Author Topic: Probably negative, but is there a need to dampen expectations? (Read 9568 times)

7777 · « **Reply #40 on:** August 13, 2011, 10:49:08 am »

Quote from: Andy@Allerton on August 13, 2011, 09:22:02 am

I'd take a spawny 95th minute winner off the referees backside.

I'd take a spawny 96th minute winner off a beach ball

Red Beret · « **Reply #41 on:** August 13, 2011, 10:56:20 am »

One three nil mauling at a time.

Torpedo Tommy · « **Reply #42 on:** August 13, 2011, 10:57:59 am »

Quote from: Al 555 on August 13, 2011, 09:59:40 am

The problem is that in 08-09 the kneejerkers went from being pleased to be competing in a title race to us apparently throwing it a way in a nanosecond. Last season before the last two games we were apparently competing with Barca as the best team on the planet according to some after two defeats those same fans were labelling us a pub team and questioning Kenny after defeats to Spurs and Villa.

As you say it's how confident the team is that counts and confidence comes from knowing that you can have a bad result or a couple of bad results and the fans won't over react and will stay with the team.

If United start sluggishly the fans will have faith that the manager and players can turn it around, will our fans do the same. What we need is confident players keeping their head down and playing not cocky fans telling everyone that will listen that this is our year.

I see your point exactly and I understand the aim of Jimmy Corkhill's OP......and to be fair, they are both valid points.

I currently have the unfortunate need to make a hour long journey into work at Salford Key's. There is a right mixed bag there. Stockport fans, a few United fans and some City. There are numerous bitters and even a few reds. It's good banter at times when you can understand what people say in their Terry Christian-esque language but I can assure you that United too have their impatient ones. One defeat and Ferguson should have done this and should have done that.

With every team you will have fickle supporters. You will have those that are more happy to analyse why a defeat has occurred against Spurts instead of enjoying the reasons why we trounced Brum and Fulham at the end of last season. We aren't going to lose that until those that do so, grow up and realise that everone on here are as frustrated as themselves.

Torpedo Tommy · « **Reply #43 on:** August 13, 2011, 10:59:10 am »

Quote from: Kopite B205 on August 13, 2011, 10:00:21 am

I'm looking forward to the new season with great optimisum. Our main challengers for 4th spot will be weakened (the expected loss of Modric, Fabregas, Nasri etc) and I fully expect us to improve upon last season. Negativity and a need for caution doesn't cone into it today whatsoever. My glass is certainly half full!

Mine is certainly full!...or it will be when I get to the Elm!

Torpedo Tommy · « **Reply #44 on:** August 13, 2011, 10:59:59 am »

Quote from: Finn Solomon on August 13, 2011, 10:03:01 am

We need another 'Liverpool are shite' thread.

Check back at 4.45 if we lose

Torpedo Tommy · « **Reply #45 on:** August 13, 2011, 11:03:19 am »

Quote from: Dr Manhattan on August 13, 2011, 10:11:55 am

I agree with the op on this one, and have been saying over the last couple of weeks that people are getting a bit carried away predicting we'll challenge for the title. We've strengthened the squad, no doubt about it, but others have strengthened too, and we finished an awful long way off the top last season. There will be progress this year but I'm not convinced it'll be progress on a grand scale. Not yet anyway.

I get why some are full of confidence though, I really do. We have great owners in charge now, a legend as our manager who has won the league before, a great coaching set up, a great youth side, money to spend, a few kids already breaking in to the first team, one of the world's most exciting players upfront, etc., so there's a lot to be thankful and hopeful for. Just don't expect it to suddenly mean we'll be right up the top.

4th place is all I care about this season. Cups and trophies and titles will come in the next few years, but we absolutely NEED to finish 4th or higher THIS season. Don't get me wrong, winning something would be incredible, no matter what it is, but the champions league is where we belong and we need to get back there asap, not just because we should be but because we can't afford to not be.

