Topic: LIVERPOOL TRANSFER THREAD - 2023 (FSG posts = get muted) - No Mbappé

[DonkeyWan]

Pointless Peter. Regardless of heat maps, everyone has a position (or a starting position) on the pitch, and Mac Allister's has predominately been LCM. Otherwise you would say he plays as a big red blob.

I wouldn't say entirely pointless. If you look closely you can make out the face of Jesus Christ in the heat map.

[Boaty McBoatface]

Mac Allister@Brighton = Modric@Spurs

[MD1990]

So Mac Allister has been compared to Iniesta & Modric this morning.

If he wasnt linked we wouldnt see those comparisons.
Good player but 70m is a crazy fee for us

[RayPhilAlan]

A lot of people pointing out that we need three midfielders because Keita, Ox and Milner are all leaving (Arthur too I guess) but surely whoever we sign they’ll individually play more minutes than those 3 (4) combined? Not every person needs replacing, if anything it was the vast number of midfielders we had last summer that prevented us improving the quality and availability of the midfield, if you go by Klopp’s quotes at the time.

That’s not to say we don’t need three midfielders btw, but it won’t be to replace those three players or their roles in the squad, it would be to replace/compete with the roles currently performed by an aging Henderson, an injured Thiago and a struggling Fabinho.

Although Jones’ recent all action performances might make Thiago’s role obsolete.

Yeah, I've wondered if we only get a third midfielder if one of those three leaves. I'd assume it would be one of the last two you name.

Back in about October, I thought we'd need two new first team midfielders over the next two transfer windows (i.e. January and the one coming up) and then two more over the following two years, to fully replace the experienced ones leaving. That would mean that by mid-2025 our midfielders are 4 players we don't have yet, Jones, Elliott and Bajcetic, plus Henderson doing the Milner role and maybe another youngster like Clark or Balagizi. If we front-load that a bit and get three this summer, that'll mean we might have slightly too many players if no one else leaves apart from those out of contract.

[disgraced cake]

Mac Allister@Brighton = Modric@Spurs

So you're saying if we sign him he's gonna take us to 5 European Cup wins in less than a decade?

Get it done, John 

[JackWard33]

Honestly, if I have to explain I can’t help you.

Or you can’t make an argument beyond your initial bias

[PeterTheRed ...]

Pointless Peter. Regardless of heat maps, everyone has a position (or a starting position) on the pitch, and Mac Allister's has predominately been LCM. Otherwise you would say he plays as a big red blob.

You have obviously missed the fact that Mac Allister has been moved to a more central position this season, as that heat map proves. In fact, if you look carefully, you will notice that he's had more touches at the right side of the pitch this season, than at the left. "Starting positions" don't really exist in football, only playing positions. Starting positions are only good for that TV graphic before the game, and nothing else. By the way, here is how Mac Allister's playing position has developed over the last few seasons ...



I am sure that you can notice his development from a left sided midfielder into a more central midfielder ...

[BarryCrocker]

Mac Allister@Brighton = Modric@Spurs

So you're saying if we sign him he's gonna take us to 5 European Cup wins in less than a decade?

Get it done, John 

Modric won nothing at Spurs.

[JackWard33]

Modric won nothing at Spurs.

Yeah but if we keep equating players to one of the best CMs of all time the board will be shut by the objectively hilarious police

[amir87]

As good as Fabinho was yesterday, and he's definitely improved in recent weeks, I really hope we haven't decided that a defensive midfielder isn't a priority this Summer.

Hope the Ugarte chat wasn't just his agent making his availability known as I think he'd be perfect for this current template.

Not convinced we should go for an 18 year old in Lavia unless the transition from Fabinho to him is a longer process.

Don't think any others have been mentioned at all that occupy that position but for me, it's as important as any signing we make this Summer.

[5-times-Phill]

Well if we want to compete in the league next year playing on a Thursday and Sunday (as at moment a EL spot still looks more likely) then we need to beef our squad up with quality. Yes, the likes of Clark, Doak, Gordon etc will get minutes in the EL but we want to challenge for the league.

Losing Keita, Milner, Ox. That’s losing quality players who all need replacing. We need players that can give competition.

We do need 2/3 midfielders this season. Yes, great we doing well now but the season from a midfield point of view hasn’t been good enough.

