Topic: Dejan Lovren

[Alan B'Stard]

There's been a few excellent CBs, Lovren amongst them

But to be honest it just isn't the time for that debate anyways. The lads just lost the WC Final, do people really need to wait by their keyboards waiting to criticise as soon as the thread is unlocked? Its just saaa aa aa aaaaad

Totally agree with you. Not sure why people need to bash the bloke or even compare.

[Chalky Boots]

I'm harsh on him at times, and I think it's a lot to do with his early spell like against Bolasie and Palace etc but really, since klopp has come here - and especially when he plays right side - he's been excellent. I mean I get when he's had some stinkers they've really stunk but I'm sure we're all guilty of exaggerating these things. Very few mention the number of games where Torres,Strurridge (AND I remember him struggling against Bellamy) made Vidic look rather shit?

Really unlucky over the past 4 weeks. He's been good enough to be on the winning side in both matches.

[sms1986]

[Caligula?]

He's done well and is great defender. He's nowhere near world class by any stretch of the imagination but if he can cut out some of the brainfarts and careless errors he makes from time to time, he'll be with us next to Van Dijk for a long time to come. He's always struck me as a confidence player and despite losing the two biggest competitions in world football in the space of a few months, he should take heart in his performances and the fact that his teams probably wouldn't have got as far in the first place if he didn't play as well as he did.

[deFacto please, you bastards]

Well done Dejane, did yourself and your country proud, the only player from my city  [Zenica,Bosnia] to play in a Champions League and World Cup final, proud of that as well.

[vivabobbygraham]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DODouLV-720

Interview with Klopp post Bury. Very funny. Dejan is brought up. Sorry, Al, Degsy gonna be here a long time, mate

4min 18 secs in

[mc_red22]

Varane has been immense no doubt.

On what basis has Godin and Jimenez had a better tournament than Lovren?

Godin was immense.

[sms1986]

He's done well and is great defender. He's nowhere near world class by any stretch of the imagination but if he can cut out some of the brainfarts and careless errors he makes from time to time, he'll be with us next to Van Dijk for a long time to come. He's always struck me as a confidence player and despite losing the two biggest competitions in world football in the space of a few months, he should take heart in his performances and the fact that his teams probably wouldn't have got as far in the first place if he didn't play as well as he did.

He'll take a lot of confidence with him into the new season.

[TepidT2O]

Really.

Unless you are taking pedantry to a new level then you were stating that Lovren was the best or joint best central defender at the World Cup.

I chose my words carefully.

There’s been no one better.  Several who have been as good.

Not the best defender in the world, but certainly really good.  But this tournament he’s been excellent.

Sorry if you found that pedantic.

[Eeyore]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DODouLV-720

Interview with Klopp post Bury. Very funny. Dejan is brought up. Sorry, Al, Degsy gonna be here a long time, mate

4min 18 secs in

I hope Lovren is here for a long time mate. I have never said he isn't a top class centre back and for me he is perfect for certain games. I have said that all along. What I don't get is the notion that he is one of the best central defenders in the World.

For me judgement seems to have gone out the window. As a Liverpool fan I want all Liverpool players to do as well as possible in every tournament they compete in. The thing is personally I think this forums rating of Lovren is completely out of kilter with the rest of the Football World.

For me he won't get anywhere near the team of the tournament and there have been better centre backs at the tournamnet

I would like people to actually dispute what I have posted and stop with the personal abuse.+ 

[vivabobbygraham]

I hope Lovren is here for a long time mate. I have never said he isn't a top class centre back and for me he is perfect for certain games. I have said that all along. What I don't get is the notion that he is one of the best central defenders in the World.

For me judgement seems to have gone out the window. As a Liverpool fan I want all Liverpool players to do as well as possible in every tournament they compete in. The thing is personally I think this forums rating of Lovren is completely out of kilter with the rest of the Football World.

For me he won't get anywhere near the team of the tournament and there have been better centre backs at the tournamnet

I would like people to actually dispute what I have posted and stop with the personal abuse.+

I understand that, mate. But, sometimes, it's better to work with what you have, as the boss likes to do, rather than continually looking to upgrade, as you've suggested, and start again. Centre backs, in particular, need to play consistently together. Degsy is still improving and I foresee a partnership with big Virgil that has the potential to be immense. The term, World class is so subjective as to be impossible to argue. I love the fellah tbf. I know his shortcomings and they are mostly in his head. I trust the boss to work with him, and he confirms that in the interview I posted.

