Topic: Work / Employment advice thread

[jordyball10]

Hi Lads,

Advice needed, I have given my notice last week however I need to work a month notice. As I owe them 4 days holiday when I next get paid will only be 6 days pay which is no good for me as I need to live etc what's best thing to do?

Thanks

[paddysour]

Hi Lads,

Advice needed, I have given my notice last week however I need to work a month notice. As I owe them 4 days holiday when I next get paid will only be 6 days pay which is no good for me as I need to live etc what's best thing to do?

Thanks

Bit confused. Do you know that you still get paid during your notice?

[Lfsea]

You will work your months notice and lose 4 days' pay relative to your salary.

Remember though that in your last month you ought to still earn about 2 days holiday leave anyway, which should balance out some of the holiday you've already taken.

[jordyball10]

Bit confused. Do you know that you still get paid during your notice?

Yes I know this, however I worked out it will be roughly 6 days pay. I can start my new job straight away and get a full month, just need to know whether I should discuss it with them or just not go in

[Claire.]

If you're planning on not going in, then at least speak to them and see if you can work out an arrangement. Never know when you'll need to speak to someone from an old job and it's best to not leave on bad terms if you can avoid it.

[Alf]

I'd just work your notice, the grass ain't always greener elsewhere even though the money is normally better.

[paddysour]

You will work your months notice and lose 4 days' pay relative to your salary.

Remember though that in your last month you ought to still earn about 2 days holiday leave anyway, which should balance out some of the holiday you've already taken.

This, I don't understand where the 6 day figure has came from

[Lfsea]

Yes I know this, however I worked out it will be roughly 6 days pay. I can start my new job straight away and get a full month, just need to know whether I should discuss it with them or just not go in

So you're currently working part-time?

[CraigDS]

So you'd normally work 10 days in a month, but given you've taken 4 holidays over what you'd be entitled to (including what you'd earn during your months notice period) you'd then only get 6 days pay?

If that's the case then you only really have 2 options - try and take the hit and just work your notice, skip working it and start the new job (but if doing the latter I'd atleast speak to your current employer first).

[jordyball10]

So you'd normally work 10 days in a month, but given you've taken 4 holidays over what you'd be entitled to (including what you'd earn during your months notice period) you'd then only get 6 days pay?

If that's the case then you only really have 2 options - try and take the hit and just work your notice, skip working it and start the new job (but if doing the latter I'd atleast speak to your current employer first).

Yes because i gave my notice on the 21st Sep and i have to work until the 16th October, so when i was paid on the 25th September that does bring me up to the end of the month. As i owe 4 days holiday this would be taken off the days i will be working if i did my notice. I could have started my new job today or next week and be paid in full for the month. The way i see it is if my current employer doesn't want to come to an arrangement i just don't go in.

[Salger]

Definitely worth speaking to your current employer and explaining the situation to them. If they're half decent then they should let you leave to start the new job, although I'm not sure how the 4 days holiday would be accounted for. If you just don't go in, you run the risk of pissing them off, taking some sort of financial hit due to the holiday and not being able to use them in future for references.

[Lfsea]

As it's part-time could you possibly do 4 days for your old employer on a casual basis? That way you don't lose out at all.

[jordyball10]

As it's part-time could you possibly do 4 days for your old employer on a casual basis? That way you don't lose out at all.

It is full time, i have used more holidays than i should have thats why i owe 4 days. I spoke to them and they said they need me this week but then take it from there, however i need to know sooner as i need to inform my next employer.

[CraigDS]

It is full time, i have used more holidays than i should have thats why i owe 4 days. I spoke to them and they said they need me this week but then take it from there, however i need to know sooner as i need to inform my next employer.

Just take that as them saying you're fine to leave at the end of the week.

You'd of worked the time to cover the holiday you owe (I presume) so worst case is you basically don't get paid for this week but then can start properly with the new job next week.

[jordyball10]

Just take that as them saying you're fine to leave at the end of the week.

You'd of worked the time to cover the holiday you owe (I presume) so worst case is you basically don't get paid for this week but then can start properly with the new job next week.

