Author Topic: Everton's stadium problems  (Read 26270 times)

Offline DonkeyWan

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Everton's stadium problems
« on: August 7, 2008, 11:22:06 am »
Are they going to put groundshare back on the agenda now that Everton look like messing up their new stadium?
Beatings will continue until morale improves...

Offline FairfieldRed

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Re: Everton's stadium problems
« Reply #1 on: August 7, 2008, 11:39:02 am »
Do you want them to?

They can put what they like back on the agenda, it won't happen.

I'm not sure how many times they need to be told.

Let them dream.

Offline CRAZY HORSE EMLYN

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Re: Everton's stadium problems
« Reply #2 on: August 7, 2008, 11:57:48 am »
I think Everton having a groundshare is a great idea...








with Tranmere

Offline mickfinney

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Re: Everton's stadium problems
« Reply #3 on: August 7, 2008, 12:22:39 pm »
I think Everton having a groundshare is a great idea...








with Tranmere
could they fill it though

Offline FairfieldRed

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Re: Everton's stadium problems
« Reply #4 on: August 7, 2008, 12:23:15 pm »
Be ideal that. Closer to Wales.

Offline 4pool

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Re: Everton's stadium problems
« Reply #5 on: August 7, 2008, 12:26:56 pm »
How many times will Everton and some council members need to be told NO by our club before it sinks in?

There will be no groundshare with LFC.

I'm not sure what's in the tea they drink but they need to change the bags once in awhile.

The answer is NO.
Either we are a club of supporters or become a club of customers.

Offline The Manhattan Project

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Re: Everton's stadium problems
« Reply #6 on: August 7, 2008, 01:30:52 pm »
To get into Everton's new stadium you have to put a one pound coin in a slot.

At the end of the game, you get the coin back.
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Offline Shane-o

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Re: Everton's stadium problems
« Reply #7 on: August 7, 2008, 02:27:19 pm »
To get into Everton's new stadium you have to put a one pound coin in a slot.

At the end of the game, you get the coin back.
Are they going to keep it as compensation should you rip out the seats and throw them on the pitch or kick up a full scale riot in there? :D

Offline Liverbird 2010

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Re: Everton's stadium problems
« Reply #8 on: August 8, 2008, 09:34:47 am »
All Ive heard now is the only thing that makes sense is a groundshare ::)

It only makes sense for them, why they want to share a stadium with Dem redshite merdering bastards I do not know.
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Offline Liverbird 2010

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Re: Everton's stadium problems
« Reply #9 on: August 8, 2008, 12:47:11 pm »
Here we go again  :butt

* WHAT now for Everton – and Liverpool? Former Anfield club secretary Peter Robinson tells Paddy Shennan why his controversial ground share idea still makes sense . . .

Despite Everton and Liverpool having kicked the always-controversial idea into touch at various times since the 1960s, it continues to be brought back into the public domain.

Mr Robinson said: “People are entitled to their opinions, but I do think the majority of fans, if a shared stadium ever came about, would quickly accept it.”

Just over two months ago the shared stadium idea was given yet another airing, this time by sports minister Gerry Sutcliffe and culture secretary Andy Burnham.

Mr Burnham, a Blues season-ticket holder, said he believed the idea was “highly attractive”.

Mr Sutcliffe said: “It is important all options are carefully considered.

“Nothing is ruled in and nothing is ruled out. It is a matter for the two clubs.”

Five years ago, a high-profile Merseyside businessman and football fan said: “If there are one or two solid ingredients in place, a ground share could be a valid option.”

He added: “Although it is not ideal in terms of timing for the clubs because they are at different stages of development (this was in 2003) one thing I have learned in business is that if a good opportunity comes along you just have to take it.”

http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/liverpool-news/local-news/2008/08/08/everton-issue-challenge-to-city-leader-warren-bradley-over-new-stadium-site-100252-21492218/2/

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Online Matt S

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Re: Everton's stadium problems
« Reply #10 on: August 8, 2008, 02:35:17 pm »
Looking at it purely practically, without bringing any other emotive issues into the equation, it does make the most sense of any option taking into account that neither club appears to have the money for a new stadium.

