« on: February 25, 2024, 02:02:37 pm »
EFL Cup Final
Chelsea v Liverpool
Wembley Stadium
25th Feb, 15:00h
Referee: Christopher Kavanagh
Assistant Referee's: Mark Scholes & James Mainwaring
Fourth Official: Tim Robinson
Reserve Assistant Referee: Wade Smith
VAR: John Brooks
Assistant VAR: Marc Perry
How big is your.....pitch
Hey folks.
Warning first - this is a long one. 
(Insert that's what he/she said jokes)
Again, it's Chelsea v Liverpool at Wembley and again, nobody can really predict much aside from it being a hard fought battle. For the most part, almost all finals, late stage CL games or late-season important games between Chelsea and Liverpool have been mud-soaked trench warfare. Games like the last one at Anfield are increasingly rare when these two sides come toghether. I expect another one of those slogs, but with Chelsea being pretty hard to read these days and our lineup being almost impossible to predict - you never really know. Here's what we do know.
We are coming into this game on the back of what I honestly believe to be the most crucial moment of our season. Think of any way a team can be challenged mentally, physically, tactically, ahead and during a game - we have faced it against Luton. It was the 'destined to lose' moment we simply said no to. Not today. Not happening. One can hope that things can only get better from here, right? And I hope they get better starting with this match against Chelsea. Let's briefly look at Chelsea and where they are. It will be expanded on much more later.
Their February hasn't really been that bad. It started with a defeat against Wolves in the League, but they followed that up with FA Cup win away to Aston Villa, League win away to Crystal Palace and with the much appreciated away draw to Manchester City. I wouldn't exactly call it picking up a head of steam, but they really aren't in a bad place either. The way they played against City should have given them some encouragement as well. Though Halland missed a hatful of golden chances, they did defend well, Disasi in particular had a very good game, and they found ways to open City up on counters. Some transition plays by Palmer (who faded later in the game) and constant pressing and effort by Gallagher gave them a foundation to build from. So yeah, very much a team finding their feet but well capable of scoring goals and creating good chances against anyone. They've also had a full week of rest, but one could debate if this is beneficial or not. Sometimes maintaining competitive tempo is better and allows you to start games faster and sharper.
As for us, well, it seems that nothing matters any longer. We are entering some kind of logic defying phase of the season. No amount of, well anything, seems to break our stride. Take it on the chin, get up and go. I see this game as a reward for hard work so far by the entire squad, as it should be really. Hopefully we get some players back for this game, both for starting eleven and also for the bench, but for the most part it's a game that will have to be handled by those that played against Luton - and that's perfectly fine. Boys deserve their chance to graduate winning trophies, I believe they have what it takes - because they've shown it more than once. So dust off any pain and fatigue and let's roll again. We'll know more in few days about who is available - but we already know that whoever gets to play will have no fear and leave everything out there. What more can you ask?
Something old, something new
We wanted to do something special for the Matchday thread ahead of the finals. So my idea was to give it a go and try and rekindle the Spyin' Kop tradition, basically get the opposition view ahead of a big match. This used to be a staple on RAWK and I very much enjoyed these threads. I suppose they've died out in recent years with forums as a medium not having the pull they once had. But I was hopeful we could pull one off. So off I went out there, into the great wilderness of the internet, bright eyed and hopeful in search of what I've been told is a very elusive and hard to find creature - a reasonable Chelsea fan. I have to report, contrary to what you might think - I found plenty of them. We got along really well all being said and think their replies are interesting. So big thanks to all participants.
Hope you enjoy the read and aren't too hard on Chelsea fans that took part.
Spyin' Kop Rekindled
I've been pretty puzzled by the way Chelsea season has turned out. It seems there were (again) too many changes during the summer and the squad is in a prolonged state of trying to stabilise that foundation, the core upon which to build up some momentum. How do you feel about your season so far under Pochetino? Is he on a trajectory to something or is the maze of new players proving too tricky to navigate?
axman2526: It is more or less how last season felt. Losing games we should not be losing, stuck in midtable, owners sticking to their guns on life time contracts and youth development. Only swapped our inability to score from last season for an inability to defend now.
charierre: No real improvement, a team full of young individuals still looking for consistency and thus become a team.
