Topic: Dani Pacheco

[stardorman]

Dani if you are reading this have you bought a copy of the single yet?

He wont be reading this and he has purchased, all over his twitter feel, him and Suso

[Neil D]

I think he should look to move on in January, probably permanently.

Four different managers haven't been impressed enough by him in training and when he has had the opportunities, he has never really seized them, even if he has played okay or well he just hasn't done enough when you compare him to say Shelvey, Sterling or Suso.

He's not made an impact here when it was his best chance to do so, with our weak squad and injuries, and if he's not getting a look in at present, he probably won't when we sign the likes of Sturridge and Ince. So it has to be time for him to leave I feel.

[GrkStav]

I think he should look to move on in January, probably permanently.

Four different managers haven't been impressed enough by him in training and when he has had the opportunities, he has never really seized them, even if he has played okay or well he just hasn't done enough when you compare him to say Shelvey, Sterling or Suso.

He's not made an impact here when it was his best chance to do so, with our weak squad and injuries, and if he's not getting a look in at present, he probably won't when we sign the likes of Sturridge and Ince. So it has to be time for him to leave I feel.

So, now Ince is considered a better player and prospect that Dani Pacheco? On the basis of good performances in the Championship with Blackpool.

I don't know what's going on, I give up.

[Fromola]

So, now Ince is considered a better player and prospect that Dani Pacheco? On the basis of good performances in the Championship with Blackpool.

I don't know what's going on, I give up.

That's the club's own fault for the way they've misused the player. Pacheco had a short spell in the Championship and looked great. If he'd had a season at somewhere like Blackpool he could have been one of the players in the division rather than the way he's been stuck in the reserve league or sent on a ridiculous loan deal within a loan.

Ince has had the benefit of 18 months of first-team football. The irony is if we'd have kept him he'd have been stuck in our reserves for most of that time and be in the same boat as Pacheco now.

[Chakan]

I think he should look to move on in January, probably permanently.

Four different managers haven't been impressed enough by him in training and when he has had the opportunities, he has never really seized them, even if he has played okay or well he just hasn't done enough when you compare him to say Shelvey, Sterling or Suso.

He's not made an impact here when it was his best chance to do so, with our weak squad and injuries, and if he's not getting a look in at present, he probably won't when we sign the likes of Sturridge and Ince. So it has to be time for him to leave I feel.

He played well in pre season. He's been given 2 opportunities this year. Once as a lone striker up front which he isn't. The other opportunity was in his natural position which I thought he did well.

So that's 2 whole opportunities and 1 off the bench.

[Neil D]

So, now Ince is considered a better player and prospect that Dani Pacheco? On the basis of good performances in the Championship with Blackpool.

I don't know what's going on, I give up.

Strange response. Surely if we're trying to resign Ince for £4m to £6m, then in Rodgers' thinking he will be ahead of a player not getting a look in at all now? Isn't that just obvious?

[Neil D]

That's the club's own fault for the way they've misused the player. Pacheco had a short spell in the Championship and looked great. If he'd had a season at somewhere like Blackpool he could have been one of the players in the division rather than the way he's been stuck in the reserve league or sent on a ridiculous loan deal within a loan.

Ince has had the benefit of 18 months of first-team football. The irony is if we'd have kept him he'd have been stuck in our reserves for most of that time and be in the same boat as Pacheco now.

I don't agree, he could have had more chances here but when he has played he has done okay, not made an impact and demanded more chances like Shelvey, Sterling and Suso.

In the Championship he looked decent, good in spells, but far from great. A bright LFC attacking prospect at a Championship side should be genuinely great more often than not, scoring and assisting and looking a cut above. He should be one o the best players in the league. Dani has never lived up to the hype I'm afraid. A good player but not one who made an impact when the chance arose.

[Sangria]

He played well in pre season. He's been given 2 opportunities this year. Once as a lone striker up front which he isn't. The other opportunity was in his natural position which I thought he did well.

So that's 2 whole opportunities and 1 off the bench.

Also a game against Anzhi after he'd knackered himself out for the reserves a few days before. Catch 22 situation for Pacheco, if he didn't work himself into the ground for the reserves, he wouldn't have had the call up, but after he got the call up because he'd worked himself into the ground just days earlier (how many days rest did he get after the ressie game did he have before he had to fly to Russia?), he had nothing left in the tank and was judged to have failed.

