Author Topic: General Athletics Thread  (Read 5493 times)

Offline TepidT2O

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Re: General Athletics Thread
« Reply #40 on: May 6, 2019, 06:31:23 pm »
I feel sorry for Semanye,  none of this is her fault.

She didn’t ask to be born intersex.

However, I also feel sorry for the people she competes against.  They are (well most are) XX chromosomes women and have the testosterone levels to match.

Semmanye isn’t.  She has XY chromosomes, no womb and undescended  testes

So how do you do what is fair?  It’s difficult to be fair both to Semanye and her competition. She is still allowed to compete as a woman, but she must suppress her testosterone to make it more compatible with other women athletes (Although still much higher).

There is also to option of competing as a man. Semanyes genetic and hormone make up means this is a much fairer playing field.

At some point you have to draw a line, otherwise we could get a situation with transgender and intersex people dominate some events and leave XX chromosomed women with no hope of competition.
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Offline Red-Soldier

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Re: General Athletics Thread
« Reply #41 on: May 6, 2019, 07:04:23 pm »
I feel sorry for Semanye,  none of this is her fault.

She didn’t ask to be born intersex.

However, I also feel sorry for the people she competes against.  They are (well most are) XX chromosomes women and have the testosterone levels to match.

Semmanye isn’t.  She has XY chromosomes, no womb and undescended  testes

So how do you do what is fair?  It’s difficult to be fair both to Semanye and her competition. She is still allowed to compete as a woman, but she must suppress her testosterone to make it more compatible with other women athletes (Although still much higher).

There is also to option of competing as a man. Semanyes genetic and hormone make up means this is a much fairer playing field.

At some point you have to draw a line, otherwise we could get a situation with transgender and intersex people dominate some events and leave XX chromosomed women with no hope of competition.

I agree with all your points there.

Offline Old No7

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Re: General Athletics Thread
« Reply #42 on: May 6, 2019, 07:27:08 pm »
I feel sorry for Semanye,  none of this is her fault.

She didn’t ask to be born intersex.

However, I also feel sorry for the people she competes against.  They are (well most are) XX chromosomes women and have the testosterone levels to match.

Semmanye isn’t.  She has XY chromosomes, no womb and undescended  testes

So how do you do what is fair?  It’s difficult to be fair both to Semanye and her competition. She is still allowed to compete as a woman, but she must suppress her testosterone to make it more compatible with other women athletes (Although still much higher).

There is also to option of competing as a man. Semanyes genetic and hormone make up means this is a much fairer playing field.

At some point you have to draw a line, otherwise we could get a situation with transgender and intersex people dominate some events and leave XX chromosomed women with no hope of competition.

I wouldn't pretend to have the knowledge to get into this one, what little i do know is its an area with several shades of grey that a black & white ruling needs to be made on.

I have sympathy for all parties involved

Offline TepidT2O

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Re: General Athletics Thread
« Reply #43 on: May 6, 2019, 07:35:41 pm »
Iirc the top three athletes at the women’s 800m at the last Olympics were intersex.
Given the rarity of the condition these seems extraordinary and gives an idea of the advantage it is, especially in the 400 & 800m
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Re: General Athletics Thread
« Reply #44 on: May 6, 2019, 11:51:37 pm »
I feel sorry for Semanye,  none of this is her fault.

She didn’t ask to be born intersex.

However, I also feel sorry for the people she competes against.  They are (well most are) XX chromosomes women and have the testosterone levels to match.

Semmanye isn’t.  She has XY chromosomes, no womb and undescended  testes

So how do you do what is fair?  It’s difficult to be fair both to Semanye and her competition. She is still allowed to compete as a woman, but she must suppress her testosterone to make it more compatible with other women athletes (Although still much higher).

There is also to option of competing as a man. Semanyes genetic and hormone make up means this is a much fairer playing field.

At some point you have to draw a line, otherwise we could get a situation with transgender and intersex people dominate some events and leave XX chromosomed women with no hope of competition.
this is why they need a third ‘open’ class for intersex/trans athletes in order to protect women’s sports and it’s credibility (as if the events are dominated by trans/intersex athletes it will lose all credibility and XX women will just not bother), likes of Kelly Holmes, Paula Radcliffe, martina navratilova and Sharron Davies getting loads of shit (admittedly a lot from nutters, likes of ash sarkar trying to make this a race issue ffs) for saying this stuff when they’re bang on (and a lot of the media aren’t reporting Semenya having XY chromosomes) - like you I feel for Semenya who has done nothing wrong but it’s an issue of protecting women’s sports and if intersex athletes are allowed to compete in women’s sports it makes a mockery of it

