Topic: Injury (and absence) related chat (so the news is kept in the other thread)

[Machae]

Dare I ask, but whats the update on Keita. Back in training or still.injured? What's the likely estimated return date?

[SamLad]

no word on Jota yet?

[JasonF]

Dare I ask, but whats the update on Keita. Back in training or still.injured? What's the likely estimated return date?

Due back this month which I guess means in the next two weeks. Klopp mentioned him as not being ready yet in a recent press conference which gave me the impression that he's close. Ox and Jones just seemed to reappear in training without any fanfare so he'll likely be the same.

no word on Jota yet?

I guess we should hear in tomorrow's press conference if nothing comes out in the late press tonight.

[Too early for flapjacks?]

Dare I ask, but whats the update on Keita. Back in training or still.injured? What's the likely estimated return date?

No recent update but Klopp said last month that he was due back in training in October. Ox rejoined training without any notice from Klopp or the journalists so might be similar with Keita but wouldn't expect him to make the match day squad until November.

[So… Howard Philips]

no word on Jota yet?

I’m resigned to him being out at least to the World Cup, the way this season has gone.

Weirdly all the discussion about signing a midfielder rather than Nunez may become temporarily redundant as our injured midfield return and our forward options are limited.

[El Lobo]

I’m resigned to him being out at least to the World Cup, the way this season has gone.

Weirdly all the discussion about signing a midfielder rather than Nunez may become temporarily redundant as our injured midfield return and our forward options are limited.

Aye, ironically had a fair amount of CMs available at the weekend and a distinct lack of attacking and CB cover!

[gerrardisgod]

Still nothing on Gordon? A couple of our youngsters have found themselves unluckily out when chances would have been available.

[DelTrotter]

Jurgen's PC in an hour, let's hope there's some better news for the thread. But expecting Diogo out for ages and another 1 or 2 injuries that weren't obvious on Sunday.

[newterp]

I fear Gordon is going to go the way of Brewster - another uber talented youth player that misses significant key development time which prevents their entry to the first team.

[Kop Kings]

I fear Gordon is going to go the way of Brewster - another uber talented youth player that misses significant key development time which prevents their entry to the first team.

Genuinely feels like he's been injured for about a year, with no actual clarification on his injury (although I may well have missed something) - such a shame, really liked the look of him. Still, fingers crossed for the lad and hope he can get back into the squad in the coming weeks

[Too early for flapjacks?]

It's a pelvic problem linked to his physical growth in regards to Kaide Gordon. So doesn't sound like he has had an injury in a game/training or required surgery. Sounds like the club are being careful with a young player to make sure he doesn't have issues in the long term.

[Fromola]

I fear Gordon is going to go the way of Brewster - another uber talented youth player that misses significant key development time which prevents their entry to the first team.

Always seems to happen to our best prospects. Glatzel was really promising and then was out injured for years after doing his ACL. Layton Stewart another one. Obviously Harvey Elliott last season with a horrible injury. Curtis Jones constant injuries as well over the last year

[Tokyoite]

Abola saying Jota will miss the WC.. 

[Chakan]

FFS every game we have an injury that costs us a player for at least 2-3 weeks.

[TepidT2O]

So the question is whether it’s a grade 2 or 3 strain.

Grade 2 is 4-8 weeks, grade 3 is 8-12.

I wonder if they know which it is yet.? Hopefully back straight after the World Cup but we will need to see.

The good news? No operation is needed

[JasonF]

So the question is whether it’s a grade 2 or 3 strain.

Grade 2 is 4-8 weeks, grade 3 is 8-12.

I wonder if they know which it is yet.? Hopefully back straight after the World Cup but we will need to see.

The good news? No operation is needed

I think Jurgen said "months not weeks" so we probably fear it's the latter. But he said we'll know more in a few days.

[killer-heels]

Konate also won't be back in team training until Saturday.

[Kashinoda]

Gutted for him

[RyanBabel19]

Are we doing something wrong? This is a huge amount of injuries and seems way too persistent to be just pure bad luck

[Chakan]

Are we doing something wrong? This is a huge amount of injuries and seems way too persistent to be just pure bad luck

This isn't a training injury though, this was more the way he turned/landed/twisted his leg.

[William Regal]

Any news on matip?

[TepidT2O]

I think Jurgen said "months not weeks" so we probably fear it's the latter. But he said we'll know more in a few days.

Two months or three months.. 

That seems to be the option

[donnerz]

Any news on matip?

"Still a little bit away"

[TepidT2O]

Any news on matip?

Not close to returning

[Persephone]

Are we doing something wrong? This is a huge amount of injuries and seems way too persistent to be just pure bad luck

We must be, the amount of non contact soft tissue injuries we've been getting are extreme.

[Too early for flapjacks?]

We'd done pretty well injury wise the 18 months before this season. I think we'd expect a little increase in issues due to the long season last year, late summer internationals, and early start to the season, but we are doing a lot worse than the other teams in the league. I think even Klopp said earlier in the season that it's something we will need to evaluate. Maybe a longer summer break for the players like City did and simply accept some players miss the start of the season and others won't be at full speed come the first game of the season. Maybe it's something we are asking our players to do during their break or something we should be asking them to do. Maybe we put too much load into the players in pre-season. Probably a combination of many things but you'd think there is more than luck at play and our sports science team/coaching team need to work together to do better.

[stjohns]

Are we doing something wrong? This is a huge amount of injuries and seems way too persistent to be just pure bad luck

96th minute is shit bad luck. Plus, apart from the header, he’d had a brilliant game.

