Author Topic: SPOILERS The Chainless Game of Thrones and House of the Dragon Discussion  (Read 1045738 times)

Offline WhereAngelsPlay

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Really he didn't work the Jon Snows real lineage out he only checked it out after Sam told him they read about it in a book.

Surely Bran has more to do or what was the point of dragging his ass up and down the 7 Kingdoms for 7 seasons.

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Offline BazC

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I don't know how those criticizing the show now would have actually been satisfied. It's alot to cover in six episodes.

The main criticism is they shouldn’t have done all that story in 6 episodes. That was the major fuck up. It’s a shit ending for most because of it.
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Offline Musketeer Gripweed

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I am staying out of this thread next week. :) *

For what it's worth, I have no idea what is going to happen this week, to be honest, having thought about it, I don't even know who I want to come out on top now. All the main characters are seriously flawed at this point. I can't wait, yet dreading it in equal measures.

* Aye, right.



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I am staying out of this thread next week. :) *

For what it's worth, I have no idea what is going to happen this week, to be honest, having thought about it, I don't even know who I want to come out on top now. All the main characters are seriously flawed at this point. I can't wait, yet dreading it in equal measures.

* Aye, right.



Given that Gendry was last week declared the legitimate son of Robert Berathion, I reckon it makes him the rightful heir to the throne once Danerys has been done away with.

He’s got no baggage so is also the perfect dark horse candidate.
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Offline The G in Gerrard

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The main criticism is they shouldn’t have done all that story in 6 episodes. That was the major fuck up. It’s a shit ending for most because of it.
Once that decision had been made what else could be done differently?

Offline The G in Gerrard

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Given that Gendry was last week declared the legitimate son of Robert Berathion, I reckon it makes him the rightful heir to the throne once Danerys has been done away with.

He’s got no baggage so is also the perfect dark horse candidate.
Hope it ain't. Much better characters should get it.

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Hope it ain't. Much better characters should get it.
Why?
“Happiness can be found in the darkest of times, if one only remembers to turn on the light.”
“Generosity always pays off. Generosity in your effort, in your work, in your kindness, in the way you look after people and take care of people. In the long run, if you are generous with a heart, and with humanity, it always pays off.”
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Offline The G in Gerrard

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Why?
Just don't like Gendry ;D I'd forgot he was around for abit until he was back running through the snow.

Offline Trada

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Its about time the ordinary folk to rise up and take control there won't be a better time to do it.

Time for a peoples revolution.

And they will appoint Davos Seaworth the lord of Flea bottom and the master of onions.

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« Last Edit: May 16, 2019, 10:04:26 pm by Big Jezza’s Jizza »
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Offline Musketeer Gripweed

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Just don't like Gendry ;D I'd forgot he was around for abit until he was back running through the snow.

I honestly don't think I like any of them now!

I have squarely been behind the Starks from Day One, but Jon is thick, Bran is Bran, Sansa is becoming a dick and Arya doesn't want to be a lady.

I am sure we will all be disappointed, but in different ways. Next week will be torture on here.

Offline BazC

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Once that decision had been made what else could be done differently?

Decision to cut it short shouldn’t have been made. Everything after is half arsed. It didn’t need to be made either. Don’t do things half arsed!
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Offline Macphisto80

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Really he didn't work the Jon Snows real lineage out he only checked it out after Sam told him they read about it in a book.

Surely Bran has more to do or what was the point of dragging his ass up and down the 7 Kingdoms for 7 seasons.
True, but he needed that to confirm it. Or rather, show the audience something they'd understand to confirm it. If he's the 3ER, why the fuck did he even need the fat fucker to give him confirmation to begin with? He was there on the day he was born. He saw and heard everything for himself.

Oh, and just saw on the news site that the petition has now got nearly half a million signatures to get it remade. Getting a bit ridiculous now.
« Last Edit: May 16, 2019, 10:39:29 pm by Macphisto80 »

Offline Lastrador

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Decision to cut it short shouldn’t have been made. Everything after is half arsed. It didn’t need to be made either. Don’t do things half arsed!
Were you present on the HBO meeting with D&D? Do you think they work on an infinite budget with no time constrains? Do you have even a clue how many decisions have to be made to make a production the size of Game of Thrones with a TV budget? a large TV budget of course, but still.
 