CaitlinCFC: Crap. He either gets it right sometimes or so wrong. It isn't his fault completely having a completely new team. He is probably the best manager we have had since Tuchel still.
mojo: I was not against his appointment, think he did very well at Spurs. but it is obvious we've become a f**king mess of a club, so I think we should not be pointing fingers towards him.
Zeta: sh*t. THERE HAVE BEEN A FEW VERY SMALL SIGNS OF PROGRESS, HIDDEN AMONGST PLAYING PLAYERS OUT OF POSITION, NO CLEAR IDEA WHAT ANYONE IS TRYING TO DO. I DIDN'T WANT HIM THEN AND I DON'T WANT HIM NOW.
carrickblue: For much of the season the team has looked unbalanced and rudderless. Only since losing to Liverpool and Wolves have we looked anything like the thing and that also coincides with not playing Silva at the back. I have been disappointed with Poch so far but maybe I was just expecting too much too soon.
Modueke: I hope it's a trajectory to something better and he looks to have picked up over the last few games! It was only a few weeks back that I thought he should be sacked, but he seems to have brought the dressing room together again/won it back, and that must've been a hard achievement in itself. Just hope he can keep it that way! I always viewed Poch as a 'nearly' manager in England. 'Nearly' winning a league, 'Nearly' winning a Champions League, so if we can compete again at a level we had been used to, I don't know if Poch would carry it through!
Gol15: Pochettino isn't a miracle worker by any means and while he is working his best it looks like he's not going to be able to rise above the occasion just yet, he simply needs more time in order to even get an opportunity to improve the competitive level of the squad and he would maybe need to spend a lot in order to do it. It's worth to add that the project itself by its design looks very hard to pull off given that it's a lot of new players that have to become a team while playing in the PL so any possible weakness will become a reality more easy since a lot of the senior players that would usually help the manager with the building of the new team have often been injured and there is simply a lack of such players to begin with.
Jezz: I think the club has been in a period of instability since Abramovich was forced to sell, and Boehly/Clearlake took over and implemented their own strategy. I'm hoping we're past the worst of it now, but time will tell on that front. With respect to this season, I think improvement has been slower than I had hoped it would be. I thought the benefit of no European football and more time between games to train and prepare would help us. I would say we're in a better spot than we were this last time year under Potter, but it's taken longer than I expected to see significant improvement. I think if we can manage to get to around 60 points by seasons end, then we're slowly progressing in the right direction. Hard to say if we're completely on the right track under Pochettino, but a settled squad and more coherent recruitment strategy would be hugely beneficial for us.
Rob B: I don't think I'm saying anything particularly controversial if I said that most fans - if not all fans - don't see Poch as the long-term solution. My personal view is that he's been dealt a difficult hand (turnover of players, injuries etc) but has made plenty of mistakes along the way. He is fine for the time being though as our problems are much bigger than the manager. I do think we can further improve under him too, I just think there will be a ceiling.
Argo: I've found him hugely frustrating so far, he's capable of setting up in an elite way and competing toe to toe with even the best sides (as you found out at The Bridge) but also capable of some absolutely amateur set ups (as you saw at Anfield). The fact he's had people unironically thinking Enzo and Caicedo are crap is a huge huge black mark.
Last summer transfer window was crazy. The blow for blow chase of Caiceido and Lavia and Chelsea once again pushing the envelope in terms of incoming transfers. But during the season both of them (Lavia was and is injured obviously) did not seem to make the impact I expected. Who do you see as the best purchase so far of the 'Wild Boehly Years', both in terms of present impact but also one you see as the possible future cornerstone?
axman2526: If we are able to keep them the majority of their careers, I.e. being a minimum regular CL qualifier, then I would say it is between Malo Gusto, Cole Palmer and Enzo Fernandez.
charierre: Palmer.
