Topic: Man City - cheating bastards rumbled

[Macphisto80]

How's their bus holding up through all of this?

[Red Beret]

So it's mid February now, and the CL group stage draw for next season would take place sometime early-mid August.  Which means CAS has a little under six months to render a judgement on UEFA's punishment.  If they can't do it by the end of July then I'd expect City to go into next year's draw; so what are the chances of City dragging their heels when it comes to producing any evidence that might be requested?

Also, reducing the punishment doesn't reduce the crime. I'm sure City (or the owners at least) want the entire verdict expunged, as it damages their whole PR exercise as a whole.

I can't see their players willingly leaving given the (secret) money they're on; but if the tax starts going through the books and the PL gets involved they might not have much choice but to take a paycut and run.

I'd say that, although the odds are long, there is a small but very real chance Abu Dhabi PR FC could completely unravel under this judgement.  CAS will be fully aware of the implications their ruling might have.

[Son of Spion]

Yeah - they aren't ashamed at all. Instead - it's everyone elses fault and they are proud that they will hire the most expensive lawyers to fight this (despite the fact that the allegations are true).

Ironically, they are outraged by everything and ashamed of nothing.

[cdav]

So all the sponsorship deals that were overinflated will need to be remeasured surely now?

No way they can afford their wage bill if they and without CL money. Will need to sell players just as they need to fund a rebuild?

[KurtVerbose]

Would a top lawyer want to work for City, knowing they're not in the champions league?

[AmanShah21]

A 10points deduction for all seasons since 11/12 should do it. Gives us 2 titles and United 1. City are still champions for their “centurion” season but no longer have that acclaim.

That would not be proportional. And if they were to be stripped of the titles, the seasons should be nulled without a champion. Either way, the trophies and points were won on the field and even if the squad was assembled unfairly, they still had to go and win. I don't like the idea of changing history unless there's been unsportsmanlike offences (doping, fixing etc.)
There should however be squad restrictions (Reduced spots for non homegrown players) and decreased FFP leeway (amount of loss allowed over a period of time) for atleast a few years alongside a proportional fine. That's what FA should be looking to do.
Even from a UEFA standpoint, I find the 2 year ban a bit disproportional. I personally feel that they are starting high so that they can negotiate it to 1 yr and a reduced fine like they did with Milan.

[Brian Blessed]

Schadenfreudegasm.

[idontknow]

City had a email leaked with a "One down five to go" mocking one of UEFA FFP administrators who passed away.

That was Simon Pearce, [Edit, Simon Cliff][Edit again Simon Pearce & Cliff are both there - not certain which one sent the email then] I think,a head honcho between City and Abu Dhabi.
He's meant to be a big important scary guy.
But that email will be sitting next to everything else when City appeal.
So, maybe their top lawyers are just grasping thickies.

That's what happens if you rely on Macafee, I suppose.

Sort of a side note, but it is heartwarming that the very best legal minds do tend to work for justice.
It's the 2nd-raters who hunt the money.

[Dave D]

[Zeb]

Chelsea's transfer ban stood whilst they appealed?

Part of Chelsea's appeal was that FIFA were picking on them by making them the first club to which that happened. CAS decided punishment was 'time served' with that window.

[AmanShah21]

So it's mid February now, and the CL group stage draw for next season would take place sometime early-mid August.  Which means CAS has a little under six months to render a judgement on UEFA's punishment.  If they can't do it by the end of July then I'd expect City to go into next year's draw; so what are the chances of City dragging their heels when it comes to producing any evidence that might be requested?

Also, reducing the punishment doesn't reduce the crime. I'm sure City (or the owners at least) want the entire verdict expunged, as it damages their whole PR exercise as a whole.

I can't see their players willingly leaving given the (secret) money they're on; but if the tax starts going through the books and the PL gets involved they might not have much choice but to take a paycut and run.

I'd say that, although the odds are long, there is a small but very real chance Abu Dhabi PR FC could completely unravel under this judgement.  CAS will be fully aware of the implications their ruling might have.

Wouldn't it be the opposite like it was with Chelsea's ban. City would be suspended unless CAS can overturn the decision in time, right? So City should want the judgment by May or June at the latest.

[Eeyore]

It will; the ban can't start until the appeal process is exhausted, otherwise a litigant could get punished for something that the appellate process clears them of.