HBO may have offered to make 10 episodes but I can bet you the budget was the same or close to that of the 6 they made. They probably thought of allocating as many resources to get those major events right. Unfortunately the story feels rushed now and those major events didn’t felt as earned or packed as much of a punch because of it, easy thing to say on hindsight.

D&D may have made a mistake in going for 6 episodes over 10 in hindsight, but I can bet you it takes and enormous amount of effort and love to spend over a decade on a project that's not even your story. That you don't get any praise when you get it right (its George word after all) and you get slaughtered by fan boys and nerds all around the word when you don't. Which you now have the responsibility to tie up because the author of the story has been procrastinating for 8 years. D&D may have been short sighted, they may have been too ambitious but lazy I don't think. Does 55 nights of filming for one battle sounds lazy or half arsed to you?
« Last Edit: May 16, 2019, 11:57:23 pm by Lastrador »

Offline WhereAngelsPlay

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I've always wanted to be called a fanboy and nerd,most of the time it is an "insult" thrown about between fanboys n girls and nerds.

Tick that off my bucket list.

D&D wanted out,not HBO.
« Last Edit: May 16, 2019, 11:42:35 pm by WhereAngelsPlay »
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Offline Lastrador

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I've always wanted to be called a fanboy and nerd,most of the time it is an "insult" thrown about between fanboys n girls and nerds.

Tick that off my bucket list.

Not aimed at anybody in here, well probably Jooney but he has been pretty quiet lately, more to the GRRM fanboys n girls that have been complaining since season 2 because of all the changes. But like voodo said: if you reckon it applies to you too then don't let me stop you.

D&D wanted out,not HBO.
Of course they don't, it's a goldmine, and they don't have to spend a single minute making them, just write the checks.

Offline WhereAngelsPlay

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Is KL in two separate parts separated by a large body of water ? I only ask because the ships that she destroyed are miles away from the part that she leveled,if that's the case then more citizens than I first thought will have survived.
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Offline Macphisto80

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Is KL in two separate parts separated by a large body of water ? I only ask because the ships that she destroyed are miles away from the part that she leveled,if that's the case then more citizens than I first thought will have survived.
I think this is a screen grab of the very first shot of it in series 1.



Strange, considering the Gold Company was stood on what appeared to be a desert patch outside the walls of the main gate. The Battle of Blackwater gave the impression there was land there, but not a strand like recent depictions of it.

The mountains seem to miraculously vanished.

Offline WhereAngelsPlay

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Yeah I've just googled and seen that picture,in the scene when it first goes to Cersei in the keep and Dany about to blast along the wall,you can clearly see a line of ships burning in the distance and what looks like another walled population center that I am assuming the Scorpions that she first wiped out were placed.
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Offline Trada

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It Is Now Clear Having Two Short ‘Game Of Thrones’ Final Seasons Was A Mistake

We are now marching toward the final episode of Game of Thrones ever, and while we don’t know exactly how it will end, the events of the past two seasons have taken us to a place where it seems…difficult to extract a worthwhile ending, to say the least.

Some of the problems are specific decisions the showrunners made, now free of the guiding light of Martin’s books, but the further we’ve gotten into these final seasons, it has become clear to almost everyone that a core problem with the ending of Game of Thrones is that the idea that the final two seasons should be 7 episodes, then a year break, then 6 episodes.

Sure, we may get to where we’re going and it could be a passable ending. But there is no benefit to arranging the show this way, instead of having a more standard ending with two or three seasons that were the traditional ten episodes in length. No benefit to anyone except the showrunners, David Benioff and D.B. Weiss who want to move on to other projects.