CaitlinCFC: Cole Palmer and Enzo Fernandez.
mojo: Cole Palmer
Zeta: NOT EXACTLY MANY TO CHOOSE FROM, THEY ARE ALL MOSTLY CRAP. PALMER IS THE ONLY DECENT ONE REALLY.
carrickblue: Palmer without a doubt.
Modueke: At present, Palmer! And want to think we can add Disasi, Gusto, and Caicedo to that future cornerstone! Enzo can be quality but I think we were already expecting that to an extent!
Gol15: Enzo Fernandez was a real key signing and a statement signing at the time. After him, managing to secure Nkunku was a big deal. Any top team would have been happy to have those two players and they have a clear path to establish themselves as top players in the near future, they could make their own legacy at the club if things turn out well.
Jezz: I agree, the transfer deals we've engaged in have been "wild". Palmer has been very good value for money for us. I think Manchester City made an error letting him go. I still think Enzo Fernandez despite the expensive transfer fee is steadly improving and will be a good long-term prospect for us. Disasi and Gusto are two defenders starting to impact for the better now and they're solidifying their spots in the team.
Rob B: Cole Palmer and Malo Gusto are probably the two stand-outs so far this season and both clearly exceptional young talents. That said, most of our transfer business has been really good and I think Petrovic, Nkunku, Fernandez, Caicedo, Jackson etc will all show their quality over time. People forget just how hard it is to adapt to the premier league as a young player. The problem with our business is that we've been exclusively young players and then added them to a team with Gallagher and Colwill etc. You could also argue that we lack experience / quality in forward areas albeit seemed to have turned a corner here of late. In isolation, we've really not got many wrong since the new Sporting Directors were in place.
Argo: For me Palmer and Enzo, don't be fooled by the latter having a little rut with Poch playing him as an auxiliary winger.
With Everton getting points deduction, Manchester City living in a limbo state of being both the best club and the biggest frauds ever and Premier League attempting to show some teeth in regulating football finance - homegrown players are becoming an increasingly valuable commodity in balancing the books. They allow clubs to make pure profit, on the other hand they bring heart and fight to the pitch that doesn't come as easy to imported players. So, is Conor Gallagher now the one player Chelsea should both definitely sell and at the same time definitely keep and build their team around?
axman2526: You lot should buy him. Seriously I told my Kopitie best mate the same. In a side looking to win in all he has flaws but he would be a cracking squad player. He has an amazing work ethic and fitness record, always keeps going. Madness we may cash in but like you said pure profit and these owners have their plan.
charierre: Conor is important for winning the ball back high. Every team requires a player prepared to do the scruffy stuff.
CaitlinCFC: They shouldn't build a team around him but need to keep 100%. He is Chelsea.
mojo: You don't build a team around Conor. He is the guy you always want to be in the team. Selling him to Tottenham would be the dumbest transfer but that's now expected from these merchants.
Zeta: WE CAN SELL HIM, I DON'T HAVE MUCH OF A PROBLEM WITH IT. TECHNICALLY, HE'S AVERAGE. DOESN'T SCORE MANY. DOESN'T ASSIST MANY. JUST RUNS AROUND AND PUTS IN SOME TACKLES. IF WE CAN GET 40M FOR HIM, TAKE IT.
carrickblue: I wouldn't sell him, we're beginning to see Gallagher, Enzo and Caicedo click - they've struggled to work as a three in midfield for much of the season but there's something good there for next year.
Modueke: Conor wants to play for Chelsea! He doesn't want to go anywhere! For that alone, he shouldn't be sold! Roman would've seen that loyalty but these new owners are all about the ££££ so who knows what happens with him. We're a business to them now!
Gol15: Conor Gallagher has shown that he a good range of skills and he's definitely a good fit for the league, it all depends if the manager believes that the squad could improve with another player instead, he wouldn't be the first quality player that the club let go but it's important to have a vision of how the team should look and play.
Jezz: I'd like to keep Gallagher rather than sell him off to a rival club, but if we're struggling to comply with FFP we might not have any other choice. I don't think he's the type of player you build a team around, but he's very useful role player that can fit in well into a strong team.
