Poll

The incoming Tory Tax Cuts..

Brilliant! With everyone struggling at the moment, a few hundred quid would be most welcome
Maybe a small one, but money should be spent on failing public services
I am an egg and I like cheese and fluffy squirrels called Bob. Bob the Fluffy squirrel is my fave babes.
There shouldn't be a tax cut when public services are already so broken. Keep spending what we are
Far more investment is needed in this country. Spend the money where it's needed now and fuck this stupid Austerity shite.

Author Topic: Never mind 'Stop the Boats' - STOP THE TORIES  (Read 1319145 times)

Offline So… Howard Philips

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Re: Conservatives: wholly-owned subsidiary of the ERG and 55 Tufton Street
« Reply #14920 on: September 28, 2022, 06:11:47 pm »
Do you ever have one of those dreams where you're about to do something like play for Liverpool or give a speech to the UN, something you've always wanted to do and have spent your whole life waiting for, and then you suddenly realise you're completely unprepared/not good enough, it's going to be a disaster and you're about to get humiliated in front of millions of people.  It's a common type of anxiety dream apparently.

Anyway I just realised that Truss and Kwarteng are literally living through that right now, and I almost feel sorry for them.

Kwarteng will be dreaming he’s running down Threadneedle Street without his keks and undies and wearing a vest which is just long enough to cover either his arse or his genitals.

That’s an anxiety dream. ;D

Offline So… Howard Philips

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Re: Conservatives: wholly-owned subsidiary of the ERG and 55 Tufton Street
« Reply #14921 on: September 28, 2022, 06:15:39 pm »
To be fair it was a figure of speech as Bruce will be squirming tomorrow, I refuse to watch it myself.

Who’s Bruce? I haven’t watched it since Sir Robin Day. ;D

Offline rafathegaffa83

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Re: Conservatives: wholly-owned subsidiary of the ERG and 55 Tufton Street
« Reply #14922 on: September 28, 2022, 06:28:11 pm »
For all the talk of Kwarteng's being toast, at the end of the day, Truss surely had to have knowledge of his plans and agreed with them. She's equally culpable for this mess

Offline KissThisGuy

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Re: Conservatives: wholly-owned subsidiary of the ERG and 55 Tufton Street
« Reply #14923 on: September 28, 2022, 06:37:57 pm »
Very easy for the Torys and right wing media to attack PR.
How will it work in practice. it can't work locally so you won't be able to vote for the MP you support to represent you in parliament. you will be given the MP the Labour party etc tell you and make do with it. so marginal seats full of center voters might be given a extreme left Labour MP who they would never vote for if given a choice, how this is a fundamental part of a democracy. voters should decide who they want to represent them in Parliament, they shouldn't be told who will represent them after they have voted.
There is some truth in this, Frottage has stood for Parliament a few times, rejected every time but he would be certain to get a seat under PR. so who will he represent. which seat will he take, who will decide what seat he has.
There is a lot to be considered and my biggest concern is ive not heard anybody arguing for us to have a chance to switch back to FPTP system if things turn out badly. you would think that would be one of the priorities after the EU referendum turmoil.
You seem to have a very narrow view of what PR is. In Ireland STV is used as a PR system and you most definitely get to vote for local politicians.

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Re: Conservatives: wholly-owned subsidiary of the ERG and 55 Tufton Street
« Reply #14924 on: September 28, 2022, 06:39:24 pm »
So far I've read the Country's richest hedge funder ( who made millions betting the pound would collapse) blaming crisis on Remainers in the UK banking system.....That the collapse is because the markets fear a Labour Government following a disastrous Tory Budget....and the IMF is undemocratic ( unlike the 0.03% of the Electorate in UK that voted for Truss) and are socialists!!


The Tory's have gone full Everton!

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Re: Conservatives: wholly-owned subsidiary of the ERG and 55 Tufton Street
« Reply #14925 on: September 28, 2022, 06:45:40 pm »
Who’s Bruce? I haven’t watched it since Sir Robin Day. ;D

Forsyth. Can practically hear him saying 'didn't they do well?' everytime a Tory dodges another question.
We have to change from doubter to believer. Now.

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Re: Conservatives: wholly-owned subsidiary of the ERG and 55 Tufton Street
« Reply #14926 on: September 28, 2022, 06:51:00 pm »
You seem to have a very narrow view of what PR is. In Ireland STV is used as a PR system and you most definitely get to vote for local politicians.