[Chakan]

Also a game against Anzhi after he'd knackered himself out for the reserves a few days before. Catch 22 situation for Pacheco, if he didn't work himself into the ground for the reserves, he wouldn't have had the call up, but after he got the call up because he'd worked himself into the ground just days earlier (how many days rest did he get after the ressie game did he have before he had to fly to Russia?), he had nothing left in the tank and was judged to have failed.

Came on as a sub though. Although have to say I can't really remember at what point he came on.

[Neil D]

He played well in pre season. He's been given 2 opportunities this year. Once as a lone striker up front which he isn't. The other opportunity was in his natural position which I thought he did well.

So that's 2 whole opportunities and 1 off the bench.

The problem is even when he does well he doesn't do enough. I can't recall once being bowled over by one of his performances in a Red shirt. He hasn't created goals or scored them or shown pure talent like Sterling did when he got the chance or Suso when he came on against United or Shelvey with his goals. I think he has been overtaken by the younger generation.

[Chakan]

The problem is even when he does well he doesn't do enough. I can't recall once being bowled over by one of his performances in a Red shirt. He hasn't created goals or scored them or shown pure talent like Sterling did when he got the chance or Suso when he came on against United or Shelvey with his goals. I think he has been overtaken by the younger generation.

He plays in Coles position. As far as I can see Rodgers has chosen him (Cole) over Pacheco for whatever reason. When you've played 2 and half times for the first team, honestly how much of a lasting impression can you make? When one of those times is a in a position you aren't familiar with getting absolutely no service whatsoever.

Anyway what I do agree with is the lad should be moved on permanently. Not for our benefit but for his, for whatever reason his time here isn't working out and he needs games somewhere, and it's clear that he isn't going to get them here.

[Neil D]

He plays in Coles position. As far as I can see Rodgers has chosen him (Cole) over Pacheco for whatever reason. When you've played 2 and half times for the first team, honestly how much of a lasting impression can you make? When one of those times is a in a position you aren't familiar with getting absolutely no service whatsoever.

Anyway what I do agree with is the lad should be moved on permanently. Not for our benefit but for his, for whatever reason his time here isn't working out and he needs games somewhere, and it's clear that he isn't going to get them here.

I suppose he's picked Cole on Cole's past ability and achievements and a belief he can get some of that back out of him. I'm not a Cole fan but he has responded to his faith with a couple of goals and assists.

Dani hasn't made the impression Sterling, Shelvey and Suso have when they got a chance over several seasons, not just under Rodgers. And he clearly isn't doing enough in training to change the manager's, or the previous three managers', minds.

I think he should be moved on for the best interests of us and him.

[Chakan]

I suppose he's picked Cole on Cole's past ability and achievements and a belief he can get some of that back out of him. I'm not a Cole fan but he has responded to his faith with a couple of goals and assists.

Dani hasn't made the impression Sterling, Shelvey and Suso have when they got a chance over several seasons, not just under Rodgers. And he clearly isn't doing enough in training to change the manager's, or the previous three managers', minds.

I think he should be moved on for the best interests of us and him.

Coles played 9 times for us this season, can't really compare the chances given to him this season and Pacheco. Who knows what would have happened had Pacheco got the same opportunities. Cole didn't play for us last season and neither did Pacheco, so you can say Rodgers was blind to both of them.

Personally except for the maybe 2 games this year I think Cole has been absolutely shocking, but that's just my opinion.

As for training no-one can speak to that except the players and trainers themselves.

[G1 Jockey 4(betfair)]

seen pacheco a few times and tbf half the time he has played quite well.

the one time he really played poorly was when he was aksed to play upfront on hsi own lol

just needs more gametime to really find out how good he will be.


sterling has had his chance even though pacheco was better in pre season.

must be money ball politics dictating the dressing room right now.....that might explain downing getting games.

[Neil D]

Coles played 9 times for us this season, can't really compare the chances given to him this season and Pacheco. Who knows what would have happened had Pacheco got the same opportunities. Cole didn't play for us last season and neither did Pacheco, so you can say Rodgers was blind to both of them.