Rob B: Keep - no question about it. We have plenty of other players to sale before him, both from the academy i.e. Chalobah, Maatsen, Broja, Anjorin, Hall etc and then from our senior squad - Lukaku, Ziyech, Sarr, Kepa, Cucurella etc
Argo: For me he's the perfect 12th/13th squad player to pad out winning squads. The type of player all squads need but isn't quite untouchable status.
Looking ahead to the Final match by looking back on our previous encounter. Liverpool were relentless on the evening, probably one of their best performances of the season, and still Chelsea had good chances, few very reasonable penalty shouts (I was certain at least one of those would be given) and on a different night the score might have looked much better for the Blues. Do you think that defeat, as it was quite recent, will galvanise your team ahead of the final?
axman2526: Not in the slightest. The gulf between the two sides was there for all to see. I told that same best mate had Nunez not decided he fancied and crossbar and post challange more than actually scoring goals you would have put us to the sword. In a way it was a worse pi$$ take that you did not.
charierre: You never know which Chelsea will turn up. It’s a final so I’d expect the better version.
CaitlinCFC: Yes. I think we are (at times) better now but still way behind Liverpool in every way.
mojo: Of course not. It is a million dollar question what galvanises this lot. From hero to zero to zero to hero.
Zeta: NO, WE'LL BE JUST AS sh*t
carrickblue: No, can imagine they'll be pretty nervous of getting tanked again.
Modueke: I think we are probably f**ked either way!
Gol15: I personally don't believe that the previous meetings between the two teams will have any weight for the cup final, that being said I believe that this upcoming matchup is looking to be more significant for Chelsea as a club as it's the only hope of having some success.
Jezz: I think the defeat at Anfield a few weeks back was quite demoralising to be honest. It showed the gulf in class between the two teams. If anything, the performance in the 4th Round of the FA Cup against Aston Villa might have been a turning point in galvanising the squad, but it's too early to say whether that's the case or not.
Rob B: To be honest, not really. I'm expecting a better performance, but we don't seem to have that mentality yet. Some of the old Mourinho, Conte, Tuchel teams would be baying for blood, but this lot have a long way to go.
Argo: After the game I thought not unless we changed managers but your recent injuries combined with Poch tactically wiping the floor with Emery and outsmarting Pep for over an hour has given me hope.
Liverpool are going through a strange patch of recurring injuries and other events conspiring so the side that played against Chelsea at Anfield did not start another game afterwards. With two more games to go before the final, who knows who gets to return to fitness or become unavailable. If you could pick one Liverpool player you do not want to see starting at Wembley - who would it be and why?
axman2526: One player does not matter when you have Klopp. No Salah when we played you last? No problem. Klopp just picks a replacement and and machine keeps going. For arguments sakes Jota, as he is your best finisher imo.
charierre: Salah ,is the obvious though Nunez is good for the ‘shots on target’ bets.
CaitlinCFC: Salah. I like him a lot but he scores goals.
mojo: It doesn't matter at all. But I would like Klopp to be suspended for this one 😁
Zeta: DIAZ
carrickblue: Jota probably, he's got a dangerous unpredictability to his play.
Modueke: It might be better for us at the moment if you play your reserves!
Gol15: For me it has to be between Jota and Szoboszlai, both are very good at what they do best and their runs forward make things very difficult for any opposition, their presence is pretty terrifying since both can solve matches just by being on the pitch.
Jezz: Mohamed Salah. An experienced player who's played on the big stage numerous times and knows what's required to get the job done. Think he'll be a real handful for our defenders.
Rob B: VVD is an obvious one as a leader and because of the way he marshals your back-line. Curveball but I'd be quite pleased to see Jota on the bench too! His goals to games ratio is incredible.
Argo: Out of who could be playing or anyone in our squad full stop? If the former Luis Diaz, feel shades of Hazard watching him play. If the latter Alisson, famous last words but I'd actually fancy our chances this time against you in a shootout if it's Kelleher vs Petrovic.
