Topic: Curtis Jones

[Magz50]

Very impressive yesterday. Showing real growth and skill. Was a monster in the middle!

[Black Bull Nova]

I feel like Dele Alli would probably object to being compared to Jordan Ibe

They were just two players I could think of whose career went backwards when their star was on the rise, Deli obviously less so but backwards nevertheless

[Fromola]

A superb protector of the football, whilst being very capable of creating dangerous situations. A fantastic combination which should see him be a fixture in the first team squad for 10/12 years.

He's the closest we've got to Gini in terms of what he brought to the midfield. It's just a question of experience.

[newterp]

is there an all touches video for this game from him? he really was excellent.

[Funky_Gibbons]

is there an all touches video for this game from him? he really was excellent.

https://twitter.com/lfc_comps/status/1484501348758478849?s=21

[afc tukrish]

https://twitter.com/lfc_comps/status/1484501348758478849?s=21

Nice one, Funky...

[newterp]

https://twitter.com/lfc_comps/status/1484501348758478849?s=21

awesome thank you1

[newterp]

https://twitter.com/lfc_comps/status/1484501348758478849?s=21

oh so it was his hospital pass that almost got Fab's ankle broken??

[royhendo]

From https://mobile.twitter.com/petemotz/status/1363464738391351305

[RedG13]

From https://mobile.twitter.com/petemotz/status/1363464738391351305

Thiago WOW also. He been very impressive so far would like to see his passing keep getting better also.

[Funky_Gibbons]

Which constellation is that?

[Red Bird]

Zug system, I think.

[El Lobo]

From https://mobile.twitter.com/petemotz/status/1363464738391351305

[farawayred]

That chart shows that after is slightly better in progressive passes. 😊

[Eeyore]

From https://mobile.twitter.com/petemotz/status/1363464738391351305

Ceballos ?

That must be from last season.

[scatman]

Can also see why Kovacic passes the eye test.

[royhendo]

[William Regal]

Was a real break out performance for him v Arsenal, big game and he was fantastic, carried the ball so well on the counter and great technical ability in tight spaces.  Confidence is not a problem for him, its now time for him to show how good he really is.

[Clint Eastwood]

Not great today, but clearly rusty like many others from the break.

I’m curious as to what our plan is with him though. He’s competent and capable enough to be a box-to-box midfielder like Gini was in this side. He’s certainly got all the attributes to be a regular for us. However, he hasn’t been a consistent attacking threat during his time in the first team. Which is surprising, because when he first broke through, all of his best moments were in and around the opposition box.

If our plan is to develop him into a Gini/Henderson/Milner mould, I think he’s coming along nicely.

[jooneyisdagod]

Not great today, but clearly rusty like many others from the break.

I’m curious as to what our plan is with him though. He’s competent and capable enough to be a box-to-box midfielder like Gini was in this side. He’s certainly got all the attributes to be a regular for us. However, he hasn’t been a consistent attacking threat during his time in the first team. Which is surprising, because when he first broke through, all of his best moments were in and around the opposition box.

If our plan is to develop him into a Gini/Henderson/Milner mould, I think he’s coming along nicely.

I strongly believe that this is not the case. When Jurgen comes out praising him, it is usually after the games where Curtis takes on players, plays a few cutting edge passes and generally is forceful around the box. That is what got him into the team and it is what will keep him there.

 I don't believe that Jurgen is trying to turn him into a more defensive-minded player at all. One of Jurgen's hallmarks as a coach is improving players at what they are already good at and enabling them to hit new heights. Curtis broke through as a dashing attacking midfielder. Since then, he has been inconsistent and has had too many anonymous games where he takes the safe option. And he seems to find himself on the bench when that happens. Personally, I would rather he played a bit more freely as he has the ability to do it and that is where I think he brings value to the team. We brought in Thiago to replace Gini. I think that says a lot about how Jurgen views the role.

[CanuckYNWA]

Thought he was poor today and very selfish in possession, i get that he has scored some bangers from outside the box but the amount of times he fails to pick his head up and even attempt to find a pass is very frustrating

Its like in middle of the pitch hes very progressive, beats players, drives forward, finds pockets of space. But when he gets in that final 3rd he just tends to lose any and all creativity and becomes very boring with his pass choices or just shoots

Compared to Elliot who came on in the RCM 8 he just seems to offer creativity everywhere. I think Curtis will be a quality depth player but dont thin he will ever be a starter for us long term.

