Topic: Jose Manuel Reina

[The Kings Army]

“I’m shocked on so many levels. Firstly, how would the Spanish feel if the English stereotyped Spanish people as backward, stupid, and animalistic homosexuals? Secondly, what does this say about Pepe Reina? The Liverpool goalkeeper has lived and worked in the UK for nearly a decade, does he think it’s ok characterise Black people this way? Does he think his Black team mates will laugh at his joke?”

There are so many things wrong with that statment. Firstly those words come from Woolley himself, and in the same manner, he is characterising what he saw as "backward, stupid, and animalistic homosexuals." peoples interpretations are totally different and just because he sees that, it does not mean that everyone else will take it that way or that the advert implied it to be that way. Secondly, does this man not realise that tribes still exist, and sometimes their natural habitat IS in the jungle, you only have to switch on  the discovery channel to understand that people live in all corners of the world. To compare black people from a tribe in the jungle to black people from England is utter nonsense, by the same token would we consider ourselves the same as the Russians, Germans, French, Canadians etc. just because we have the same colour skin? The homosexual comment is ridiculous. It would have related to anybody. Had it been white people in a tribe the joke still would have applied, because his name is Reina and translates to queen, and the king of the tribe wanted a queen. It is a joke that was probably intended to relate to people on a level that was nowhere near racism, but since everybody is on a racism kick at the moment thats how it has been taken. Finally, to have a pop at Pepe Reina for it? Like it was his idea for the advert? like he would have had the power to change it? sure he could have dropped out, but lets be honest, its not in your face racism like the whole Suarez affair was supposed to be. You couldn't define this advert as a hate crime could you? If this is bad, then just watch Ace Ventura: When Nature calls and tell me that that is not a racist film.

[se9R.F.L]

Have you listened to a lot of 'black actors' recently? If 'white actors' are struggling then understand that 'black actors' are really struggling. its not a black thing??!!! really!!!!

Not too sure where to start but here goes...

I work with actors as my job, from lowly extras with dreams to bonafide stars and I do my best not to listen too hard to any of them.
You are the one here making a point of the colour of said actors skin.

I would pay no more heed to a black actor than to a white, or indeed Asian, Latino, whatever's gripes.
Characters in movies, tv shows and indeed adverts are written with a specific image in mind. Sometimes this image will change slightly to suit a specific actor at the discretion of the director or casting dept but usually if the character is a 40 something Asian guy then dexter Fletcher probably won't get past the first audition.
It's the nature of the game so yes, really, it's not a black thing. Sorry about that.

Is it really racist just to portray tribesmen? It's an advert remember, they are usually fairly lighthearted affairs and only ever challenge gender age or racial stereotypes in a comedic way ie puppets of old people dancing to drum n bass , ageist? Who gives a fuck? Certainly not Simon wooley. By the way, when's your dolmio day?

[cptrios]

I swear, if someone asks Kenny about this in the next press conference, I'm going to vomit.

The funniest thing is that this doesn't even come close to a lot of the mainstream stuff that goes on in Spain that we'd all consider "racist." They haven't had a particularly multiethnic society until fairly recently, so they really don't have any concept of what might be deemed racially offensive, and almost always bear no ill will when they do it. Take their basketball national team's "Chinese eyes" photo from the Beijing olympics, for example...my Spanish girlfriend, who is quite patently not racist, literally has no idea why anyone would take offense to that picture.

[shelovesyou]

Yeah I seen Eddie Murphy & Morgan Freeman selling the Big Issue in town the other day.

If you didnt buy one that makes you a racist dont yer know.

[Tomo!]

Completely ridiculous.

As for homophobic if that's not a "any holes a goal" look from Pepe at the end then I don't know what is.

[hurricane74]

i don't want to misinterpret, can you explain what you mean there?

The point I'm making is if 'white actors' are finding it hard to get work, then experience tells me that 'black actor(s)' will be finding twice, three, four times as hard.  That's what I mean. You only have to ask black actors who in the last decade  have left this country to go to the USA to get work and these are actors with soild working backgorund  in  theatre etc but can't find work here or roles they are offered are limited so have to leave to find work. 

[macca888]

My post didn't say that, in listening to black actors in the past and present, they sometimes have to  take roles  and are offered roles which can be very uncomfortable for them. Some won't do them, however the reality is some people have to take roles for a variety of reasons. I don't see the people who have to do this as traitors, or call them any names, I understand the game.