Yeah I don’t disagree with the numbers at all or the quality of the midfield this season, but if we sign Mac Allister for example and he is available next season for as many games as he was this season then we’ll already have replaced all their minutes and then some.I just think those particular three players shouldn’t be in anyone’s thoughts at all really. Milner obviously a hugely important player but his role theoretically should be filled by Henderson next season unless we want to specifically bring in a midfield player who can also play full back.

For me, given the players we’re talking about, the thinking shouldn’t be ‘we’re losing three players so we need three players’ it should be ‘what qualities is the midfield missing and what will it take to inject those qualities into the squad’. If we signed the right two I don’t think anyone should complain that we didn’t sign three, for example.

[disgraced cake]

Modric won nothing at Spurs.

Mac Allister's won nothing at Brighton, tbf

[LovelyCushionedHeader]

You have obviously missed the fact that Mac Allister has been moved to a more central position this season, as that heat map proves. In fact, if you look carefully, you will notice that he's had more touches at the right side of the pitch this season, than at the left. "Starting positions" don't really exist in football, only playing positions. Starting positions are only good for that TV graphic before the game, and nothing else. By the way, here is how Mac Allister's playing position has developed over the last few seasons ...



I am sure that you can notice his development from a left sided midfielder into a more central midfielder ...

Of course starting positions exist. It's literally the position you start the match in.

Not going to take this any further as I have a new brick wall to smash my head against instead.

[Asam]

Mac Allister@Brighton = Modric@Spurs

So he’s arguably in the top 3/4 midfielder of his generation in his position?

[RyanBabel19]

I’ve slotted Mac Allister into the Cazorla pigeon hole in my brain. Can do everything, isn’t the quickest, played a key marginal role in a World Cup win, ten yards quicker upstairs. Add in a Milner style ability to shithouse and that’s an appealing package to me.

Best comparison i've seen thus far

[DelTrotter]

As good as Fabinho was yesterday, and he's definitely improved in recent weeks, I really hope we haven't decided that a defensive midfielder isn't a priority this Summer.

Hope the Ugarte chat wasn't just his agent making his availability known as I think he'd be perfect for this current template.

Not convinced we should go for an 18 year old in Lavia unless the transition from Fabinho to him is a longer process.

Don't think any others have been mentioned at all that occupy that position but for me, it's as important as any signing we make this Summer.

Yep, if anything the timing of getting one is even more perfect when Fab plays like this as they can have time to adapt and not have the pressure of solving a crisis position straight away. Get it done!!! NOW!!

[Fordy]

Yeah I don’t disagree with the numbers at all or the quality of the midfield this season, but if we sign Mac Allister for example and he is available next season for as many games as he was this season then we’ll already have replaced all their minutes and then some.I just think those particular three players shouldn’t be in anyone’s thoughts at all really. Milner obviously a hugely important player but his role theoretically should be filled by Henderson next season unless we want to specifically bring in a midfield player who can also play full back.

For me, given the players we’re talking about, the thinking shouldn’t be ‘we’re losing three players so we need three players’ it should be ‘what qualities is the midfield missing and what will it take to inject those qualities into the squad’. If we signed the right two I don’t think anyone should complain that we didn’t sign three, for example.

Well Mount presses hard, can play in other positions. Mac Allister is can do it all.

The issue isn’t about minutes that will be replaced it’s about higher level of competition. Players raising their game knowing full well that others are in waiting. Our midfield area needed Trent to come into it to improve. Next season teams will be looking to deal with Trent and he might not have as much time on the ball as currently.

Plus we have to think Jones, Hendo and Tiago do tend to get injuries. We need a squad to compete with City and that’s tough. Mount looks like he’s signing as does Mac Allister. We might need one more but due to Jones form we might leave it for now.

[Boaty McBoatface]

So he’s arguably in the top 3/4 midfielder of his generation in his position?

I'm saying Mac Allister is potentially on that trajectory. He has all the tools.

Did you think the spurs version of Luka Modric was one of the best of his generation?

At 24, Modric was 2 years into his spurs career and wasn't exactly pulling up trees.

[the_red_pill]

Him getting us a CL place v Newcastle then signing a few days later would be the dream.

Yep.. you saw Mac Allister's performance against United?
Lad was doing his bit already, to ensure he plays CL next season!
Now it's Mount's turn..