Think its a fine line between saying "we should win it" and saying "we should target 1st" though. I for one don't think we'll end up winning it. But I think we need a change in mentality. That change in mentality seems to be one embraced by our manager

john_mac · « **Reply #46 on:** August 13, 2011, 11:12:15 am »

One game at a time

& let's twat each & every one of them one game at a time

tinkertailor · « **Reply #47 on:** August 13, 2011, 11:17:27 am »

I don't 'expect' anything. I'm just absurdly optimistic. Nothing wrong with that - it's much nicer than being down in the dumps.

dzaek · « **Reply #48 on:** August 13, 2011, 11:19:31 am »

no problem here.

king kenny is a legend who has gone through a few seasons of playing 38 games, and winning the league!.

dalglish - the best signing in 2011!

AndrewLFC_1971 · « **Reply #49 on:** August 13, 2011, 11:22:41 am »

The King knows the score, if he says we can win it then i'm in.

vivabobbygraham · « **Reply #50 on:** August 13, 2011, 11:24:53 am »

Teams above us may have added to their squads but have they improved it? United, no, and with the new keeper they have gone backwards there. Chelsea, no, they have not yet replaced Essien so at best are the same as last year. Arsenal, no which leaves City. If Tevez stays then they have deffo improved with Aguero. Now, we have improved the squad all over the pitch so I think 2nd is very doable and 1st is not out of the question. I don't think the optimism is misplaced.

"It's not personal, Sonny, it's just business."

Abrak · « **Reply #51 on:** August 13, 2011, 12:12:18 pm »

Quote from: vivabobbygraham on August 13, 2011, 11:24:53 am

Teams above us may have added to their squads but have they improved it? United, no, and with the new keeper they have gone backwards there. Chelsea, no, they have not yet replaced Essien so at best are the same as last year. Arsenal, no which leaves City. If Tevez stays then they have deffo improved with Aguero. Now, we have improved the squad all over the pitch so I think 2nd is very doable and 1st is not out of the question. I don't think the optimism is misplaced.

"It's not personal, Sonny, it's just business."

I have to say that I am not so bothered about where we finish in this season's league.

It seems to me that both City and Chelsea are gaining their place by 'financial doping' or losing huge amounts of money. Ultimately if there is any faith in FFP the question is going to be who wins when clubs have to get close to breakeven not who wins by spending the most.

postblue · « **Reply #52 on:** August 13, 2011, 12:47:27 pm »

I haven't really set expectations, but fourth is absolutely doable. Thinking we could win the thing is a little deluded though unfortunately.

Indian Scouser · « **Reply #53 on:** August 13, 2011, 01:07:22 pm »

We'll win every game and finish with 114 points. Anything less will be unacceptable.

meady1981 · « **Reply #54 on:** August 13, 2011, 01:15:51 pm »

I agree with all the above points.

Crimson_Tank · « **Reply #55 on:** August 13, 2011, 01:51:17 pm »

Supply me with an injury free match and a clean sheet and I will be quite happy! (winning 3 nil will make my week)

Ultimate Bromance · « **Reply #56 on:** August 13, 2011, 02:09:34 pm »

Bollocks, nailed on for the treble.

redoneusa · « **Reply #57 on:** August 13, 2011, 02:13:04 pm »

Well, as Liverpool Football Club we know no other way than to go out to win every game, chase every piece of silverware. It's the Liverpool way.

So let's twat every team on our march back to the top.

MrEazi1 · « **Reply #58 on:** August 13, 2011, 02:38:08 pm »

Mark Bright thinks on Final Score we are going to win the title.

Garth Crooks predicts 3rd place for the Reds.

Ambrosia · « **Reply #59 on:** August 13, 2011, 02:39:01 pm »

I'm feeling horribly optimistic.

Dreading the inevitable letdown.

Samee · « **Reply #60 on:** August 13, 2011, 05:11:08 pm »

I've always said our aim should be top 4. I think the best we can hope for at this point is 3rd. Our buying this summer indicates we're only going for the top 4. This season is about reshaping and next season will be about pushing on to the top.

aoaaron · « **Reply #61 on:** August 13, 2011, 05:17:16 pm »

Top 4 would be a fantastic achievement considering United, City, Chelsea and Arsenal are better than us.