Of course I'm not suggesting for 1 minute I would want a shared stadium.

Offline smicer07

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Re: Everton's stadium problems
« Reply #11 on: August 8, 2008, 02:35:53 pm »
Looking at it purely practically, without bringing any other emotive issues into the equation, it does make the most sense of any option.

Of course I'm not suggesting for 1 minute I would want a shared stadium.

Makes sense for Everton. Doesn't make sense for us.

Offline albertared

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Re: Everton's stadium problems
« Reply #12 on: August 8, 2008, 07:14:04 pm »
Do you want them to?

They can put what they like back on the agenda, it won't happen.

I'm not sure how many times they need to be told.

Let them dream.

and you know for sure what our twattish yankee owners are going to do next, do you?

mate, don't count anything out...it's all about the money for them...if they think it makes financial sense it could well happen.
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Offline albertared

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Re: Everton's stadium problems
« Reply #13 on: August 8, 2008, 07:17:35 pm »
Makes sense for Everton. Doesn't make sense for us.

why not? we obviously can't afford our own stadium. look at Arsenal's problems...it appeared that they were golden but now it seems the Emirates is holding them back in spite of all the extra revenue.

i hate the idea of ground sharing but the economics of it might mean it will happen anyway.
Left England 1990...still on our perch...I think I'd better come back because it's all gone haywire since!

Offline HarryLabrador

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Re: Everton's stadium problems
« Reply #14 on: August 8, 2008, 08:06:02 pm »
why not? we obviously can't afford our own stadium. look at Arsenal's problems...it appeared that they were golden but now it seems the Emirates is holding them back in spite of all the extra revenue.

i hate the idea of ground sharing but the economics of it might mean it will happen anyway.

Not if we get owners with real clout. The very thought of a shared stadium .... uugh!!!

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Offline No666

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Re: Everton's stadium problems
« Reply #15 on: August 8, 2008, 09:55:26 pm »
They kill something fundamental to LFC if they shove us in the same stadium as the blueshite. A lot of people were torn about leaving Anfield, but to not have a particular, specified, spiritual home?

Offline finchie

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Re: Everton's stadium problems
« Reply #16 on: August 8, 2008, 10:02:58 pm »
I can see the press statement now:
"Due to the current financial situation Kop holdings (aka George and Tom) have reached agreement today with Everton football club..bullshit...etc...history...respect for fans....great clubs..to compete with rivals....worth one great signing per year...etc...."

Unless them fuckers piss off I can't see them reaching anything other than a business decision that shits on our history. 

What's the worst that can happen for them? Lose popularity with the fans. Sorry lost that already.


Offline oldboybailey

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Re: Everton's stadium problems
« Reply #17 on: August 8, 2008, 11:15:37 pm »
why not? we obviously can't afford our own stadium. look at Arsenal's problems...it appeared that they were golden but now it seems the Emirates is holding them back in spite of all the extra revenue.

i hate the idea of ground sharing but the economics of it might mean it will happen anyway.

i think thats the nub of it all really. None of our fans want it, in fact most would probably shoot themselves in the bollock with a crossbow to prevent it happening. but at the end of the day our owners want to make as much money as possible and this is the cheapest way to build ourselves a massive stadium without spending loads of money. ok, some revenues would be smaller with a shared stadium, such as advertising and sponsorship, but most would be massively increasd like ticket sales, pie sales, carlsberg sales etc and that is probably enough for them to decide its the best plan financially. id be surprised if hicks and gillette gave a toss about the fact that no regular liverpool fan wouldnt even entertain the idea. this is why everyime these stories resurface theres always that worry in my mind. especially with both our stadiums seemingly taking an age to get started.