Personally except for the maybe 2 games this year I think Cole has been absolutely shocking, but that's just my opinion.

As for training no-one can speak to that except the players and trainers themselves.

Definitely, I'm just saying why I think Rodgers has gone for Cole over Dani. I agree Cole has been abysmal overall.

It stands to reason that if Dani was more impressive in training and reserve games he would get more chances.

[Neil D]

seen pacheco a few times and tbf half the time he has played quite well.

the one time he really played poorly was when he was aksed to play upfront on hsi own lol

just needs more gametime to really find out how good he will be.


sterling has had his chance even though pacheco was better in pre season.

must be money ball politics dictating the dressing room right now.....that might explain downing getting games.

Not sure pre-season performances carry that much weight.

[NZ Red]

The fact is we really haven't seen enough of him in top level games to make a judgement on his quality. He's always looked like an incredible player in reserve games and on his loan spell in the Championship at Norwich, but he's only been given a handful of opportunities to play in Premier League or European games. And while he's always impressed me whenever awarded a cameo in such matches, it's not enough for me to make a judgement to say if he's good enough to play regularly in these competitions or better than what we currently have available.

At the end of the day he hasn't done enough to convince Hodgson, Kenny or Rodgers that he's up to par, and they are the ones who see him in training. I think that Rafa was looking to slowly introduce him to regular first team appearances, but his subsequent three managers haven't been impressed by him at all. Rodgers seems to have no real desire to keep Downing and has told him publicly that he can leave if he wishes, but he still plays him ahead of Pacheco. This is where the alarm bells start ringing for me. He must not be doing something right in training, as he hasn't managed to convince any manager for some years that he warrants a spot even on the bench of the first team (he couldn't even hold down a regular spot on loan at Rayo).

I've always liked him and thought he'd be a great player for us, and have (like everyone else) been incredibly puzzled by his lack of appearances and development over the past few seasons. What makes the situation even more bizarre is that he was capable of breaking into the toughest national youth squad at every age group, and lit up some of the national youth tournaments. But I guess there is just something missing with him, or else we'd have seen him play more regularly. At this stage it's best for both parties if he moves on as soon as possible. A real shame and will always be a mystery to me.

[Chakan]

Definitely, I'm just saying why I think Rodgers has gone for Cole over Dani. I agree Cole has been abysmal overall.

It stands to reason that if Dani was more impressive in training and reserve games he would get more chances.

I think we are so desperate to get rid of Cole that we are playing him over and over again in the hopes that someone will take him off our hands, when he has a good game or 2.

Don't think we are in the same boat with Pacheco. Hope the lad finds a club that gives him the opportunity in the first team, because it's definitely not going to be here.

[Fordy]

So, now Ince is considered a better player and prospect that Dani Pacheco? On the basis of good performances in the Championship with Blackpool.

I don't know what's going on, I give up.

Don't get what you're trying to say here.

Do you think the Under 21 league is a higher standard than the Championship or something?

[Neil D]

The fact is we really haven't seen enough of him in top level games to make a judgement on his quality. He's always looked like an incredible player in reserve games and on his loan spell in the Championship at Norwich, but he's only been given a handful of opportunities to play in Premier League or European games. And while he's always impressed me whenever awarded a cameo in such matches, it's not enough for me to make a judgement to say if he's good enough to play regularly in these competitions or better than what we currently have available.

At the end of the day he hasn't done enough to convince Hodgson, Kenny or Rodgers that he's up to par, and they are the ones who see him in training. I think that Rafa was looking to slowly introduce him to regular first team appearances, but his subsequent three managers haven't been impressed by him at all. Rodgers seems to have no real desire to keep Downing and has told him publicly that he can leave if he wishes, but he still plays him ahead of Pacheco. This is where the alarm bells start ringing for me. He must not be doing something right in training, as he hasn't managed to convince any manager for some years that he warrants a spot even on the bench of the first team (he couldn't even hold down a regular spot on loan at Rayo).

I've always liked him and thought he'd be a great player for us, and have (like everyone else) been incredibly puzzled by his lack of appearances and development over the past few seasons. What makes the situation even more bizarre is that he was capable of breaking into the toughest national youth squad at every age group, and lit up some of the national youth tournaments. But I guess there is just something missing with him, or else we'd have seen him play more regularly. At this stage it's best for both parties if he moves on as soon as possible. A real shame and will always be a mystery to me.