[Gnurglan]

Not the one he wanted, but he should be proud of it.

[Eeyore]

I choose my words carefully.

There’s been no one better.  Several who have been as good.

Not the best defender in the world, but certainly really good.  But this tournament he’s been excellent.

Sorry if you found that pedantic.

Obviously you don't choose your words that well because best defender in the World wasn't mentioned. You stated that 'There wasn’t a better central defender at the World Cup....'

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion but for me you would be in a tiny minority if you think that other centre backs didn't have a better World Cup than Lovren. 

[TepidT2O]

Obviously you don't choose your words that well because best defender in the World wasn't mentioned. You stated that 'There wasn’t a better central defender at the World Cup....'

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion but for me you would be in a tiny minority if you think that other centre backs didn't have a better World Cup than Lovren. 

Jog on Al

Back on the ignore list

Life is better without this drivel.

[sms1986]

Not the one he wanted, but he should be proud of it.

Yeah, it's their best ever World Cup performance, beating their 3rd place in the 1998 World Cup, and he along with his team mates should be deeply proud of themselves.

[Dim Glas]

I hope Lovren is here for a long time mate. I have never said he isn't a top class centre back and for me he is perfect for certain games. I have said that all along. What I don't get is the notion that he is one of the best central defenders in the World.

For me judgement seems to have gone out the window. As a Liverpool fan I want all Liverpool players to do as well as possible in every tournament they compete in. The thing is personally I think this forums rating of Lovren is completely out of kilter with the rest of the Football World.

For me he won't get anywhere near the team of the tournament and there have been better centre backs at the tournamnet

I would like people to actually dispute what I have posted and stop with the personal abuse.+

you seem to be disputing something that isnt actually in dispute though.

Has he been one of the best CBs at the world cup? I would say so. Would he get in the team of the tournament? I dont know who picks it. I'm sure plenty would put him in, after all he's had to play more games than some of the other good performers in that role. Godin being a good example. Yes, fantastic, but he played less games.

Verane and Umtiti are up there, with maybe Verane being the pick, Alderwereld too I'm sure would be a pick for many.   

I don't think you are right when you say "For me he won't get anywhere near the team of the tournament" though. But if you want to explain why, then go for it.

Although of course him not getting in the team of the tournament then gives you ammuniton to go 'see? I was right'

But he's definately been one of the best central defenders in the WC.

[robgomm]

He's had a fine tournament. Been a good one for centre-backs. Varane was mostly brilliant, I was impressed with Stones for England, loved Godin for Uruguay and Alderweireld had a good tournament especially given his lack of playing time last season. Lovren is right in amongst them. Vida is a level below but played with his heart and was damned entertaining to watch.

[Eeyore]

I understand that, mate. But, sometimes, it's better to work with what you have, as the boss likes to do, rather than continually looking to upgrade, as you've suggested, and start again. Centre backs, in particular, need to play consistently together. Degsy is still improving and I foresee a partnership with big Virgil that has the potential to be immense. The term, World class is so subjective as to be impossible to argue. I love the fellah tbf. I know his shortcomings and they are mostly in his head. I trust the boss to work with him, and he confirms that in the interview I posted.

I agree with you. I think Lovren has most of the attributes needed to be a top central defender and if anyone can improve him then Klopp can. My problem is how many work in progress players you can have and actually win things.

When we dominated at home and abroad we improved players and brought players through but we were also absolutely ruthless. I feel for Lovren because he has lost the two biggest prizes in Football in an incredibly short period of time. Then again part of me thinks that he has been part of defences that have conceded 7 goals in those two games.

[sms1986]

I agree with you. I think Lovren has most of the attributes needed to be a top central defender and if anyone can improve him then Klopp can. My problem is how many work in progress players you can have and actually win things.

When we dominated at home and abroad we improved players and brought players through but we were also absolutely ruthless. I feel for Lovren because he has lost the two biggest prizes in Football in an incredibly short period of time. Then again part of me thinks that he has been part of defences that have conceded 7 goals in those two games.

