Author Topic: Not quite so 'Super' League  (Read 528251 times)

Offline redmark

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Re: Not quite so 'Super' League
« Reply #11840 on: May 18, 2021, 12:27:11 pm »
This is the concern. What does an 'independent regulator' even mean, in practice? Sounds like a shit idea.

There's still someone who's going to be behind it. Could effectively just be another PGMOL stuffed with more Mancs.

I remember Rio Ferdinand being part of an 'independent' group '(along with other visionaries like Danny Mills) with an initiative to change football. Part of their proposals was bringing B teams into the lower leagues.

I wouldn't trust anything that wasn't fan led.
That's ok then:

"The Government should use the recently established fan led review of football to introduce an Independent Football Regulator in England to put fans back at the heart of our national game."

Nobody has to agree with every word Neville or Carragher says, to accept that their support can amplify the campaign.
Stop whining : https://spiritofshankly.com/ : https://thefsa.org.uk/join/ : https://reclaimourgame.com/
The focus now should not be on who the owners are, but limits on what owners can do without formal supporter agreement. At all clubs.

Offline Fromola

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Re: Not quite so 'Super' League
« Reply #11841 on: May 18, 2021, 01:58:48 pm »
That's ok then:

"The Government should use the recently established fan led review of football to introduce an Independent Football Regulator in England to put fans back at the heart of our national game."

Nobody has to agree with every word Neville or Carragher says, to accept that their support can amplify the campaign.

Yes, i'm aware that's the theory and it's a catchy tagline to get more signatures that it's fan led

But in reality ... Independent regulator could mean anything
« Last Edit: May 18, 2021, 02:00:22 pm by Fromola »
Could have done with Grujic and even Chirivella to tide us over this season

Offline Zeb

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Re: Not quite so 'Super' League
« Reply #11842 on: May 18, 2021, 03:31:27 pm »
If you've been following the efforts to reform the game over the past few years, this will probably not be a new link for you: https://www.ourbeautifulgame.co.uk/about

It sets out some of the ideas which are in the legislation before Parliament to establish an independent regulator.

https://static1.squarespace.com/static/5f78751d052f492f9d39e80d/t/5f858cd74076656f3bfa4279/1602587865197/Saving+the+Beautiful+Game_2020.pdf

Quote
So, we propose legislation in Parliament that sets up a new regulatory body for football with the challenge of radically reforming the way our national game is governed.

It should:

1) Be independent of the current structure of the game.
2) Decide on new ways of distributing funds to the wider game based on a funding formula and a fair levy payable by the EPL.
3) Set up a new and comprehensive licencing system for the professional game.
4) Review causes of financial stress in the EFL including parachute payments, solidarity payments, salary caps and mandatory relegation clauses in players’ contracts.
5) Implement governance reforms at the FA which are essential to ensure it is truly independent, diverse and representative of English football today. A fundamental reform of The FA Council would be an impressive start of this process.
6) Liaise with supporters’ organisations to progress issues that are of concern to fans and provide a greater voice for supporters.
7) Study lessons from abroad and seek to champion supporter involvement in the running of clubs.

This regulatory body would drive progress on greater diversity and inclusion in football on and off the pitch and press clubs to improve BAME representation on the coaching field and in the boardroom. Football has rightly been praised for its commitment to fighting racism through organisations like ‘Kick It Out’. However, we believe that, as public expectations of how organisations engage with race rises, these commitments need to be refocussed and properly financed by football as a whole.

In addition, there should be greater focus on whether sufficient resources are finding their way to develop the women’s game and football for the disabled. We were alarmed by the findings of the recent DCMS Committee report that noted ‘that the lack of visibility of women’s sport risked undoing work to improve funding for the game.
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Offline redmark

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Re: Not quite so 'Super' League
« Reply #11843 on: May 18, 2021, 03:36:24 pm »
If you've been following the efforts to reform the game over the past few years, this will probably not be a new link for you: https://www.ourbeautifulgame.co.uk/about

It sets out some of the ideas which are in the legislation before Parliament to establish an independent regulator.

https://static1.squarespace.com/static/5f78751d052f492f9d39e80d/t/5f858cd74076656f3bfa4279/1602587865197/Saving+the+Beautiful+Game_2020.pdf

It's almost as though people have been thinking about and working on this for years, rather than something Gary Neville made up yesterday to trick Liverpool fans into a trap where referees would be officially allowed to be biased against Liverpool, or something.