In similar vein to the question above. Who is one Chelsea player you would want to both start and also have a good game at Wembley and why?
axman2526: Reece James. On his day he wins games on his own with assists and goals.
charierre: Palmer, makes us tick.
CaitlinCFC: Eden Hazard 😆 Cole Palmer because he can change a match. Or a peak Sterling masterclass.
mojo: Reece James.
Zeta: PALMER
carrickblue: Palmer. He has the ability to create and the knows how to frustrate the opposition.
Modueke: Reece James would be good but won't happen so hoping Conor has a good game!
Gol15: Having Nkunku ready to start and have a good game would be pivotal for Chelsea's chances to win the final.
Jezz: Cole Palmer. He was poor at Anfield a few weeks back, but he's a dangerous goal scoring threat and his incisive passing will give our attackers opportunities in front of goal.
Rob B: Enzo was superb in the earlier fixture this season and if he plays well, the team will play well. The other one is Cole Palmer. Already our main creative force up top. So one of those two.
Argo: Nkunku. Although I think Poch will stick to the same team that played against City his record in domestic finals is sensational.
You're facing a pretty tricky game against Manchester City this upcoming weekend, but will have the week off ahead of the Final. Meanwhile Liverpool will play Luton at Anfield midweek before the Final. Do you think the week of rest will benefit you (players returning, working on tactics) or would you prefer to play and keep your players sharp?
axman2526: We have had both this season and had no benefit either way. Don't believe it will be a factor.
charierre: We don’t appear to do tactics, hopefully we don’t get more injuries in training.
CaitlinCFC: Prefer to play as long as there are no injuries.
mojo: It doesn't matter with this lot.
Zeta: DOESN'T MATTER EITHER WAY. STILL sh*t.
carrickblue: Hardly matters, our form has been so erratic a break or another game seems to make no difference - you never know which Chelsea is going to turn up.
Modueke: I think breaks are bad for Chelsea unless its a close season. An International break broke our momentum before after a few weeks without games, so sharpness off the back of a good couple of games is better!
Gol15: I don't believe it will matter for Chelsea, the team will have it on their minds that there is a cup final coming up and having to play Man City before it can only have a positive impact due to the level of competitiveness of Man City.
Jezz: I think the week off will be beneficial. Gives us more time to prepare and do our homework on the opposition. Our record and performances against the top clubs has been decent this season. Liverpool will also be challenged by squad rotation due to their current injuries.
Rob B: Week of rest allowing us to fully focus.
Argo: Hard to tell, we've on paper had that advantage all season but it's not worked out that way.
Not exactly asking for a prediction, there are too many unknowns in terms of availability and so on to even get into it now. But how do you see the game playing out? Are we finally going to get something other than a wrestling match and see some free flowing, goal-scoring football?
axman2526: You will win the game comfortably, Poch cannot train a cohesive defensive unit.
charierre: End to end ,free flowing, 2-2
CaitlinCFC: We need to at least try. It would mean more to us. If it went to penalties again then we may have a chance with Petrovic but we need to get there first 😐
Zeta: EASY WIN FOR LIVERPOOL.
carrickblue: Probably be over by half-time, I think you'll win comfortably.
Modueke: We're probably f**ked but after a good game against City at the weekend, I hope we can carry that into this one!
Gol15: Since it's a final I believe that both teams will be nervous and I expect the second half to be much more entertaining than the first.
Jezz: I can see it being tight, but Liverpool should have enough to overcome us.
Rob B: No idea, I thought the recent game would be tight and it was anything but! Only thing I would say is most finals tend to be quite cagey so if pushed I see us losing by the odd goal.
Argo: Can't see another 0-0 as back in those two finals (and last season) our strengths laid in defense and we didn't have a particularly good attack, at the moment it's the total opposite so I can see some goals here.