Spot on. It is what i am hoping. However if they haven't got back to me by Thursday with an answer maybe i just don't go in on the Monday.

[Mr Mingebag Squid]

What a load of shit.

Just found out I'm probably going to be made redundant. Our company was bought by a bigger corporate monster, and they've just told us the bit we work in is being relocated from Cheltenham to Ipswich. Bloody Ipswich!?!?

Second time in 5 years for me now - I'm kinda relieved by this one though - can kick back and enjoy the footy!

Ps Apologies to any Ipswich dwellers!

[Grobbelrevell]

That's a bummer if it happens mate. Time to get the feelers out into the job market in that case I guess!

Hopefully you'll look back at this as a good thing, after you land a better position 

[Pheeny]

I got made redundant at the beginning of the year,I was one of the luckier ones as because of my age I'm a sort of early retirement.

 

[Les Willis]

A few guys where I work have been made redundant. The rest of us have a reprieve till the end of Jan - though there might be other things we can be redeployed on. Personally, the only reason I've stayed in the role so long is waiting for the (what should be) a reasonable sized payoff. I was Tuped from a larger company to a smaller one, but they kept the redundo terms as was. I can see it might be a bit of a legal battle getting them to honour it mind you.

[Elmo!]

My building is pretty much a ghost town after all the redundancies this year.  I work in the Oil industry in Aberdeen and moved into a brand new building early last year before the oil price crash, now we are stuck in a building 4 times the required size with people getting let go almost everyday. My department (IT) is the only one that hasn't had any redundancies yet but I suspect that is only because we have been busy shutting down rigs and once that has died down, one or two of us will have to go.

[red mongoose]

My building is pretty much a ghost town after all the redundancies this year.  I work in the Oil industry in Aberdeen and moved into a brand new building early last year before the oil price crash, now we are stuck in a building 4 times the required size with people getting let go almost everyday. My department (IT) is the only one that hasn't had any redundancies yet but I suspect that is only because we have been busy shutting down rigs and once that has died down, one or two of us will have to go.

The newspaper I worked for was in trouble for a while and we all knew it, but I survived about four culls until myself and one woman from sales were the only ones left - an entire newspaper office staffed by two people. It was especially jarring because when fully staffed, we must have been the loudest place around, shouting insults and questions and curses and jokes across the room at each other all day long. We had this one old lady who was always asking us to shut up because she was trying to do interviews on her phone haha  Eventually they shut even the two of us down.

Because I knew this would happen eventually, I started to do my research long before the hammer fell, so I was ready to start my move to Thailand. It still took a year to make it happen and during that time it was a sad weekly slog down to unemployment to pick up the government scraps. Another bit of planning that paid off was my Mini Cooper - it wasn't easy to afford the car loan payments on my salary, but I knew it had very good re-sale value. When I was set to go, I sold my car and used the profit to pay for my plane ticket to Bangkok. That was the very last of my money, but luckily I had made arrangements with friends here and could hit the ground running.

The time to plan is before you lose your weekly wage - you aren't so desperate in that case and can think clearly. Just some thoughts from someone who has been through this 

[Mr Mingebag Squid]

Definitely see it as an opportunity - I currently have a 45 minute commute, and this is my chance to get a job closer to home.

Just gutted I wont be working with my colleagues any more - don't care for the company one bit.

[pw1008]

Happened to me last year, came completely out of the blue although there wasnt that much work on the previous couple of months. I'd be bored there for years but it was easy but forced me into looking elsewhere and its worked out better for me despite a longer commute actually enjoying things more.

Good Luck

[Elmo!]

I work for an IT managed service provider, which means I work permanently on site with one of our clients (effectively outsourcing).  The client is an oil company, and due to the fact my employer are an Aberdeen based company, around 80-90% of their clients are Oil & Gas related.   This means that since the oil price crash last year, times have been pretty tough as Oil companies try to cut costs.

