Author Topic: Support - You're Doing it Wrong  (Read 41463 times)

Offline Fat Scouser

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Re: Support - You're Doing it Wrong
« Reply #360 on: April 13, 2012, 10:17:27 pm »
Feel a bit sorry for the lad meself. From what I can see, he's only trying to be logical about it all. Seems to have swallowed a dictionary, but at least the lad's trying to explain his opinions instead of just giving it the usual "get rid, bell end, knob" type comments that get posted on here.
He's got the results issue between Hodge Podge and Kenny wrong. Of course Kenny is going to be given more leeway. I also think, as I've said loads of times, the lad also needs to be given time. The place is still obviously a mess. It's not going to get sorted overnight. But there's no room for sentimentallity either, and the way things are going I'm sure FSG will be reviewing things at the end of the season. I hope they decide to give Kenny at least one more season. Any manager will need time to bring the title back, probably a lot more time than Kenny's had. But Dalglish deserves at least one more crack at it. He's earned at least that, but would probably need longer. It's all still a bit of a mess, really.
"A peasant you are. A peasant you will remain. And we shall use all our wealth and power, to make your lot even worse and keep you exactly where you are, Bondage!"    The Boy King, Richard II, after  putting down the The Peasants Revolt in 1381.

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Offline Alan_X

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Re: Support - You're Doing it Wrong
« Reply #361 on: April 13, 2012, 10:27:35 pm »
Feel a bit sorry for the lad meself. From what I can see, he's only trying to be logical about it all. Seems to have swallowed a dictionary, but at least the lad's trying to explain his opinions instead of just giving it the usual "get rid, bell end, knob" type comments that get posted on here.
He's got the results issue between Hodge Podge and Kenny wrong. Of course Kenny is going to be given more leeway. I also think, as I've said loads of times, the lad also needs to be given time. The place is still obviously a mess. It's not going to get sorted overnight. But there's no room for sentimentallity either, and the way things are going I'm sure FSG will be reviewing things at the end of the season. I hope they decide to give Kenny at least one more season. Any manager will need time to bring the title back, probably a lot more time than Kenny's had. But Dalglish deserves at least one more crack at it. He's earned at least that, but would probably need longer. It's all still a bit of a mess, really.

Leo - when was following a football clubs ever about logic? Logically we'd all be supporting that shower of shite in Salford.

He seems like a bright enough lad. Won't do him any harm to learn a little hubris and try and say in a paragraph what he says in a whole page at the moment.
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Offline Fat Scouser

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Re: Support - You're Doing it Wrong
« Reply #362 on: April 13, 2012, 10:37:07 pm »
Leo - when was following a football clubs ever about logic? Logically we'd all be supporting that shower of shite in Salford.

He seems like a bright enough lad. Won't do him any harm to learn a little hubris and try and say in a paragraph what he says in a whole page at the moment.
I don't understand half the words he used. I think it comes down to one thing... he still misses Rafa. I shouldn't second judge what he's saying, but I'm still gutted Rafa's gone meself. I think it's still the cause of our failings now. Having said that though, I wouldn't want him back, not now, any way. And maybe not ever. It wouldn't be right for the club, Dalglish or Rafa, himself. All the old rifts would open up. I just hope Kenny is given another crack next season, and he turns league results around, maybe, gets us a UEFA cup an all. And that's the real problem with our support right now, Al. We are greedy bastards. We've got no patience. I get what you mean about logical support. Of course it's an emotional thing but we could probably do with a little logic and calm thinking when it comes to our expectectations. I think it's been a burden on everyone since Souness. I wouldn't want the job for a big clock.
"A peasant you are. A peasant you will remain. And we shall use all our wealth and power, to make your lot even worse and keep you exactly where you are, Bondage!"    The Boy King, Richard II, after  putting down the The Peasants Revolt in 1381.