We've been over this several times with OF, but he keeps repeating it. We use AMS in Scotland instead of PR, and also get to vote for our local MSP.

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Re: Conservatives: wholly-owned subsidiary of the ERG and 55 Tufton Street
« Reply #14927 on: September 28, 2022, 07:02:25 pm »
Aren’t there protests planned on Saturday ?
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Re: Conservatives: wholly-owned subsidiary of the ERG and 55 Tufton Street
« Reply #14928 on: September 28, 2022, 07:09:55 pm »
You seem to have a very narrow view of what PR is. In Ireland STV is used as a PR system and you most definitely get to vote for local politicians.
? The reason people want PR is to stop a Tory majority government. STV can still bring a Tory majority and you do have a say on who represents you in Parliament.  ive always supported STV and it does work locally, it's more democratic as candidates have to win over 50% of the votes rather than the majority. I also like it because you can make a protest vote without wasting your vote.
People are arguing for PR, I assume they mean a similar system we used for EU MEP elections. they can only work regionally not locally.

It might take our producers five minutes to find 60 economists who feared Brexit and five hours to find a sole voice who espoused it.
“But by the time we went on air we simply had one of each; we presented this unequal effort to our audience as balance. It wasn’t.”
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Re: Conservatives: wholly-owned subsidiary of the ERG and 55 Tufton Street
« Reply #14929 on: September 28, 2022, 07:13:22 pm »
Am I the only one that thinks the country is on course to getting bankrupt??!!  :o :butt :wanker :no
Economy/pound going from bad to worse by the minute!  :shocked
 :no
Fucking tory c*nts  :no :wanker
who are you to judge the life i live?
i know im not perfect-and i dont live to be,
but before you start pointing fingers make
sure your hands are clean!.

Offline Son of Spion

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Re: Conservatives: wholly-owned subsidiary of the ERG and 55 Tufton Street
« Reply #14930 on: September 28, 2022, 07:22:16 pm »
Am I the only one that thinks the country is on course to getting bankrupt??!!  :o :butt :wanker :no
Economy/pound going from bad to worse by the minute!  :shocked
 :no
Fucking tory c*nts  :no :wanker
We must persevere with them though. We can't trust Labour with the economy.  ::)
The light that burns twice as bright, burns half as long, and you've burned so very, very brightly, Jürgen.

Offline Son of Spion

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Re: Conservatives: wholly-owned subsidiary of the ERG and 55 Tufton Street
« Reply #14931 on: September 28, 2022, 07:24:00 pm »
So far I've read the Country's richest hedge funder ( who made millions betting the pound would collapse) blaming crisis on Remainers in the UK banking system.....That the collapse is because the markets fear a Labour Government following a disastrous Tory Budget....and the IMF is undemocratic ( unlike the 0.03% of the Electorate in UK that voted for Truss) and are socialists!!


The Tory's have gone full Everton!

 :o

True Blues indeed.
The light that burns twice as bright, burns half as long, and you've burned so very, very brightly, Jürgen.

Offline spen71

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Re: Conservatives: wholly-owned subsidiary of the ERG and 55 Tufton Street
« Reply #14932 on: September 28, 2022, 07:25:59 pm »
https://www.theguardian.com/money/2022/sep/28/almost-1000-mortgage-deals-pulled-as-panic-grips-uk-housing-market

It’s hitting home to a lot of people.    The Tories are finished for a generation,  I don’t know how the hell Labour are going to sort this out.    Hire the best economists in the world?

Offline Legs

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Re: Conservatives: wholly-owned subsidiary of the ERG and 55 Tufton Street
« Reply #14933 on: September 28, 2022, 07:37:15 pm »
https://www.theguardian.com/money/2022/sep/28/almost-1000-mortgage-deals-pulled-as-panic-grips-uk-housing-market

It’s hitting home to a lot of people.    The Tories are finished for a generation,  I don’t know how the hell Labour are going to sort this out.    Hire the best economists in the world?

We hope they are finished but as ive said a few times it comes down to the British public.

Im not confident in them, are you ?