;)
Stop whining : https://spiritofshankly.com/ : https://thefsa.org.uk/join/ : https://reclaimourgame.com/
The focus now should not be on who the owners are, but limits on what owners can do without formal supporter agreement. At all clubs.

Offline Zeb

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Re: Not quite so 'Super' League
« Reply #11844 on: May 18, 2021, 03:49:47 pm »
It's almost as though people have been thinking about and working on this for years, rather than something Gary Neville made up yesterday to trick Liverpool fans into a trap where referees would be officially allowed to be biased against Liverpool, or something.

;)


He needs to rebrand himself as Andy Burnham really. Cagoule, specs, and Clarks' Wallabees. He'll still be Gary Neville but not quite so overtly so and people would even start to believe him that he did something after Bury went bust.
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Offline Fromola

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Re: Not quite so 'Super' League
« Reply #11845 on: May 18, 2021, 05:30:46 pm »
It's almost as though people have been thinking about and working on this for years, rather than something Gary Neville made up yesterday to trick Liverpool fans into a trap where referees would be officially allowed to be biased against Liverpool, or something.

;)

And relying on the fucking Tories to actually implement it as set out.

Could have done with Grujic and even Chirivella to tide us over this season

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Re: Not quite so 'Super' League
« Reply #11846 on: May 20, 2021, 05:15:52 pm »
LFC set to launch a new Supporters Board in a new initiative which will deliver meaningful fan representation at main board and executive levels as part of the club's commitment to put supporters at the heart of its decision-making processes.

https://www.liverpoolfc.com/news/announcements/434959-lfc-to-create-supporters-board-to-give-fans-representation-on-major-fan-facing-strategic-decisions

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Re: Not quite so 'Super' League
« Reply #11847 on: May 20, 2021, 05:17:36 pm »
Quote
Liverpool FC is set to launch a new Supporters Board in a new initiative which will deliver meaningful fan representation at main board and executive levels as part of the club's commitment to put supporters at the heart of its decision-making processes.

The development follows a series of recent meetings with the Official Liverpool Supporters Trust, Spirit of Shankly, and will see the creation of a new engagement model that enables deeper consultation with supporters on fan-facing strategic decisions.

Crucially, this consultation process will be enshrined in the club’s Articles of Association and a legally binding Memorandum of Understanding between the club and the Official Liverpool Supporters Trust will be entered into, thereby ensuring supporters input on fan issues via structured dialogue.

The Supporters Board will be launched ahead of the new season and will be made up of a group of supporters that represent the club’s diverse fanbase. The Official Liverpool Supporters Trust will be responsible for running the Supporters Board and will be liaising with its affiliate groups and the wider supporter base in order to ensure such representation is achieved. The Supporters Board will hold regular meetings with the club and the chair will be invited to attend LFC’s main board meetings when fan-facing strategic matters arise.

The existing fan forums structure will remain in place but will be reshaped into three main working groups to cover ticketing, matchday experience and ED&I. This will ensure operational issues and projects continue to be discussed by club officials and supporters. When appropriate, these matters will also be represented at the Supporters Board level.

Discussions between the club and the Official Liverpool Supporters Trust will continue over the coming weeks to finalise and formalise this new engagement structure with a public declaration. The Liverpool Supporters Trust will also be meeting its members to vote on this new structure.

Billy Hogan, chief executive of Liverpool FC, said: “Firstly I’d like to thank all those supporters we’ve either met in person from the Liverpool Supporters Trust or received feedback from over the past few weeks. This input has been invaluable and has helped us to reach a point at which we have been able to agree the principles that will lead to the creation of a new Supporters Board.