City have already indicated, in leaked emails, that they are prepared to pay tens of millions to hire the best lawyers to turn this into a sporting Jarndyce vs Jarndyce

That was in the original case from 13/14 though when any judgement was subjective and based on what constituted a fair value for sponsorship. This case isn't subjective. It is about City falsifying the evidence they gave to UEFA. Football leaks and Der Spiegel have provided internal emails that are pretty irrefutable.

It would be much more difficult and much more damaging to try and take this case to court and attempt to kick it into the long grass.   

[Red Beret]

https://twitter.com/sportingintel/status/1228406708176850944?s=21

Interesting, maybe the #taintedtitles will be gone, ah well they’ll still have those carabao cups

City always had a choice - having signed up to the FFP rules, like all the clubs in Europe - NOT to break them. Just spend a bit less, take longer to catch up. But Mansour & Khaldoon's mindset is: "We're rich. We do what we want."

Pretty much what I said earlier.  Not just the money they spent but the attitude they had spending it made them a lot of enemies.  They don't have enough Range Rovers for all of them either.

As an aside, I imagine other football clubs will now be looking very closely at this.  Many at or near the top table will want this punishment to stick; and I imagine a number of clubs who have already been punished would be rightly pissed off to see City get off the hook, so the pressure will be on.

[Ghost Town]

Chelsea's transfer ban stood whilst they appealed?

Right, but weren't they only appealing the length of it, rather than the fact of it? I'd have to recheck.

[Dave D]

Some useless c*nt on sky sports nearly in tears telling us man city have better lawyers.

[DangerScouse]

And to think most of the English c*nts wanted these cheating fucks to win the league last season.

[tornado]

Finally, a punishment which befits the crime, I think what also hurt City is their aggressive posturing and bullying tactics in spite of the smoking gun which probably irritated UEFA even more.

They will go to CAS, but I am sure UEFA thinks this is watertight, else they wouldn't have been so bold.

[Lush is the best medicine...]

The footballing Gods can't be this kind, surely?

While no one sees an expulsion from the Premier League as likely, the Football League have recently changed their rules so that any club in that situation must start again in League Two.

[idontknow]

It will; the ban can't start until the appeal process is exhausted, otherwise a litigant could get punished for something that the appellate process clears them of.

City have already indicated, in leaked emails, that they are prepared to pay tens of millions to hire the best lawyers to turn this into a sporting Jarndyce vs Jarndyce

Can't wait for the spontaneous combustion.

[vicar]

City had a email leaked with a "One down five to go" mocking one of UEFA FFP administrators who passed away.

The quote from the guardian article:

In 2014, the IC determined that City had a deficit of €180m over that two year period, vastly in excess of the €45m permitted, and in May that year agreed a settlement which some at Uefa believed was too lenient. A day before that, the former chair of the IC, Jean-Luc Dehaene, a distinguished former prime minister of Belgium and senior European Union politician, died aged 73, survived by his wife of 49 years and their four children. Spiegel quoted Cliff’s reaction to this news in an internal email, referring to the membership of the IC: “1 down, 6 to go.”

Cliff being the club’s lawyer Simon Cliff, who sounds like a piece of work if you read the other stuff.

[Ghost Town]

That was in the original case from 13/14 though when any judgement was subjective and based on what constituted a fair value for sponsorship. This case isn't subjective. It is about City falsifying the evidence they gave to UEFA. Football leaks and Der Spiegel have provided internal emails that are pretty irrefutable.

It would be much more difficult and much more damaging to try and take this case to court and attempt to kick it into the long grass.

Yes I tend to agree, which is why I think there's a good chance that despite their immediate posturing, they will ultimately not appeal the judgement, though they may try for a technicality review

[Red Beret]

UEFA tried to reopen PSG FFP case but couldn't.

What a farce.  Looks like UEFA decided to take their frustrations out on City instead.

[AmanShah21]

This place and bluemoon are opposite ends of a spectrum right now.

City fans seem to believe they'll end up making lots of money out of this by some kind of weird logic like 2+2 = Carrot
On the other end, we have our lot thinking they'll end up in league 2 for an FFP breach.

I'd like to see the odds off either of those.

[disgraced cake]

If they where to get a points deduction, how many would it be, and can it happen now so we're confirmed champions at the earliest possible date? (I know Leicester are close to them on points  )

[RK7]

And to think most of the English c*nts wanted these cheating fucks to win the league last season.

Strangely (I know) they found it easier to deal with knowing Man City cheated, anyone else winning it would have been harder to accept.