Offline McSquared

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Re: Conservatives: wholly-owned subsidiary of the ERG and 55 Tufton Street
« Reply #14934 on: September 28, 2022, 07:37:31 pm »
It was saying on the news before that the boe intervention of 65 billion to shore up the bond market is underwritten by the treasury and we the taxpayer will have to fund this shitshow. It’s like living in some alternative reality

Offline Red Beret

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Re: Conservatives: wholly-owned subsidiary of the ERG and 55 Tufton Street
« Reply #14935 on: September 28, 2022, 07:38:19 pm »
I'm a little bit ashamed to admit, but I honestly don't know a great deal about what has gone on, why its happened and who's at fault.  :-\

Yes, I know we are in a cost of living crisis, but why are the Bank of England baling out the government all of a sudden? Is it a case of this shit show government being found out to have literally no money left?

Honest to god, if it's not covid, it's the trouble with Russia and the Ukraine and now this! Any chance of a bit of normality or what.  :'(

The government are a gang of chancers, a collection of ideologues and political theorists completely divorced from the reality of surviving as a modern day worker.

They make John Major's government look like a bastion of competence. The BoE is basically trying to save the patient whilst the Tories keep stabbing it.
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Re: Conservatives: wholly-owned subsidiary of the ERG and 55 Tufton Street
« Reply #14936 on: September 28, 2022, 07:53:20 pm »
? The reason people want PR is to stop a Tory majority government. STV can still bring a Tory majority and you do have a say on who represents you in Parliament.  ive always supported STV and it does work locally, it's more democratic as candidates have to win over 50% of the votes rather than the majority. I also like it because you can make a protest vote without wasting your vote.
People are arguing for PR, I assume they mean a similar system we used for EU MEP elections. they can only work regionally not locally.



Come on man, this has been done to death on here.

STV is a form of PR.
The D'Hondt method, which was used by the UK for EU parliament elections, is also a form of PR.
The Additional Member System (AMS) used in Scotland and Wales is also a form of PR.

Proportional Representation (PR) is an umbrella term for a range of different voting systems, it isn't just the party list system that you have in mind. If you support STV then you support PR. Some people will favour one system over another but generally speaking when people say they support PR they mean they support the principle of the share of votes translating accurately to the share of seats won.
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Offline Son of Spion

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Re: Conservatives: wholly-owned subsidiary of the ERG and 55 Tufton Street
« Reply #14937 on: September 28, 2022, 07:58:27 pm »
We hope they are finished but as ive said a few times it comes down to the British public.

Im not confident in them, are you ?
The good old British public have proven time and time again to be highly masochistic. I'd not invest much confidence in them at all.
The light that burns twice as bright, burns half as long, and you've burned so very, very brightly, Jürgen.

Offline TepidT2O

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Re: Conservatives: wholly-owned subsidiary of the ERG and 55 Tufton Street
« Reply #14938 on: September 28, 2022, 08:06:26 pm »
WHERE IS LIZ TRUSS!?
“Happiness can be found in the darkest of times, if one only remembers to turn on the light.”
“Generosity always pays off. Generosity in your effort, in your work, in your kindness, in the way you look after people and take care of people. In the long run, if you are generous with a heart, and with humanity, it always pays off.”
W

Offline TepidT2O

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Re: Conservatives: wholly-owned subsidiary of the ERG and 55 Tufton Street
« Reply #14939 on: September 28, 2022, 08:08:28 pm »
New C4 poll gives another 17 point lead…
“Happiness can be found in the darkest of times, if one only remembers to turn on the light.”
“Generosity always pays off. Generosity in your effort, in your work, in your kindness, in the way you look after people and take care of people. In the long run, if you are generous with a heart, and with humanity, it always pays off.”
W

Offline Elmo!

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Re: Conservatives: wholly-owned subsidiary of the ERG and 55 Tufton Street
« Reply #14940 on: September 28, 2022, 08:10:52 pm »
New C4 poll gives another 17 point lead…

Obviously a biased woke lefty poll that proves we need to privatise Channel 4.

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Re: Conservatives: wholly-owned subsidiary of the ERG and 55 Tufton Street
« Reply #14941 on: September 28, 2022, 08:11:32 pm »
Come on man, this has been done to death on here.

STV is a form of PR.
The D'Hondt method, which was used by the UK for EU parliament elections, is also a form of PR.
The Additional Member System (AMS) used in Scotland and Wales is also a form of PR.