No one wanted this except them. HBO wanted more. Here’s an EW interview from 2015, back when the showrunners were threatening to end the series after seven seasons:

“This is the hard part of what we do,” sighs HBO programming president Michael Lombardo. “We started this journey with David and Dan. It’s their vision. Would I love the show to go 10 years as both a fan and a network executive? Absolutely…If they weren’t comfortable going beyond seven seasons, I trust them implicitly and trust that’s the right decision—as horrifying as that is to me.”

More recently, HBO offered the showrunners more money and time to at least add more episodes to the final season, after eight seasons, the last two being shortened, was concocted as a compromise.

"HBO would have been happy for the show to keep going, to have more episodes in the final season," Benioff said. "We always believed it was about 73 hours, and it will be roughly that. As much as they wanted more, they understood that this is where the story ends."

And then there’s George RR Martin, who has always thought the show was cutting too much from the books. A long time ago he said the 10 episode seasons should be more like 13, and more recently he’s said that the show could continue well, well beyond eight seasons. Here’s him at the Emmys last year:

"I don't know," Martin said. "Ask David [Benioff] and Dan [Weiss] when they come through. We could have gone to 11, 12, 13 seasons, but I guess they wanted a life.”

And finally there are fans, who have now seen the results of this spaced-out, shortened final pair of seasons, and most everyone believes that the show has felt painfully rushed as a result. How so? It’s tough to know where to even start.

The Jon and Daenerys relationship, what should be the most important one of the show, has been massively rushed, with the two not getting together until the finale of season seven, and yet Jon has become slavishly devoted to her in just a few episodes’ time, making their entire rollercoaster ride of a relationship (ending now with Dany going full Mad Queen) feel way, way too fast.

There are the bent-out-of-shape character arcs, which have flung these characters toward a specific end goal, ignoring that the path to get there does not make much sense. In episode 2 of season 8, Jaime is hanging out with all his new friends in Winterfell, knighting Brienne. In episode 5, he’s throwing away six years of an arc to run away to be with Cersei as she dies because nothing else matters but her. In episode 2 Dany and Jon are riding dragons in the snow like they’re in a Dreamworks movie. In two more episodes, Dany loses half her army, Jorah and Missandei, learns the truth about Jon and develops a taste for genocide. One complaint from last episode is not that these characters turns happened, it’s that not enough time was given to make them feel earned, hence why these two characters (among others) have had arcs that have given fans whiplash.

Then there’s the now infamous teleportation of the last few seasons. Game of Thrones has always been about these long, epic journeys from place to place, which is where a load of character development happens, and twists and turns derail characters along the way. But after six years of that, the show realized it was running out of time because of this self-imposed deadline, and suddenly everyone is warping all around the map instantly, erasing that entire part of the show that was a key aspect of it before. This results in some plot holes, but also a general sense of disorientation and like everything is moving at breakneck speed. And usually, this is done in service of just hammering us with battle after battle, with maybe one episode of downtime in between them. It’s felt exhausting, and like the show is trying to sprint its way through a marathon, losing steam far before it should.

It is easy to see how the last 13 episodes of the series could have been 20-30 episodes if the showrunners had decided to take their time, taking an unlimited budget from HBO, respecting the opinion of the series’ creator, and doing service to fans who would loyally show up for a decade or more if asked. Instead, they wanted to be done, and rather than leave and hand the show off to someone who actually wanted to be there, they’re just blasting through it, and clearly, it’s suffering as a result.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/paultassi/2019/05/14/it-is-now-clear-having-two-short-game-of-thrones-final-seasons-was-a-mistake/#5ede0120788a
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Offline WhereAngelsPlay

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They fucked it up & I kind of hope that they fuck Star Wars up as well.
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Offline Lastrador

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It Is Now Clear Having Two Short ‘Game Of Thrones’ Final Seasons Was A Mistake

We are now marching toward the final episode of Game of Thrones ever, and while we don’t know exactly how it will end, the events of the past two seasons have taken us to a place where it seems…difficult to extract a worthwhile ending, to say the least.