Again, absolute bollocks. They don't "have" to take them at all. They choose to take them, and make a conscious decision to do so. If all black actors refused to accept such roles, the adverts or movies would not get made, end of story. There is no way in these more enlightened times that directors and filmakers would dare to use blackened up white actors to play the roles. So the advert or film would not be made at all. Then nobody would be able to take offence to it, and nobody would have racial stereotypes made to them to support or justify any bigoted views they may hold. What you are effectively saying is that black actors choose to promote negative racial stereotypes, which I quite frankly find offensive. And as for your point about black actors finding it difficult to find work, get yourself over to LA, where there are thousands of "resting" white actors and actresses working in bars and restaurants.

[Pistolero]

to be honest we should just drop this now...it was a nonsense fuckin non-news story and it appears the only people still discussing it are Liverpool fans .....let it die ffs

[Kevend]

I'm confused, why do the papers say if someone is black/homosexual its an 'issue' or a 'negative' thing?

[macca888]

Right, my job here is done. I'm off now to complain to Proctor and Gamble about their "Fairy Liquid" adverts, the homophobic twats. How dare they imply that gay men jizz on their dishes to get them clean. Treating gay men like animalistic sex freaks, furiously masturbating over Weetabix encrusted breakfast bowls is the only conclusion I can make by branding their product in such a derogatory anti-gay way. It just perpetuates the stereotype of gays that we have in this country of them always wanking over the wine glasses. How could Nanette Newman ever have endorsed this bile filled commercial just for a few quid in the bank I'll never know. She's lived in England all her life, I think, so she's got no excuse for ignorance in the fight against homophobia in the UK.

And further to this, the lyrics are "Hans that do dishes." Are they trying to say that all Germans are gays now, is that it? Or all gays are Nazis? I'm shocked to the core by this further outrage. How do things like this not get in the press? You can bet your fucking bottom dollar that if Kenny Dalglish used Fairy Liquid, there'd probably be a headline like "Herr Kenny Caught Up In New Homophobia Scandal."

[ArgImAPirate]

Woah! Good post mate but this bit was unnecessary. I don't think anyone would accuse you of that just cos you said you are accepting of homosexuality!

Not so much directed any anyone actively posting on here. Moreso towards the lurkers.

Because I know there are people lurking who aren't fans of the club but either fans of the other club, or "distinguished" members of the press who rely on fan forums to help write the crap they write.

[hurricane74]

Again, absolute bollocks. They don't "have" to take them at all. They choose to take them, and make a conscious decision to do so. If all black actors refused to accept such roles, the adverts or movies would not get made, end of story. There is no way in these more enlightened times that directors and filmakers would dare to use blackened up white actors to play the roles. So the advert or film would not be made at all. Then nobody would be able to take offence to it, and nobody would have racial stereotypes made to them to support or justify any bigoted views they may hold. What you are effectively saying is that black actors choose to promote negative racial stereotypes, which I quite frankly find offensive. And as for your point about black actors finding it difficult to find work, get yourself over to LA, where there are thousands of "resting" white actors and actresses working in bars and restaurants.

'Bollocks' in your opinion, Re reading my posts I never said black actors  are 'promoting neagtive racial stereotypes' if your're reading that into my posts, then that's your issue. The point I making is 'black actors' are sometimes put into positions which 'white actors' may not be. This goes across a number of industries. Re LA  that's demorgaphics, you'll  naturally get a lots of actors out of work, beacuse there's not enough jobs for the amount of actors.

[Alan_X]

Ha good find, what an utter twat.

Infuriating that no one picks up on shit like this and calls them on it.

The saddest thing about this and the Suarez issue is that my respect for anyone associated with the fight against racism in this country has dropped to zero.  It pains me to say this but they are a bunch of self serving c*nts with more interest in their position in the anti-racism hierarchy than actually dealing with real issues.

Honestly, if I was a black man, Asian or any other race that still suffers prejudice in this country (travellers, french, italian etc) I would be fucking livid at the actions of these twats, diverting the effort from deserved targets to Liverpool FC.

[paddysour]

'Bollocks' in your opinion, Re reading my posts I never said black actors  are 'promoting neagtive racial stereotypes' if your're reading that into my posts, then that's your issue. The point I making is 'black actors' are sometimes put into positions which 'white actors' may not be. This goes across a number of industries. Re LA  that's demorgaphics, you'll  naturally get a lots of actors out of work, beacuse there's not enough jobs for the amount of actors.

So if a white actor is out of work it's because there isn't enough jobs, but if a black actor is out of work it's because of racism?

[stevo7]

wonder what king Ghezo would say

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ghezo

Throughout his reign, Ghezo waged a military campaign every year during the dry season. His prisoners-of-war were sold into slavery, thus fattening the royal treasury, increasing the annual budget, and making war a very efficient means of raising revenues.