And to close it off, I'm really interested in your mid-long term views on Chelsea at the moment. Do you think you'll end the season in european places and do if not - would you still hope the owner sticks with Pochetino? Also do you think you'll have another 'wild transfer summer' (is it even needed) or will it be more a case of re-balancing the squad and the books and adding few smart additions to the squad?
axman2526: European places? No, 11th, 10th or 9th I believe we end the season in. Stick with Poch, continue the Brighton fetish with RDZ, appoint Tim Todd's mate to run the show. Don't matter, no faith in these owners or directors to make the right choice and support a manager. Don't think we can have another wild summer. We are feeling the FFP pinch now imo, and is why players like Maatsen, Broja, Gallagher and Gilchrist will likely be sold.
charierre: No,No,No
CaitlinCFC: It will be hard to climb the table that much. We have been stuck around the same place for so long. I think a few players will come in because we need a striker. A few will get sold or loaned. It will not be big spending again because the owners must know by now that it doesn't quite work that way unless you are on a Playstation.
mojo: Can't tell at the moment. Depends on what we'll see more of this season, I am hoping for a miracle but realisticly we all know what awaits us - more mess.
Zeta: NO. NO. MORE OUTGOINGS THAN INCOMINGS. UNDERPERFORMING, HIGH WAGE PLAYERS WILL GO, E.G. STERLING. PROBABLY LOAN OUT A FEW OF THE YOUNGER ONES WHO CAN'T CUT IT, E.G. MUDRYK, MADUEKE. I'M SURE THEY'LL SIGN A FEW RANDOM BRAZILIAN TEENAGERS FOR 20M A POP THOUGH.
carrickblue: Don't see us getting into Europe - that might be a reason for them to ditch Poch but I don't know who comes next. I wouldn't trust these owners to make a good choice. Can't see us spending big this summer. FFP has to be on their minds and they've committed long term to the guys they've bought. We could see a few players leaving, including Gallagher. That'd be a poor move in my opinion.
Modueke: Some sort of Europe would be good but we need consistency to finish the season and hope some others above can f**k up! I doubt there will be massive transfers again, but I wouldn't mind seeing some experienced players in, especially with talk of Silva going at the end of the season too.
Gol15: The club will have to simply survive this season, so far it hasn't look like the squad could actually finish in top eight but even so I believe that the summer will be interesting in one way or another, some players will leave and whoever the manager is he will want some specific addition to this squad.
Jezz: I think the highest we can finish is 7th, which would give us qualification for the Conference League. We've been perpeutally stuck in 10th for most of the season, but we're only 3 points off 7th so it's gettable. I'm on the fence with respect to Pochettino, but I'm always adverse to change without having a proper alternative in place. A lot will hinge on how well we finish the season whether the owners stick with him or not. Winning the League Cup would certainly add to his credibility and give him time. Who knows what will happen under these owners, but I think it will be a summer of re-balancing the squad, clearing out some deadwood and hopefully making a few intelligent additions to the squad.
Rob B: I don't think we'll make Europe, I think there are too many teams above us. I think we could leap-frog one or maybe two but not three or four. I'm a bit nonplussed on Poch to be honest. Wouldn't lose any sleep if he went, but happy enough for him to stay. Main priorities have to be to sign a striker, renew Gallagher's contract, get the likes of Lavia and James properly fit, and then a couple of ins/out.
Argo: I'd like to think we'll just buy when we need to buy at this point.
PS - I love you
Lastly, in case anyone needs reminding of what's obvious. Days go by, time flies, roses are red - stop and smell them. This season is special, Klopp's time with us was, is and will forever be special. Just savour it. Every game, every minute of what's left. Nobody knows what lies ahead, but as the clock ticks relentlessly - steal some time to enjoy this crazy, crazy ride. Let's go. Again.
Final?
Every game is our final.
« Last Edit: February 25, 2024, 05:44:13 pm by TepidT2O »
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“Happiness can be found in the darkest of times, if one only remembers to turn on the light.”
“Generosity always pays off. Generosity in your effort, in your work, in your kindness, in the way you look after people and take care of people. In the long run, if you are generous with a heart, and with humanity, it always pays off.”
W