Some of the problems are specific decisions the showrunners made, now free of the guiding light of Martin’s books, but the further we’ve gotten into these final seasons, it has become clear to almost everyone that a core problem with the ending of Game of Thrones is that the idea that the final two seasons should be 7 episodes, then a year break, then 6 episodes.

Sure, we may get to where we’re going and it could be a passable ending. But there is no benefit to arranging the show this way, instead of having a more standard ending with two or three seasons that were the traditional ten episodes in length. No benefit to anyone except the showrunners, David Benioff and D.B. Weiss who want to move on to other projects.

No one wanted this except them. HBO wanted more. Here’s an EW interview from 2015, back when the showrunners were threatening to end the series after seven seasons:

“This is the hard part of what we do,” sighs HBO programming president Michael Lombardo. “We started this journey with David and Dan. It’s their vision. Would I love the show to go 10 years as both a fan and a network executive? Absolutely…If they weren’t comfortable going beyond seven seasons, I trust them implicitly and trust that’s the right decision—as horrifying as that is to me.”

More recently, HBO offered the showrunners more money and time to at least add more episodes to the final season, after eight seasons, the last two being shortened, was concocted as a compromise.

"HBO would have been happy for the show to keep going, to have more episodes in the final season," Benioff said. "We always believed it was about 73 hours, and it will be roughly that. As much as they wanted more, they understood that this is where the story ends."

And then there’s George RR Martin, who has always thought the show was cutting too much from the books. A long time ago he said the 10 episode seasons should be more like 13, and more recently he’s said that the show could continue well, well beyond eight seasons. Here’s him at the Emmys last year:

"I don't know," Martin said. "Ask David [Benioff] and Dan [Weiss] when they come through. We could have gone to 11, 12, 13 seasons, but I guess they wanted a life.”

And finally there are fans, who have now seen the results of this spaced-out, shortened final pair of seasons, and most everyone believes that the show has felt painfully rushed as a result. How so? It’s tough to know where to even start.

The Jon and Daenerys relationship, what should be the most important one of the show, has been massively rushed, with the two not getting together until the finale of season seven, and yet Jon has become slavishly devoted to her in just a few episodes’ time, making their entire rollercoaster ride of a relationship (ending now with Dany going full Mad Queen) feel way, way too fast.

There are the bent-out-of-shape character arcs, which have flung these characters toward a specific end goal, ignoring that the path to get there does not make much sense. In episode 2 of season 8, Jaime is hanging out with all his new friends in Winterfell, knighting Brienne. In episode 5, he’s throwing away six years of an arc to run away to be with Cersei as she dies because nothing else matters but her. In episode 2 Dany and Jon are riding dragons in the snow like they’re in a Dreamworks movie. In two more episodes, Dany loses half her army, Jorah and Missandei, learns the truth about Jon and develops a taste for genocide. One complaint from last episode is not that these characters turns happened, it’s that not enough time was given to make them feel earned, hence why these two characters (among others) have had arcs that have given fans whiplash.

Then there’s the now infamous teleportation of the last few seasons. Game of Thrones has always been about these long, epic journeys from place to place, which is where a load of character development happens, and twists and turns derail characters along the way. But after six years of that, the show realized it was running out of time because of this self-imposed deadline, and suddenly everyone is warping all around the map instantly, erasing that entire part of the show that was a key aspect of it before. This results in some plot holes, but also a general sense of disorientation and like everything is moving at breakneck speed. And usually, this is done in service of just hammering us with battle after battle, with maybe one episode of downtime in between them. It’s felt exhausting, and like the show is trying to sprint its way through a marathon, losing steam far before it should.

It is easy to see how the last 13 episodes of the series could have been 20-30 episodes if the showrunners had decided to take their time, taking an unlimited budget from HBO, respecting the opinion of the series’ creator, and doing service to fans who would loyally show up for a decade or more if asked. Instead, they wanted to be done, and rather than leave and hand the show off to someone who actually wanted to be there, they’re just blasting through it, and clearly, it’s suffering as a result.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/paultassi/2019/05/14/it-is-now-clear-having-two-short-game-of-thrones-final-seasons-was-a-mistake/#5ede0120788a
Unlimited budget? K.

