Topic: Round Table Newcastle 2-0 Liverpool

[royhendo]

So, Flanno can play a bit eh?

Stood in the clouds behind that goal, all I can say is that, at half time, I felt we had scope to run Gutierrez ragged down that flank and win the game, despite the half-assed contributions from some players in the first half.

But of course we moved Bellamy away from the slot that was asking that particular question, and we, well... what did we do exactly, other than contain ourselves as a unit and allow them to counter effectively?

Pepe's red mist is a massive problem, obviously... but let's not ignore the pachyderm in the pavilion. We have massive problems, and they appear to be motivational and tactical, do they not. There are issues with the scouting and the values paid for players, granted, but despite them being a good side, we never even turned up today. What gives?

[Yorkykopite]

It was brutal to see us fall apart against Newcastle, of all teams. Newcastle who sold us a pup and replaced him with not just one, but two, strikers most of our fans would now kill for. Newcastle who we normally stuff, St James's or no St James's. Newcastle who are managed by a tart like Pardew but who somehow contrive to play a maverick like Ben Arfa, the sort of intuitive player we haven't seen take the field for Liverpool since.....since....since who? Litmanen? Beardsley?  Of course he wouldn't be able to play for us because he doesn't 'track back' or whatever it is the Dirk Kuyts of the world do.

It's like a virus has got into the team and no one has a clue what the antidote is. Maybe a semi-final win over Everton will be the antidote. One fears, if it is not, that Kenny is now on borrowed time.

It's so hard to work out what the team is trying to do. Clearly there must have been a vague sort of message to hit the ball long a bit more often - and sure enough quite a few lollipops were launched from the back which Newcastle's weak defence picked up and sucked. But what was Gerrard meant to be doing? What was Shelvey's role exactly? And Spearing? Is he allowed to move when we have the ball? I know he points a lot and spreads his arms out wide. But movement? Is that not permitted?

That was a predominantly British team out there today yet there seemed to be incredible communication problems: players converging on the same ball, players making identical runs into the box, players occupying the same space. Players standing still for seconds on end. Zero imagination.

I caught a bit of Pienaar's movement off the ball yesterday on MoD. Jeezus, how we could do with some of that. Or Ben Arfa's today. These sorts of midfielders know what it means to support the man on the ball. They change their mind and alter their trajectory when the ball moves in an unexpected way and they do it instantly and damagingly. We seem to have none of that intellligence in the middle of the pitch.

Let's not talk about Carroll. He had such a wonderful chance to make his erstwhile admirers choke on their pies and elected to dive instead. And what an inept dive. At least clip the fucker, Pires style, if you're going down.  I see no hope for him at Liverpool unless Liverpool have given up on hope.

I hope Suarez doesn't give up on us. He had a poor game today but he was still on another level to his teammates.

Finally, the Geordies are wankers. 'You'll never get a job'? Yeah, like Tyneside is riding some kind of economic miracle. I used to feel a sense of solidarity with that part of the world. But today it sounded like a stadium full of David Camerons. Shame on you you c*nts.   

[Vulmea]

think its hard to comment on tactics or individuals when the side is so mentally fragile any plan goes out the window with the first set back that comes our way

the Newcastle goal which came against the flow of the game imho just seemed to drain us of  belief as though both teams knew we couldn't score

if the first goal did that - the second when perhaps we'd just started trying again - completely shut us down - the Suarez chance immediately after - I mean come on thats got to go in right?

Reina gave vent to his frustrations which have been simmering through the team for weeks - it was stupid and really annoying but it was his fault - does that happen in a side confident and comfortable with each other - we'd given up again and whilst  most of the players should hang their heads in shame at that, the manager is not immune - where does that attitude come from how is it allowed to thrive -  instead of coming togther we fractured apart -

[Corkboy]

I watched this game in a rather pleasant bar in Bruges, which is about the best thing I have to say about it. I'm now typing this in my hotel in pitch darkness in reception because I can't find the light and everyone has gone to bed.