“The focus over the last few weeks of dialogue has been to find a long-term solution that is in the best interests of Liverpool FC and its supporters – one that we firmly believe is not only meaningful but also wholly in keeping with the values and aspirations of the club.

“While these changes are significant, it is important to stress that the current fan forums have also worked incredibly well since they were introduced four years ago and it is crucial that they continue in addition to the Supporters Board in order to give us a range of engagement options.

“There is still a lot to discuss with representatives of the Liverpool Supporters Trust in the weeks ahead but having these principles in place is a great step forward and we look forward to formalising the details of the structure over the summer. We will then share the details with all supporters ahead of the new season.”

Joe Blott, chair of Spirit of Shankly, the Liverpool Supporters Trust, said: “Spirit of Shankly met with representatives of Liverpool FC’s board on Tuesday May 18, 2021 to continue talks on the union’s four requests.

“After discussions of the past weeks, we believe this is a unique deal and recommend its acceptance. We see this as a chance to help shape the future of our club and put us at the forefront of changing football in general.

“We are arranging an online meeting for members, hopefully at the start of next week, where this will be discussed and then put to the vote.”

Offline CraigDS

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Re: Not quite so 'Super' League
« Reply #11848 on: May 20, 2021, 05:19:20 pm »
Seems a good option and goes with what I was saying in that it would be good to have a wide range of fans (not just form SOS) to get the biggest range of views on matters.

Offline Dave McCoy

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Re: Not quite so 'Super' League
« Reply #11849 on: May 20, 2021, 05:51:14 pm »
NYT article today seems to make clear FIFA was on board with the ESL.  Will be interesting to see how the board changes at the clubs changes the dynamic for this in going forward.

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Re: Not quite so 'Super' League
« Reply #11850 on: May 20, 2021, 11:01:22 pm »
The Guardian still whining about the ESL and presenting it as if Liverpool were the only club involved.
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Offline Eeyore

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Re: Not quite so 'Super' League
« Reply #11851 on: May 20, 2021, 11:18:23 pm »
The Guardian still whining about the ESL and presenting it as if Liverpool were the only club involved.

Maybe that is because we are judged by different standards. We are known to be a club with a social conscience.

That is something that I love about our Club. We were the last of the big clubs to sell out to big business and even when Moores sold the family silver we have still managed to hold our owners to account.

That is why things like the ticket price rise, looking to trademark Liverpool, project big picture, furloughing staff and the ESL have been so vociferously opposed and overturned. 
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Offline PeterTheRed ...

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Re: Not quite so 'Super' League
« Reply #11852 on: May 20, 2021, 11:19:19 pm »
NYT article today seems to make clear FIFA was on board with the ESL.  Will be interesting to see how the board changes at the clubs changes the dynamic for this in going forward.

I am not not surprised that FIFA were supportive of the Super League, probably until they received an offer from UEFA that was too good to turn down.

As for the fans' involvement in the clubs' decision making structures, I doubt it would change anything, since the real decisions will still be made by the owners, and the fans will find it difficult to elect their representatives ...

Offline Eeyore

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Re: Not quite so 'Super' League
« Reply #11853 on: May 20, 2021, 11:23:44 pm »
I am not not surprised that FIFA were supportive of the Super League, probably until they received an offer from UEFA that was too good to turn down.

As for the fans' involvement in the clubs' decision making structures, I doubt it would change anything, since the real decisions will still be made by the owners, and the fans will find it difficult to elect their representatives ...

Why will Liverpool fans find it difficult to elect their representatives. SoS are the official Liverpool Supporters Trust and have been recognised as such by the club. SoS have also garnered legal guaranties.
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Offline PeterTheRed ...

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Re: Not quite so 'Super' League
« Reply #11854 on: May 20, 2021, 11:31:09 pm »
Why will Liverpool fans find it difficult to elect their representatives. SoS are the official Liverpool Supporters Trust and have been recognised as such by the club. SoS have also garnered legal guaranties.

What percentage of LFC supporters overall are members of the SoS?

