Topic: Brexit - doesn't really seem to be a very good idea does it? (*)

[west_london_red]

What are the bookies odds that we end up with a deal in two years time?

I reckon there's almost no chance ....

Would depend on what you define as a deal? An agreement to share information on security and sorting out the situation of immigrants in the EU and UK (probably two of least contentious issues) could be defined as 'a deal' with no mention of trade or the more complicated subjects covered.

[Priest078]

Sad day today.

They have jus been back to Sunderland on radio 4', it's definitely all about immigration with them lot.

[SlowRap]

17 things European funding has done for Merseyside
http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/news/liverpool-news/17-things-european-funding-done-10925208

That's the reason why I voted IN, because I'm sure the Tories will not match the spending EU has done for my city - yes they bought my vote per say. Reading this thread though no lessons have been learnt by the pro EU camp - still calling people stupid, racist, etc. for wanting out without really understanding the principle. Try and ignore the posh tone but this guy is spot on https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hLqDIZwr378

[The North Bank]

Need to move the argument on now, cant believe people are still arguing why they voted in or out, its done, cant be reversed, we shat the bed, now we have to lie in it.
What will shape the country's future is what deal our unelected prime minister who voted in will get us while exiting. If we can remain part of a single market and keep the trade agreements then its not so bad. If Europe boots us into the kerb, there may be very dark times ahead , but at least there'll always be immigrants to fear and blame.

[Libertine]

Continued shit hurling really does nothing, the individual voter is at fault for nothing.

The Tories are the ones responsible for getting us in this mess, and for the time being they're going to be the ones to continually fuck the process.

How are voters (that voted to leave) not responsible for this? They knew exactly what they were doing, chose to pander to the prejuduces and narrow mindedness of the leave campaign and this is where we ended up. People need to take responsibility for their actions - they are adults and openly chose this destructive course. They now have to live with it.

[Trada]

Fucking helll Sky News with their Brexit deadline countdown clock are they really going to keep that onscreen for 2 years. 

[Ray K]

Fucking helll Sky News with their Brexit deadline countdown clock are they really going to keep that onscreen for 2 years. 

Just wait until they bring in Jim White to host the last day countdown.

[zero zero]

That's the reason why I voted IN, because I'm sure the Tories will not match the spending EU has done for my city - yes they bought my vote per say. Reading this thread though no lessons have been learnt by the pro EU camp - still calling people stupid, racist, etc. for wanting out without really understanding the principle. Try and ignore the posh tone but this guy is spot on https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hLqDIZwr378

Sorry you're quoting Jacob Rees-Mogg, it's impossible to get past his posh tone.

What lessons am I supposed to have learned?

[Red-Soldier]

Need to move the argument on now, cant believe people are still arguing why they voted in or out, its done, cant be reversed, we shat the bed, now we have to lie in it.
What will shape the country's future is what deal our unelected prime minister who voted in will get us while exiting. If we can remain part of a single market and keep the trade agreements then its not so bad. If Europe boots us into the kerb, there may be very dark times ahead , but at least there'll always be immigrants to fear and blame.

Says a person that thinks we send soldiers to other countries to murder people.

I dont know about everyone else in this thread, but, I cannot accept a result with a majority of 52-48.  The margin isn't large enough to change the whole future direction of this country.  It's not right!

Plus the whole Leave campaign was based on total bollocks, xenophobia and racism.

Why should nearly half of the 67% that voted just shut up and get on with it?

[Rastas]

Says a person that thinks we send soldiers to other countries to murder people.

I dont know about everyone else in this thread, but, I cannot accept a result with a majority of 52-48.  The margin isn't large enough to change the whole future direction of this country.  It's not right!

Plus the whole Leave campaign was based on total bollocks, xenophobia and racism.

Why should nearly half of the 67% that voted just shut up and get on with it?

Because they lost?