Around 6 months ago, we were asked to sign an amendment to our contracts removing certain benefits in order to keep us competitive and to prevent redundancies.  This included the 'away rate' which was a fixed amount we were paid per night we spent away on work trips.  They said this was because 1) none of our competitors had an away rate, so it was proving hard to win contracts and 2) several of our current clients had asked for it to be removed in order to cut costs.  However the client I work for has not asked for it to be removed and doesn't have a problem paying for it.  We were told that our company would continue charging my client for it, and as a compromise, would give us something but it wouldn't be the full amount (it was very vague).  There was a lot of pressure put on us to sign the amended contract (it will save colleagues jobs etc) and it was clear anyone who refused to sign it would not be looked on favourably if it came to redundancies. I and all my colleagues at this client site signed it (reluctantly).

I have had a couple of trips since then where I have put down the away rate on my timesheet and I have been given a few hours overtime per night on my payslip but I have just had the payslip that covers my most recent trip, and I have been given nothing.  Contractually I know I don't have a leg to stand on but I think it is grossly unfair that they are chargin the client for it but not passing anything on to me.  I wouldn't mind so much if the client was refusing to pay it but they are not.  The company were also making a big deal at the AGM in September about how they were outperforming all our competitors and despite the poor conditions were still profitable.

Is it worth me chasing it up and causing a fuss or is it pointless given I have signed the contract relinquishing the right to the away rate?

It's not a huge amount of money involved but it's the principle of it that pisses me off.

[Ciara (with a capital "C")]

Are you out of pocket?

[Elmo!]

Are you out of pocket?

Well contractually no, but my company is being paid extra money by our client for me being away on a work trip for them, and they are keeping all that to themselves.  We used to have it in our contract that we would be paid for it.  There was a verbal agreement that we (those of us who work for this particular client) would be compensated in the form of an unspecified amount of overtime hours but it would be unofficial and it wouldn't be as much as the fixed rate we had in our contracts previously - we accepted this as we didn't have much choice - but they haven't done so this time.

[AndyInVA]

People are being laid off left and right in Oil and Gas.

Maybe better to grin and bear it even if it pisses you off a bit. Look on the bright side, your still employed in a traditionally well paying sector.

My mate in Oslo in O&G was told yesterday he will be laid off just before Christmas at a time when the oil price is down and another job in the same sector will be really hard as every employer is pretty much in the same boat.

[Nick110581]

If anyone works within HR please pm as big question to ask and don't need witty replies....

[zebenzui]

I got a[nother] petty work problem to put on rawk's collective desk.

I work retail, and the store is straddling the line in terms of staff cover, such that I am asked to do cover shifts, or called up to work (often with only a few hour's notice) to cover for sickness.

During the interview when I got this job, the interviewer asked what reasons I would have for refusing overtime. Not being tied to college/uni, another job, or children to look after, I said a couple of tame reasons then shrugged and said I couldn't think of any. She has since taken this to be an exhaustive list, and that I have literally no reason to refuse overtime, and brings this up whenever I say no to any overtime. As well as this she is generally not understanding of me having prior arrangements, and consistently tries to coerce and pressure me into overtime I've explicitly said no to.

My contracted hours are quite low, so I work about 20-50% more than my core hours as overtime per week. This, however, is seemingly not enough I am still informally told I need to do more in this regard.

My contract states: "there may be occasions when it is necessary for you to work additional hours, in those circumstances your co-operation is expected and we will provide you with as much notice as possible."

What does this actually mean for me in this scenario? Can any rawkites give their views on this?

(As an aside, I've taken up the advice offered on my last thread about work problems and joined an union, so if this gets worse I'll be sure to consult them.)

[CraigDS]

You're not contractually obliged to accept any and/or all overtime hours offered to you, no matter what you said at your interview.

Accept what you want to accept, refuse what you don't want to. If they kick up a fuss or try to pressure you into anything else then contact your union rep.

[Phil M]

My contract states: "there may be occasions when it is necessary for you to work additional hours, in those circumstances your co-operation is expected and we will provide you with as much notice as possible."

Allow me to translate...

"As you mean nothing to us, there will be numerous occasions where we will make you work additional shitty hours, in those circumstances your co-operation is expected as is your loyalty, punctuality and your willingness to work at short notice for shitty pay for a bunch of c*nts who neither value you or your service to the company. Should you not agree to this you will be asked to leave at the shortest notice possible."

Do the right thing, jack up.