With the money Kenny's been allowed to spend since hes come in (i'm not arsed about net-spend over the past 8 months), we should be finishing 5th in the league (ahead of Spurs who haven't strengthened and have been unsettled by the Modric fiasco).

It's Jimmy Corkhill · « **Reply #62 on:** August 13, 2011, 05:32:18 pm »

Gonna take a wild guess and say that, sadly, this thread may be bumped a lot during the season.

redway101 · « **Reply #63 on:** August 13, 2011, 05:38:45 pm »

Lack of physical fitness seemed key to me, Sunderland are much physically fitter than us. It wasn't a case of them raising their game rather they maintained their level longer whilst we fell away. It doesn't matter how talented you are if the opposition are two yards quicker. All tired signs crept in, poor touch, lack control, clumsy challenges. In truth it started just before half time and we faded badly in the second half, Adam, Downing, Carroll all fell away badly.

Flanagan had a bit of mare as the match went on, confidence went a bit after a few mistakes and Henderson really needs to learn to track back and improve his positional play quickly.

Still first game, most sides are well of the pace at the start, it takes time to build up fitness levels and team understanding which is often why we get such unusual results early on. Perhaps Sunderland are just an exceptionally fit side? They looked a couple of weeks ahead of us. Just concerned now about the slow start we all wanted to avoid with a tough game coming up.

Camarero25 · « **Reply #64 on:** August 13, 2011, 05:48:16 pm »

I still expect us to finish top four and to have a good season. Despite the poor second half there were positive signs today and we may take a while to gel completely. We often have slow starts to seasons and I expect us to really pick up a bit later on. Arsenal are the opposite, they start strongly and fade away, so we have to be in touching distance later in the season if they falter. I suppose what I'm really trying to say is that I wouldn't be too worried about early results, as I feel we'll get stronger as the season goes on.

Discipline · « **Reply #65 on:** August 13, 2011, 05:51:36 pm »

Quote from: Indian Scouser on August 13, 2011, 01:07:22 pm

We'll win every game and finish with 114 points. Anything less will be unacceptable.

112?

Redeo · « **Reply #66 on:** August 13, 2011, 05:56:51 pm »

Quote from: Camarero25 on August 13, 2011, 05:48:16 pm

I still expect us to finish top four and to have a good season. Despite the poor second half there were positive signs today and we may take a while to gel completely. We often have slow starts to seasons and I expect us to really pick up a bit later on. Arsenal are the opposite, they start strongly and fade away, so we have to be in touching distance later in the season if they falter. I suppose what I'm really trying to say is that I wouldn't be too worried about early results, as I feel we'll get stronger as the season goes on.

I agree with you, but feel it is fair to say that the game today showed both positive and negative signs. Positively, first 35 minutes were excellent, there was a flow and purpose to our game. Downing showed his potential. Suarez looked unstoppable, and it felt like Carroll would pitch in with a goal any moment.
Negatively, second half turned this upside down, exposed some limitations of our players, and suggested that Kenny still does not have a system. To not succeed in swarming their goal during the last 15 minutes of the game, during the first game of the season when passions are running high, is not encouraging at all.
Simply put, 2 points lost...

cptrios · « **Reply #67 on:** August 13, 2011, 06:58:52 pm »

I will be thrilled if we get 2 points out of our first two games, and incredibly thrilled if we beat Arsenal. With all of these new signings, our injuries, and two of our best players coming off a big tournament, I'm not going to let myself be either worried or excited until we've played about 5 matches. If we're within 5 points of 1st after those 5 matches, and we're starting to play cohesively, then I'd say we're on great footing.

TheRedBull · « **Reply #68 on:** August 13, 2011, 07:02:51 pm »

Barca under Pepe's first season only had one point from the first 2 games... People need to be patient and wait for the team to click first.