Proportional Representation (PR) is an umbrella term for a range of different voting systems, it isn't just the party list system that you have in mind. If you support STV then you support PR. Some people will favour one system over another but generally speaking when people say they support PR they mean they support the principle of the share of votes translating accurately to the share of seats won.
Am all for a different voting system and I would prefer STV but let's get this right, why are people arguing for PR now. it's to stop the Tory government from gaining a majority, STV will not stop the Torys from gaining a majority so I am ruling STV out of the choices for this reason,  you can class STV as PR but it still boils down to FPTP in the final count, the candidate with over 50% of the votes wins that seat.
Now if ive got this wrong then explain to me how STV would stop a Tory majority government from taking power and why it is classed as PR. you don't win a proportional vote share to win the seat. you have to win over 50%

« Last Edit: September 28, 2022, 08:14:35 pm by oldfordie »
It might take our producers five minutes to find 60 economists who feared Brexit and five hours to find a sole voice who espoused it.
“But by the time we went on air we simply had one of each; we presented this unequal effort to our audience as balance. It wasn’t.”
               Emily Maitlis

Offline ljycb

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Re: Conservatives: wholly-owned subsidiary of the ERG and 55 Tufton Street
« Reply #14942 on: September 28, 2022, 08:17:15 pm »
We hope they are finished but as ive said a few times it comes down to the British public.

Im not confident in them, are you ?

Sure! I think the last election was a Tory majority built on sand. People who wanted Brexit and didn’t want Corbyn went Tory. I don’t know what there is to keep them on that same side next time out.

Offline west_london_red

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Re: Conservatives: wholly-owned subsidiary of the ERG and 55 Tufton Street
« Reply #14943 on: September 28, 2022, 08:22:16 pm »
New C4 poll gives another 17 point lead…

Seriously, how the fuck is not double that? That’s not me having a go at Starmer but how bad must things get for the electorate to open its fucking eyes  :butt
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Re: Conservatives: wholly-owned subsidiary of the ERG and 55 Tufton Street
« Reply #14944 on: September 28, 2022, 08:24:18 pm »
https://www.theguardian.com/money/2022/sep/28/almost-1000-mortgage-deals-pulled-as-panic-grips-uk-housing-market

It’s hitting home to a lot of people.    The Tories are finished for a generation,  I don’t know how the hell Labour are going to sort this out.    Hire the best economists in the world?

Even from the dung pile the Tories had on offer, Sunak doesn't pull this move.

The fundamental issue is the quality of the people with the power to choose. You mix in those who see things accurately with the senile, the racist, those without the mental capacity to learn and observe accurately, those too lazy to do it...you'll always end up with randomness. Until democracy faces up to the immutable logic of the variance of the human mind and capacities, democracy in the management of a country will always be substandard in how well it allocates power and decision-making. Whether we switch to PR or another form, this issue will still be there. At best, you can temper its excesses. It'll still be substandard, not even in the same timezone as a well run, superbly managed company. The quality of the latter, the top tier, is what we should want for ourselves in those who run the country, make decisions that affect us.

Ah well, no point talking about it now, as with the markets, the time to act is before the event.

Offline Kashinoda

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Re: Conservatives: wholly-owned subsidiary of the ERG and 55 Tufton Street
« Reply #14945 on: September 28, 2022, 08:24:26 pm »
I love data.

:D

Offline TepidT2O

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Re: Conservatives: wholly-owned subsidiary of the ERG and 55 Tufton Street
« Reply #14946 on: September 28, 2022, 08:27:20 pm »
Quote
Westminster Voting Intention:

LAB: 45% (+7)
CON: 28% (-4)
LDM: 11% (-2)
GRN: 6% (-1)
RFM: 3% (=)

Via @FindoutnowUK, 23-27 Sep.
Changes w/ 14-18 Feb.
“Happiness can be found in the darkest of times, if one only remembers to turn on the light.”
“Generosity always pays off. Generosity in your effort, in your work, in your kindness, in the way you look after people and take care of people. In the long run, if you are generous with a heart, and with humanity, it always pays off.”
W

Offline TepidT2O

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Re: Conservatives: wholly-owned subsidiary of the ERG and 55 Tufton Street
« Reply #14947 on: September 28, 2022, 08:35:58 pm »
Quote
No10 and Treasury ministers reject any notion tonight that there's a crisis. Meetings are continuing on a range of subjects in Number 10 - but there's no big focus on the market turmoil. Ministers in cabinet rubbish the link between Friday's statement and today's turmoil....

.... No10 see this is a communications and stakeholder error not a policy messup. So for them, it's business as usual.

