Topic: Most Overrated Footballers?

[Coolie High]

Benzema is one I missed.

Are you saying Kane, Neymar and Robben are in that group with Lewandowski, Salah and Suarez? I’m not sure personally. Kane and Benzema would be closest to it for me.

They all are, it’s laughable people on this forum say Neymar is overrated... What is he overrated at? What doesn’t he do to a high level as a forward, what hasn’t he won?


Neymar for the last 5-7 years has been one of the most productive footballers on the planet, check his stats, he scores goals at a high level, he assists and play-makes at a high level and he dribbled and ball carries at a high level. On top of that he’s the top goalscorer for a nation that includes Pele R9 Rivaldo Ronaldinho Garrincha and Romario, if anything if going by this forum he’s underrated.

Robben would be up there for me as well, for a good 5 years he was the next line of best players alongside Iniesta Suarez and a couple others after Ronaldo and Messi, he has the stats and he has the big game performances, he almost carried Netherlands to a World Cup that year they went to the final.

[I've been a good boy]

Neymar's had a very strange career. Came to Europe with massive hype, did very well at Barca then retired to a farmers league, ad now effectively retired in Saudi.

[Too early for flapjacks?]

Neymar isn't even an out and out striker and he is Brazil's top scorer. Also the Brazilian with the most goals in Champions League history. Scored more goals in the Champions League than Cavani, Rooney, Eto'o, Rivaldo, Suarez, Kaka, and Gerrard. I think people are clouded by the villain image he has ended up with and the fact he went to PSG for the money. He's an exceptional player.

[jizzspunk]

Over a cafe breakfast a few years back a group of lads who have been watching since the mid 70's got this chat going and Franck Ribery featured highly..successful career with Bayern but rarely lit up a game that anybody in my group had watched...I present Franck Ribery to the judge & jury

[Sheer Magnetism]

Goals will be influenced by how teams set up, who takes set pieces etc but, personally, I’d say objectively that Ronaldo s clearly the better player. He’d be in the wider conversation, outside of a Liverpool forum, of being a Top 5 player ever. I’m not sure Suarez is even a Top 5 Liverpool player despite being an incredible player and one of the best players in the World for  a period.

But his performances, his contributions, his durability and duration of being an elite footballer make him stand out. In my opinion, only Messi is clearly better than him in the last 30-40 years. I suspect if you asked an unbiased audience you’d get a similar answer in vast majority of cases.

Naaaahhhh. By this measure Ronaldo is hugely overrated. Did he have a stratospheric scoring record? Of course, but he was playing ahead of the likes of Ozil, Di Maria, Modric, Kroos, Isco, James, Asensio and Bale, in a structure set up more for him to score than for the team to win. How often did he create a goal out of nothing compared to Messi, Suarez or Ibra? How many did he set up? What did he do off the ball?

As for his contributions, looking at how Real as a team performed, you could make the argument Benzema was a better focal point for the attack. They won just as much, with a considerably weaker team. Sure, Ronaldo's Real were up against peak Barca, but has anyone in history managed to put together a team with that level of Galactico at every position? As for his scoring record, they were so monumentally better than 17 teams in the league that he may as well have been playing in a lesser league. Don't even get me started on his flat track bullying at international level: eight goals in five World Cups says far more, not to mention Portugal have often looked better when he hasn't been playing.

A top player for sure but top five all time? No one clearly better than him in a period that includes Maradona? Too many asterisks for me to agree.

[G Richards]

Leicester’s Harry Maguire. Stout defender. £80M worth? 😂

[disgraced cake]

Over a cafe breakfast a few years back a group of lads who have been watching since the mid 70's got this chat going and Franck Ribery featured highly..successful career with Bayern but rarely lit up a game that anybody in my group had watched...I present Franck Ribery to the judge & jury

I think Ribery was overrated personally, obviously still a top player in his prime but never one of the elites and Robben always outperformed him at Bayern despite often looking like a one trick pony. I remember that great Bayern side of about a decade ago and many were talked up as potential Balon D'or winners but Ribery should never have been in that conversation.

[PoetryInMotion]

Neymar isn't even an out and out striker and he is Brazil's top scorer. Also the Brazilian with the most goals in Champions League history. Scored more goals in the Champions League than Cavani, Rooney, Eto'o, Rivaldo, Suarez, Kaka, and Gerrard. I think people are clouded by the villain image he has ended up with and the fact he went to PSG for the money. He's an exceptional player.