[careful on these streets, I've heard stories]

Leicester has lots of decent players surely we can find one that will perform better in our setup even as squad players

https://fbref.com/en/players/56f7a928/Youri-Tielemans

https://fbref.com/en/players/5c74c0f5/Kiernan-Dewsbury-Hall

https://fbref.com/en/players/197640fd/Timothy-Castagne

https://fbref.com/en/players/ee38d9c5/James-Maddison

[MD1990]

i think we you see Fabinho improving i think it is the perfect time to sell.
We would get a decent fee I feel. Could see either Milan clubs ,Atletico or Juve paying 30m euros
We all saw Mane have a great upturn in the 2nd half of last season but as now with Fabinho you can see the decline.

Think it would be the perfect timing to get in some money.
We cant afford to lose out on transfer fee's & let all our midfield players leave on a free.

[tubby]

Is Dewsbury-Hall actually any good?  Didn't realise he's already 24, thought he was just starting out.

Maddison is the only one I'd take from Leicester as an alternative to Mount/Mac Allister.

[Henry Gale]

Leicester has lots of decent players surely we can find one that will perform better in our setup even as squad players

https://fbref.com/en/players/56f7a928/Youri-Tielemans

https://fbref.com/en/players/5c74c0f5/Kiernan-Dewsbury-Hall

https://fbref.com/en/players/197640fd/Timothy-Castagne

https://fbref.com/en/players/ee38d9c5/James-Maddison

Wouldn't go anywhere near any of them.

[MD1990]

Leicester has lots of decent players surely we can find one that will perform better in our setup even as squad players

https://fbref.com/en/players/56f7a928/Youri-Tielemans

https://fbref.com/en/players/5c74c0f5/Kiernan-Dewsbury-Hall

https://fbref.com/en/players/197640fd/Timothy-Castagne

https://fbref.com/en/players/ee38d9c5/James-Maddison

Dewsbury Hall doesnt start for them. Tielemans cannot run. Maddison we dont need a player who cant defend. Castagne would be ok.

[5-times-Phill]

Well Mount presses hard, can play in other positions. Mac Allister is can do it all.

The issue isn’t about minutes that will be replaced it’s about higher level of competition. Players raising their game knowing full well that others are in waiting. Our midfield area needed Trent to come into it to improve. Next season teams will be looking to deal with Trent and he might not have as much time on the ball as currently.

Plus we have to think Jones, Hendo and Tiago do tend to get injuries. We need a squad to compete with City and that’s tough. Mount looks like he’s signing as does Mac Allister. We might need one more but due to Jones form we might leave it for now.

Yeah agreed. I think Mac Allister and Mount are actually the perfect example of ‘needing three midfielders’ because for me you’d want that extra, more physical, a bit more defensive when needed type. I wouldn’t want to rely on Fab to play every game for another season and I wouldn’t want to try on Mac Allister or any of our existing players in that position either.
However if it was Rice and Mac Allister or doing the Brighton double I think 2 would be sound. (I reckon Rice could be essentially be young Henderson in the 8 but also sit on in some games)

For complete transparency of what a fool I am though i’’d have been selling Jones in the summer if he wasn’t home grown, with view to shifting anyone who has been injured for over 30% of the last two seasons. And look at him now.

[disgraced cake]

I'm saying Mac Allister is potentially on that trajectory. He has all the tools.

Did you think the spurs version of Luka Modric was one of the best of his generation?

At 24, Modric was 2 years into his spurs career and wasn't exactly pulling up trees.

He really did come on in those last couple of years at Spurs and obviously took a while to get to the top of his game at Madrid.

I'm sure by the time Spurs signed him he was about 23. Shows a bit how things have changed because nowadays I reckon if one of the bigger sides in the Prem brought in a 23 year old who had only played in the Croatian league you'd have people saying who's this loser 

Of course Modric is a rare case as he's obviously turned into one of the top centre mids of his day and played to the top level late into his 30s.

[Asam]

I'm saying Mac Allister is potentially on that trajectory. He has all the tools.

Did you think the spurs version of Luka Modric was one of the best of his generation?

At 24, Modric was 2 years into his spurs career and wasn't exactly pulling up trees.

Modric was one of the best midfielders in the premier league at the time & for a number of years not just after one season, if you can share all the posts you made last season or the season before about MacAllister being the best in the league i’d be delighted to see it

[classycarra]

How are people still suggesting Tielemans could play under Klopp?!