[youll never walk alone it]

Don't think it would be too bad for us in England. Plus imagine how great it will be to see the United Kingdom break apart? All the super patriotic people will have their precious union in the dustbin.

Nail on head!

[Zeb]

Because they lost?

Not really how it works. Or we'd not have had the referendum in the first place.

[Dr. Beaker]

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-mps-leave-meeting-protest-gloomy-report-on-life-after-eu-economy-too-remain-a7654801.html




"The report was simply reflecting what Brexit David Davis had said to the committee, but they didn't like that it was put in a poor light."

[killer-heels]

Just wait until they bring in Jim White to host the last day countdown.

'... we are just getting word here at Sky that the UK have made a last minute bid for tarriff free access for motor vehicles out of the UK, but in return the EU want a higher quota for salmon fishing"

[Trada]

Personally I think one of the really big hurdles to the Brexit deal will be Spain and Gibraltar.

Spain will want something there or they will veto the whole deal.

I will be shocked if they don't threaten that at some point.

[Craig S]

Because they lost?

Everyone lost, mate.
We also don't live in a dictatorship, without voice of protest.

[So… Howard Philips]

Sad day today.

They have jus been back to Sunderland on radio 4', it's definitely all about immigration with them lot.

Nick Clegg was in Ebbw Vale last night. Despite only having 2% non Ebbw born residents the locals trotted out immigration as a problem when they weren't complaining that the steelworks and mines have closed.

You cannot argue with that degree of illogicality.

The Tories closed both industries and merrily sold off, to use Harold McMillan's words, "the family silver" to a host of international investors. How many, if any, of our utilities are British owned. None I'd venture.

 I can guarantee in four years time neither the residents od America's rust belt states or oir equivalents in Sunderland and Ebbw Vale will be no better of and, probably, worse off than now.

[nick_8589]

Because they lost?

Yeah because that's how it works, you make it sound like a game.

[killer-heels]

Personally I think one of the really big hurdles to the Brexit deal will be Spain and Gibraltar.

Spain will want something there or they will veto the whole deal.

I will be shocked if they don't threaten that at some point.

It will be interesting to see how the EU internal politics will play out here. Germany and France, provided Macron wins, normally calls the shots and certainly Germany are reported to be most likely to offer us a good deal.

[Bangin Them In]

Watch the headlines

Good day to bury fuck ups

[west_london_red]

It will be interesting to see how the EU internal politics will play out here. Germany and France, provided Macron wins, normally calls the shots and certainly Germany are reported to be most likely to offer us a good deal.

When push comes to shove its usually the Germans who get their way. France wanted to give Greece some leeway on their debts and actually forgo some of what is owed, Germany didn't and so the EU didn't.

[Red-Soldier]

Because they lost?

Oh dear 

We all lost.

It's not like winning a raffle or a competition, this is serious stuff.

Do you know how a democracy works??

[G1 Jockey 4(betfair)]

Germany might get sensible and realise that a small hit on their car industry but gaining in services is a good way to ballance out reliance int heir economy.

[killer-heels]

When push comes to shove its usually the Germans who get their way. France wanted to give Greece some leeway on their debts and actually forgo some of what is owed, Germany didn't and so the EU didn't.

Its an interesting balancing act for Merkel long term. Any sort of economic down turn is never well received regardless of the political rationale for it at the time.

Personally, I would take the gamble and slap tariffs on products coming out of the UK. Despite the rhetoric, the Tories are so anti tarriff that I dont even believe they would slap on reciprocal tariffs.

[kennedy81]

It's a sad day. The whole thing is just thoroughly depressing from an Irish point of view. If I was a UK citizen I'd be absolutely fucking seething.

Keep your heads up folks, there's many battles still to be won.

[killer-heels]

Germany might get sensible and realise that a small hit on their car industry but gaining in services is a good way to ballance out reliance int heir economy.

I dont think car manufacturers will take a hit because i dont think the British government will slap tariffs on products coming in to the UK. It goes against the Tory DNA and it will mean the consumer nation we reside in grinds to a slowdown.