Gerrard was a disgrace. He wasn't a member of the the front three, and yet he seemed perfectly entitled to lose the ball and walk. Let me say that again. He lost the ball and walked. That wasn't ok when we had Rush, who was a striker. When you play for Liverpool Football Club and you lose the ball, you don't walk. He could do a lot worse than look at Cabaye or Tiote for an example of how to play football.

Carroll is an enigma. I really don't know what goes through the lad's head. His chance early on, which could have dictated the game, was baffling. He rounded the keeper and then succumbed to what I can only presume was a bad case of oh shit my right foot isn't very good itis.

I don't know how else to put this but we are shit. I don't know when or how this happened but there it is. We were schooled by a half decent Newcastle side. At the moment, we couldn't beat eggs with an electric whisk.

We are lost. No doubt, we will conjure up an epic performance against Everton because, for some reason, the players will be motivated by some ineffable thing outside of their pay cheques but I won't care. This is a fucking horrible season. Reina's sending off was idiotic but emblematic. We have lost the plot. For once, it wasn't Carra or Kuyt or any of the usual scapegoats. It was pretty much all of them. I don't mind an off day but we have now cemented our status as a mediocre team. Whatever the plan was, it hasn't worked.

The numbers don't lie. Right now, we are a horror show.

[Yorkykopite]

I watched this game in a rather pleasant bar in Bruges, which is about the best thing I have to say about it.

Don't jump off that big tower Corky.

Even if they do play 'Raglan Road'.

[Veinticinco de Mayo]

think its hard to comment on tactics or individuals when the side is so mentally fragile any plan goes out the window with the first set back that comes our way

[Yorkykopite]

So why is the team so "mentally fragile"? Who is responsible for getting the side to such a point that tactics "go out of the window at the first setback"?

[killer-heels]

So why is the team so "mentally fragile"? Who is responsible for getting the side to such a point that tactics "go out of the window at the first setback"?

Probably everybody in the club.

Its not just this season. Poor mentality has reared its ugly head after Alonso left in the summer of 09. That season, all the players had a strop that Alonso hadn't been replaced and we moaned and bitched and we had a crap season because we felt all the woe in the world. Whereas not too far away, Man Utd had lost both Cristiano Ronaldo and Carlos Tevez and although I loved Alonso, that was a greater loss in my opinion.

While our players sulked, Man Utd players gave interviews stating how it wouldn't impact them. They lost the league by just the 1 point but won it last season and look set to win it this season, while we are pretty much nowhere in the league. Thats the culture that they have and one that we don't have unfortunately.

That was poor that neither the manager and/or players could create such a mentality and it appears that this lot of players and manager haven't been able to do the same, in the league anyway.

[No666]

Killer - that was a symptom. You had a situation in which the manager, in particular, was making it obvious the owners were bleeding the club dry. It was a considered tactic to help get rid and it was true; we all knew it and it was not surprising the players knew it, too. Right now we have several players who are aware this is their last season with us, and unconsciously (if not consciously) couldn't give a shite whether we have CL football next year or not. (You could argue it's no surprise the team is delivering in cup competitions, because that gives the hard, in-hand currency of a medal to take with them.) We have others who do not have the confidence or the status, because they are new/young/untried to turn a game, let alone a losing run, around. What's so surprising in any of this?

[Hinesy]

bump

[BCCC]

No belief, disjointed, lack of effort, lack of quality and capitulation when we don't get the rub of the green.

We'll probably win the FA Cup.

[Mutton Geoff]

horrible horrible game, only bright bits the performances of Flanagan and Shelvey, as for the rest I hope to wipe this game out of my memory very quickly. One thing though is Stevie still injured or just off form these days?

[The G in Gerrard]

It's April now and its the case of square pegs in round holes still and that's the frightening bit about it all.

Carroll starts - ok. His chance in first half, he created by himself. It may be archaic but why don't we "gamble" on midfield runners or our wider players run beyond him to get any flick ons he may win?

The midfield, Gerrard needs to be higher up the pitch if he's going to have a positive impact. Shelvey - good to see the lad start but again where does this come from? He'd had zero to a few minutes inbetween his appearance at Villa away.

I'm just not sure how our team sets up sometimes and it isn't to the benefit of most of our players.