Football isn't played in a vacuum. He looked out of sorts physically against our team/midfield (who weren't even at their fluent best, after the break in spain, and two of whom are considered to be shadows of their physical peak). I'm sure there's room for him in a team where a player doesn't have to do anything when their team doesn't have the ball, he can pass a ball fine, but that's not us

[Vinay]

Well, that doesn't look "on the left" to me ...

That is one hell of a heat map Peter! Is Alexis shooting up the map, or down? I feel he is attacking towards the top.

[Asam]

I think last summer this would have been perfect, but things have moved on significantly since then.

We're losing 3 first team midfielders this summer. Keita and Ox in particular are players that we would hope to be available to start games and play significant minutes, though obviously due to form and fitness their contributions have dwindled away to almost nil. And it's clear that we could have done with an extra first choice midfielder last summer, a need that has only grown as Fabinho's form has dropped off significantly and Thiago has spent more time in the physio room.

IF everything turns around next season - Fab rediscovers his form, Thiago stays fit, Bajectic / Elliot / Jones all kick on, then your pair of midfield signings would probably be sufficient. But that's a vast "IF" to me. We won't know until it's too late whether Thiago has recovered from his hip operation and whether Fabinho has got his mojo back. If they don't then bringing in Lavia as a key signing is a massive risk.

For me we need to sign two top class players we can plug into the side from day one, players who are as good as or better than our current first choice trio. Much as I love him to bits, we need to replace Thiago now, not in 12 months when his contract expires.

We're playing in Europe, we'll have plenty of games for everyone to get minutes. I'm not saying we shouldn't sign Lavia, he looks very talented. Just that if we do, he should be one of three mids we bring in, and if necessary we can loan Bajectic out for a year to get some regular first team football.

Not that we will, but if we had say:
Thiago, Hendo, Fabinho, Mac Allister, Mount, Lavia, Elliot and Jones as our midfield group next season, with Baj on loan, then when Thiago leaves we bring Bajectic back in... I feel we'd be far better placed to compete in 4 competitions.

Though still holding out hope we get Barella in

I wouldn't risk sending Bajectic on loan, with 5 subs he can still get plenty of game time and was in the side on merit, the system has changed which may need us to tweak what we're looking for but then again its always better to have players who do adapt rather than only having one string to their bow

I do rate Lavia but would want both midfield signings to be better than what we have today and not just competition, Kone / Gravenberch for the midfield and Eze for the forwards + a LCB, we will also need a right back if Bradley/Ramsey aren't retained in the sqaud

[PeterTheRed ...]

That is one hell of a heat map Peter! Is Alexis shooting up the map, or down? I feel he is attacking towards the top.

Well, you can notice him taking their penalties and corners

[Vinay]

When are we going to start having a conversation about Mohamed Camara (Mali and AS Monaco)?

[classycarra]

When are we going to start having a conversation about Mohamed Camara (Mali and AS Monaco)?

Are they better than Aztec Camera (Scotland and Kilbride)?

[PeterTheRed ...]

When are we going to start having a conversation about Mohamed Camara (Mali and AS Monaco)?

Very good first season in France, but I am afraid he is a bit short for the defensive midfield position in our setup. Great talent, though ...

[paddysour]

Leicester has lots of decent players surely we can find one that will perform better in our setup even as squad players

https://fbref.com/en/players/56f7a928/Youri-Tielemans

https://fbref.com/en/players/5c74c0f5/Kiernan-Dewsbury-Hall

https://fbref.com/en/players/197640fd/Timothy-Castagne

https://fbref.com/en/players/ee38d9c5/James-Maddison

From the relegated clubs I'd go for Ward Prowse, but not as a CM, as our Trent backup.

[spider-neil]

James Pearce saying the club have distanced themselves from the links to Manuel Ugarte.

[Asam]

James Pearce saying the club have distanced themselves from the links to Manuel Ugarte.

if he didn’t use the phrase “off the radar” i’d be devastated

[CraigDS]

James Pearce saying the club have distanced themselves from the links to Manuel Ugarte.

Almost a dead cert then in that case.

[Boaty McBoatface]

Modric was one of the best midfielders in the premier league at the time & for a number of years not just after one season, if you can share all the posts you made last season or the season before about MacAllister being the best in the league i’d be delighted to see it

Not at 24 he wasn't.

[BarryCrocker]

When are we going to start having a conversation about Mohamed Camara (Mali and AS Monaco)?

He's been given the wrong size kit for next season.