Offline oojason

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Re: Not quite so 'Super' League
« Reply #11855 on: May 21, 2021, 01:53:26 am »

'The Super League Thought It Had a Silent Partner: FIFA':-

Publicly, soccer’s global governing body criticized a breakaway European Super League. Privately, it had held talks for months with the founders about endorsing the competition.

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/05/20/sports/soccer/super-league-fifa-infantino.html
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Re: Not quite so 'Super' League
« Reply #11856 on: May 21, 2021, 02:14:09 am »
'The Super League Thought It Had a Silent Partner: FIFA':-

Publicly, soccer’s global governing body criticized a breakaway European Super League. Privately, it had held talks for months with the founders about endorsing the competition.

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/05/20/sports/soccer/super-league-fifa-infantino.html
I KNEW it!! Fucking hypocrite Infantino.

Offline Vulmea

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Re: Not quite so 'Super' League
« Reply #11857 on: May 21, 2021, 02:26:10 am »
If you've been following the efforts to reform the game over the past few years, this will probably not be a new link for you: https://www.ourbeautifulgame.co.uk/about

It sets out some of the ideas which are in the legislation before Parliament to establish an independent regulator.

https://static1.squarespace.com/static/5f78751d052f492f9d39e80d/t/5f858cd74076656f3bfa4279/1602587865197/Saving+the+Beautiful+Game_2020.pdf


we arent going to save the game with government committee's and fans making business decisions they arent qualified to make, are we? What needs to be recognised is that you cant have fair competition when one team costs 1 Billion and the other a bag of quavers and a left over mint.

It needs the big and powerful clubs to recognise they are cheating, they are buying an unfair advantage and ruining the spirit of football. They of course would need to understand that it should not be about how much you pay, but the skill or players, managers and the inspiration of supporters and of course lady luck. thats the whole bleedin point - football should be socialism not capitalism - everybody contributes everybody shares in the rewards, currently it is more like animal farm with us being one of the pigs with their nose in the trough. Of course big business dont really get the value just the cost so good luck with that.

if you want everybody genuinely to have a shot, for the game to actually be fair  you would have to remove the structural bias in the game which is the very reason big business have bought in. Liverpool are unique in the respect of a working class club that earned it's success and status from success on the pitch, not from a billionaire, not from a bank flotation or a gangster, or the ruling political party in Spain, or pretending to represent an entire Country, whats happened since the 80's was inevitable and probably irreversible but shouldnt stop people trying but fan representation without control is pretty totemic - we've see over the past year that the fans and their spending is the real power in the game - if SOS or whoever can harness that and make real change then maybe something good could come from the tragic year everybody has had, a goverment quango no doubt led by a Tory appointee (track and trace anybody) isnt really the answer.

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Offline Eeyore

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Re: Not quite so 'Super' League
« Reply #11858 on: May 21, 2021, 01:12:30 pm »
What percentage of LFC supporters overall are members of the SoS?

I do not get the relevance of your question Peter.
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Offline PeterTheRed ...

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Re: Not quite so 'Super' League
« Reply #11859 on: May 21, 2021, 06:26:27 pm »
I do not get the relevance of your question Peter.

The relevance is that the fans' representatives on the Board should be elected, not appointed. I don't mind SoS, but like I asked above, what percentage of the LFC supporters World wide are members of SoS? Who decided that SoS should lead the Supporters Board? Are there any other official LFC supporters groups represented?

I understand that yesterday's news is good PR and damage control, but I can't see it being anything more than that ...

Offline Eeyore

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Re: Not quite so 'Super' League
« Reply #11860 on: May 21, 2021, 07:22:05 pm »
The relevance is that the fans' representatives on the Board should be elected, not appointed. I don't mind SoS, but like I asked above, what percentage of the LFC supporters World wide are members of SoS? Who decided that SoS should lead the Supporters Board? Are there any other official LFC supporters groups represented?

I understand that yesterday's news is good PR and damage control, but I can't see it being anything more than that ...