I'm as sure as I can be that the Bank of England - and much of the City and the IMF - do not agree

@SamCoatesSky


I mean, this is absolutely insane.  Saying this sort of thing  is only making things worse at each step…far worse

They are genuinely fucking mental
“Happiness can be found in the darkest of times, if one only remembers to turn on the light.”
“Generosity always pays off. Generosity in your effort, in your work, in your kindness, in the way you look after people and take care of people. In the long run, if you are generous with a heart, and with humanity, it always pays off.”
W

Offline Circa1892

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Re: Conservatives: wholly-owned subsidiary of the ERG and 55 Tufton Street
« Reply #14948 on: September 28, 2022, 08:36:49 pm »


You’d hope outside Brighton a lot of those green votes went Labour or LD. Labour + Lib Dems + Greens on 62%, added to that the SNP will win 50 seats. The DUP will lose some too. No route to anything for these awful lying c*nts.

The cabinet have apparently decided on a narrative there is no link between their policies and the market turmoil. Weird fucking c*nts

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Re: Conservatives: wholly-owned subsidiary of the ERG and 55 Tufton Street
« Reply #14949 on: September 28, 2022, 08:47:02 pm »
Seriously, how the fuck is not double that? That’s not me having a go at Starmer but how bad must things get for the electorate to open its fucking eyes  :butt

I think there's going to be a lot of stubborn people who have been taken massively for fools who can't countenance the idea yet they've been massively duped and will keep on making excuses or blaming someone else. See Brexit.

In reality though the Tories were done electorally after Black Wednesday in the 90s and same again now after this week.
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Offline Red Beret

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Re: Conservatives: wholly-owned subsidiary of the ERG and 55 Tufton Street
« Reply #14950 on: September 28, 2022, 08:48:17 pm »
Crisis? What Crisis?
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Offline west_london_red

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Re: Conservatives: wholly-owned subsidiary of the ERG and 55 Tufton Street
« Reply #14951 on: September 28, 2022, 08:52:09 pm »
You’d hope outside Brighton a lot of those green votes went Labour or LD. Labour + Lib Dems + Greens on 62%, added to that the SNP will win 50 seats. The DUP will lose some too. No route to anything for these awful lying c*nts.

The cabinet have apparently decided on a narrative there is no link between their policies and the market turmoil. Weird fucking c*nts

I have this reoccurring nightmare that those tree hugging Greens end up costing Labour the election and we end up with another 5 years of these pig fuckers.
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Offline McSquared

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Re: Conservatives: wholly-owned subsidiary of the ERG and 55 Tufton Street
« Reply #14952 on: September 28, 2022, 09:03:57 pm »
Saw rory stewart ripping truss and the torys to shreds on joe politics before

Offline redbyrdz

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Re: Conservatives: wholly-owned subsidiary of the ERG and 55 Tufton Street
« Reply #14953 on: September 28, 2022, 09:22:04 pm »
https://www.theguardian.com/money/2022/sep/28/almost-1000-mortgage-deals-pulled-as-panic-grips-uk-housing-market

It’s hitting home to a lot of people.    The Tories are finished for a generation,  I don’t know how the hell Labour are going to sort this out.    Hire the best economists in the world?

Maybe, but there's still no way of getring them out of office right now, and they'll have another 2 years to fuck things up more.
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Online TheShanklyGates

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Re: Conservatives: wholly-owned subsidiary of the ERG and 55 Tufton Street
« Reply #14954 on: September 28, 2022, 09:22:46 pm »
Am all for a different voting system and I would prefer STV but let's get this right, why are people arguing for PR now. it's to stop the Tory government from gaining a majority, STV will not stop the Torys from gaining a majority so I am ruling STV out of the choices for this reason,  you can class STV as PR but it still boils down to FPTP in the final count, the candidate with over 50% of the votes wins that seat.
Now if ive got this wrong then explain to me how STV would stop a Tory majority government from taking power and why it is classed as PR. you don't win a proportional vote share to win the seat. you have to win over 50%



:butt

https://www.electoral-reform.org.uk/voting-systems/types-of-voting-system/single-transferable-vote/

Under First Past the Post the only votes that actually count are the votes up to the number it requires to have the most votes in each seat. Any excess votes for the winning candidate or votes for a losing candidate are effectively wasted votes. Single Transferable Vote is not FPTP because excess votes for the most popular candidate and votes cast for candidates with no chance of winning are transferred rather than simply wasted.

It is considered a proportional system because the proportion of seats won by each party will broadly reflect the proportion of votes they receive when the final results are tallied.