Offline Liverbird 2010

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Re: Everton's stadium problems
« Reply #18 on: August 9, 2008, 12:04:31 am »
The day we share a stadium with the bitters is the day I stop being a Liverpool fan.
That will be end game for me.
I will be finished that will put the final nail in the coffin.
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Offline JohnSullie

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Re: Everton's stadium problems
« Reply #19 on: August 9, 2008, 01:08:10 am »
The day we share a stadium with the bitters is the day I stop being a Liverpool fan.
That will be end game for me.
I will be finished that will put the final nail in the coffin.
+1

Offline shanklyboy

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Re: Everton's stadium problems
« Reply #20 on: August 9, 2008, 02:01:10 am »
No Kop.
No This is Anfield sign.
No Shankly/Paisley gates.

No fucking chance.
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Offline 4pool

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Re: Everton's stadium problems
« Reply #21 on: August 9, 2008, 02:06:35 am »
The day we share a stadium with the bitters is the day I stop being a Liverpool fan.
That will be end game for me.
I will be finished that will put the final nail in the coffin.

+2



And it does NOT make financial sense. Which has been posted before the reasoning why.
Either we are a club of supporters or become a club of customers.

Offline Alf

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Re: Everton's stadium problems
« Reply #22 on: August 9, 2008, 09:43:03 am »
It's back on according to the Beeb.

Merseyside groundshare back on.
Liverpool owners Tom Hicks and George Gillett have sensationally admitted for the first time that a groundshare with fierce local rivals Everton is at an advanced stage.

In a joint statement issued to the press, the pair, who trade under the Kop Holdings Ltd banner confirmed that "Talks with Everton to share a stadium that would benefit not just both clubs immensely, but the city as a whole, something we are keen to help."

Everton chief Bill Kenwright admitted that the groundshare move looked "the best bet", and would only smile and add "no comment" when asked whether the proposed ground had been given the green light by council chiefs, and whether the ground would be built in the Stanley Park area designated to Liverpool's new stadium.

More to follow ...
« Last Edit: August 9, 2008, 10:49:18 am by Alf »

Offline ttnbd

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Re: Everton's stadium problems
« Reply #23 on: August 9, 2008, 09:50:15 am »
the link, quick hide it ;) (been done last week).
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Offline roz mac

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Re: Everton's stadium problems
« Reply #24 on: August 9, 2008, 09:50:55 am »
give them a shed and tell em to fuck off

Offline HarryLabrador

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Re: Everton's stadium problems
« Reply #25 on: August 9, 2008, 09:54:57 am »
give them a shed and tell em to fuck off

Ignore it, it's a fake link.
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Offline albertared

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Re: Everton's stadium problems
« Reply #26 on: August 9, 2008, 02:48:01 pm »
+2



And it does NOT make financial sense. Which has been posted before the reasoning why.

it doesn't? why not?
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Offline albertared

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Re: Everton's stadium problems
« Reply #27 on: August 9, 2008, 02:49:38 pm »
No Kop.
No This is Anfield sign.
No Shankly/Paisley gates.

No fucking chance.

yes, but our owners don't give a flying fuck about all that so there definitely is a fucking chance. it has been my fear from the time we were sold.
Left England 1990...still on our perch...I think I'd better come back because it's all gone haywire since!

Offline 4pool

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Re: Everton's stadium problems
« Reply #28 on: August 9, 2008, 03:55:07 pm »
it doesn't? why not?

Would you want half the profit from your stadium?

As Everton can't afford their own, can't stump up 1/2 of the cost of ours, do you think that we'll automatically be in the chips collecting from Everton? G&H would have to be assured they get the money first. And if they do, that puts Everton at risk because they too don't get 100% of the profits and are paying for something they can't afford. Which drains their finances and maybe they get relegated because they can't afford new players. And when they do, their income drops even further. Which means they have problems paying even worse. Everton having to come up with 1/2 of the financing puts their beleaguered club into even more peril. ( unless they are sold. In which case a new owner would want their own stadium, not groundshare.)



G&H's financial plan and maximum profits revolves around outright owning the new stadium. As it would DIC or whomever.