I think Merkel should take the punishment gamble. That said, her own agenda could be under threat if there is a slowdown in Germany.

[west_london_red]

Its an interesting balancing act for Merkel long term. Any sort of economic down turn is never well received regardless of the political rationale for it at the time.

Personally, I would take the gamble and slap tariffs on products coming out of the UK. Despite the rhetoric, the Tories are so anti tarriff that I dont even believe they would slap on reciprocal tariffs.

Thing is there are a million different way this could play, and so many unknows that I haven't seen any reference to. How much would the UK be likely to receive in tariffs from EU nations exports with the UK being such a big importer? Another grey area at least for me personally is where do tariffs for goods coming into the EU (including the UK) current go - eg when a car comes here from say the US some tariffs would be paid - where do they currently go? I think its the EU but am not 100% and how much is this that would then go directly to the UK in the future?

[Haemoglobin]

It's a sad day. The whole thing is just thoroughly depressing from an Irish point of view. If I was a UK citizen I'd be absolutely fucking seething.

Keep your heads up folks, there's many battles still to be won.

I honestly am mate, as much as I knew it was always coming, and the next notch up on that fucked scale is being from Merseyside too.


Putting aside for a moment the issue of EU-funded turkeys voting for Christmas (good luck replacing all that), the just-can't-be-arsed no-shows, and the completely oblivious eeny-meeny-miney-moe crowd utterly shocked to see such repercussions (that is, cushions laid out for the reaper, heh)...


35-44: 52% Remain
25-34: 62% Remain
18-24: 73% Remain
Under 18: No vote



The people have spoken though, of course.

[youll never walk alone it]

Few on social media talking about getting irish pazzys.

[killer-heels]

Thing is there are a million different way this could play, and so many unknows that I haven't seen any reference to. How much would the UK be likely to receive in tariffs from EU nations exports with the UK being such a big importer? Another grey area at least for me personally is where do tariffs for goods coming into the EU (including the UK) current go - eg when a car comes here from say the US some tariffs would be paid - where do they currently go? I think its the EU but am not 100% and how much is this that would then go directly to the UK in the future?

I fully believe that the UK wont put tariffs on imports from the EU. Why would you when that and the exchange rate just fucks consumers? The change would be too great for the public and the UK government would want conditions for consumers to be as close to currently as possible. It removes a massive headache by making access to the UK free as it is now and its a battle no one really wants in government apart from the nutter Brexiteers.

However, there will be tariffs for what we export so i think the government will aim to focus all its resources in helping UK based exporters. Whether it be tax breaks, infrastructure projects, work visas, training etc.

Nissan apparently made demands over charging point infrastructure and conviniently the government has announced further investment into that.

[sms1986]

Few on social media talking about getting irish pazzys.

One of my friends got an Irish passport recently, although he's been wanting to get one for years, the referendum result was just the final straw.

[west_london_red]

I honestly am mate, as much as I knew it was always coming, and the next notch up on that fucked scale is being from Merseyside too.


Putting aside for a moment the issue of EU-funded turkeys voting for Christmas (good luck replacing all that), the just-can't-be-arsed no-shows, and the completely oblivious eeny-meeny-miney-moe crowd utterly shocked to see such repercussions (that is, cushions laid out for the reaper, heh)...


35-44: 52% Remain
25-34: 62% Remain
18-24: 73% Remain
Under 18: No vote



The people have spoken though, of course.

The people did speak, at least the ones who bothered voting. We get the government we deserve when there is such apathy by the people most impacted by the actions of this government.

[oldfordie]

Need to move the argument on now, cant believe people are still arguing why they voted in or out, its done, cant be reversed, we shat the bed, now we have to lie in it.
What will shape the country's future is what deal our unelected prime minister who voted in will get us while exiting. If we can remain part of a single market and keep the trade agreements then its not so bad. If Europe boots us into the kerb, there may be very dark times ahead , but at least there'll always be immigrants to fear and blame.