As that chart shows, hes very good at carrying the ball and driving forward but he clearly lacks the killer ball which is just as important when you open up that space in front of you after carrying it past players. But time and again i see him beat players, open up space and then just dribble into a brick wall, pass back or lose the ball.

[UNO]

The problem with Jones is that he never sees the situation around him before he gets the ball. Every time he receives the pass, he stops, make some minor movements trying to get pass the defending player in front of him, then he passes the ball to his teammates when all possible opportunities are lost! The best example is the instance when he gets Tsimicas offside after fiddling on the ball meaninglessly while Tsim is getting into a great position. His performance today is horrible. It’s even worst when you compare him with the quick thinking, quick passing Elliot who makes the team run much more smoothly and efficiently! Jones really needs to improve quickly otherwise he will be way behind Elliot in the team selection.

[RedG13]

Not great today, but clearly rusty like many others from the break.

I’m curious as to what our plan is with him though. He’s competent and capable enough to be a box-to-box midfielder like Gini was in this side. He’s certainly got all the attributes to be a regular for us. However, he hasn’t been a consistent attacking threat during his time in the first team. Which is surprising, because when he first broke through, all of his best moments were in and around the opposition box.

If our plan is to develop him into a Gini/Henderson/Milner mould, I think he’s coming along nicely.

I think the plan is a mold into an Thiago type MFer. He looks like a controller type Mf where Elliott the Penetration final 3rd type. Jones has the talent to do it just takes to time to learn and do it more constantly. He getting there more and more.

[disgraced cake]

Yeah, not great today but since the start of the year it's been nice to see him get games after a stop/start frustrating season. With presumably a couple of our elder midfielders leaving in the summer there's going to be plenty of time and chances for Jones to impress, and in the long term I've always thought he'll be a key player for us going forward. I'm probably more interested to see where Jones will be more than any other player when Klopp (likely) leaves in a couple of years from now.

[mrantarctica]

I think the plan is a mold into an Thiago type MFer. He looks like a controller type Mf where Elliott the Penetration final 3rd type. Jones has the talent to do it just takes to time to learn and do it more constantly. He getting there more and more.

I think he's got it in his locker to do both. The big difference between good and top class is that ability to get forward at pace and then keep progressing at the opposition defence. He breaks quickly forward multiple times today, receives the ball moving forward with really good first touch but instead of just continuing the pace, he slows down and stops and allows the defence to organise and this kills our attacks. He's got to keep working on that aspect to keep the tempo of the game high. He's progressing but he needs more games too. We need to be patient.

[RedG13]

I think he's got it in his locker to do both. The big difference between good and top class is that ability to get forward at pace and then keep progressing at the opposition defence. He breaks quickly forward multiple times today, receives the ball moving forward with really good first touch but instead of just continuing the pace, he slows down and stops and allows the defence to organise and this kills our attacks. He's got to keep working on that aspect to keep the tempo of the game high. He's progressing but he needs more games too. We need to be patient.

Thiago can do both too which is good thing. Jones gets to learn from the best in Thiago too. He pretty good already but just turned 21 years old, I expect him to keep improving at it.

[El Lobo]

I think his decision making definitely needs to improve, he's had quite a few instances recently where he's almost purposely not gone for the obvious pass when the obvious pass was....pretty obvious. But he's only just turned 21, and I'm not sure I know many of that sort of age or younger who have their decision making nailed already (except Harvey, which might end up being a problem for Curtis....)

[Knight]

The idea that what’ll keep Jones in the team at LCM if he creates and scores is so different to what we normally ask of our LCM that I’m not sure it can be right. Given the way we play we don’t need him to score and create and we don’t make those criteria determinative for our other CMs. Perhaps the issue is he’s not great defensively AND he’s not brilliant around the box. Thiago is a brilliant progressive the ball and brilliant defensively and mainly stays behind the ball so isn’t in the box. Jones doesn’t do much in the box either but also doesnt give enough defensively yet.