To be fair, in the Champions League final one was a wonder goal and Karius was concussed for much of the match. In the World Cup final, one was a penalty and one was an own goal.

[Eeyore]

you seem to be disputing something that isnt actually in dispute though.

Has he been one of the best CBs at the world cup? I would say so. Would he get in the team of the tournament? I dont know who picks it. I'm sure plenty would put him in, after all he's had to play more games than some of the other good performers in that role. Godin being a good example. Yes, fantastic, but he played less games.

Verane and Umtiti are up there, with maybe Verane being the pick, Alderwereld too I'm sure would be a pick for many.   

I don't think you are right when you say "For me he won't get anywhere near the team of the tournament" though. But if you want to explain why, then go for it.

Although of course him not getting in the team of the tournament then gives you ammuniton to go 'see? I was right'

But he's definately been one of the best central defenders in the WC.

There are two places up for grabs as centre backs in the team of the tournament and to be honest I don't think Lovren would get in the top 5 of centre backs for most people. That isn't having a pop at Lovren I just think if you look at it objectively then other centre backs have had better tournaments.

[Chris~]

To be fair, in the Champions League final one was a wonder goal and Karius was concussed for much of the match. In the World Cup final, one was a penalty and one was an own goal.

If he was being fair he would have brought it up. Hates stats without context but loves to post them.

[sms1986]

There are two places up for grabs as centre backs in the team of the tournament and to be honest I don't think Lovren would get in the top 5 of centre backs for most people. That isn't having a pop at Lovren I just think if you look at it objectively then other centre backs have had better tournaments.

To be fair, though, this is the Lovren thread, people are going to be happy for him. Yes, you think it's a little over the top but it's just people celebrating a great achievement from one of our players.

[Dim Glas]

There are two places up for grabs as centre backs in the team of the tournament and to be honest I don't think Lovren would get in the top 5 of centre backs for most people. That isn't having a pop at Lovren I just think if you look at it objectively then other centre backs have had better tournaments.

so who would be the 5 best CB's over the course of the world cup then?

I honestly don't know, I probably didn't see enough of certain teams games to know how well some did. And I'm not sure what the criteria is either - do they just have to make the knockout stages to be considered, or quarter finals or what?

But from what I saw, I'd have Lovren behind the French lads and maybe Toby Alderwereld and Godin in there too.

I'm probably missing someone obvious too.
 

[Eeyore]

If he was being fair he would have brought it up. Hates stats without context but loves to post them.

I back stats up with watching both games and to be honest I didn't see a defensively solid performance in either game. Did you ?

[Eeyore]

so who would be the 5 best CB's over the course of the world cup then?

It is subjective but for me it would be.

1. Godin
2. Varane
3. Jiminez
4. Umtiti
5. Aderweireld

I honestly don't know, I probably didn't see enough of certain teams games to know how well some did. And I'm not sure what the criteria is either - do they just have to make the knockout stages to be considered, or quarter finals or what?

But from what I saw, I'd have Lovren behind the French lads and maybe Toby Alderwereld and Godin in there too.

I'm probably missing someone obvious too.
 

[smicer07]

Sign up his mate Vida I reckon. They'd be a good pairing (obviously VVD first choice).

[24/7]

Okay I'm putting my foot down here.

This thread is now SOLELY for discussion of Lovren in a LIVERPOOL shirt from this point onwards.

Take the tedious Fantasy World Cup Team Manager shit to the thread for the France v Croatia match or any other suitable thread in the World Cup Forum.

Let's try to have a Liverpool FC thread in the Liverpool FC Main Forum that runs nicely and on-topic for a change.

[John C]

Let's try to have a Liverpool FC thread in the Liverpool FC Main Forum that runs nicely and on-topic for a change.

Good luck with that Jimbo   

[Captain Kos]

Look at the centre halves for the other top 4 contenders, who is obviously better. Not man city's, definitely not utd's, not arsenals and probably not Chelseas. Is alderweirald much better?

The question we need to ask as fans is can we support a very good player even if they make a mistake?

[Cu Chulainn]

He might inexplicably fuck up from time to time, but one thing you just can't doubt is this guy's mental toughness. Been through a load of difficult personal shit off the field, and had loads of (often unfair) criticism from fans and the media, and just gets up and keeps going. I always say that you can't ask any more of anyone than that they try their best; Dejan certainly does that. Love the big guy.