1906, kop outs and the Liverpool branch of the official Liverpool supporters Club are all affiliated to SoS. The reason SoS should lead the supporters board is because they are the official Liverpool supporters trust. SOS have pledged to represent all fans whether they are members of SoS or not.
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Re: Not quite so 'Super' League
« Reply #11861 on: May 21, 2021, 07:26:10 pm »
What percentage of LFC supporters overall are members of the SoS?

join up mate have your say and help 
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Re: Not quite so 'Super' League
« Reply #11862 on: May 21, 2021, 07:27:31 pm »
join up mate have your say and help 

Was just about to say the same.
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Re: Not quite so 'Super' League
« Reply #11863 on: May 21, 2021, 07:33:56 pm »
1906, kop outs and the Liverpool branch of the official Liverpool supporters Club are all affiliated to SoS. The reason SoS should lead the supporters board is because they are the official Liverpool supporters trust. SOS have pledged to represent all fans whether they are members of SoS or not.

What is wrong with all the members of the Official Liverpool Supporters Club voting on who will represent them on the Board? You know, like in real elections, with candidates, campaigns and everything? This way, it doesn't look pretty democratic ...

Offline Eeyore

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Re: Not quite so 'Super' League
« Reply #11864 on: May 21, 2021, 07:38:27 pm »
What is wrong with all the members of the Official Liverpool Supporters Club voting on who will represent them on the Board? You know, like in real elections, with candidates, campaigns and everything? This way, it doesn't look pretty democratic ...

I think you are missing the point Peter. The Club and SoS are coming to a formal agreement which will give supporters vetos over certain things. It is far more than having fans on the supporters board. It is about protecting the club and above all the fans.

This article from the Athletic explains the significance.


Simon Hughes in the Athletic:

There is an easy way to understand what the agreement between Liverpool’s supporters’ trust and the club’s board means in real terms.

If John W Henry woke up in Boston one morning and decided it was necessary to change the sausage roll supplier on a match day at Anfield, he would still be able to go ahead and do it. If he decided, however, that he wanted to join a breakaway league then he’d have to work his way through a system first, consulting those who hold a deeper, more localised relationship with the institution he owns.

There will be breakers in place that have the potential to intercept any of his ideas. Supporters will have a greater influence than they ever have without holding the same level of responsibility or risk as the owners.

Given that the new arrangement will be wrapped up in the articles of association that define the club’s existence, it will mean any future owner of Liverpool will inherit this relationship as part of their undertaking. If it is all signed off, this could be a groundbreaking day for English football at an elite level.

A couple of weeks ago, the Spirit of Shankly group had asked for two seats on Liverpool’s board and ultimately, they have only negotiated for representation of one delegate at board level. It might seem they have not got exactly what they want but in reality, they have potentially obtained more than they ever asked for. By contractual law, Liverpool’s owners now have to consult them before taking the biggest decisions. If they do not, they could find themselves in a courtroom.

This represents a power shift. It is not what has happened at Chelsea, where two fan board representatives are bound by confidentiality and restricted by company law which means that whatever thoughts they have, they ultimately have to cede to the club’s wishes.

Considering where Liverpool’s owners and its supporters stood after the collapse of the Super League, this is a spectacular development. It is true that Liverpool’s supporter base has been less visible in their wrath compared to Arsenal and especially Manchester United over the last month. There have been no demonstrations outside Anfield. That, however, does not mean they have been any less active.

The frustrations with Fenway Sports Group (FSG) are real and in too many cases justified. Yet there is also an understanding that they have done more to develop the infrastructure at Liverpool than either the Glazers at United and Stanley Kroenke at Arsenal, owners that have barely done anything since their arrival and have merely sat on their asset. At Anfield, there are figures to negotiate with. The same cannot be said at Old Trafford or the Emirates.

There had been a genuine belief that Liverpool’s owners could be persuaded of a better way because of their appointments on Merseyside, those who were cut out of discussions around the Super League. FSG, through Liverpool’s chief executive Billy Hogan, were warned at the start of their discussions that if talks did not amount to profound change then it was possible the scenes that caused the postponement of Liverpool’s game at United at the start of this month could be witnessed at Anfield. If this reaches a positive conclusion, it should reflect well on Hogan and enable him to avoid some of the mistakes of his predecessors.