[RayPhilAlan]

What. A. Shambles. That was as bad as Tottenham away, in terms of everything that could go wrong did go wrong. Refereeing mistakes, sure, but how many mistakes did we make ourselves? I'll probably just get angry if I try to list them, so I'd better not.

I'll just say - was that Gerrard's worst game for the club? Worse, has he lost his mojo? It was those sort of games, where we play badly, that he used to rescue us from single-handed, with the sheer power of his self-belief. I think that self-belief has gone. I was amazed he stayed on the field when others were subbed off, but at least he looked not too bad as a right-back.

Oh, and who knew Carroll could go on a run like that? Beating three players as he broke through into the box? Not Andy Carroll himself, clearly, as he had no idea what to do once he'd got there. Embarrassed for the guy.

Better stop now. I'm clearly not ready for a calm round table discussion.

[Adeemo]

Gerrard was a disgrace. He wasn't a member of the the front three, and yet he seemed perfectly entitled to lose the ball and walk. Let me say that again. He lost the ball and walked. That wasn't ok when we had Rush, who was a striker. When you play for Liverpool Football Club and you lose the ball, you don't walk. He could do a lot worse than look at Cabaye or Tiote for an example of how to play football.

One thing though is Stevie still injured or just off form these days?

It's a massive question and one that seems to be a kind of elephant in the room for many fans, and possibly Kenny. It's soon going to be 3 seasons since we've seen any sort of consistent form from our captain, at some point his role/place in the team will have to be questioned. Or do we just let him wander through games, playing in his favoured central midfield role, until he's had enough and decides it's time to hang up his boots?

[farawayred]

On the face of it, we lost by 2-0 a game that we dominated the play through one defensive error and one offside not given, a penalty not given. We had a keeper sent out for playacting of an opponent instead of him being sent out (one yellow for the foul, given, and one for the dive, not given) and had Cabaye spared a yellow for his dive on Suarez.

The game was a poor game for us, but it was an utter disgrace for the Premier League referees, Premier, my arse...

[Johnnyboy1973]

I thought we started alright, but boy when that goal went in I was sorely tempted to turn over. Not 'cos I'm a miserable bastard but you just knew that was it - game over - the only question then was how many we lost by.

Individually - well once that goal goes in they were all shit just to varying degrees. Although fair play to Shelvey and Flanagan, they certainly weren't outshone by their seniors I wasn't suprised to see Reina lose it, however unprofessional it was. If I was as good as him and turning up for this week in week out, the least I would do is headbutt an opposition player. I'm beginning to feel confident enough to say if he is here next season, I will bare my arse for RAWK.

As for Carroll, I dont think he dived. It's worse - technically, he's inept. I'd swap him for the horse.

The system just looked a bit mental at times. Bellamy and Gerrard just appeared to be in a straight line on the right and it didn't matter cos they were both shite when up against the man mountain of Gutierrez. Suarez shunted to the left and eventually isolated. Spearing isolated and over run. Skrtel having another brain fart and prepared to follow defenders as far back as our own net it seems.

But, you know what, if they were fighting you could handle that level of shitness - just. But, they are so weak and where is the leadership? Forget Gerrard and Carra there was none, just a load of blokes running around aimlessly waiting for the final whistle to put all of us out of our misery.

But, it's alright, Villa at home? I'm not convinced. They look broken, have done for a while and I really think Kenny has got his work cut out. I wouldn't be suprised to see them lose every game now until the end of the season. I also wouldn't be suprised to see Kenny gone at the end of the season. I'd be disappointed but I wouldn't be suprised. It's a complete clusterfuck at present.

Even if we can get them to pull their heads out of their arses for next seasons, there is a low level of quality in that squad which is a fucking nightmare when the few quality first teamers you have get injured regularly.

[TipTopKop]

For decades now, we seem to fix one side of our game, the other goes belly up, and then you have a season like this, where pretty much everything's broken.

[trembles97]

I'm just at a loss as to how we continue to look scared shitless once a little bit of adversity comes our way. We work hard in the beginning of matches and usually produce some wonderful flashes of football, but then as the match goes on we continually lose our will to play and take our foot off the gas, usually without even scoring a goal. Its pitiful that we make the chances by the bundles and then we just give up once we decide that none of them are going to go in, and it really says a lot about the character of the members of the squad.