[sms1986]

The question we need to ask as fans is can we support a very good player even if they make a mistake?

I would hope the answer would always be yes, personally.

[Captain Kos]

Also, as much as people like to say we need a keeper yo play our style,  we also need to appreciate that we need CBs to play our style.
We will expose our defenders. They will make mistakes. It's judged as for the benefit of the common good.

[Bobinhood]

Okay I'm putting my foot down here.

This thread is now SOLELY for discussion of Lovren in a LIVERPOOL shirt from this point onwards.

Take the tedious Fantasy World Cup Team Manager shit to the thread for the France v Croatia match or any other suitable thread in the World Cup Forum.

Let's try to have a Liverpool FC thread in the Liverpool FC Main Forum that runs nicely and on-topic for a change.

Do you have any further opinion on the use of "Degsy" when there is no E or G in the pronunciation of his name which is day han or day jan if your slightly lazy about it? I personally feel its a crime against humanity and should be put on trial at the Hague or included in the WC Team Manager edict, its almost like adding "inator" to something in fact the Dejaninator while yes turgid dated and cringeworthy, is actually better in that it utilizes vowels and letters that actually exist.

Weve got to do the right thing for the children they are the future. Most of them only speak emoji as it is. Lovren is Boss but Matip played hurt last year and will challenge at a high level going forward on topic in a Liverpool Purple shirt.

 

[vivabobbygraham]

Do you have any further opinion on the use of "Degsy" when there is no E or G in the pronunciation of his name which is day han or day jan if your slightly lazy about it? I personally feel its a crime against humanity and should be put on trial at the Hague or included in the WC Team Manager edict, its almost like adding "inator" to something in fact the Dejaninator while yes turgid dated and cringeworthy, is actually better in that it utilizes vowels and letters that actually exist.

Weve got to do the right thing for the children they are the future. Most of them only speak emoji as it is. Lovren is Boss but Matip played hurt last year and will challenge at a high level going forward on topic in a Liverpool Purple shirt.

[Alf]

Other than VVD, Lovren's our best centre back. He's played a lot of football over the last year, it will be interesting to see how we cover him with Gomez & Matip also injury prone.

[Chris~]

I back stats up with watching both games and to be honest I didn't see a defensively solid performance in either game. Did you ?

By lovren? Yeah. You'd be in the absolute minority if you don't think he was good in the champions league final

[Bobinhood]

  my precious Its mine Baggins stole it whats in his pockets Not Fair

[24/7]

Do you have any further opinion on the use of "Degsy" when there is no E or G in the pronunciation of his name which is day han or day jan if your slightly lazy about it? I personally feel its a crime against humanity and should be put on trial at the Hague or included in the WC Team Manager edict, its almost like adding "inator" to something in fact the Dejaninator while yes turgid dated and cringeworthy, is actually better in that it utilizes vowels and letters that actually exist.

I always thought "Degsy" was short for "Derek". So it did confuse me somewhat. I've asked a Croatian friend if there's any way that Dejan can be translated to Derek and he just looked at me like I had seven heads, so.....

In short, no opinion offered, merely a bemused shake of the head and a "Carry on, lads and lasses!" cursory wave, almost regal you might say.........regsy if you will........

[So… Howard Philips]

I always thought "Degsy" was short for "Derek". So it did confuse me somewhat. I've asked a Croatian friend if there's any way that Dejan can be translated to Derek and he just looked at me like I had seven heads, so.....

In short, no opinion offered, merely a bemused shake of the head and a "Carry on, lads and lasses!" cursory wave, almost regal you might say.........regsy if you will........

"Degsy" Hatton says hello.

[Claire.]

I always thought "Degsy" was short for "Derek". So it did confuse me somewhat. I've asked a Croatian friend if there's any way that Dejan can be translated to Derek and he just looked at me like I had seven heads, so.....

In short, no opinion offered, merely a bemused shake of the head and a "Carry on, lads and lasses!" cursory wave, almost regal you might say.........regsy if you will........

It is short for Derek and that doesn't have a 'g' sound in it either. It's just a nickname, who bleedin cares Maybe we can call him Day-Boy instead?