When each element of Liverpool pulls in the same direction, it can be an irresistible force but it does not take much to upset a fragile ecosystem. FSG must realise now that a clearer line of communication with fans can be beneficial if managed carefully, saving them time on projects and schemes destined never to get off the ground.

They came to realise their reputation had hit rock bottom. There was arguably more outrage at their involvement in the ESL because more was expected of them. Reparation was given a priority status yet it is also safe to say they realised the benefits of being the first of the bad guys to turn the other way.

The devil will always be in the detail but the signs are promising and there should be a wider spirit of optimism surrounding today’s announcement. The new structure at Anfield has not been designed for the supporters but by them. The model is one that will surely encourage others to try and replicate in some recognisable form.
« Last Edit: May 21, 2021, 07:41:13 pm by Al 666 »
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Offline The-Originals

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Re: Not quite so 'Super' League
« Reply #11865 on: May 21, 2021, 07:48:15 pm »
What is wrong with all the members of the Official Liverpool Supporters Club voting on who will represent them on the Board? You know, like in real elections, with candidates, campaigns and everything? This way, it doesn't look pretty democratic ...

the average age is 11 
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Offline PeterTheRed ...

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Re: Not quite so 'Super' League
« Reply #11866 on: May 21, 2021, 07:48:27 pm »
I think you are missing the point Peter. The Club and SoS are coming to a formal agreement which will give supporters vetos over certain things. It is far more than having fans on the supporters board. It is about protecting the club and above all the fans.

This article from the Athletic explains the significance.


Simon Hughes in the Athletic:

There is an easy way to understand what the agreement between Liverpool’s supporters’ trust and the club’s board means in real terms.

If John W Henry woke up in Boston one morning and decided it was necessary to change the sausage roll supplier on a match day at Anfield, he would still be able to go ahead and do it. If he decided, however, that he wanted to join a breakaway league then he’d have to work his way through a system first, consulting those who hold a deeper, more localised relationship with the institution he owns.

There will be breakers in place that have the potential to intercept any of his ideas. Supporters will have a greater influence than they ever have without holding the same level of responsibility or risk as the owners.

Given that the new arrangement will be wrapped up in the articles of association that define the club’s existence, it will mean any future owner of Liverpool will inherit this relationship as part of their undertaking. If it is all signed off, this could be a groundbreaking day for English football at an elite level.

A couple of weeks ago, the Spirit of Shankly group had asked for two seats on Liverpool’s board and ultimately, they have only negotiated for representation of one delegate at board level. It might seem they have not got exactly what they want but in reality, they have potentially obtained more than they ever asked for. By contractual law, Liverpool’s owners now have to consult them before taking the biggest decisions. If they do not, they could find themselves in a courtroom.

This represents a power shift. It is not what has happened at Chelsea, where two fan board representatives are bound by confidentiality and restricted by company law which means that whatever thoughts they have, they ultimately have to cede to the club’s wishes.

Considering where Liverpool’s owners and its supporters stood after the collapse of the Super League, this is a spectacular development. It is true that Liverpool’s supporter base has been less visible in their wrath compared to Arsenal and especially Manchester United over the last month. There have been no demonstrations outside Anfield. That, however, does not mean they have been any less active.

The frustrations with Fenway Sports Group (FSG) are real and in too many cases justified. Yet there is also an understanding that they have done more to develop the infrastructure at Liverpool than either the Glazers at United and Stanley Kroenke at Arsenal, owners that have barely done anything since their arrival and have merely sat on their asset. At Anfield, there are figures to negotiate with. The same cannot be said at Old Trafford or the Emirates.