Discipline · « **Reply #69 on:** August 14, 2011, 05:57:53 am »

Quote from: TheRedBull on August 13, 2011, 07:02:51 pm

Barca under Pepe's first season only had one point from the first 2 games... People need to be patient and wait for the team to click first.

0-0 with Mourinho's first game at Madrid too.

MKelly34 · « **Reply #70 on:** August 14, 2011, 06:05:50 am »

Quote from: TheRedBull on August 13, 2011, 07:02:51 pm

Barca under Pepe's first season only had one point from the first 2 games... People need to be patient and wait for the team to click first.

Pepe's team had a higher quality than ours though, so you'd expect them to click up fast.

We had a 'clicked' team already, but our best players went straight to the bench...

Red Beret · « **Reply #71 on:** August 14, 2011, 09:20:52 am »

I expect us to improve. If Arsenal improve it wont be by much.

Twelfth Man · « **Reply #72 on:** August 14, 2011, 09:25:59 am »

Football is about pain. Winning is merely the temporary absence of pain. It is what we/I sign up to each season. The more things change, the more they stay the same.

Get · « **Reply #73 on:** August 14, 2011, 09:30:36 am »

a thread like this after the first game in the season with a first eleven with 4 new players (+Carroll & Suarez)

Didi_ram · « **Reply #74 on:** August 14, 2011, 09:43:27 am »

We can probably comment after the Arsenal performance.If we lose there,then the management would need to sit down and rethink,and change some tactics.Or maybe a panic buy or two to plug gaps.

Andy @ Allerton! · « **Reply #75 on:** August 14, 2011, 09:46:32 am »

1 point gained. Some lessons learned. As this squad gels and builds understanding I think we'll get there. We showed some real promise yesterday and after such a short time together it's clear that we have some fine intelligence and ability at our fingertips.

I was (Like everyone) a bit disappointed that we didn't win the game - but I don't see any reason for doom or gloom or whining at the moment.

Get · « **Reply #76 on:** August 14, 2011, 09:46:37 am »

if.. there is someone to blame and thats a big if because it's only the start of the season, then it's the fitness staff because our players in the second half looked terrible in terms of closing down. sunderland were twice as sharp and fast on the ball, turns movements etc. this will most likely improve but a bit surprising watching all the other teams play and not having such a low stamina.

Twelfth Man · « **Reply #77 on:** August 14, 2011, 09:48:56 am »

Quote from: Didi_ram on August 14, 2011, 09:43:27 am

We can probably comment after the Arsenal performance.If we lose there,then the management would need to sit down and rethink,and change some tactics.Or maybe a panic buy or two to plug gaps.

Panic buys is good! Losing might benefit our overall season more than winning if said panic buys turn out to be Sammi Hyypiaesque...

Twelfth Man · « **Reply #78 on:** August 14, 2011, 09:52:22 am »

Quote from: Get on August 14, 2011, 09:46:37 am

if.. there is someone to blame and thats a big if because it's only the start of the season, then it's the fitness staff because our players in the second half looked terrible in terms of closing down. sunderland were twice as sharp and fast on the ball, turns movements etc. this will most likely improve but a bit surprising watching all the other teams play and not having such a low stamina.

One of the criticisms of KK when at Newcastle was too much 5-a-side (actually I have always called for it because it is perfect for encouraging pass and move). However you would think the club has a dedicated fitness coach. Rafa was huge on fitness, the players often didn't like it but the team getting tired so visibly under Rafa would be unthinkable.

ALANM · « **Reply #79 on:** August 14, 2011, 09:56:05 am »

We drew yesterday which means my glass is half full not half empty. I admit the 2nd half was poor, but let's not get depressed about it. Regarding the fitness issue, I think it's a mixture of all the pre-season travelling (was the Istanbul trip really necessary??) coupled with the midweek internationals taking its toll. I targeted top 4 before the season kicked off and a poor 45 minutes doesn't change that.