His goals have come in an era, where there are so many International friendlies for South American nations, how many of his goals have come in an important knockout round for Brazil? Brazil won the Copa America without him. What has he really achieved for Brazil? And in CL, PSG have been wank for most seasons. His best season was with Barca when they won the treble. Is one season of peak really enough to have him as one of his generation's best players? Absolutely no.

Neymar is over-rated. He's the definition of one in this generation.

[PoetryInMotion]

Benzema is one I missed.

Are you saying Kane, Neymar and Robben are in that group with Lewandowski, Salah and Suarez? I’m not sure personally. Kane and Benzema would be closest to it for me.

Maybe Robben as a winger is close to Lewy, Salah and Suarez, but Kane and Neymar are below that rung.

[Kopenhagen]

Neymar isn't even an out and out striker and he is Brazil's top scorer. Also the Brazilian with the most goals in Champions League history. Scored more goals in the Champions League than Cavani, Rooney, Eto'o, Rivaldo, Suarez, Kaka, and Gerrard. I think people are clouded by the villain image he has ended up with and the fact he went to PSG for the money. He's an exceptional player.

Sure, but nobody should be fighting his corner in these conversations because he's a fraud who retired and took Saudi blood money at 31. In terms of the truly elite players of his generation he should never be in the conversation and quite rightly. And for that reason he is overrated. Just as a comparison, someone like Mo is so much better than him it's honestly untrue that they'd be even rated in the same category.

[Flaccido Dongingo]

Maybe Robben as a winger is close to Lewy, Salah and Suarez, but Kane and Neymar are below that rung.

If Kane would have moved to an elite team when he was 26 or so, then he'd have been posting Lewandowski type numbers, he was scoring goals for fun playing for a shower of shit.

[disgraced cake]

Neymar was obviously quality at Santos and Barca but when you look back his career looked to be practically over at 25. PSG move was a disaster.

The leading goalscorer stat for Brazil ... meh. He'll probably always have it but he never won a trophy with them and probably never will now, I don't know if he's ever scored in a World Cup knockout therefor most of his goals have came in friendlies or qualifiers. Also, like Ronaldo, a liberal amount of penalties along the way 

I feel like if he'd have stayed at Barca he'd have carried on doing well, he definitely could have helped them win a Champions League during those next couple of years after he left. So yeah, up until 2017, great player who actually showed it on the field, after that, nothing of note really.

[Bullet500]

Michael Cox wrote an article on Neymar last month on The Athletic. I think the article is free to read: https://theathletic.com/4838524/2023/09/09/neymar-pele-brazil/

[Coolie High]

Sure, but nobody should be fighting his corner in these conversations because he's a fraud who retired and took Saudi blood money at 31. In terms of the truly elite players of his generation he should never be in the conversation and quite rightly. And for that reason he is overrated. Just as a comparison, someone like Mo is so much better than him it's honestly untrue that they'd be even rated in the same category.

By what metric is Mo much better than him? I don’t understand how some see football, Neymar is easily an elite player of his generation, it’s delusional to say otherwise?

Mbappe has played for the same PSG sides for most of his career by the way and is argued to be the best in the world right now, why one rule for him and another for Neymar?

[Coolie High]

His goals have come in an era, where there are so many International friendlies for South American nations, how many of his goals have come in an important knockout round for Brazil? Brazil won the Copa America without him. What has he really achieved for Brazil? And in CL, PSG have been wank for most seasons. His best season was with Barca when they won the treble. Is one season of peak really enough to have him as one of his generation's best players? Absolutely no.

Neymar is over-rated. He's the definition of one in this generation.

Brazil hasn’t achieved much but that’s not down to him, he has been undoubtedly the best Brazilian player in that period, it’s players like Vini who haven’t quite brought their club form to international level.

Neymar has been a shining light for Brazil, just go have a conversation with any Brazilian national football fan if you don’t believe me.

For PSG he’s been good too, the fact they’ve underachieved is more a team and manager issue, him and Mbappe have done their job for the most part, using your logic I don’t see why Mbappe is mentioned as the best in the world if playing for PSG automatically invalidates players from this conversation.

[Coolie High]

If Kane would have moved to an elite team when he was 26 or so, then he'd have been posting Lewandowski type numbers, he was scoring goals for fun playing for a shower of shit.

Kane is easily in that conversation, what you get here is a bunch of people who judge football strictly on emotions and can’t be objective.

[darragh85]

Neymar is overrated in the sense that some people were putting him up there with Messi or  including him amongst the Brazilian greats. He was never near Messi level or amongst the very greatest Brazilian.