I agree with most of this, only quibble is that he has been decent or good in reserve games and in the Championship, but far from incredible. He has never produced the performances to match his potential here or in Spain.

[Neil D]

I think we are so desperate to get rid of Cole that we are playing him over and over again in the hopes that someone will take him off our hands, when he has a good game or 2.

Don't think we are in the same boat with Pacheco. Hope the lad finds a club that gives him the opportunity in the first team, because it's definitely not going to be here.

Yeah think there is truth to that but also think his reputation and Rodgers knowledge of his past ability has got him games. And he has responded with moments of quality

[Fordy]

I agree with most of this, only quibble is that he has been decent or good in reserve games and in the Championship, but far from incredible. He has never produced the performances to match his potential here or in Spain.

My main concern is that Norwich didn't want him on loan when they got promoted.

Think Dani should be getting a chance now though ahead of Downing but something is clearly wrong when 3 -4 managers haven't really given him a chance.

[NZ Red]

I agree with most of this, only quibble is that he has been decent or good in reserve games and in the Championship, but far from incredible. He has never produced the performances to match his potential here or in Spain.

Fair call - I'll be more accurate and say a good player with the occasional flash of brilliance

[Chakan]

Yeah think there is truth to that but also think his reputation and Rodgers knowledge of his past ability has got him games. And he has responded with moments of quality

Suppose so, hoping Dani finds a place at Norwich though. Really seemed to get on there.
Will see what Jan has to offer him. If I was his agent I would be taking all offers.

[GrkStav]

Strange response. Surely if we're trying to resign Ince for £4m to £6m, then in Rodgers' thinking he will be ahead of a player not getting a look in at all now? Isn't that just obvious?

What is your independent judgment of the two players?

Do you consider a 4-6 M quid price reasonable for Ince?

How much more are you going to get from Ince, based on your independent evaluation of his performances and potential, than Pacheco?

How much are WE going to get for Pacheco, given how infrequently he's had the chance to showcase his talent and improve? We've been playing Joe Cole, ffs, to put him (I hope that's the reason and not on perceived merit) on the proverbial shop window. What have we done to maximize the value of Pacheco to us in the transfer market?

We sold Ince to Blackpool for 250K with a 35% sell-on clause just 18 months ago. Now, it appears, we're willing to buy him back at an asking price of 6m (which will be reduced for us, given the above). What sense does that make? Is he really worth that much, based on his performances for Blackpool in the Championship?

[Fordy]

What is your independent judgment of the two players?

Do you consider a 4-6 M quid price reasonable for Ince?

How much more are you going to get from Ince, based on your independent evaluation of his performances and potential, than Pacheco?

How much are WE going to get for Pacheco, given how infrequently he's had the chance to showcase his talent and improve? We've been playing Joe Cole, ffs, to put him (I hope that's the reason and not on perceived merit) on the proverbial shop window. What have we done to maximize the value of Pacheco to us in the transfer market?

We sold Ince to Blackpool for 250K with a 35% sell-on clause just 18 months ago. Now, it appears, we're willing to buy him back at an asking price of 6m (which will be reduced for us, given the above). What sense does that make? Is he really worth that much, based on his performances for Blackpool in the Championship?

Let's not turn this into a transfer thread.

But to answer your questions - yes he is. It was our fault for letting him go in the 1st place.

Already an under 21 player and done that while in the Championship. Considering we paid 18m for Henderson who is mainly an Under 21 player plus figures of 15m being talked about for Wilford Zaha then 4m for one of the Championships best players is a bloody steal.

[Chakan]

Let's not turn this into a transfer thread.

But to answer your questions - yes he is. It was our fault for letting him go in the 1st place.

Already an under 21 player and done that while in the Championship. Considering we paid 18m for Henderson who is mainly an Under 21 player plus figures of 15m being talked about for Wilford Zaha then 4m for one of the Championships best players is a bloody steal.

Come on mate there is no way you can compare Ince to Henderson who played 79 times for Sunderland.