And if you'll research ttnbd's explanation about the stadium and potential financing, you will see that it will pay for itself without a drastic drain on resources.
Either we are a club of supporters or become a club of customers.

Offline albertared

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Re: Everton's stadium problems
« Reply #29 on: August 10, 2008, 01:35:26 am »
Would you want half the profit from your stadium?

As Everton can't afford their own, can't stump up 1/2 of the cost of ours, do you think that we'll automatically be in the chips collecting from Everton? G&H would have to be assured they get the money first. And if they do, that puts Everton at risk because they too don't get 100% of the profits and are paying for something they can't afford. Which drains their finances and maybe they get relegated because they can't afford new players. And when they do, their income drops even further. Which means they have problems paying even worse. Everton having to come up with 1/2 of the financing puts their beleaguered club into even more peril. ( unless they are sold. In which case a new owner would want their own stadium, not groundshare.)



G&H's financial plan and maximum profits revolves around outright owning the new stadium. As it would DIC or whomever.


And if you'll research ttnbd's explanation about the stadium and potential financing, you will see that it will pay for itself without a drastic drain on resources.

ok, thanks, most of that makes sense...not totally convinced by the last sentence though, just based on the quotes coming from arsene venger about their problems...i think players' wages are running too far ahead of any reasonable business plan to keep up with them...something has to change soon...if tv revenues fall we will be in serious trouble.
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Offline Morse

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Re: Everton's stadium problems
« Reply #30 on: August 10, 2008, 01:43:19 am »
The day we share a stadium with the bitters is the day I stop being a Liverpool fan.
That will be end game for me.
I will be finished that will put the final nail in the coffin.


What a load of dramatic twaddle!

Offline TSC

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Re: Everton's stadium problems
« Reply #31 on: August 10, 2008, 01:49:35 am »
ok, thanks, most of that makes sense...not totally convinced by the last sentence though, just based on the quotes coming from arsene venger about their problems...i think players' wages are running too far ahead of any reasonable business plan to keep up with them...something has to change soon...if tv revenues fall we will be in serious trouble.

Take the last sentence with a pinch of salt mate.

Offline Alf

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Re: Everton's stadium problems
« Reply #32 on: August 10, 2008, 02:50:12 am »
I'm certain that G & H will not move to a shared stadium because the new stadium is  part of their grand plan to sell us for a massive profit. Whether they'll still be around if\when it gets built I'm not certain of. But I still think a groundshare with Everton is a possibility.

Offline Manila Vanilla

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Re: Everton's stadium problems
« Reply #33 on: August 10, 2008, 03:25:28 am »
Would you want half the profit from your stadium?

And if you'll research ttnbd's explanation about the stadium and potential financing, you will see that it will pay for itself without a drastic drain on resources.

I don’t recall seeing any calculations proving that the new stadium will be profitable. It seems to have become an unquestioned mantra. Personally, I think it will be a drain on resources and we’ll be lucky if it pays for itself over 25 years. I can’t see it providing extra transfer money.

I’ve looked at it two ways. Firstly, by doing rough calculations. We will have large cash outflows for the first few years as we pay interest on interest (not just on capital) and when we have no income for the first 4 years. The additional spectators will only initially give about £15M per year (15,000 people per game x £40 x 25 games?). We expect interest alone to be over £30M per year. The plug is going to have to come from corporate, naming rights, etc.

Another way of looking at it is to consider Man United’s position as being the ultimate we can aim for. Their accounts show they make £50M more than us from “Matchday”. We won’t make £50M as:
1.   They averaged 75,000 per game. Our finished stadium will be smaller (the interim stadium even smaller). And we won’t fill it on wet Wednesday nights…
2.   They charged higher average prices. We discounted tickets for some games.
3.   They have more experience and are better placed geographically for the corporate market.

Our interest cost is projected to be around £30M per year even if we stay within budget. Remember, iron ore and steel are still rising, we’ll no doubt have more expensive redesign costs, etc. Costs of £30M plus are uncomfortably close to revenues of £50M minus… And Arsenal, who charge more than both of us and have tapped the lucrative London corporate market, consider themselves a “selling club” now.

