Topic: Welcome to LFC Ben Doak

[amir87]

He's got the smile of a serial killer.

[farawayred]

Only a couple of days ago he was 16... His aging rate is way too high; he'll be 30 in a blink of an eye... FSG out!

What an exciting prospect! I pray he stays injury-free and develops his full potential.

[Robinred]

Needs to get that hair sorted.

It’s the haircut every youngster I saw in Ireland, of all places, had when I was there earlier this year - short back and sides, pudding basin style, but with an eyebrow length fringe.

[terry_macss_perm]

Playing for Scotland u21s tonight. Live on the bbc sport website.

[MBL?]

Playing for Scotland u21s tonight. Live on the bbc sport website.

Was their best player and got an assist in their defeat.

He definitely already looks like he will make a proper career out of the game but I have my doubts on whether he can be much more than a squad player for us for a few more years. This lad is a pure front 3 player in our system and in that system goals and assists are needed for us to compete at the level we need to be at. He does look the best since Sterling but won’t get the same game time as Sterling did because we are far better than when he broke into the side.

Like anyone else I want him to succeed here but we have to be realistic and this lad already looks like he could get significant minutes in the league elsewhere so I’m not sure he will be happy sitting on the bench for a few years. Maybe a loan at the start of next season would be a good thing or maybe he gets more minutes and is able to produce straight away.

A lot of assumptions have been made here but no different to anyone else!

[MBL?]

Before anyone says he’s just turned 17.. Some lads develop quicker and need to play at a higher level. It’s apparent this fella is one of them.

[Dim Glas]

Was their best player and got an assist in their defeat.

He definitely already looks like he will make a proper career out of the game but I have my doubts on whether he can be much more than a squad player for us for a few more years. This lad is a pure front 3 player in our system and in that system goals and assists are needed for us to compete at the level we need to be at. He does look the best since Sterling but won’t get the same game time as Sterling did because we are far better than when he broke into the side.

Like anyone else I want him to succeed here but we have to be realistic and this lad already looks like he could get significant minutes in the league elsewhere so I’m not sure he will be happy sitting on the bench for a few years. Maybe a loan at the start of next season would be a good thing or maybe he gets more minutes and is able to produce straight away.

A lot of assumptions have been made here but no different to anyone else!

He’s more than 6 years younger than our next youngest first team forward in Darwin.  If he really is a special talent as suggested - and as seen in glimpses so far, he’ll make it. For sure going out on loan might be in his future, but if he carries on the path he is on now, no reason to think he can’t be more than just a squad player.

[MBL?]

He’s more than 6 years younger than our next youngest first team forward in Darwin.  If he really is a special talent as suggested - and as seen in glimpses so far, he’ll make it. For sure going out on loan might be in his future, but if he carries on the path he is on now, no reason to think he can’t be more than just a squad player.

All I’m saying is that right now the most likely outlook is squad player and I don’t think a dynamic young player like this wants to be a back up for a long time. He may well be exceptional out the gate and that is what is needed from any first team forward that is in the first team squad.

[El Lobo]

 

I mean.....he has just turned 17. He's still months younger than other notorious young starters like Owen and Sterling. It doesn't really make sense that you think he could get significant minutes elsewhere in the league, at just turned 17, but you think his most likely outlook is a squad player. If you think he could be getting significant minutes in the PL at just turned 17, that suggests a massively high ceiling. I think that Romeo Lavia is probably the youngest player in the league playing significant minutes and he's over a year older than Doak. He hasn't just moved from Celtic to Liverpool with the expectation that he's a first team regular before he's 19.

[Clint Eastwood]

I mean, best case scenario is that he's so good that he can eventually replace Mo on the right, which is probably 2 years away?

I think he has a good clear path to the first team here. He'll be largely appearing as a sub this season, starting cup games next year and then if all goes well he could be a serious player for us. I wouldn't want to see him go out on loan, he needs as much nurturing under Klopp as possible.

[Fromola]

Hopefully he stays fit and keeps developing. He's more or less where Gordon was a year ago.

Special talent.

[killer-heels]

I mean, best case scenario is that he's so good that he can eventually replace Mo on the right, which is probably 2 years away?

I think he has a good clear path to the first team here. He'll be largely appearing as a sub this season, starting cup games next year and then if all goes well he could be a serious player for us. I wouldn't want to see him go out on loan, he needs as much nurturing under Klopp as possible.

Replacing one of our greatest ever players with a player who is 18/19 at the time? Unlikely.