We haven't made our bed yet. if things go wrong then it's obvious what will happen next, in 2 yrs the Torys will tell us we have to give this at least 7 yrs before we feel the benefit of leaving so full steam ahead.
I would hope people reconsider, I dont want those same leave voters telling us to be quiet and get behind the country while forcing our MPs to accept a hard Brexit.
Have you read the profiles of the EU trade negotiators? they feel strongly over protecting the 4 freedoms. no access to the SM without FOM.

[Craig S]

When push comes to shove its usually the Germans who get their way. France wanted to give Greece some leeway on their debts and actually forgo some of what is owed, Germany didn't and so the EU didn't.

Surely to cut Greece debt, all nations would need to agree. So Germany would have just been using or threatening it's power of veto.
If Germany were to dictate this deal, they need all other nations not to use their veto, which is a very different ballgame.

[west_london_red]

I fully believe that the UK wont put tariffs on imports from the EU. Why would you when that and the exchange rate just fucks consumers? The change would be too great for the public and the UK government would want conditions for consumers to be as close to currently as possible. It removes a massive headache by making access to the UK free as it is now and its a battle no one really wants in government apart from the nutter Brexiteers.

However, there will be tariffs for what we export so i think the government will aim to focus all its resources in helping UK based exporters. Whether it be tax breaks, infrastructure projects, work visas, training etc.

Under WTO rules I don't think we can just allow EU goods in with no tariffs, we would have to allow goods in from all countries with in the WTO with no tariffs.

[quinny]

I honestly am mate, as much as I knew it was always coming, and the next notch up on that fucked scale is being from Merseyside too.

Putting aside for a moment the issue of EU-funded turkeys voting for Christmas (good luck replacing all that), the just-can't-be-arsed no-shows, and the completely oblivious eeny-meeny-miney-moe crowd utterly shocked to see such repercussions (that is, cushions laid out for the reaper, heh)...

35-44: 52% Remain
25-34: 62% Remain
18-24: 73% Remain
Under 18: No vote

The people have spoken though, of course.

They have, and they voted to Leave. I voted Remain but if 'we' had won and Leave voters were out protesting everyone on here would be saying you had a vote and lost, that's democracy, we need to move on etc. Believe me I think it's a shocking decision by the public and can't believe we're leaving, but we voted and that's what most people wanted. How we leave is a different matter, but the upshot is we're leaving.

Oh dear 

We all lost.

It's not like winning a raffle or a competition, this is serious stuff.

Do you know how a democracy works??

Do you? More people voted to Leave than Remain, so we're leaving.

[west_london_red]

Surely to cut Greece debt, all nations would need to agree. So Germany would have just been using or threatening it's power of veto.
If Germany were to dictate this deal, they need all other nations not to use their veto, which is a very different ballgame.

Technically your probably right, but in reality its very different. There was no push from the EU to share the burden of refugees from Syria when it was just Greece and Italy having to bear the burden, once they started arriving in Germany it became an EU problem and steps taken to share refugees across the EU (although some countries are still refusing)

[Crosby Nick]

'... we are just getting word here at Sky that the UK have made a last minute bid for tarriff free access for motor vehicles out of the UK, but in return the EU want a higher quota for salmon fishing"

We're getting reports that Peter Odemwingie has arrived at the Port of Calais claiming he wants to come back to the UK... But has sensationally be turned away.

[killer-heels]

Under WTO rules I don't think we can just allow EU goods in with no tariffs, we would have to allow goods in from all countries with in the WTO with no tariffs.

Yes but thats exactly what we will do I reckon.

[west_london_red]

What people? Because the overall nationwide result was decidely narrow one, and for the under-40s who will face the consequences the longest, and various indispensible economic & cultural hub areas, it was a definite Remain. Are they not the people too?

'The people' were not and are not in unison on this, stop fuelling that shite.

How many under 40's voted?