Offline WhereAngelsPlay

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Unlimited budget? K.

As in it could run and run until it reached its natural end.


Were you present on the HBO meeting with D&D? Do you think they work on an infinite budget with no time constrains? Do you have even a clue how many decisions have to be made to make a production the size of Game of Thrones with a TV budget? a large TV budget of course, but still.
 


 :lmao :lmao


Quote
HBO wanted more. Here’s an EW interview from 2015, back when the showrunners were threatening to end the series after seven seasons:

“This is the hard part of what we do,” sighs HBO programming president Michael Lombardo. “We started this journey with David and Dan. It’s their vision. Would I love the show to go 10 years as both a fan and a network executive? Absolutely…If they weren’t comfortable going beyond seven seasons, I trust them implicitly and trust that’s the right decision—as horrifying as that is to me.”

More recently, HBO offered the showrunners more money and time to at least add more episodes to the final season, after eight seasons, the last two being shortened, was concocted as a compromise.


This is 100% on D&D being pricks and not wanting somebody else to take over from them.
« Last Edit: May 17, 2019, 01:46:03 am by WhereAngelsPlay »
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Offline thejbs

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The problem with the pacing is that the first three episodes covered maybe a week and there was a jarring jump of weeks or months in just two episodes.

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As in it could run and run until it reached its natural end.
No mate, the author of that pathetic childish article said “they could have made 20-30 episodes on an unlimited budget. Any person who has been in any type of production can tell you there’s not such thing as an unlimited budget.
 
:lmao :lmao
Mate, you’re the type of person that wants someone to fail so you can come to a forum to gloat at how stupid they are. You’re a narcissist that thinks that everyone who complains about the over the top criticism the show is getting is talking about you. You’re a hateful sad little person, laugh away.
« Last Edit: May 17, 2019, 05:28:27 am by Lastrador »

Offline Lastrador

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<a href="https://www.youtube.com/v/2mlNyqhnc1M" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer" class="bbc_link bbc_flash_disabled new_win">https://www.youtube.com/v/2mlNyqhnc1M</a>

This is a very good and fair take on Dany's turn, pretty much were I stand. Logic but not earned.

Offline GreatEx

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Who gives a shit that everything's racing to a conclusion? Anyone ever had a wedding? 6-12 months of meticulous planning, then it's all over in what feels like seconds and you didn't have time to talk to a whole bunch of people you love, and the next day you can hardly remember any of it despite being sober. That's life... Happens while you're planning other things, or whatever. The point is, dragons blowing up cities is way cool.

Offline Riquende

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Audience expectations subverted in the final season of Game of Thrones: "Bad writing! And Character x would never do that!"

Audience expectations subverted in Star Wars: The Last Jedi: "Brave writing! You're just too invested in character x to get it... let the past die!"

Good job, internet.
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Offline royhendo

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Now. Nobody is hateful, or a narcissist.

It’s fine us all having strong views but let’s try and be nice to each other, myself included.
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Offline Trada

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I guess it had to happen fans have started a petition on Change.org for HBO to remake season 8 it already has 15,000.

Hmmm I have a feeling that won't happen.

That moved quick up to nearly 750,000 now.

and going up like a rocket right now.

https://www.change.org/p/hbo-remake-game-of-thrones-season-8-with-competent-writers
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Who gives a shit that everything's racing to a conclusion? Anyone ever had a wedding? 6-12 months of meticulous planning, then it's all over in what feels like seconds and you didn't have time to talk to a whole bunch of people you love, and the next day you can hardly remember any of it despite being sober. That's life... Happens while you're planning other things, or whatever. The point is, dragons blowing up cities is way cool.

Bit overboard for your Stag do though mate.

Offline Barneylfc∗

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That moved quick up to nearly 750,000 now.

and going up like a rocket right now.

https://www.change.org/p/hbo-remake-game-of-thrones-season-8-with-competent-writers

Some seriously sad bastards out there
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Offline Red Viper

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Audience expectations subverted in the final season of Game of Thrones: "Bad writing! And Character x would never do that!"