For example, here are the results of the 2020 Irish General Election which used STV:



The top chart is the percentage of the votes cast and the bottom chart is the percentage of the seats won. Looks pretty proportional to me.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2020_Irish_general_election#Voting_summary

I've said many, many times that I want PR (of which STV is a form) because it produces a fairer representation of how people actually voted, not because I expect it to return any particular result. I actually suspect it would damage the party I usually vote for (Labour) because plenty of Labour voters currently cast their votes while holding their nose but under a PR system they could cast a vote for a candidate that better reflects their views safe in the knowledge that they aren't enabling the party that they really don't want to get in. It's not just about preventing a Tory government, indeed there is no system that would 100% guarantee the Tories never win a majority again - if over 50% of the electorate vote Tory under a PR system then so be it, a Tory majority government would be the democratic outcome.
« Last Edit: September 28, 2022, 09:35:08 pm by TheShanklyGates »
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Offline Circa1892

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Re: Conservatives: wholly-owned subsidiary of the ERG and 55 Tufton Street
« Reply #14955 on: September 28, 2022, 09:38:01 pm »
Lanky streak of piss Chris Philip has said on Peston that the govt won’t raise benefits in line with inflation. Reversing Sunaks promise and condemning thousands to death.

Offline killer-heels

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Re: Conservatives: wholly-owned subsidiary of the ERG and 55 Tufton Street
« Reply #14956 on: September 28, 2022, 09:40:59 pm »
The Tories are completely fucked in terms of messaging. They are parroting the line of economic growth and putting out videos trying to explain how growth will benefit everyone. However, its just not a powerful line as ‘levelling up’ that Bozo used.

They are trying to promote the positive response people like the CBI gave them, which of course people showed during Brexit that they dont give a shit about.

Offline Circa1892

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Re: Conservatives: wholly-owned subsidiary of the ERG and 55 Tufton Street
« Reply #14957 on: September 28, 2022, 09:43:17 pm »
The Tories are completely fucked in terms of messaging. They are parroting the line of economic growth and putting out videos trying to explain how growth will benefit everyone. However, its just not a powerful line as ‘levelling up’ that Bozo used.

Because they’ve started it by giving millions to the super rich.

And also Kwarteng and Truss are awkward as fuck. People thought Johnson would be good for a pint. He’d done HIGNFY, he was a celebrity who became a politician to them. Kwarteng and Truss are boring as fuck.

Hilarious that the Tories main attack on Starmer is that he’s boring. But fuck me Kwarteng is a weird boring little c*nt.

Offline Dr Stu-Pid

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Re: Conservatives: wholly-owned subsidiary of the ERG and 55 Tufton Street
« Reply #14958 on: September 28, 2022, 09:43:31 pm »
Sadly this mess is hardly surprising when you consider that at best Truss and Kwarteng are the fourth choice for PM and Chancellor just based on the turnover in the last 5 years (Cameron and Osborn, May and Hammond, Johnson and Sunak). In reality they are far, far further down the original pecking order, as most of the remaining semi-competent Tories took themselves out of the running when they ousted Johnson.  That's like Liverpool playing a team of under-18s in the CL and wondering why we get dumped out at the group stage with zero points. There'd be outrage if that happened, with the media and UEFA saying that we'd brought the competition into disrepute, but it's been allowed to happen with the people charged with running (or ruining) the country without any real protests or upheaval. Millions of people will be financially ruined if things continue like this, and yet there is no real lever to restore sanity that doesn't involve Tory MPs backing a motion of no confidence to trigger an election that they know would see (hopefully) hundreds of them lose their jobs. Like asking turkeys voting for Xmas.

If nothing else comes of this, I'd love to see some in-built emergency measures introduced that would automatically trigger an election if certain economic thresholds were breached (strength of the pound, interest rate levels, debt levels, credit rating, etc).  Plus of course an automatic general election if a party decides to oust the sitting PM as they did with Johnson.  As things stand this could go on for another two years unless enough of the more centrist Tories are willing to do the decent thing for the country and fall on their swords. Imagine the damage that these b*stards could cause in that time.

Offline Jiminy Cricket

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Re: Conservatives: wholly-owned subsidiary of the ERG and 55 Tufton Street
« Reply #14959 on: September 28, 2022, 09:43:53 pm »
Saw rory stewart ripping truss and the torys to shreds on joe politics before
Listening now:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d3YgpZhgrDE
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