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Offline Evans

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Re: Support - You're Doing it Wrong
« Reply #363 on: April 13, 2012, 11:14:31 pm »
I read the quotes in this post, and immediately thought about Orwell, which I read just some months ago and can't seem to put away.

I deleted them because they were boring, poorly argued and were taking over the discussion and you clearly have no idea what you are talking about.



Then this post comes next. Spot on.


subroc - read this:

Politics and the English Language by George Orwell

http://gutenberg.net.au/ebooks03/0300011h.html#part42


Sorry for off-topic. Even though I don't seem to be the only one right now, and Orwell is a worthy distraction.

Offline Fat Scouser

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Re: Support - You're Doing it Wrong
« Reply #364 on: April 13, 2012, 11:22:19 pm »
Love old George. The Lion and The Unicorn is about the best thing I've ever read about the English character. Some of it wouldn't go amiss in here really.
"A peasant you are. A peasant you will remain. And we shall use all our wealth and power, to make your lot even worse and keep you exactly where you are, Bondage!"    The Boy King, Richard II, after  putting down the The Peasants Revolt in 1381.

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Offline redbyrdz

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Re: Support - You're Doing it Wrong
« Reply #365 on: April 13, 2012, 11:25:13 pm »
Love old George. The Lion and The Unicorn is about the best thing I've ever read about the English character. Some of it wouldn't go amiss in here really.
http://orwell.ru/library/essays/lion/english/


Edit: Fucks sake FS, now I spend my pre-match prep reading Orwell! Think his observations are amazingly accurate, even 70 years on.
« Last Edit: April 13, 2012, 11:34:27 pm by redbyrdz »
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Offline RedMarko

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Re: Support - You're Doing it Wrong
« Reply #366 on: April 14, 2012, 12:53:32 am »
Apologies - a beer on board - but for me it all comes down to humility.


As a fanbase, we are known and, by others, slagged off for being "the best fans in the world". Tough cross to bear that one, but there is reason for it. There is a reason why we're (slaggingly/knowingly/abusively) known as the best fans in the world. It in not because we as fans know the shape or selections in the next match. It's not because we expect to win. It's not because we are on Sky Sports most....it's because we know what it means to support the club.


It's because we wholeheartedly SUPPORT.


Our crew did not jump trains/sell belongings to get to Rome/Paris/Istanbul to shout about who should be playing in DM. They did not make close friends in Leverkusen because the DOF should be an ex-player instead of a businessman. They went because they believed that was their jobs as supporters.


We have lost a bit of track of that. Not individually, but as a collective.


I see online arguments break out between purple binners and OOTers on here and they are properly locked. But the bit I take from it is that OOT/purple bin/OOC/ even jester hat wearing, the one thing you can't take from any one of us is our love and devotion to LFC.


I am on this site years. I only tend to post when something has really got my goat, or I'm looking for a cheap Friday afternoon troll. And yet what I've learned from here has been immense. Not from arguments between people saying "X, Y or  should start".


The reason I still come here after 7.5 years is not because I like an argument (I do - but that's not the reason!) it's because there are a few types on here that I believe see things the same way.


The point of this thread (and put me right if I'm wrong Rhi ;) ) is that on here we're losing focus in enjoying being LFC fans because we're losing sight of the reason we're LFC fans. I could write another essay on why. But on the eve of a HUGE 'MERSEYSIDE' game in Wembley, there are people arguing the toss over who should replace Damian Comolli!! WHO CARES!!


I've learnt more from this site by reading than expressing opinion. I learn, then try to express myself. I never try to imply I know whats right or whats wrong. I do know there is a huge number of other fans on this site who think like the OP, - Fat Scouser, like Ray, like vicgill/Rushian/Gary/Jag/Jonny H.... (this list will get too long). Pure love for the club and a desire to speak with like minded fans. If some of the posters in this very thread READ as opposed to spending hours replying to without point, they might just get the point and the reason the place became popular.