I wouldn’t be at all surprised if ground share rears its head at some time in the future as the only financial solution for both clubs. They may decide that half the losses are better than half the profits.

Offline coffeehead

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Re: Everton's stadium problems
« Reply #34 on: August 10, 2008, 05:32:31 am »
I've said it before and I'll say it again. No matter how much "more" money a club makes, the vast proportion of it will go into players (and agents') pockets and transfer fee inflation (i.e getting the same quality of player as before but for a higher fee). That's the key truism of modern football.

Just look at this closed season and the the extra TV money from the record deal.  Grandiose claims were made about how it would allow clubs to buy more, better players and what do we get? Andy Fucking Johnson going for 11m!!!

More money means higher wages, higher singing on fees , higher agents fees, higher transfer outlay; I can't see the new stadium generating enough extra to make a huge difference for us. Only new investment will do that (IMO) and that ain't gonna come from G&H
« Last Edit: August 10, 2008, 05:34:47 am by coffeehead »

Offline shanklyboy

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Re: Everton's stadium problems
« Reply #35 on: August 11, 2008, 01:03:54 am »
I've said it before and I'll say it again. No matter how much "more" money a club makes, the vast proportion of it will go into players (and agents') pockets and transfer fee inflation (i.e getting the same quality of player as before but for a higher fee). That's the key truism of modern football.

Just look at this closed season and the the extra TV money from the record deal.  Grandiose claims were made about how it would allow clubs to buy more, better players and what do we get? Andy Fucking Johnson going for 11m!!!

More money means higher wages, higher singing on fees , higher agents fees, higher transfer outlay; I can't see the new stadium generating enough extra to make a huge difference for us. Only new investment will do that (IMO) and that ain't gonna come from G&H

Good points there.
Though I don't remember us ever getting a fee for singing........I want my cut backdated...........cash will do!
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Offline albertared

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Re: Everton's stadium problems
« Reply #36 on: August 11, 2008, 05:30:41 am »
I've said it before and I'll say it again. No matter how much "more" money a club makes, the vast proportion of it will go into players (and agents') pockets and transfer fee inflation (i.e getting the same quality of player as before but for a higher fee). That's the key truism of modern football.

Just look at this closed season and the the extra TV money from the record deal.  Grandiose claims were made about how it would allow clubs to buy more, better players and what do we get? Andy Fucking Johnson going for 11m!!!

More money means higher wages, higher singing on fees , higher agents fees, higher transfer outlay; I can't see the new stadium generating enough extra to make a huge difference for us. Only new investment will do that (IMO) and that ain't gonna come from G&H

all true...unless every club gains an abramovich i just don't see how players' wages and fees are sustainable at these levels...the bubble just has to burst at some point
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Offline starskysdad

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Re: Everton's stadium problems
« Reply #37 on: August 11, 2008, 12:41:32 pm »
Cant see what the problem is with this planning permission malarky - Tesco express stores are popping up all over the country - surely they can bang one up - just means seats instead of shelves surely?

Tesco Clubcard today released the following points offers:

3 points - Phil Neville Lookalike mask
5 points - All of last years match day programs
10 points - Hand relief from Amichebe
20 pts - Manage the team for a day
100 pts - Years supply of Tesco carrier bags with Everton player prints carry yer shopping home with the 'Yak'
I'm not saying I disagree with you but, you're pissing in the wind if you think calling someone a c*nt on the net is gonna change the way they think.

Offline irishred1991

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Re: Everton's stadium problems
« Reply #38 on: August 11, 2008, 03:44:33 pm »
better not be a groundshare
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Offline the growler

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Re: Everton's stadium problems
« Reply #39 on: September 10, 2008, 12:47:13 pm »
A ground share will never happen even everton don't want one. our new ground must be 80 thousand seater though we have to be bigger than united we are the biggest team in england we should have the biggest ground we would fill it as well lower the ticket prices abit more people will go the match, club will make more money as more seats will be sold!