Despite his great ability, he is hard to Watch due his character and attitude on the pitch.

[Terry de Niro]

If Kane would have moved to an elite team when he was 26 or so, then he'd have been posting Lewandowski type numbers, he was scoring goals for fun playing for a shower of shit.

This 100%

[Hazell]

Despite his great ability, he is hard to Watch due his character and attitude on the pitch.

You're talking about Kane right? Apart from the great ability bit.

[Dim Glas]

Kane is easily in that conversation, what you get here is a bunch of people who judge football strictly on emotions and can’t be objective.

fans on a team specific football forum in being emotional shocker 

[afc tukrish]

fans on a team specific football forum in being emotional shocker 

And also, the one who thinks he is always right attacking the opinions of the others...

[PoetryInMotion]

Kane is easily in that conversation, what you get here is a bunch of people who judge football strictly on emotions and can’t be objective.

Kane is in the conversation, nobody is denying that, but he's a rung below Lewy as of now. Maybe in a few more years he'll get there.

But he will never get to Suarez levels.

[Yorkykopite]

Neymar obviously. Beckham too. Portuguese Ronaldo seems to me very overrated, though that's partly based on his toothlessness against Liverpool. Just not one of those players who you feared when lined up against the Reds. Bobby Moore, Baggio, Pirlo.

Oh, and Peter Marinello.

[Samie]

Roberto Baggio is an interesting one. I don't thnik he was overrated and his exploits are more known for what he did and didn't do for Italy than any club side really.  But I get your point Yorky.

[Billy The Kid]

Despite my best efforts to be objective in my appraisals, I still to this day cannot see what so many people claim they saw in Paul Scholes. Don't get me wrong, he was undoubtedly a very good player who had the ability to control the tempo, use the ball intelligently, and pick some great passes.

The bit I struggle with is the notion he was some sort of genius, who supposedly did all of the above on a consistent basis against all opponents. Because my lasting memories of him competing against top bracket midfielders (particularly in the business end of the Champions League) are that of him sitting on his arse, kicking like an upturned kangaroo, while the player who just nutmegged him goes steaming forward

I'm happy to concede he was a very good premier league player, but I saw him smoked too often and too easily to ever buy the notion that he was some sort of genius   

[So… Howard Philips]

Neymar obviously. Beckham too. Portuguese Ronaldo seems to me very overrated, though that's partly based on his toothlessness against Liverpool. Just not one of those players who you feared when lined up against the Reds. Bobby Moore, Baggio, Pirlo.

Oh, and Peter Marinello.

That’s a blast from the past. I was very envious of a tweed suit he was wearing in that era.

[PoetryInMotion]

Despite my best efforts to be objective in my appraisals, I still to this day cannot see what so many people claim they saw in Paul Scholes. Don't get me wrong, he was undoubtedly a very good player who had the ability to control the tempo, use the ball intelligently, and pick some great passes.

The bit I struggle with is the notion he was some sort of genius, who supposedly did all of the above on a consistent basis against all opponents. Because my lasting memories of him competing against top bracket midfielders (particularly in the business end of the Champions League) are that of him sitting on his arse, kicking like an upturned kangaroo, while the player who just nutmegged him goes steaming forward

I'm happy to concede he was a very good premier league player, but I saw him smoked too often and too easily to ever buy the notion that he was some sort of genius

You're right. His reputation grew after he retired. He was a very good player, but he was no genius. He failed to get a single Ballon d'Or vote from his colleague when he was playing.

[Coolie High]

Roberto Baggio is an interesting one. I don't thnik he was overrated and his exploits are more known for what he did and didn't do for Italy than any club side really.  But I get your point Yorky.

Baggio is underrated if anything, he was a penalty miss away from being mentioned with the likes of Zidane.

[Coolie High]

You're right. His reputation grew after he retired. He was a very good player, but he was no genius. He failed to get a single Ballon d'Or vote from his colleague when he was playing.

Scholes definitely belongs in this thread, very good player but he was regarded how is he now when he was actually playing.

[cardiff2001]

Fernando Torres. One great season with us. Spent the next two and a half seasons injured 50% of the time. Pretty average goalscoring record at Atletico and very poor goalscoring records at Chelsea and for Spain.

[Wigwamdelbert]

Fernando Torres. One great season with us. Spent the next two and a half seasons injured 50% of the time. Pretty average goalscoring record at Atletico and very poor goalscoring records at Chelsea and for Spain.