We should never be loud about ourselves. Be humble, but roar your fucking head off when our boys are on the pitch.




Time to crack open another beer.


C'MON YOU REDMEN!!!!


 :wave
« Last Edit: April 14, 2012, 12:56:32 am by RedMarko »

Offline Marty 85

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Re: Support - You're Doing it Wrong
« Reply #367 on: April 14, 2012, 10:09:44 pm »
It's easy to follow this post after a result like today.

Bookmark it, give it a bump or just read it and take a breather when things aren't going so well.

Offline Tony Drago

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Re: Support - You're Doing it Wrong
« Reply #368 on: April 14, 2012, 10:54:39 pm »
I'll tell you what, I'd hate to be in the trenches with some of our supporters. Sorry. Not supporters. Fans.

I'm fucking sick of them. I'm sick of all the whining and bitching before a ball has been kicked. I swear to God, yesterday you'd have thought we had a team of Sunday League players on the pitch the way some of them were going on when the team sheet was announced. And then they have the audacity to expect those very same players who they can't give a little bit of fucking encouragement and respect to, to perform to the best of their abilities? How is it not obvious that it's part of the problem?

But I'm glad I've seen what they have to say. I'm glad because it's gradually been grating on me. Until I realised... This isn't right. The way I've been acting isn't right.

It's been going on all season. If we're not whining about Carroll, we're moaning about Carragher. If we're not moaning about Carragher, we're bitching about Adam. If we're not bitching about Adam, we're despairing at Henderson. And all the while we expect them to turn up, perform at the highest level, and "entertain" us. I include myself in that. I'm a bit ashamed of how I reacted to some of our players earlier this season. I'm even a bit ashamed at how I treated Roy Hodgson. What we've become is not what I was brought up on. What we've become is not how I was taught to be a Liverpool supporter.

I've supported Liverpool FC for as long as I can remember. I've been going to the match regularly for a decade. A decade that's seen us have four different managers, more cups than most clubs could ever dream of, more of the best nights in European history than any supporter has a right to live through, more angst than we should ever have to endure with our club, and more politics than should ever be a part of football. But we've always tried to do things in the right way, as supporters. I'd have backed Gerard Houllier to the last. I'd have fought to the death for Rafa Benitez. I didn't give Roy Hodgson the respect that a Liverpool manager deserved, but then we all know the mitigating circumstances there. And now we have Kenny. And I absolutely refuse to turn on him. No matter how bad things get.

They tell me that if we continue on this path then we're building for mediocrity, and they tell me that the players we have are not good enough for our club. And you know what? They might even be right. But there are more important things than that. And our identity as a club, the way we support our team, the things that are unique about Liverpool FC are more important than short term success. Right now a lot of us have lost sight of that. I include myself in that. Because I've acted like a c*nt this season too. But for me it ends now.

"Ah, but if we let things go much further, we'll end up like Villa, a mid-table ex-giant", we'd say, like drama queens. But that's all bollocks really. We played in a European Cup Final five years ago. We won it two years before that. And that was out of nowhere. "But we'd won the treble not long before that..." God. If only there was a comparison to make there, somewhere...

Anyway. I'm not arguing for the "patience" that some seem to think is such a terrible trait. But respect? Respect is something we fucking owe this club. This club that has given us some of the best days of our lives. I've seen them all on Twitter, with their sarcasm and their bitching about the arl arses who try to make these points. But you know what? The arl arses are fucking right. Too many of our supporters are spoiled brats when it comes to football, and they're becoming an absolute joke.

Some of the things that make our club so special are respect, patience (yeah, fucking patience), long-term vision, and togetherness. There are far, FAR too many of us who have forgotten that in the last few years of civil war. It's time to put a stop to acting like kids with a sense of entitlement. It's as much our responsibility to support the team and the club as it is theirs to perform. It's our job to be there - in the good times AND the bad. And the sad truth of the matter is, we are in much more danger of becoming one of those midtable teams in terms of culture than we are of ever becoming them in terms of success.