There had been a genuine belief that Liverpool’s owners could be persuaded of a better way because of their appointments on Merseyside, those who were cut out of discussions around the Super League. FSG, through Liverpool’s chief executive Billy Hogan, were warned at the start of their discussions that if talks did not amount to profound change then it was possible the scenes that caused the postponement of Liverpool’s game at United at the start of this month could be witnessed at Anfield. If this reaches a positive conclusion, it should reflect well on Hogan and enable him to avoid some of the mistakes of his predecessors.

When each element of Liverpool pulls in the same direction, it can be an irresistible force but it does not take much to upset a fragile ecosystem. FSG must realise now that a clearer line of communication with fans can be beneficial if managed carefully, saving them time on projects and schemes destined never to get off the ground.

They came to realise their reputation had hit rock bottom. There was arguably more outrage at their involvement in the ESL because more was expected of them. Reparation was given a priority status yet it is also safe to say they realised the benefits of being the first of the bad guys to turn the other way.

The devil will always be in the detail but the signs are promising and there should be a wider spirit of optimism surrounding today’s announcement. The new structure at Anfield has not been designed for the supporters but by them. The model is one that will surely encourage others to try and replicate in some recognisable form.


Al, I was born and raised in a socialist self-management society. I was member of the Socialist Youth, Socialist Alliance of the Working People, The Workers Union and the Communist Party. I know everything about delegated democracy. It doesn't work. Unless I see direct elections for the fans' representatives on the club's Board, I will know that this is just a PR exercise and a damage control. I know that you have high hopes for what you have posted above, but I've lived through it ...

Offline Fordy

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Re: Not quite so 'Super' League
« Reply #11867 on: May 21, 2021, 07:49:43 pm »
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/57205872

World Cup every 2 years.

Starting to make the super league idea not that bad.

Offline Mighty_Red

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Re: Not quite so 'Super' League
« Reply #11868 on: May 21, 2021, 07:58:45 pm »
We need to see the detail but we have to be pleased with what has been achieved so far. SoS have been one of FSGs biggest critics yet they have been able have constructive discussions and got to a point that is far beyond what many thought was possible.

We don't need a veto for everyday decisions - issues such as ticketing are usually achieve through dialogue (or protest at the last resort). The veto is there to stop owners (current or future) from being able to change the club substantially like putting unsustainable amounts of debt, moving ground or breaking away without proper consultation. 

Heck we should also be able to protect ourselves from being bought by sportswashers.
Some clubs were always destined for greatness...

Offline Eeyore

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Re: Not quite so 'Super' League
« Reply #11869 on: May 21, 2021, 07:59:41 pm »
Al, I was born and raised in a socialist self-management society. I was member of the Socialist Youth, Socialist Alliance of the Working People, The Workers Union and the Communist Party. I know everything about delegated democracy. It doesn't work. Unless I see direct elections for the fans' representatives on the club's Board, I will know that this is just a PR exercise and a damage control. I know that you have high hopes for what you have posted above, but I've lived through it ...

From the SoS statement.

A representative of the Supporters Board will meet annually with LFC’s board of directors to consult on issues pertinent to fans. Outside of this, if an agreed consultation matter is to be discussed at an LFC board meeting, the chair of the Supporters Board will be present.

Supporters Board representatives will have a term of two years and be chosen as the result of a democratic vote.
"Ohhh-kayyy"

Offline rob1966

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Re: Not quite so 'Super' League
« Reply #11870 on: May 21, 2021, 08:05:07 pm »
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/57205872

World Cup every 2 years.

Starting to make the super league idea not that bad.

So UEFA then have the Euro's every two years as well? Players will start to think fuck this, we need a break and the ESL could be the beneficiary.
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Offline PeterTheRed ...

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Re: Not quite so 'Super' League
« Reply #11871 on: May 21, 2021, 08:09:19 pm »
From the SoS statement.

A representative of the Supporters Board will meet annually with LFC’s board of directors to consult on issues pertinent to fans. Outside of this, if an agreed consultation matter is to be discussed at an LFC board meeting, the chair of the Supporters Board will be present.

Supporters Board representatives will have a term of two years and be chosen as the result of a democratic vote.