[Ghost Town]

Can't wait for the spontaneous combustion.

Bleak!

[CraigDS]

On the other end, we have our lot thinking they'll end up in league 2 for an FFP breach.

Has this actually been said by anyone?

[KurtVerbose]

While no one sees an expulsion from the Premier League as likely, the Football League have recently changed their rules so that any club in that situation must start again in League Two.

Hard to see Pep motivating Agüero to win against Grimsby Town.

[Lush is the best medicine...]

Has this actually been said by anyone?

its what happens if they kicked out of the league

Hard to see Pep motivating Agüero to win against Grimsby Town.

Those full stadiums will do it, speaking of aguero he bought a massive penthouse in the centre of manc a while ago for £4m, bet he regrets that now!

[decosabute]

Utter laissez faire approach from the cowardly media here, who were more hyped by pepball over an even playing field.

Absolutely right. Far too many have turned a blind eye.

Just the other day, 'respected' journalist Miguel Delaney was banging on again about his "super clubs killing the game" shite, which involves essentially putting what we and City do together as the same thing. It's false equivalence that even Donald Trump would think twice about.

Well now one of the clubs have been called cheats and banned by UEFA. So maybe there are some who have earned the right to be super clubs and some cheating pricks who haven't.

[Red Beret]

AguerNOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!

So, if City had to give up their titles, would the players have to give their medals back as well?

Imagine, giving the best years of your career for nothing - well other than being labelled as a financial cheat anyway.

[Qston]

This place and bluemoon are opposite ends of a spectrum right now.

City fans seem to believe they'll end up making lots of money out of this by some kind of weird logic like 2+2 = Carrot
On the other end, we have our lot thinking they'll end up in league 2 for an FFP breach.

I'd like to see the odds off either of those.

You're not very good at maths are you. Everyone knows 2+2= turnip

[WhereAngelsPlay]

Has this actually been said by anyone?

Only as a joke.

[Hazell]

So, if City had to give up their titles, would the players have to give their medals back as well?

Imagine, giving the best years of your career for nothing - well other than being labelled as a financial cheat anyway.

All their goals during this time should be chalked off as well so that Shaun Goater or someone remains their all time top scorer.

[Armand9]

meh, i'll believe it if their appeal crashes and burns, fuck knows which way it'll fall, they seem confident, some due process not followed? or they just whinging impartiality? we'll see

[decosabute]

Big question here about the credibility of the English press. It took a German newspaper to uncover all this, so begs the question what the fuck were the English papers doing? Forget about the tabloid rags, I'm talking about your 'serious' broadsheets.

Too scared to 'rock the boat'? Weaklings the lot of them, too busy propping up fairytales like a now proven financially corrupt multi-billionaire club beating the likes of the, erm, mighty QPR.

The English press's claim to fame is a myth, independent my arse. Only David Conn pursued this with any vigour and he himself was a boyhood City fan for fuck sake.

While German sports press were doing an unbelievable job, we have to keep up with the likes of Hodgson's boyfriend Henry Winter as one of the peak writers of English football. Barrels being scraped indeed.

Again, absolutely bang on.

[dimwit]

City should absolutely be stripped of the titles in the relevant seasons, any points deduction has to apply to the first season they are allowed back into Europe or it’s absolutely fucking meaningless.

If I was a Man City supporter I’d be fucking ashamed of my club today, everything they’ve won is basically meaningless now unless you are a morally bankrupt c*nt

They should be made to pay any european income from those seasons to the clubs that missed those via mcity cheating.
No reason that income should be accounted for city in their ffp budget..

[Sir Capon of Debaser]

Surely they haven’t got a leg to stand on appeal wise , because this is also about the last appeal they won unfairly which has basically made uefa look like absolute fucking dickheads.

 When the cas look at this,they’ll obviously take how they duped uefa last time and think this is the least they deserve. The only reason we’re here is cos they conned uefa last time.

[swoopy]

Has anyone checked on Stuart Brennan ?

[Son of Spion]

Strangely (I know) they found it easier to deal with knowing Man City cheated, anyone else winning it would have been harder to accept.

This is it. Everyone knew a plastic club purchasing the title meant nothing at all, but a real club winning it properly scared the crap out of them.

That lot are like those 'Lords of backwatershire' who bought their titles for £18.99 on the internet. Only difference is Abu Dhabi paid billions for theirs because they thought it would make them look respectable.