[tubby]

Agree with a lot of what's been said about his recent performances.  He's a bit of an odd player in that he does have the skill and drive to progress the ball, but not the passing vision or range of someone like Elliott once he's created the space for himself.  Feels like he's better at creating opportunities for himself instead of others.

[RedForeverTT]

Agree with a lot of what's been said about his recent performances.  He's a bit of an odd player in that he does have the skill and drive to progress the ball, but not the passing vision or range of someone like Elliott once he's created the space for himself.  Feels like he's better at creating opportunities for himself instead of others.

Isn’t this the reason Klopp had an honest conversation with him? There is something that looked to block his progress at the moment that only he knows.

[royhendo]

'Recent performances'. The game before last he was pretty brilliant away at Arsenal - it's a strange thing, the human brain.

[So… Howard Philips]

'Recent performances'. The game before last he was pretty brilliant away at Arsenal - it's a strange thing, the human brain.

Young player being inconsistent shocker!

[SamLad]

Young player being inconsistent shocker!

god help all of us when it happens to Harvey.

[mercurial]

Agree with a lot of what's been said about his recent performances.  He's a bit of an odd player in that he does have the skill and drive to progress the ball, but not the passing vision or range of someone like Elliott once he's created the space for himself.  Feels like he's better at creating opportunities for himself instead of others.

What is his assist rate? I think he creates enough for others. Not always do you need to make the final pass, if he can bring the ball into the opposing third then we must appreciate that. It’s not easy to progress the ball and create spaces. Look at how firmino is valuable to the team. I think prople get taken in by dribbles, assists and jazzy play and the more  fundamental aspects are undervalued. You don’t need a team with 5 messi playing in there. It would be unbalanced.

[RedG13]

What is his assist rate? I think he creates enough for others. Not always do you need to make the final pass, if he can bring the ball into the opposing third then we must appreciate that. It’s not easy to progress the ball and create spaces. Look at how firmino is valuable to the team. I think prople get taken in by dribbles, assists and jazzy play and the more  fundamental aspects are undervalued. You don’t need a team with 5 messi playing in there. It would be unbalanced.

https://fbref.com/en/players/4fb9c88f/Curtis-Jones
His Progressive passing is low right now but basically everything else is 80th if not 90th percentile.

[Knight]

https://fbref.com/en/players/4fb9c88f/Curtis-Jones
His Progressive passing is low right now but basically everything else is 80th if not 90th percentile.

Decent pressure numbers but he's not good defensively at the moment which is a problem given the way we play.

[RedKenWah]

My one criticism of him at the moment is that he hangs onto the ball far too much, and when you come up against sides who are defensively compact then what you want from the your players is for them to move the ball quickly.

Game on Sunday v Cardiff, it was noticeably better when Harvey came on he was passing the ball a lot more quickly than Curtis. Granted it could be argued that Cardiff were tiring so their pressing was less effective but I think it’s the one part of his game that he can do to work on.

Obviously I’m being hyper critical of a very young lad who has an amazing ceiling for his talent to flourish, but yeah sometimes some teams require us to hold onto the ball and make something happen and sometimes you need to recycle possession quickly to counteract a side who sit back.

[CanuckYNWA]

My one criticism of him at the moment is that he hangs onto the ball far too much, and when you come up against sides who are defensively compact then what you want from the your players is for them to move the ball quickly.

People can say he is young and inconsistency is part of it. Fair play

However he is VERY consistent at dribbling into brick walls and failing to pass the ball off. This is not inconsistency, he does it regularly. Its his weakest part of his game and people can claim our 8s dont need to create, thats bs. They might not be the last pass before a goal but the amount of times, keita, thiago and even henderson pass a ball to someone with space who then assists the goal is huge compared to Curtis.

He dribbles into dead ends or blind alleys way too often and makes us super predictable when playing against low block teams.

[Knight]

That might be true but it's also true that we can be very predictable in passing the ball side to side against a low block and having players able to receive and dribble into tight spaces is very helpful.

[Elzar]

Not having any of this, he has off days of course, but when he came on vs Arsenal he opened them up plenty and if he had longer we would have won that first leg. His style of play means he will fail to take it past someone at times and will miss a pass sometimes but he is great with the ball at his feet and he provides a very direct option for us.