[se9R.F.L]

'Bollocks' in your opinion, Re reading my posts I never said black actors  are 'promoting neagtive racial stereotypes' if your're reading that into my posts, then that's your issue. The point I making is 'black actors' are sometimes put into positions which 'white actors' may not be. This goes across a number of industries. Re LA  that's demorgaphics, you'll  naturally get a lots of actors out of work, beacuse there's not enough jobs for the amount of actors.

All actors, unless mega famous have to take roles which might make them feel stupid/uncomfortable/embarrassed.
Your notion that that black actors have it "two, three or even four times harder" than all other actors is, frankly, ridiculous.

[hollger]

Why are we spoiling Pepe's thread with this utter nonsense

[Eeyore]

The saddest thing about this and the Suarez issue is that my respect for anyone associated with the fight against racism in this country has dropped to zero.  It pains me to say this but they are a bunch of self serving c*nts with more interest in their position in the anti-racism hierarchy than actually dealing with real issues.

Honestly, if I was a black man, Asian or any other race that still suffers prejudice in this country (travellers, french, italian etc) I would be fucking livid at the actions of these twats, diverting the effort from deserved targets to Liverpool FC.

Couldn't agree more and furthermore all they actually do is create disharmony, divide people who were not divided and act as recruiting sergeants for the real racists. Compare the actions and the rhetoric of these people with the absolute inclusiveness of someone like John Barnes and it's pretty clear that we have the wrong people in the wrong positions.

It shouldn't be about point scoring or positive discrimination but about things like common decency and fairness.

[reddd10]

White shirts with a baldy on the front and 25 on the back anyone?

[Alan_X]

Why are we spoiling Pepe's thread with this utter nonsense

Might split it off but sadly Simon Wooley has decided to cast Pepe Reina as a racist. Not our decision.

[scatman]

The saddest thing about this and the Suarez issue is that my respect for anyone associated with the fight against racism in this country has dropped to zero.  It pains me to say this but they are a bunch of self serving c*nts with more interest in their position in the anti-racism hierarchy than actually dealing with real issues.

Honestly, if I was a black man, Asian or any other race that still suffers prejudice in this country (travellers, french, italian etc) I would be fucking livid at the actions of these twats, diverting the effort from deserved targets to Liverpool FC.

I am annoyed and have been for some time now, I find it hard on occasions to hold back from what I think about these guys who've never promoted the problems above themselves.

I tell you those extremist preachers are people who are benefitting from these sort of dividing comments from these organisations.

[Davvo7]

The saddest thing about this and the Suarez issue is that my respect for anyone associated with the fight against racism in this country has dropped to zero.  It pains me to say this but they are a bunch of self serving c*nts with more interest in their position in the anti-racism hierarchy than actually dealing with real issues.

Honestly, if I was a black man, Asian or any other race that still suffers prejudice in this country (travellers, french, italian etc) I would be fucking livid at the actions of these twats, diverting the effort from deserved targets to Liverpool FC.

Absolutely spot on Alan. Well said.

[WhiteHeat]

I haven't stopped humming that tune all day!

[shelovesyou]

I haven't stopped humming that tune all day!

Dont you start, your clearly racist with a username like that.
Youve been rumbled mate, Im off to report you to the FA.

[macca888]

White shirts with a baldy on the front and 25 on the back anyone?

Animalistic black homosexuals? Surely the t shirts should have a picture of Purple Aki on them next to an open jawed Pepe with the words "siempre seguros, la la la la la" underneath?

[se9R.F.L]

The saddest thing about this and the Suarez issue is that my respect for anyone associated with the fight against racism in this country has dropped to zero.  It pains me to say this but they are a bunch of self serving c*nts with more interest in their position in the anti-racism hierarchy than actually dealing with real issues.

Honestly, if I ywas a black man, Asian or any other race that still suffers prejudice in this country (travellers, french, italian etc) I would be fucking livid at the actions of these twats, diverting the effort from deserved targets to Liverpool FC.

My sentiments exactly.
Im from a very racist part of south London. Eltham (google what happened there if y'all don't know) and I have seen and heard racism first hand. These things are not racist, not to me. Im English and white with a little Spanish so I maybe don't know what it's like to be racially abused first hand but that doesn't stop me from despising racism or indeed nationalism. Even patriotism gets my back up.  Im as bored by these twats as I am by some old drunk in the pub  going on about white this and white that. They seem to have no point and certainly no solutions or suggestions and to ch allenge them makes you racist (or some other unpleasant names if challenging the bnp  twats)

[Stussy]

Stussy I understand what you are saying mate, but why does it feel like this is not going to be the last time these groups are going to blame LFC for being rascist again when we are not !!!

