her life is like.

This isn't me defending her either, she's a lot of what you have said, and she'd certainly be shocked if she had to work what an NHS nurse or paramedic did (so would 90% of us btw).

He was talking to the chair.

[keano7]

Honestly I think you probably undersell the amount of work she does - even if you may not consider it work. People who aren't around the whole social media marketing thing tend to think these people take a few pics a day and that's it. They work a hell of a lot harder than that, but they sell the idea that their life is some idyllic thing. That dream is part of their marketing, but for 99% of them (her included) what you see in the pics is 100% not what her life is like.

This isn't me defending her either, she's a lot of what you have said, and she'd certainly be shocked if she had to work what an NHS nurse or paramedic did (so would 90% of us btw).

You can’t compare her life to an everyday working man or woman who has to slave away for 8-10 hours a day just to feed their family or pay for bills. It’s probably not just a couple of pictures posted here and there for likes but it’s hardly painstaking work like the rest of us. I imagine she works harder than other love contestants who just come out the show and post in bikinis in Dubai on a weekly basis.

[CraigDS]

You can’t compare her life to an everyday working man or woman who has to slave away for 8-10 hours a day just to feed their family or pay for bills.

I didn't.

It’s probably not just a couple of pictures posted here and there for likes but it’s hardly painstaking work like the rest of us.

Not sure what world you live in, but many jobs are not painstaking work. Loads are, of course. Loads aren't.

I imagine she works harder than other love contestants who just come out the show and post in bikinis in Dubai on a weekly basis.

I mean I can't comment on this as no idea about what any of the fuckers do. I do have experience in social media marketing though, and the thought it's easy, even for the big profiles who like to pretend they have some idyllic life, is far from it.

Yeah, of course they're not slaving it away like a night worker in ASDA, or a copper, or loads of other jobs, but the idea it's 5 mins a day taking 3 pics and shoving them up is wayyyy far of the mark.

[12C]

I watched that out of some kind of morbid curiosity. It was just depressing how some people act. Really bizarre way of life in Dubai as well for non-nationals. Felt so sorry for the Filipino home helps too.

The bit where they were shopping for second hand clothes, was so sad. The nanny trying to bring up the brat in the absence of any parental input was another insight into how some kids born into wealthy backgrounds grow up to be selfish sociopaths.
The child was smart enough to have worked out that the nanny could do sod all in the way of stopping her excesses. The mother sitting there chatting to her guests whist the child basically did whatever she could to wind up the nanny was really infuriating. The look on the poor nanny was one of fear that this kid was going to get her the sack, because the parents wouldn’t criticise their little Princess.
Horrible

[Charlie Adams fried egg]

All influencers are is people who have benefitted from the fragmentation of the media and by extension how companies spend their marketing budget.
If my company’s target market was say women in their early 20s, I’d be wasting my money spending on TV or printed ads and would probably reach them via influencers or some other arm of social media.

It’s like most things though, the real money has been made and it’s more difficult to get to the level of followers that makes money due to how crowded the market is.

5 figure followers may get you a few product freebies in certain markets, money certainly won’t change hands.

The sad thing though is that many people are attracted by the wealth and status of the few and they aspire to it rather than building themselves a sustainable career.

[jonnypb]

Social media and reality show 'star' Molly-Mae Hague has caused ructions by saying, in an interview, that people can achieve whatever they want in life just by wanting it enough and working hard to get it, and rubbishing the notion that things like having a natural advantage in life (in her case coming from a well-off family, having good looks, being white) is not a factor.

I wonder if such ructions would have been caused if a male came out and said what she did?

Had to google who Molly-Mae was, I’d heard of her, but wasn’t sure how she was in the public eye. This tweet came up when I was having a search and I think what he says is pretty spot on. The guy who did the podcast said he’d interviewed male guests who had said exactly the same things as she did, but no one cared then, when a female says it she’s crucified.

https://twitter.com/stevebartlettsc/status/1479413354716405763?s=21

[Jshooters]

I wonder if such ructions would have been caused if a male came out and said what she did?

Had to google who Molly-Mae was, I’d heard of her, but wasn’t sure how she was in the public eye. This tweet came up when I was having a search and I think what he says is pretty spot on. The guy who did the podcast said he’d interviewed male guests who had said exactly the same things as she did, but no one cared then, when a female says it she’s crucified.

https://twitter.com/stevebartlettsc/status/1479413354716405763?s=21

Bad take mate, read some of the replies to his tweet to see why

[Brissyred]

This sums it up.

[jonnypb]

Bad take mate, read some of the replies to his tweet to see why

I read the replies and get what many are saying, and I don’t agree with what she said btw, but there is a difference between how this would have been portrayed had it come from a male influencer. Let’s say Joey Essex came out with something similar, would he have got the same abuse and trolling that she appears to be getting now? Probably not.

She clearly has led a privileged life style and is naive to how an ‘ordinary’ person lives and gets by day to day. She could obviously have phrased what she said a lot better, but things like this that triggers a reaction from people really shows how vile social media quickly becomes.

[FlashGordon]

I read the replies and get what many are saying, and I don’t agree with what she said btw, but there is a difference between how this would have been portrayed had it come from a male influencer. Let’s say Joey Essex came out with something similar, would he have got the same abuse and trolling that she appears to be getting now? Probably not.

She clearly has led a privileged life style and is naive to how an ‘ordinary’ person lives and gets by day to day. She could obviously have phrased what she said a lot better, but things like this that triggers a reaction from people really shows how vile social media quickly becomes.

You must be having a laugh, Joey Essex would have been slaughtered for it.

Live by social media, die by social media (not literally, of course)

[jonnypb]

You must be having a laugh, Joey Essex would have been slaughtered for it.

Live by social media, die by social media (not literally, of course)

Yes he would, but in a different way. Whether someone says something good, bad, stupid, or indifferent, Social media becomes toxic very quickly and it’s not difficult to see how much more toxic it can be for women.

[GreatEx]

Yes he would, but in a different way. Whether someone says something good, bad, stupid, or indifferent, Social media becomes toxic very quickly and it’s not difficult to see how much more toxic it can be for women.

To be fair, you originally said that people wouldn't have reacted negatively to a male influencer making those remarks (wrongly, imo, albeit you were quoting someone else) and have now shifted to saying trolling of women tends to be more toxic (which is a more reasonable argument).