[El Lobo]

Replacing one of our greatest ever players with a player who is 18/19 at the time? Unlikely.

We replaced Clyne, our greatest ever RB, with Trent

[killer-heels]

We replaced Clyne, our greatest ever RB, with Trent

True, that does throw up the possibility that it can happen.

[FlashGordon]

Hopefully he stays fit and keeps developing. He's more or less where Gordon was a year ago.

Special talent.

Have to say he's looked even a level above Gordon to be honest, which is absolutely ridiculous.

[MBL?]

I mean.....he has just turned 17. He's still months younger than other notorious young starters like Owen and Sterling. It doesn't really make sense that you think he could get significant minutes elsewhere in the league, at just turned 17, but you think his most likely outlook is a squad player. If you think he could be getting significant minutes in the PL at just turned 17, that suggests a massively high ceiling. I think that Romeo Lavia is probably the youngest player in the league playing significant minutes and he's over a year older than Doak. He hasn't just moved from Celtic to Liverpool with the expectation that he's a first team regular before he's 19.

I suppose I’m just trying to dampen expectations. He seems like Forrester and a bit like Guald. He may well go on to be far better than both and I hope and think he will. My estimation of him looking like a squad player this early is because from what I’ve seen he is already brilliant and it won’t take a massive amount of improvement along with age to reach that level. That level is extremely high as it is.

Can he go on to be a world beater? We expect this from starting front players and have been used to it for a number of years now. It is far less likely no matter how you swing it.

[4pool]

Will Ben Doak be the next Michael Owen or the next Rhian Brewster?

[jooneyisdagod]

Will Ben Doak be the next Michael Owen or the next Rhian Brewster?

More Owen than Brewster on current showing. He's just so comfortable beating players at this level seemingly, and he develops physically, that will likely improve.

[MBL?]

More Owen than Brewster on current showing. He's just so comfortable beating players at this level seemingly, and he develops physically, that will likely improve.

Far more likely to be a Brewster. Nothing against Brewster, he looked like he had a genuine chance but players like Owen aren’t just 1 in a million. They are more like 1 in one hundred million. It’s mad that we got him and Fowler in the same decade.

[Fromola]

Have to say he's looked even a level above Gordon to be honest, which is absolutely ridiculous.

Yeah could be, more in terms of the fact of making his Liverpool debut at 16 and impressing,

[Red Beret]

He's got the smile of a serial killer.

Great for penalties then?

[didi shamone]

Far more likely to be a Brewster. Nothing against Brewster, he looked like he had a genuine chance but players like Owen aren’t just 1 in a million. They are more like 1 in one hundred million. It’s mad that we got him and Fowler in the same decade.

I never saw much in Brewster to be honest.  Doak is genuinely exciting but reminds me more of Sterling at similar age

Owen was freakishly good at 17/18 but never improved. He was lightning fast with great movement and world class finishing.  But he was a limited footballer and when he lost the pace he became ordinary
I expect Doak to be a premier league footballer. Time will tell what level.

[TepidT2O]

He did win the Balloon D’Or…. I mean he wasnt that bad really

[GreatEx]

I for one will be over the moon if Ben Doak develops into a player as limited as Michael Owen.

[jooneyisdagod]

Far more likely to be a Brewster. Nothing against Brewster, he looked like he had a genuine chance but players like Owen aren’t just 1 in a million. They are more like 1 in one hundred million. It’s mad that we got him and Fowler in the same decade.

I was never sold on Brewster, which perhaps explains why I went with Owen. But you're right. Owen was a phenomenon when he broke through.

[killer-heels]

I was never sold on Brewster, which perhaps explains why I went with Owen. But you're right. Owen was a phenomenon when he broke through.

Yeah I was surprised at the level of hype Brewster got. He had an excellent youth world cup but he was always levels below the likes of Foden and Sancho. Classic example of overhyping young players.

[Sheer Magnetism]

Ironically, Brewster probably would have done well in the Owen era when you could be a goalhanger, get 15 a season and be labelled a top player. It was always the rest of his game that was the biggest problem, even when he was doing well at Swansea. Still not a patch on Owen though obviously.

[tubby]

Brewster was a weird one, he scored goals at youth levels but never really looked like he had anything special about him.  Didn't have the speed of an Owen, didn't have the impudence of Fowler, wasn't particularly strong, was just one of those players who shine in youth football without really having anything to take them to the next level.

[El Lobo]

Lets not stop over-hyping youngsters though, lest we forget we got £24 million odd for Brewster!