Come out with all guns blazing then, whilst the desperate for attention Lee Jasper and his associates rub their hands with glee at having baited the club into a mudfight with them?

Seriously, it really is a case of not giving them anything to build their legitimacy on. We don't need to defer to dodgy people like Lee Jasper. The club loses its dignity doing that.

[Stussy]

The Club needs to make a statement highlight the steps we have taken to fight racism and cut off the supply of oxygen to shitehawks like Jasper.

We need to be doing that anyway, and we've been doing that for a long long time always have and always will. We need to step up the game on that for its own sake and that diffuses outwards because its not just PR its for its own sake that we have been committed to that.

Unless you want to catalyse it further though you don't respond to discredited hustlers like Lee Jasper who wants to bait the club so he can promote himself and regain his profile. You don't respond to situations like this with belligerence. You stay silent and you do what you do anyway.

[Kevend]

Wonder if that grabbed any attention? Did they even do that? If it did I didnt see anything about it in the news.

[Stussy]

What's that got to do with anything?

[Kevend]

What's that got to do with anything?

If that actually happened I'd see that being more news worthy than Pepes advert.

[Lush is the best medicine...]

The saddest thing about this and the Suarez issue is that my respect for anyone associated with the fight against racism in this country has dropped to zero.  It pains me to say this but they are a bunch of self serving c*nts with more interest in their position in the anti-racism hierarchy than actually dealing with real issues.

i'd slightly disagree as there are many anti-racism campaigners who are in it for the right reason, but like you i've got nothing but contempt for the ones who appear on sky and all that as they dont give a fuck about racism, they just want to appear on tv to play up to the 'outraged black/asian' man. and of course the guardian can fuck off now, used to enjoy that site but they are just as bad as the red tops to me now, if not worse trying to act all sophisticated and intelligent when they are just fucking pondlife going after the lowest common denominator, just scum

one thing i've thought though, have any anti-homophobia groups commented on this?

[Liverbird 2010]

The saddest thing about this and the Suarez issue is that my respect for anyone associated with the fight against racism in this country has dropped to zero.  It pains me to say this but they are a bunch of self serving c*nts with more interest in their position in the anti-racism hierarchy than actually dealing with real issues.

Honestly, if I was a black man, Asian or any other race that still suffers prejudice in this country (travellers, french, italian etc) I would be fucking livid at the actions of these twats, diverting the effort from deserved targets to Liverpool FC.

Well said Alan 

[Lush is the best medicine...]

What's that got to do with anything?

that these people do fuck all when it comes to the likes of the edl?

[montysmum]

Why are we spoiling Pepe's thread with this utter nonsense

Exactly!  please, to preserve our sanity, can we stop giving these stupid tossers any attention.  It is why the do what they are doing.

They have decided we are an easy way to get their names recognised, get their 5 minutes of fame.  They have very little interest in really combating racism but are solely interested in having their ego's stroked and gaining a bit of notoriety.

Right now, I couldn't give a bugger what 'outsiders' think about the club or its supporters.  I know how the club values equality and is against discrimination of all sorts, and I believe in my heart that the vast majority of Liverpool supporters feel that way too.  As far as I am concerned that is all that matters.

If others want to try and portray us in a different light - let them.  Sooner or later the reality will overwhelm them and they will retreat back under the stone they have crawled out of, but for now they are having their fun.

We know the truth, we know the reality and that should be all that is important to us.

[Kevend]

that these people do fuck all when it comes to the likes of the edl?

Wasted breathe mate, apparently he thinks that if a fascist group who go and support a team just because theyre playing a foreign team and gets 0 media attention while a harmless advert does, they both share no common ground or proves that all this comotion isnt targeting one club over another.



or maybe I'm just thinking tooooo much into it.

(btw i only found that image cause I googled 'EDL football flag' cause I'm sure I saw one with a chelsea badge on it not long ago)

[Stussy]

that these people do fuck all when it comes to the likes of the edl?

They're flogging a dying horse because its us, we know that. Its bandwagon jumping and grandstanding no doubt.

[Kevend]

They're flogging a dying horse because its us, we know that. Its bandwagon jumping and grandstanding no doubt.

You changed your tune, did his post count convince you?

[Stussy]

Wasted breathe mate, apparently he thinks that if a fascist group who go and support a team just because theyre playing a foreign team and gets 0 media attention while a harmless advert does, they both share no common ground or proves that all this comotion isnt targeting one club over another.

We know its them targetting us because of what happened over the Suarez issue, thats self evident.
 

[Stussy]

You changed your tune, did his post count convince you?

You've got the wrong end of the stick mate, drop it.