[RyanBabel19]

This isn't a training injury though, this was more the way he turned/landed/twisted his leg.

I mean more in the way of overtraining/too high of an intensity with too high a regularity... surely that would then stretch to games as well, no? I'm also not talking specifically about Jotas injury but the level of injuries week after week as a club

I'm not saying what is the case either way just raising the question as it just seems to be a recurring problem (obviously compounded by other types of injuries being mixed in) but we seemingly get such a high amount of injuries with alarming regularity.

We've gotta be a mile ahead of anyone else in terms of players being out injured across this season so far.

[shank94]

Jota just another name added in a list of many more, and some still to come. Playing the WC in between the season, so many of these players will lose 4 years because of this, horrible.

[Dave McCoy]

So there's no website that does an aggregate of days missed, right? I asked the other day and nobody responded.

[keyop]

So there's no website that does an aggregate of days missed, right? I asked the other day and nobody responded.

I replied, but not sure it was much help.

Might be too early in the season for anyone to have done the analysis, but I recall in 2020/21 we were double the next nearest team (Leicester) in terms of player games missed through injury.

Wouldn't surprise me if we're on a similar trajectory now. We've been hovering around 5-6 players out at any one time this season already (it was as high as 10 at one point), and most clubs have been around 1-3. We were actually as low as 3 players out injured (Ox, Keita, Ramsay), but that lasted only a few days.

I don't think there's any one factor causing it. It's likely a combination of injury prone players, our intensity, the sheer number of games, some bad luck, cumulative fatigue over the seasons, and the strenuous training required to get us to the levels we've achieved under Jurgen.

I think one of the media outlets did some analysis in Spring 2021 (as we were so screwed by injuries), and those figures were picked up and shared on social media. Transfermarkt also have a ton of data on individual injuries/games missed, but I've not seen an aggregate list for each team split by season. I'll post on here if I find anything, as it'd be interesting to see how each team has fared over the years.

[Dave McCoy]

I replied, but not sure it was much help.I think one of the media outlets did some analysis in Spring 2021 (as we were so screwed by injuries), and those figures were picked up and shared on social media. Transfermarkt also have a ton of data on individual injuries/games missed, but I've not seen an aggregate list for each team split by season. I'll post on here if I find anything, as it'd be interesting to see how each team has fared over the years.

No I saw you replied with how we were tied with Leicester for days missed but you didn't link to anything. Do you have the link for that at least? Would be someplace to start.

Just you want to say that yes, the club has gotten something badly wrong this season but without any context it's hard to really make that argument one way or another.

[keyop]

So there's no website that does an aggregate of days missed, right? I asked the other day and nobody responded.

Here's some interesting data on injuries - done by an insurance group that's created a European Injury Index to measure the impact on the clubs in each of the top 5 European leagues. It's packed full of analysis on each of the top 6 clubs in each league, including number of injuries, durations, financial impact, type of injuries, injuries by player age, by player position, and a lot more.

The main publication starts here:
https://view.publitas.com/howden-uk-group/howden-sport-and-entertainment-european-injury-index-2022/page/1

The Premier League section starts here:
https://view.publitas.com/howden-uk-group/howden-sport-and-entertainment-european-injury-index-2022/page/48-49

It's a long document but a few things jump out:

The Premier League had 27% of all injuries across the top 5 leagues.

In 2018/19 there were 495 injuries in the PL
In 2019/20 that rose to 562
In 2020/21 it jumped to 938
Last season it rose again to 1231

The report says the PL is likely much higher due to the high tempo, physicality, and fixture congestion.

You're welcome 

[Dave McCoy]

You're welcome 

Thanks!

[aussie_ox]

Are we doing something wrong? This is a huge amount of injuries and seems way too persistent to be just pure bad luck

My thoughts exactly.  Maybe time for a new medical team.   Impact injuries cannot be held against them but this season we've had way too many soft tissue injuries.   We started the season with half our midfield injured!

[kcbworth]

Jota just another name added in a list of many more, and some still to come. Playing the WC in between the season, so many of these players will lose 4 years because of this, horrible.

Very real risk that players (at all clubs in all comps) wont give 100% now to avoid this risk

[aussie_ox]

"Still a little bit away"

Out until the WC which would make sense. 

[ScouserAtHeart]

On Darwin Núñez: “He is one of the cases where we need to have a look because he was not injured, but he felt something and I don’t know if he feels that still today and what the medical department tells me then, we have to see.”

On Joel Matip: “Good, everything is going well, but he needs a bit of time. I think with him it will be tight until the World Cup break, hopefully the last two or three games he might be in contention, but I don’t know yet. It is all going in the right direction.”

On Naby Keita: “He was only involved in parts [in team training], but will be from Monday on - I think, like Ibou [Konate] - both will be involved in full training after the Nottingham Forest game on, which is obviously good. But then Naby especially needs time, Ibou not that much because he was not out that long. Naby is a bit behind Oxlade - Oxlade trains now for four or five days with us, so that is better but he was out for a long time as well.”

https://www.theguardian.com/football/live/2022/oct/21/weekend-countdown-premier-league-aston-villa-chelsea-manchester-united-live

[Garnier]

Jurgen just used that "wife waits for the husband in prison" line he used for Ox in 2018 to describe the Jota situation

spooky news

[disgraced cake]

Jurgen just used that "wife waits for the husband in prison" line he used for Ox in 2018 to describe the Jota situation

spooky news

Fairly sure he used this for Van Dijk too.

'It's alright though lad, he walked off the pitch!'