Offline kavah

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Re: General Athletics Thread
« Reply #45 on: May 26, 2019, 08:40:50 pm »
Another outstanding performance by Katarina JT

With a bit of luck she could be in with a great chance at the olympics in Tokyo next year



https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2019/may/26/katarina-johnson-thompson-destroys-personal-best-win-gotzis


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Re: General Athletics Thread
« Reply #46 on: May 26, 2019, 08:44:52 pm »
Another outstanding performance by Katarina JT

With a bit of luck she could be in with a great chance at the olympics in Tokyo next year



https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2019/may/26/katarina-johnson-thompson-destroys-personal-best-win-gotzis

She's in great form.  Hopefully, she can stay injury free from now till the end of the Olympics.

Offline Ziltoid

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Re: General Athletics Thread
« Reply #47 on: May 27, 2019, 08:48:19 am »
Still needs to sort that javelin and Shot out, but she's certainly going in the right direction.

Offline Crosby Nick

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Re: General Athletics Thread
« Reply #48 on: May 27, 2019, 09:15:48 am »
She's in great form.  Hopefully, she can stay injury free from now till the end of the Olympics.

Really hope so, she’s great.

Is that Belgian who won in Rio still around. She looked very hard to beat.

Offline Ziltoid

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Re: General Athletics Thread
« Reply #49 on: May 27, 2019, 01:27:38 pm »
Thiam.

Probably, with a pb of 59m in the javelin, KJT needs to add another 7m to her javelin of 42m. It can be done I think but it's quite a lot to do with mental attitude with her.

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Re: General Athletics Thread
« Reply #50 on: June 24, 2019, 10:40:55 am »
Local lad just smashed a load more records at 17 years old over 800m this weekend

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lEXZzhee-ZA

https://twitter.com/Statman_Jon/status/1142915914217775106

His 1:45.36 is:

✅ UK U20 record
✅ European U18 best
✅ 2019 senior UK lead
✅ World Champs qualifier
✅ faster than the winning times at this year's Stockholm, Oslo & Rabat DLs

World U18 all-time 800m list:

1:43.37 Mohammed Aman (ETH)
1:44.08 Leonard Kosencha (KEN)
1:44.34 Belal Mansoor Ali (BRN)
1:44.51 Willy Tarbei (KEN)
1:44.55 Kipyegon Bett (KEN)
1:44.98 Timothy Kitum (KEN)
1:45.38 Max Burgin (GBR)
1:45.78 Abubaker Kaki (SUD)


Offline Old No7

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Re: General Athletics Thread
« Reply #51 on: June 24, 2019, 06:49:21 pm »
Local lad just smashed a load more records at 17 years old over 800m this weekend

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lEXZzhee-ZA

https://twitter.com/Statman_Jon/status/1142915914217775106

His 1:45.36 is:

✅ UK U20 record
✅ European U18 best
✅ 2019 senior UK lead
✅ World Champs qualifier
✅ faster than the winning times at this year's Stockholm, Oslo & Rabat DLs

World U18 all-time 800m list:

1:43.37 Mohammed Aman (ETH)
1:44.08 Leonard Kosencha (KEN)
1:44.34 Belal Mansoor Ali (BRN)
1:44.51 Willy Tarbei (KEN)
1:44.55 Kipyegon Bett (KEN)
1:44.98 Timothy Kitum (KEN)
1:45.38 Max Burgin (GBR)
1:45.78 Abubaker Kaki (SUD)



That was some chat about this at my running club over the weekend, what a prospect!

Offline kavah

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Re: General Athletics Thread
« Reply #52 on: October 13, 2019, 10:07:41 pm »

Offline Crosby Nick

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Re: General Athletics Thread
« Reply #53 on: May 1, 2022, 09:16:25 am »
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/athletics/61286185

Blimey. Only 18 and running 19.49 for the 200m!
« Last Edit: May 1, 2022, 09:18:37 am by Crosby Nick »

Offline royhendo

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Re: General Athletics Thread
« Reply #54 on: May 1, 2022, 09:18:13 am »
Absolutely incredible that
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Re: General Athletics Thread
« Reply #55 on: May 1, 2022, 10:51:20 am »
Oof, broke his own age group record by over a third of a second! Rapid. One of the most astonishing runs I’ve seen since Van Niekerk’s 400m Olympic and World Record.

Absolutely awful that unlike Bolt, Van Niekerk’s body hasn’t held together well enough for him to stretch his legend further.