And the laziness. It kills me. I think it might be time to take a look at Gerrard's overall fitness. As corkboy stated earlier he's been doing a lot of walking as games go on and his unwillingness to press and apply pressure is a bit worrying from our captain. Not only that, but he'll give the ball away time after time in situations that it would probably be better to play the simple ball. Its not only him though. Andy does a lot of standing around, as does Bellamy and Jonjo, but you don't want that kind of late game play from your captain. Its time for him to either be willing to come off after 60-70 minutes or become the substitution off the bench.

And while on the topic of substitutions, I think its safe to say that not only does Kenny's timing appear to be off, but the actual players being subbed off and on is questionable at best. Sterling was extremely lively when he came on vs. Wigan and created a few clear chances, but instead of maybe keeping him on the bench to make a similar impact, we opt to go, yet again, to Downing and Henderson off the bench. How many assists do they have between them? And goals? Exactly. Its almost like making a defensive substitution because they don't actually do anything going forward. I thought all this outlay in the summer was supposed to add quality to our bench? How many goals have come from the substitutes bench so far this season? (I don't actually know, but I'm sure that its not many).

The only reassuring thing that I have coming away from all these poor results is that we actually play good football the majority of the time, something which is a big credit to Kenny, Clarke, and co. Under Roy we were not only getting bad results, but we were playing atrocious football, some of the worst I've ever seen LFC play, but that is not the case under Kenny. Thats the main reason why I'd give Kenny another season, because I have faith that he'll stop all this Premiership proven bullshit and actually use our international scouting network to pick up some gems.

I just hope he sets his aims a little higher than the Carling Cup and looks to actually challenge for the top four, because thats where long term success comes from.

[lorenzo23]

Killer - that was a symptom. You had a situation in which the manager, in particular, was making it obvious the owners were bleeding the club dry. It was a considered tactic to help get rid and it was true; we all knew it and it was not surprising the players knew it, too. Right now we have several players who are aware this is their last season with us, and unconsciously (if not consciously) couldn't give a shite whether we have CL football next year or not. (You could argue it's no surprise the team is delivering in cup competitions, because that gives the hard, in-hand currency of a medal to take with them.) We have others who do not have the confidence or the status, because they are new/young/untried to turn a game, let alone a losing run, around. What's so surprising in any of this?

Well that is where management comes into it all, if i am not mistaken is that not one of Kennys pros? as manager his man management skills?

[Floydy]

@ Royhendo- thought I saw you there yesterday.

Never felt confident before the game to be honest. Not quite sure what its gonna take to get us out of this rut, at the moment its looking like only the end of the season and start afresh.

Lack fight through the middle, we got out thought and fought in midfield key players just simply didnt turn up, our lack of ball retention is a concern.

[montysmum]

Not much to say really is there apart from what an obnoxious bunch of fans they are.

Carroll needs to learn how to stay upright, Gerrard seems to have lost any spark he had - wonder if the long term injuries he's had have really taken a toll, and Pepe was just plain silly to react how he did.

I will breathe a sigh of relief when this season ends.

The players seem to have lost all belief and in a way I can't blame them.  They have played some pretty decent footy for a good portion of the season, but due to the fact we don't have a decent striker they have not achieved the results they should have in the league.

Now, I think they go on the pitch believing they aren't going to win, rather than thinking they have a chance.

[Master ScouseKnee]

I wrote the following in the post-match thread when I got home last after the game, feel it chimes with alot of whats been said so far:

Right need to say a few things but not really sure what my point is. I've been at all three of our most recent league losses. I think there are a few things that are bothering me that Im sure have been mentioned by others. Firstly and probably least importantly I do feel a bit of luck in those games and we get the result e.g. Suarez goal is awarded vs Wigan or Perch gets sent off for his goaline clearance today. Second, Steven Gerrard was probably the best player on the pitch against QPR, was abysmal against Wigan and today looked like he wasnt sure what position hes playing. Hes not alone in having bad games, my concern really is how good a job he's doing as captain? I think this is indicative of a wider problem: a lack of leadership on the pitch exacerbated by the losses of Lucas and Agger and perhaps even with Pepe focussing on his own performances? Finally, in both of the away games weve played some decent stuff and been reasonably incisive but as we get closer to goal our decision making becomes atrocious. People go on about how bad we are at taking chances but how many promising situations are ruined by terrible decision making.