[didi shamone]

I for one will be over the moon if Ben Doak develops into a player as limited as Michael Owen.

You mean when he lost his pace and became a modest player?

Strange call. I hope he maintains his pace and becomes electric like Owen was as a young player.

[didi shamone]

He did win the Balloon D’Or…. I mean he wasnt that bad really

At 21. Who said he was bad then?

[Too early for flapjacks?]

Brewster was a weird one, he scored goals at youth levels but never really looked like he had anything special about him.  Didn't have the speed of an Owen, didn't have the impudence of Fowler, wasn't particularly strong, was just one of those players who shine in youth football without really having anything to take them to the next level.

I'm sure the injury he picked up was a factor. He did his ankle and knee ligaments in one go and it seemed the initial surgery wasn't a total success as I think he had to be operated on 4 times before he was able to return.

[GreatEx]

You mean when he lost his pace and became a modest player?

Strange call. I hope he maintains his pace and becomes electric like Owen was as a young player.

Well, you explicitly said he was a limited player and then lost his pace to become an "ordinary" player. So I was facetiously playing with your assessment of peak Owen as a "limited" player, because let's face it, if Doak can reach that level then we've pulled an absolute blinder.

[didi shamone]

Well, you explicitly said he was a limited player and then lost his pace to become an "ordinary" player. So I was facetiously playing with your assessment of peak Owen as a "limited" player, because let's face it, if Doak can reach that level then we've pulled an absolute blinder.

I explicitly said  "Owen was freakishly good at 17/18 but never improved. He was lightning fast with great movement and world class finishing".  But you jumped on one word.  I mean come on is that the description of a limited player?

What I said or at least what I meant is when he lost that explosiveness he didn't have the technical ability to alter his game. Injuries robbed him of his main asset which was pace.

If we're comparing Doak to Owen then I hope Doak is a much better technical player because if he's not then he'll need to become a goal machine. Every forward we have now is vastly superior to Owen in the technical sense

[El Lobo]

I'm sure the injury he picked up was a factor. He did his ankle and knee ligaments in one go and it seemed the initial surgery wasn't a total success as I think he had to be operated on 4 times before he was able to return.

You're literally paying for potential at that age, its a risky game. English though. Even if they become a decent player without being close to world class, you're looking at a major profit. When you've got the likes of Wan-Bissaka, Ben White and Maguire all going for £50 million plus you can see why lower table clubs chuck money at players of that age, and there still seems to be a case of 'ahhh they're at a big club and played a few times, they must be good'.

[deadsetred]

I explicitly said  "Owen was freakishly good at 17/18 but never improved. He was lightning fast with great movement and world class finishing".  But you jumped on one word.  I mean come on is that the description of a limited player?

What I said or at least what I meant is when he lost that explosiveness he didn't have the technical ability to alter his game. Injuries robbed him of his main asset which was pace.

If we're comparing Doak to Owen then I hope Doak is a much better technical player because if he's not then he'll need to become a goal machine. Every forward we have now is vastly superior to Owen in the technical sense

Mate....come on....one way or another you suggested that Doak becoming an Owen would be somewhat overwhelming...Everyone else (rightly) pointed out that Doak becoming an Owen (even with the same career trajectory) would be an incredible outcome. Nothing more to see here.

[didi shamone]

Mate....come on....one way or another you suggested that Doak becoming an Owen would be somewhat overwhelming...Everyone else (rightly) pointed out that Doak becoming an Owen (even with the same career trajectory) would be an incredible outcome. Nothing more to see here.

You  obviously don't understand what I posted, or the meaning of overwhelming  apparently.

[royhendo]

Could we agree instead that if Doak becomes a player at Owen’s peak level that’d be a good thing? Or even a Damien Duff type level? Agreement is sometimes helpful. Find what you can agree on eh?

[WhereAngelsPlay]

Could we agree instead that if Doak becomes a player at Owen’s peak level that’d be a good thing? Or even a Damien Duff type level? Agreement is sometimes helpful. Find what you can agree on eh?

Not how this place works atm,youngsters have to be picked apart before they even find themselves & even when they do,they're then picked apart and blamed for any little mistake or drop in form.

Fuck development and fuck support. 

Do you agree ?

[afc tukrish]

Could we agree instead that if Doak becomes a player at Owen’s peak level that’d be a good thing? Or even a Damien Duff type level? Agreement is sometimes helpful. Find what you can agree on eh?

I just want you to tell me he'll be at Robbo level.

You've got confidence-boosting previous in that regard...