Not having that. Torres for us was immense - clearly started a decline and we sold him on, but he had 3 great years.
2007/08 - 33 goals in 46 appearances
2008/09 - 17 goals in 38 appearances
2009/10 - 22 goals in 32 appearances
2010/11 - 9 goals in 26 appearances

[JP!]

Ederson.

[storkfoot]

Duncan Ferguson.

[cardiff2001]

Not having that. Torres for us was immense - clearly started a decline and we sold him on, but he had 3 great years.
2007/08 - 33 goals in 46 appearances
2008/09 - 17 goals in 38 appearances
2009/10 - 22 goals in 32 appearances
2010/11 - 9 goals in 26 appearances

You can't say his 2008-09 and 2009-10 seasons were great when he missed so much football. The biggest way people overrated him is the constant Suarez or Torres debate, I see Gerrard and Carragher asked about it quite a lot. Suarez is on a completely different planet.

[disgraced cake]

Torres only done 20 league goals or more one season in his career (his first with us). That was also the only year of his entire career in which he scored 30 or more in all competitions. Obviously he was really good as a youngster with Atletico and started off so well with Liverpool, but it's a pretty telling stat. He had the potential to go on and be one of the elite but never got close really.

That said in 09/10 he scored 18 league goals in 22 appearances which was very good.

Duncan Ferguson.

Only by one club in particular

[Crosby Nick]

Torres only done 20 league goals or more one season in his career (his first with us). That was also the only year of his entire career in which he scored 30 or more in all competitions. Obviously he was really good as a youngster with Atletico and started off so well with Liverpool, but it's a pretty telling stat. He had the potential to go on and be one of the elite but never got close really.

That said in 09/10 he scored 18 league goals in 22 appearances which was very good.

Only by one club in particular

That’s once more than Michael Owen to be fair!

[JJ Red]

Despite my best efforts to be objective in my appraisals, I still to this day cannot see what so many people claim they saw in Paul Scholes. Don't get me wrong, he was undoubtedly a very good player who had the ability to control the tempo, use the ball intelligently, and pick some great passes.

The bit I struggle with is the notion he was some sort of genius, who supposedly did all of the above on a consistent basis against all opponents. Because my lasting memories of him competing against top bracket midfielders (particularly in the business end of the Champions League) are that of him sitting on his arse, kicking like an upturned kangaroo, while the player who just nutmegged him goes steaming forward

I'm happy to concede he was a very good premier league player, but I saw him smoked too often and too easily to ever buy the notion that he was some sort of genius   

I think Utd fans cling like sailors to a life raft onto the comments Iniesta (i think?) made about him when he retired.

I feel exactly the same about Scholes. Perhaps it is unconscious bias?

That 'Class of 92' thing is a joke; the 2 Nevilles, Nicky Butt, Scholes, and Beckham!!??

[RedSince86]

Neymar.

[Sheer Magnetism]

I think Utd fans cling like sailors to a life raft onto the comments Iniesta (i think?) made about him when he retired.

I feel exactly the same about Scholes. Perhaps it is unconscious bias?

That 'Class of 92' thing is a joke; the 2 Nevilles, Nicky Butt, Scholes, and Beckham!!??

I'd say that's a very good line up: Three England regulars and two very decent back ups - how many other teams have come up with that in a three-year age group?* That doesn't include Keith Gillespie, who was a regular for Newcastle when they were winning the league, and Robbie Savage, who ended up logging some 330 top-flight appearances.

Of course, we had Owen, Gerrard and Carragher in a similar time stretch (and Leeds had Robinson, Woodgate, Kewell and Harte at the same time), but that isn't really the same kind of depth.

*If we're talking international, Barcelona had Messi, Pique, Busquets, Alba, Pedro and Fabregas within three years, but of course they ended up having to buy half of them back.

[Zee_26]

I'd say that's a very good line up: Three England regulars and two very decent back ups - how many other teams have come up with that in a three-year age group?* That doesn't include Keith Gillespie, who was a regular for Newcastle when they were winning the league, and Robbie Savage, who ended up logging some 330 top-flight appearances.

Of course, we had Owen, Gerrard and Carragher in a similar time stretch (and Leeds had Robinson, Woodgate, Kewell and Harte at the same time), but that isn't really the same kind of depth.

*If we're talking international, Barcelona had Messi, Pique, Busquets, Alba, Pedro and Fabregas within three years, but of course they ended up having to buy half of them back.

Ajax of 1995 are right up there in producing a stellar group of players. Van de Sar, De Boer brothers, Reizeger, Overmars, Kanu, Seedorf, Davids and Kluivert. Also had Finidi George and Litmanen in their ranks.