Audience expectations subverted in Star Wars: The Last Jedi: "Brave writing! You're just too invested in character x to get it... let the past die!"

Good job, internet.

LOL

Offline Trada

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Some seriously sad bastards out there

I think its more about saying you are disappointed in the final series than really thinking it will be redone.
Don't blame me I voted for Jeremy Corbyn!!

Miss you Tracy more and more every day xxx

“I carry them with me: what they would have thought and said and done. Make them a part of who I am. So even though they’re gone from the world they’re never gone from me.

Offline royhendo

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I bet there is a remake eventually.
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Offline Trada

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I bet there is a remake eventually.

Maybe they will make the last books whenever they are released into films Game of Thrones The Real Ending.
Don't blame me I voted for Jeremy Corbyn!!

Miss you Tracy more and more every day xxx

“I carry them with me: what they would have thought and said and done. Make them a part of who I am. So even though they’re gone from the world they’re never gone from me.

Offline GreatEx

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One positive to come out of this nerdish shithousery is that I can add "earning one's character arc" to the list of expressions I use to mock millennial dipshits.

Offline Henry Gale

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<a href="https://www.youtube.com/v/2mlNyqhnc1M" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer" class="bbc_link bbc_flash_disabled new_win">https://www.youtube.com/v/2mlNyqhnc1M</a>

This is a very good and fair take on Dany's turn, pretty much were I stand. Logic but not earned.

Hard to disagree with anything from that video.

Offline BazC

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Were you present on the HBO meeting with D&D? Do you think they work on an infinite budget with no time constrains? Do you have even a clue how many decisions have to be made to make a production the size of Game of Thrones with a TV budget? a large TV budget of course, but still.
 
HBO may have offered to make 10 episodes but I can bet you the budget was the same or close to that of the 6 they made. They probably thought of allocating as many resources to get those major events right. Unfortunately the story feels rushed now and those major events didn’t felt as earned or packed as much of a punch because of it, easy thing to say on hindsight.

D&D may have made a mistake in going for 6 episodes over 10 in hindsight, but I can bet you it takes and enormous amount of effort and love to spend over a decade on a project that's not even your story. That you don't get any praise when you get it right (its George word after all) and you get slaughtered by fan boys and nerds all around the word when you don't. Which you now have the responsibility to tie up because the author of the story has been procrastinating for 8 years. D&D may have been short sighted, they may have been too ambitious but lazy I don't think. Does 55 nights of filming for one battle sounds lazy or half arsed to you?


Yeah it’s half arsed. I can understand they wanted to move on, that’s fair enough. The earlier seasons were great and they spent a lot of their careers on bringing that story to the screen. It’s been amazing. But that still doesn’t mean the last 2 seasons haven’t been half arsed. They have been.

Read my posts last few pages and that Forbes article. It’s not rocket science, they ruined it by rushing it. 

If they wanted to move on hbo should have let them and brought in other writers to carry on with a few more seasons and done the story justice.
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Online voodoo ray

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I bet there is a remake eventually.


I'd probably take that bet. Though it depends what you mean by remake really.

Offline WhereAngelsPlay

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No mate, the author of that pathetic childish article said “they could have made 20-30 episodes on an unlimited budget. Any person who has been in any type of production can tell you there’s not such thing as an unlimited budget.
 Mate, you’re the type of person that wants someone to fail so you can come to a forum to gloat at how stupid they are. You’re a narcissist that thinks that everyone who complains about the over the top criticism the show is getting is talking about you. You’re a hateful sad little person, laugh away.

No,I'm the type of person that tells dickheads like yourself to go fuck themselves.

The person who wrote the article also quotes GRRM and the HBO boss who both shit all over the post of yours that I quoted.

You making out that you have insider knowledge of how these things are made as a way to belittle others opinions is comical.

The fact that they contradicted you just makes it even more so. :tosser
« Last Edit: May 17, 2019, 11:16:22 am by WhereAngelsPlay »
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