Yes, a democratic vote by the members of The Socialist Youth, The Socialist Alliance of the Working People, The Workers Union and The Communist Party. Sorry mate, I will be wasting my time trying to explain it. You will have to see it yourself ...

Offline Eeyore

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Re: Not quite so 'Super' League
« Reply #11872 on: May 21, 2021, 09:24:47 pm »
Yes, a democratic vote by the members of The Socialist Youth, The Socialist Alliance of the Working People, The Workers Union and The Communist Party. Sorry mate, I will be wasting my time trying to explain it. You will have to see it yourself ...

You are not making sense here Peter.

Anyone can join SoS regardless of any political views they may hold. They are an inclusive group, why not join and express your views ?
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Offline Fordy

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Re: Not quite so 'Super' League
« Reply #11873 on: May 21, 2021, 09:29:27 pm »
So UEFA then have the Euro's every two years as well? Players will start to think fuck this, we need a break and the ESL could be the beneficiary.

Yep. Fans were quick to think about the clubs instead of what UEFA and FIFA were planning.

Offline PeterTheRed ...

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Re: Not quite so 'Super' League
« Reply #11874 on: May 21, 2021, 09:35:00 pm »
You are not making sense here Peter.

Anyone can join SoS regardless of any political views they may hold. They are an inclusive group, why not join and express your views ?

Because SoS are the chosen ones, not the elected ones. In time, you will understand ...

Offline Eeyore

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Re: Not quite so 'Super' League
« Reply #11875 on: May 21, 2021, 09:41:32 pm »
Because SoS are the chosen ones, not the elected ones. In time, you will understand ...

SoS are the official Liverpool supporters trust. What is there to understand.
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Offline PeterTheRed ...

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Re: Not quite so 'Super' League
« Reply #11876 on: May 21, 2021, 09:45:53 pm »
SoS are the official Liverpool supporters trust. What is there to understand.

One LFC supporter, one vote. Until that happens, everything is only politics, PR and damage control ...

Offline Red1976

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Re: Not quite so 'Super' League
« Reply #11877 on: May 21, 2021, 09:50:47 pm »
These things always have great ideas and great headlines - then always find a way to mess it up

The petition - https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/584632

1. Like a referee, an independent regulator would safeguard our beautiful game impartially.

Seriously - referee's are independent? Obviously not started by a Liverpool fan this season.

The letter - https://gary-neville.medium.com/an-open-letter-e5b4749fb50a

It is time to act. We support:
  • Government legislation to block any Premier League clubs attempting to abandon the country’s football pyramid.
  • The appointment of an Independent Football Regulator.

Why not just the latter and focus on that, rather than trying to stop clubs leaving. What happens if a club goes bust? Will they not be 'allowed' to leave?


 An independent regulator would be pointless if they had no legal powers and support of UEFA and FIFA who run football. And what would this mean for the FA and Premier League- would the regulator's powers and remit not clash and cancel each other out? It would lead to too many people giving orders and not enough to carry them out.







Offline Red1976

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Re: Not quite so 'Super' League
« Reply #11878 on: May 21, 2021, 09:57:07 pm »
From the SoS statement.

A representative of the Supporters Board will meet annually with LFC’s board of directors to consult on issues pertinent to fans. Outside of this, if an agreed consultation matter is to be discussed at an LFC board meeting, the chair of the Supporters Board will be present.

Supporters Board representatives will have a term of two years and be chosen as the result of a democratic vote.



 The problem with "consult" is that any suggestions or ideas can be ignored. I have worked for employers who have "consulted" the workforce and then gone and done what they please. The same happens with Government or local authority consultations! This to me seems like 'lip service' rather than anything meaningful.


Offline Eeyore

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Re: Not quite so 'Super' League
« Reply #11879 on: May 21, 2021, 10:15:02 pm »
One LFC supporter, one vote. Until that happens, everything is only politics, PR and damage control ...

Liverpool according to a report from the London school of marketing from 2015 have 580m supporters worldwide. Are you really suggesting that nothing can be achieved without all 580m fans voting ?
"Ohhh-kayyy"