[Fordy]

Come on mate there is no way you can compare Ince to Henderson who played 79 times for Sunderland.

Not comparing them two directly.

Point I was trying to make is that Ince's value will increase being in the 21 squad and being British.

No reason he can't be a 18m player in years to come.

 4m is peanuts for an under 21 player these days.

[Chakan]

Not comparing them two directly.

Point I was trying to make is that Ince's value will increase being in the 21 squad and being British. 4m is peanuts for an under 21 player these days.

Fair enough.

[Neil D]

What is your independent judgment of the two players?

Do you consider a 4-6 M quid price reasonable for Ince?

How much more are you going to get from Ince, based on your independent evaluation of his performances and potential, than Pacheco?

How much are WE going to get for Pacheco, given how infrequently he's had the chance to showcase his talent and improve? We've been playing Joe Cole, ffs, to put him (I hope that's the reason and not on perceived merit) on the proverbial shop window. What have we done to maximize the value of Pacheco to us in the transfer market?

We sold Ince to Blackpool for 250K with a 35% sell-on clause just 18 months ago. Now, it appears, we're willing to buy him back at an asking price of 6m (which will be reduced for us, given the above). What sense does that make? Is he really worth that much, based on his performances for Blackpool in the Championship?

Firstly, my independent judgement of the two players is a separate argument. I was talking about Dani's role at the club and the thinking of the man that matters, Brendan Rodgers, and all I was saying was that if he isn't getting a look in and isn't in the manager's thinking now, he probably won't be when (or if) our manager signs two more attacking players in Sturridge and Ince who would join the likes of Suarez, Borini, Shelvey, Sterling, Suso, Cole, Downing etc who are already ahead of Dani. To which you replied somewhat unnecessarily abruptly with that comment and "I don't know what's going on, I give up"!

I've not personally seen enough of Ince at senior level to truly evaluate his worth, and my opinion is hardly important compared to our manager's. But FWIW, I don't get to see Blackpool matches and all I know is that he looked like he had potential for us at youth level when I saw him on LFC TV, and he's done fantastically well there, scoring 13 goals and setting up nine in just 20 league games. I don't think clearly that selling so low and buying so high makes sense, but his performances in the Championship have been far more impressive than Dani's at Norwich. I don't think Dani has shown enough in a red shirt. Hopefully Ince will.

If Ince had never played for us and we were after a young player with such brilliant stats in the Championship for say £4m I would be excited and I think most fans would too. It doesn't seem extortionate when you take our prior ownership out of the equation. So I would say £4m is reasonable.

I don't think Dani has great worth in the transfer market sadly.

[john_mac]

I don't think Dani has great worth in the transfer market sadly.

We can't give him away

[gazzathered]

How Cole and Pacheceo are getting game time in front of him amazes me.

[NZ Red]

How Cole and Pacheceo are getting game time in front of him amazes me.

Fucking clones

[Dirk18Kuyt]

I think at the rapid rate we're offloading players it doesn't take a wild guess to work out that Pacheco and Wilson etc are off next, so why can't he be given a chance?! I don't get it at all to be honest. Not at all.

[Danny_]

Time's up for Pacheco.  I'm very disappointed that Wilson didn't make it either.  Had high hopes for him.   

[Neil D]

How Cole and Pacheceo are getting game time in front of him amazes me.

Fucking clones

 

[irish musicman]

seems LFC are looking to loan Dani out in Jan, might not be all over for him yet, maybe one more chance to show what he can do.

[dast18]

Daniel Pacheco ‏@dani37pacheco
Here u got @AMorgan94 having his steak and no sharing with anyone. Enjoy goal machine. Ready for tomorrow. 😜😘👍🎅 pic.twitter.com/jfAtgxFT

adam morgan ‏@AMorgan94
@dani37pacheco hahah dani!! Only just seen that.. Thanks very much for paying my bill along with everyone elses in there very kind! #topman

Seems like Dani did a Balotelli! Very nice touch

[tanvir]

Seems like Dani did a Balotelli! Very nice touch

Loan him to Derby County so he might end up in the same restaurant as me...

[blacksun]

Surely if the Ince deal is real it would be a good opportunity to send him to Blackpool on loan til the end of the season and see how he does, they will need another attacking player after all.