So next time you start to type out that sarcastic post or tweet, or the next time you want to stamp your feet about Carragher being in the starting line-up (as if you've watched the lads train all week and know what's what), have a look in the mirror and ask yourself whether that's really how a supporter should be acting?

I really have had enough of the negativity surrounding the club. I'm going to Wembley next week, and I'm going there expecting our players to fucking steamroller the Blueshite all the way back to their shitty shed. And if you're not? Then honestly? You're fucking doing it wrong.

Completely agree with you right till you mention that fraudulent Owl.

Would also take slight issue at the "back Houllier till the last" bit. I think everyone knew it was the right decision for him to move on at the time, for the benefit of both the club and the man.

The stick Adam gets is ridiculous. "Fat scottish c*nt" being the most obvious load of bollocks. Carroll and Henderson have under performed but.....both are still young and could well still make it and your point about support is right.

As for Carragher, frankly I'll never forgive him for the part he played in ousting the best tactician in Europe just so he could get a cushty 2 year extension. He's finished as a player at the highest level and needs to accept that. If he somehow ever becomes Liverpool manager however, I am done with it.

Sorry for missing you today btw.

Offline redbyrdz

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Re: Support - You're Doing it Wrong
« Reply #369 on: May 1, 2012, 12:06:27 am »
Just a bit from our manager on the topic - not that he hasn't said exactly the same before, but I thought it'd fit the thread quite well.


Meanwhile, Dalglish has paid tribute to the travelling supporters who made themselves heard in Norwich.

"I don't think you should ever underestimate how important they are to the players," he said. "For them to make the effort to turn up to support us I think is really appreciated by the players.

"As we said from the outset when we came in 18 months ago: if everybody sticks together, everybody plays their part and we all chip in together, then there's nobody any more important than the next person.

"Whatever role you play at the football club let's try and do it to the best of our abilities. If we do that then we've got a better chance of moving forward, but the supporters have always been an integral part of this football club, and when I'm here then they always will be in our eyes.

"I think they know that and they appreciate the effort that the boys have put in for them and I think maybe the adversity we had a few weeks ago maybe stands us in good stead because it brings everybody closer together."
"I want to build a team that's invincible, so that they have to send a team from bloody Mars to beat us." - Bill Shankly

Offline Il Nina

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Re: Support - You're Doing it Wrong
« Reply #370 on: May 1, 2012, 12:13:07 am »
Brilliant post! I loved it, thanks for writing what needed to be said.
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Offline Suarez 7

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Re: Support - You're Doing it Wrong
« Reply #371 on: May 1, 2012, 12:15:38 am »
Great post. Your so boss. Everyone who isnt the same as you is wrong and a shite "fan"
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Offline Fluke

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Re: Support - You're Doing it Wrong
« Reply #372 on: May 1, 2012, 12:38:29 am »
The title of this thread has taken a whole new meaning for me recently.

I think the point is that if you love something, you support it no matter what. The good, the bad, the ugly, you get behind it and give it whatever help you can.

It's human nature, we look for things to blame. Really we should be looking at ourselves and asking, "what can I do?" Yes, our league form has been terrible, but having a go at the players or manager won't change that. Going to the game and being heard. That just might.

We need to be there for them, no matter what. Isn't that the point?
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Offline -HH-

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Re: Support - You're Doing it Wrong
« Reply #373 on: May 1, 2012, 11:45:36 am »
Great post. Your so boss. Everyone who isnt the same as you is wrong and a shite "fan"

It should be you're so boss. Isn't has an apostrophe. I found the sarcasm a little stale, the tone unnecessarily hostile and the fact that rather than look in the mirror and examine your behaviour you've decided to dismiss some excellent points as just some know-it-all telling you what to do very sad. That aside, it was an excellent post and I look forward to hearing more from you.
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