I don't know what the answers are but Im getting my Wembley ticket in the morning. Our season depends on that game. And I dont know about you lot but I don't think there's one person alive I'd want to be leading us out at Wembley more than Kenny Dalglish.

[Floydy]

Jose Enrique certainly let the occasion get to him,  not sure why either there will be bigger games than the barcoes away  @ LFC my friend. Certain players need to man up or get out. The lack of cohesion in our play was evident in the second half and we simply gone done by not controlling the spaces when we didnt have the ball.  no pressing them allowed them to control and dictate

[Corkboy]

1953, according the Guardian, was the last time we had form this bad in the league. That's something. Isn't that something?

[The G in Gerrard]

The players seem to have lost all belief and in a way I can't blame them.  They have played some pretty decent footy for a good portion of the season, but due to the fact we don't have a decent striker they have not achieved the results they should have in the league.

That's no reason at all to lose belief

[leivapool]

Someone used the word 'clusterfuck', It suits the team in it's current guise I think.

What the hell is happening out there on the pitch.  What the hell is happening behind closed doors and in training?  Who Knows?

We appear to have no plan.  What are our tactics.  I've asked it before, and it still seems to be the unanswerable question.  How are we trying to play? 

Yes we're missing arguably our most important player, and 2 important members of our defence, but we aren't really down any men in the attacking part of our squad, bar the woeful Adam, yet we turn in a performance like that.   Most of the season we've done pretty well defensively, bar any match where Carra plays and it all goes to rat pretty quickly, but what the hell is happening with our front 6?  Bar Suarez, whoi plays for the shirt for the full 90 mins can we say that any of our attacking players have stood up to be counted this season?  Even Bellamy appears to be struggling with the general malaise.  Yet Maxi is left to rot on the bench.  Noe of this makes  any sense to me, and probably most others.

We need to define a style of play.  We need to define a set of tactics, and we need to get a squad of players who fit the defined system.  if we are gonna go British, the Carroll, Downing and Adam thing, then lets just bin off  Suarez, cos we're not playing to his strengths.  If we're gonna keep Lucas and Suarez then we're gonna need to get a set of players that fit the style of football they excel in.  Currently Suarez is on a different planet to most of the players around him and is getting very frustrated with it.

On a positive note I thought Shelvey did well all things cosidered.

[Crosby Nick]

I really don't know what to think at the moment. If I'm being charitable I think our problems are temporary largely in the head and can be remedied (if not this season then by the start of next). When Agger and Johnson were fit our defence looked strong and all good on the ball. When Lucas was fit our midfield looked ok. With him back we don't have to see Gerrard playing so deep. Get those three back and we automatically look stronger and with a couple of shrewd additions (bear with me!...) we will be strong again.

However than something kicks in (hopefully not reality) and I wonder if all the above is just papering over the cracks?  Do the problems run a lot deeper than that? Scared to find out that answer to be honest.

[lgvkarlos]

Can we really blame the players, Kenny talks them up all the time keeps telling the world how great they are and how stupid everybody else is to  think otherwise. Changes the team and tactics weekly, one minute it's pass and move  next it's the long ball I couldn't tell you what our pattern of play is.
  I feel Kenny is lost and it has transferred down to the players. Does anybody think Shankly would have been bigging this lot up after every game.
  He is more like there mum than manager. He managed my favourite team ever and brought in my favourite player ever (John Barnes ). He seems a different man.