[ThePeetmix]

Another one of the horrible new trends that has come with the lower-pay grade level jobs.

Companies should always get enough staff. THEN if people have holidays or are off sick, it can be offered out to people to do overtime. But don't have a go at people if they don't want to do it. You shouldn't be forced to work outside your contracted hours. It's pure stupidity and it's just praying on people's need to work.

[Les Willis]

Just say, "My working hours are ...." "I've been flexible and done overtime on the following occasions ...."

"I'm sorry, but I'm not able to do this particular shift but will be willing to help out when I haven't got a prior arrangement".

Can't see that they can be arsey at all given that.

[Lfsea]

I'm in a similar situation with work at the moment with regards to overtime. We've had a boatload of redundancies so I understand their position and am begrudgingly accepting for the time being, however I won't be doing so forever - especially as it's a 24/7 company and I dont much enjoy getting up at midnight to go to work.

The world of overtime appears to be a legally grey one. Basically, it depends on exactly what it states in your contract. Have a read of this:

http://www.nidirect.gov.uk/sm/overtime

I would be very surprised though if you had to accept overtime that was sent to you on the same day as the shift.

It does sound like you are being borderline bullied about it, which is a different situation altogether.

Simplistic question, but if it's a part-time retail position, are there not lots of other companies you could potentially jump ship to if it is so miserable where you're at currently?

[zebenzui]

You're not contractually obliged to accept any and/or all overtime hours offered to you, no matter what you said at your interview.

So that paragraph of the contract I quoted is basically meaningless?

Can't see that they can be arsey at all given that.

They've found a way to be. Even when I'd be out of town for the shift they want me to do, they'd tell me to cancel it. Fortunately I'm not that indolent to give it on that occasion, but I have colleagues who do cave to the pressure all the time. Which is sad to see as well.

The page basically says you don't have to do overtime unless it says so in your contract, I'm just curious as to whether that passage I quoted out of my contract equates to such a clause.

Also I wouldn't say bullying, but the inferrence is there that if I say no enough times it will definitely turn to that. And everytime I've said no so far the reaction I've gotten has been irritable and surly. Such that I'm always nervous about saying no, regardless of the reason - which they won't accept as valid anyway. In fact, one time, I declined a shift I was asked to do 3 hours in advance because I had babysitting that night - this was later brought up as an example in which my attitude towards overtime has not been good enough.

In short, they don't operate on the basis that overtime is voluntary. And I don't know if that bit in my contract allows them to do so.

[redbyrdz]

If you're working part time, but regularly have to do overtime to cover normal shifts (not like during Christmas sales or whatever), I'd ask them to increase your regular hours.

If your contract mentions overtime, I think you can't legally refuse it, unless it'd take your working hours over 48 for that week or if there's less than 11 hours between one shift and the next (I think - I'm not a legal expert). I also think they have to give 'reasonable' notice for an extra shift - what 'reasonable' is, is not clear, but I think three hours is a bit short.

Ask your union rep, they will know what is normal in your workplace. They're there to help.

[Lfsea]

If you're working part time, but regularly have to do overtime to cover normal shifts (not like during Christmas sales or whatever), I'd ask them to increase your regular hours.

If your contract mentions overtime, I think you can't legally refuse it, unless it'd take your working hours over 48 for that week or if there's less than 11 hours between one shift and the next (I think - I'm not a legal expert). I also think they have to give 'reasonable' notice for an extra shift - what 'reasonable' is, is not clear, but I think three hours is a bit short.

Ask your union rep, they will know what is normal in your workplace. They're there to help.

I did some reading around the subject after I originally posted as it's something I'm experiencing at the moment in work, as we level out following our mass redundancies. What you have written there is what I ascertained.

[Mr Mingebag Squid]

Fellow Rawkites...

Is there anybody out the with any familiarity with employment law regarding redundancy? I have a question regarding consultation periods that I'm looking for advice over before potentially going to the CAB and/or a solicitors....

[ollyfrom.tv]

Plenty of good advice on here

http://www.acas.org.uk/index.aspx?articleid=1611

[Mr Mingebag Squid]

 Cheers mate!