At Knighton’s age, you’d expect him to pepper a few times towards Bolt’s record. Still not sure whether that will be beaten in my lifetime though, although they said the same about Johnson.
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Offline Elzar

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Re: General Athletics Thread
« Reply #56 on: August 11, 2022, 11:26:45 am »
Leslie Tebogo set a new world record at u20 level. 9.91.... but safe to say he could have gone faster..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4gj8Zebqjd8

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Re: General Athletics Thread
« Reply #57 on: August 18, 2022, 03:08:38 pm »
This was brilliant from the Europeans last night

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/av/athletics/62583566

His face in mid air! :D
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Offline dalarr

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Re: General Athletics Thread
« Reply #58 on: August 20, 2022, 08:56:58 pm »
It’s been a pleasure watching Femke Bol completely destroy everyone in her path here. Three gold medals is a decent performance.

Offline Crosby Nick

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Re: General Athletics Thread
« Reply #59 on: August 21, 2022, 12:13:56 am »
Great to see Hodgkinson finally get a gold and a couple of cracking 4x400s today as well.

Offline Ray K

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Re: General Athletics Thread
« Reply #60 on: August 21, 2022, 08:54:00 pm »
Those British and French women's relay gave a perfect example of how not to run a relay. The 2nd French girl was halfway down the back straight before the first had arrived at her mark, and the 1st British girl thought 'fuck it' and threw the baton to her team mate   ;D

I've really enjoyed these championships. I think it's because they're on for 2 hrs from 7 to 9 in the evening means they're perfect for the casual fan like myself.  Whereas the world's in Eugene were a dead loss cos of the time difference.

Plus being a European rather than a world field meant that Ireland could win some medals for a change. Very promising future for our new Irish-Nigerian sprinters like Rhasidat Adeleke who's going to be a real star in the years to come.

Does it always rain in Munich? Whenever I've watched football or athletics, even in the summer more often than not it's pissing it down.
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Re: General Athletics Thread
« Reply #61 on: August 21, 2022, 09:29:21 pm »
Think they get a lot of summer thunderstorms don’t they?

Did Sonia O’Sullivan win?

Offline MH41

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Re: General Athletics Thread
« Reply #62 on: August 21, 2022, 10:58:10 pm »
Think they get a lot of summer thunderstorms don’t they?

Did Sonia O’Sullivan win?

They do indeed....(think 1974 WC)
She did.....in 1994 and a double in 1998, lol.

Offline Crosby Nick

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Re: General Athletics Thread
« Reply #63 on: August 21, 2022, 11:00:10 pm »
They do indeed....(think 1974 WC)
She did.....in 1994 and a double in 1998, lol.

Before my rule but I do remember seeing the official film of it once and was the final delayed while they had to brush water off the pitch?

Offline rushyman

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Re: General Athletics Thread
« Reply #64 on: August 21, 2022, 11:02:19 pm »
Those British and French women's relay gave a perfect example of how not to run a relay. The 2nd French girl was halfway down the back straight before the first had arrived at her mark, and the 1st British girl thought 'fuck it' and threw the baton to her team mate   ;D

I've really enjoyed these championships. I think it's because they're on for 2 hrs from 7 to 9 in the evening means they're perfect for the casual fan like myself.  Whereas the world's in Eugene were a dead loss cos of the time difference.

Plus being a European rather than a world field meant that Ireland could win some medals for a change. Very promising future for our new Irish-Nigerian sprinters like Rhasidat Adeleke who's going to be a real star in the years to come.

Does it always rain in Munich? Whenever I've watched football or athletics, even in the summer more often than not it's pissing it down.

What is the baton bullshit about anyway

Surely you want the fastest to win. Just touch hands should be enough without this added crap of baton passing
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Offline Lastrador

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Re: General Athletics Thread
« Reply #65 on: August 22, 2022, 12:21:35 am »
What is the baton bullshit about anyway

Surely you want the fastest to win. Just touch hands should be enough without this added crap of baton passing
That's what the 100m dash are for, to find out who is the fastest. The relay race is not just about who's the fastest, but what team has the best exchange technique too. It's an integral part of the discipline, and one thing they work on a lot. That's why USA women could beat Jamaica in the past World Championship on Eugen, even though Jamaica on paper are much stronger. That's what makes the whole event so unpredictable and so fun. Just a terrible idea.

Offline lfcred1976

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Re: General Athletics Thread
« Reply #66 on: September 25, 2022, 10:42:10 am »
Eliud Kipchoge just broke his own marathon world record at the Berlin Marathon. His previous world record at that event in 2018 was 2:01:39 and he’s just broke that today with a time of 2:01:09.