[jaffod]

Team looked decent on paper but it was hard to see what sort of formation we'd play. I fear Kenny is now picking sides the same way a gambler will blindly stick pins into a coupon.
 The team lacks shape and clear tactics. It's all just random like 11 schoolkids chasing a ball about.
That said I feel we suffered the same shite luck yesterday we have suffered all season. Every major decision went against us but when you are spineless as a club some people, i.e referees, will shaft you whenever they can.
 Saddest thing for me was the paucity of chances against that defence. Krul barely made a save. Newcastle are fucking average and I don't buy into this 'good team' bullshit at all. They also have several complete c*nts playing for them.
 We need to get Agger and Johnson back asap although young Flanagan played with great spirit. Shelvey deserves a run in the side too.
 Wanted to try and remain positive during the game rather than picking faults and pointing fingers but sadly the longer it went on the more painful it got. Bad times indeed.

[steveeastend]

I think we lost this game mainly in midfield and because of our defending line not pushing on in order to make spaces more narrow to make it possible for the players to play the way Kenny wants them to.

Which is still trying to have them play free floating pass and move, putting the responsibility for every single pass and every single movement on the shoulders of the players.

In general I like this but in our case I think too many players are simply not good enough for this. Loosing confidence is just a logical consequence.

As a main mistake I thought we were stretched too far apart, the distance between defense line and attack was just too big, pretty much like at the beginning of the season. With gaps like these, it´s always difficult to control the game by passing the ball around although we nearly did benefit from this open spaces at the beginning of the game.

With this sort of space and gaps, no strict tactical rules and no Lucas around, it pretty much went the same way as against ManU away. Our players looked lost, always chasing, always under pressure to react, rather than act. You feel this pretty early on as a player, that it doesn´t work out with this game plan, this approach together with the line up and loosing confidence is just a logical consequence of this.

I thought Andy had his best game for us so far in the first half and I liked the technique and overall quality of Shelvey. Very promising.

Spearing tried to do his best to close down spaces and create some sort of pressure on the ball but he was on his own, just as ManU away. I have massive respect for the qualities of Gerrard as a footballers by the way. But playing him in center midfield, especially every game is becoming a problem Kenny has to solve right in front of him. His legs are gone and it´s just so much wasted talent to not play him in the final third together with Suarez.

[Torpedo Tommy]

So why is the team so "mentally fragile"? Who is responsible for getting the side to such a point that tactics "go out of the window at the first setback"?

A 90 minute performance is missing.  The same approach for 90 full minutes.  None of this foot off the gas shite - 90 minutes of going forward until we are comfortably in front and the game is dead.  That will get us a little belief attacking wise and take pressure off the defence at the other end.

Sunday was woeful.  It lacked a lot of everything.  From the moment Andy dived to win the pen I genuinely never believed we would win.  I feel sorry for the lad.  He's under the microscope and has fuck all confidence.  99% of the time the goalkeeper puts in a challenge and its a penalty but instead, Krul plays a blinder and stays so far back he makes the dive so blatant.

Andy ain't alone with his lack of confidence / belief.  Everybody just looked away with the fairies on Sunday.  Every player looked like he could not have given a shite.  The only people who were hurting because of the result on Saturday were Kenny, Pepe and the fans.

You start wondering if going out of the FA Cup and the UEFA Cup early last year helped us.  From Feb onwards we were able to focus on the league and get some momentum.  Our profligacy in front of goal is now catching up but you can't help but feel that eyes were on Wembley.  As it been the distraction or do the players genuinely feel that the league cup is mission accomplished?

What a shithouse couple of months - here's hoping for a big performance on Saturday

[Torpedo Tommy]

Can we really blame the players, Kenny talks them up all the time keeps telling the world how great they are and how stupid everybody else is to  think otherwise. Changes the team and tactics weekly, one minute it's pass and move  next it's the long ball I couldn't tell you what our pattern of play is.
  I feel Kenny is lost and it has transferred down to the players. Does anybody think Shankly would have been bigging this lot up after every game.
  He is more like there mum than manager. He managed my favourite team ever and brought in my favourite player ever (John Barnes ). He seems a different man.

Yes we can.  Kenny is not faultless but some of the effort levels this season have been shameful

[jaffod]

1953, according the Guardian, was the last time we had form this bad in the league. That's something. Isn't that something?

I fear by the end of this league campaign we'll be reading about stuff from the end of the 19th century.

[blert596]

I thought we were very good until we realised we'd missed 4 chances to score and then shat ourselves again. You can see it in the players and the fans. Its become an expectancy for both.  We play well, should score a couple, dont, become frail, concede and become lost and bereft of any on the pitch leadership, or any sort of belief in we can change things round from off the pitch.

We all know its coming. I'm not sure why anyone is surprised by it.

For all the slagging of AC I thought the worse player on the pich was Gerrard. Not specifically because he done anything wrong. Simply because he didn't do anything at all. I've said it before and to me he seems to have taken the role of some type of elder statesman in the team. I dont know what it is about him that been annoying me but its like he's lording it around out there. He's capable of much much more than he's giving, but seems happy to be strolling around popping off increasingly innefectual and meaningless passes. He's bringing nothing to the table.

That doesnt mean the others were any better. But  then again most of them only have about 10% of the talent compared to SG.

[Upinsmoke]

Thought it was pretty even, if anything they played on the counter. We missed somebody clinical and when we got in good positions to put a decent ball in we failed to do so.
I dont think anyone was particulary shite, just a even game and they took there chances.
Cant really be arsed discussing the sending off, the offside, the dive, the handball. Because it just sums our season up. Nice for flanno and shelvey to get some minutes.

[lgvkarlos]

Yes we can.  Kenny is not faultless but some of the effort levels this season have been shameful

The boss of a company is responsible for employing the correct people and motivating them, even Gerrard doesn't seem to give a shit. The buck stops at the top.
Kenny needs to stop being there best mate and change his approach because this way is clearly not working

[filopastry]

I'm not sure its a lack of effort as such, more just a ridiculously weak mentality where the heads of the team start to drop as soon as things go against us (or just if we don't score after looking good for 20 mins).

I've never really been convinced by the mentality of our team in recent years, but this one really takes the biscuit when it comes to folding at the first sight of adversity, shambolic stuff.

I do think though that we do seem to struggle to make effective tactical changes as the game goes on, as has been the case for a fair bit of this season.


With regards to Gerrard, I know I'm pretty much in a minority of 1, but I still don't see why he was offered another year on his deal when he was, he's a player who is being paid like an elite level player but hasn't remotely consistently shown that for a few years now, I'd have applauded the club for saying they'd look at a new deal for him at the end of the season after he'd had this season to show what he was capable of, post-injury, I'm still convinced that he has more to offer than he has shown so far this season though (with a few notable exceptions), we just don't seem to have generally used him in positions where he can hurt the opposition.

For Carroll yesterday will be overshadowed by his dive/fall on arse, but the first half yesterday was one of his best performances for us, just sad that it takes a game against his old club to get that out of him.

If we can't get a result against a shit Villa team at home next week, I'll really fear for what joys the rest of the season will bring for us.

[Packalacky]

Everyone seems to be avoiding the main point. First off, I'll say Kenny should keep the job for another season, regardless of what happens till the end of the season, he deserves it and much more for everything he has done for LFC.

The main point is this:

These are Kenny's signing, his players, his tactics, his training methods, his team talks, his substitutions, this is his team. At the moment this is the worst run of form since 1953, in other words, worst than at any point last year under Roy. 8 points from a possible 36, only slightly better than Wolves since Mick was sacked.

Kenny needs to get things right in the summer and learn from his mistakes. The current situation lays currently on his shoulders.

[Always_A_Red]

No belief, disjointed, lack of effort, lack of quality and capitulation when we don't get the rub of the green.

We'll probably win the FA Cup.

We have absolutely no chance of winning the FA cup. No chance at all. All 3 teams play better football than us, have more confidence than us and actually look like a team. I even include Chelsea in that. We are so far away from where we need to be I honestly dont know where to start but I will say that if we lose to Everton in the cup, and we finish lower than them in the league it'll take this nightmare to a whole new level. I hope to god it doesnt happen.

Yes, we've won the league cup, but in truth we were bloody lucky to win that game. We all go on about how unlucky we are, but 2 misses from your first 2 pens, to come back and win it....thats unreal. Most of the time, we'd lose in that situation and what would everyone be saying then?

Events tonight from down the M62 just add salt to the wound.....and it fuckin hurts.

I fuckin hate you Purslow