Already cemented his place as the GOAT of marathon running, but this just reaffirms it
« Last Edit: September 25, 2022, 10:46:08 am by lfcred1976 »

Offline Circa1892

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Re: General Athletics Thread
« Reply #67 on: September 25, 2022, 11:57:22 am »
30 seconds off is insane, even allowing for the carbon plates etc. Just astonishing - it’s a decent time for a half!

Offline SouthDerryLaggo

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Re: General Athletics Thread
« Reply #68 on: September 25, 2022, 12:09:16 pm »
30 seconds off is insane, even allowing for the carbon plates etc. Just astonishing - it’s a decent time for a half!
at 37 years old...
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Offline lfcred1976

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Re: General Athletics Thread
« Reply #69 on: September 25, 2022, 12:33:04 pm »
at 37 years old...
30 seconds off is insane, even allowing for the carbon plates etc. Just astonishing - it’s a decent time for a half!

Madness isn’t it. Seems to be getting better with age.

Offline kavah

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Re: General Athletics Thread
« Reply #70 on: September 25, 2022, 01:45:55 pm »
Unbelievable from Kipchoge

Offline Gerry Attrick

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Re: General Athletics Thread
« Reply #71 on: September 25, 2022, 03:45:17 pm »
Must say it is incredibly strange for somebody to be running faster at they get older. Seems like Kipchoge cracked the cycle of life.

Offline SouthDerryLaggo

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Re: General Athletics Thread
« Reply #72 on: September 25, 2022, 08:53:13 pm »
Must say it is incredibly strange for somebody to be running faster at they get older. Seems like Kipchoge cracked the cycle of life.
its taking the piss
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Offline Circa1892

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Re: General Athletics Thread
« Reply #73 on: September 26, 2022, 03:03:04 pm »
Must say it is incredibly strange for somebody to be running faster at they get older. Seems like Kipchoge cracked the cycle of life.

Less strange at the longer distances than in sprinting - but that said 37 is definitely getting past the curve... wonder if he'd beat Milner in the lactate test...

Offline lfcred1976

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Re: General Athletics Thread
« Reply #74 on: September 26, 2022, 06:59:28 pm »
What’s possibly quite suspect is the winner of the women’s marathon. 3rd fastest female time in history and she knocked 18 minutes off her marathon PB. Absolutely unheard of at the elite level.

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Re: General Athletics Thread
« Reply #75 on: September 27, 2022, 09:25:01 am »
What’s possibly quite suspect is the winner of the women’s marathon. 3rd fastest female time in history and she knocked 18 minutes off her marathon PB. Absolutely unheard of at the elite level.
Yeah this is what’s more eyebrow raising for me than Kipchoge. Marathon runners peak late and whilst Kipchoge has certainly hit that record late in the day, there’s still older marathon runners competing at the elite level posting sub 2:04. Kipchoge’s last half a decade has all been spent micromanaging the absolute fine set of margins enabling him to get the times he is, he’s the greatest distance runner of all time. He’s gone sub 2 hours, albeit in a massively controlled ‘perfect’ set of conditions so biomechanically he’s capable. Kipchoge’s never been caught doping or aroused suspicion, nor was he in the stable of Kenyans that got busted a few years back. I think he’s earned the benefit of the doubt.

Assefa’s marathon yesterday looks dodgy as fuck. Like Kipchoge, never caught doping so you could argue we could extend the same benefit I’m suggesting to him above, however, LFCred is spot on in that this sort of improvement, in that sort of timespan is highly suspicious. I’ve said for years Farah was a doper based on his rapid improvement at an older age, this is giving me similar vibes. She’s only ever ran one other marathon, that was 4 months ago in Riyadh. Her improvement represents 5+ years of improvement in less than 5 months. The other possibility is that she simply didn’t go hard at Riyadh and it was essentially to feel out the distance and she’s an undiscovered phenom at marathon level. Possible, but it feels dodgy. Cherono, Abayechew, Wanjiru - had any of these just done that it would have been shrug of the shoulders. Super human clearly, but the norm from those names. Assefa is a 400m/800m runner that’s increased her range exponentially and apparently turned out to be world class as both sprinter and distance runner. No one’s ever done that.

She may be one of the most unique athletes of all time, but two years ago she was running 54 seconds for 400m and now doing a course record at a marathon. It just feels impossible but maybe she is indeed the most versatile runner of all time.
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