Topic: Roberto Firmino

[Flaccid Bobby Fowler]

Just needs to figure out how to celebrate a goal properly.

His celebration when he took his top off and fucked it up in the air was pretty decent!

Here’s the thing with Bob, in the lead up to the free kick from Milner, the ball was rolling aimlessly towards the byline going out for a kick out. Most players wouldn’t give a shit, turn around and stroll back knowing it will be a kick out. He actively harassed and pushed and pulled right till the last minute then done a Moreno tackle out of nowhere, won the ball back and set coutinho up which led to the free – which led to the goal.

My point being, all that is required is one goal to win a game, in the 1st or 93rd minute, it’s that intensity he has that will turn draws or losses into wins. Shudder to think what may have happened if Rodgers stayed in charge, given what happened to Lazar.

[jooneyisdagod]

We definitely need another reliable attacker in there with some pace. Unfortunately with Sturridge's injuries we still will need another striker.

All 3 have plenty of flair though and you wonder whether Klopp would want a solid but not spectacular choice to balance that out on the wing. Kind of like Milner but with a bit more speed.

Markovic might be the one. I like bits and pieces of what I see from him, but I don't like other bits and pieces. He really needs to up his dribbling game but his touch, speed and passing are all quite good. He can at least provide what Milner provides and more.

[Adam_LFC]

Markovic might be the one. I like bits and pieces of what I see from him, but I don't like other bits and pieces. He really needs to up his dribbling game but his touch, speed and passing are all quite good. He can at least provide what Milner provides and more.

Another criticism I have against Markovic is that he is too selfless. He needs to believe in his ability more and try things himself. I  am sure Klopp is the man to bring it out in him.

On topic though. Firmino is just churning out end product every game now. He will only get better.

[kaz1983]

http://thebotafogostar.com/2015/03/28/france-1-brazil-3-tactics-friendly-match/

To further confuse the opposition defence, The nominated striker Roberto Firmino would also drop deep at times, with right winger Willian taking his place or drifting centrally himself. Willian and Firmino saw less of the action, but played important roles when it came to dragging defenders around and creating space for Neymar and Oscar.

It was Firmino, dropping deep to link up play, who assisted the first Brazil goal for Oscar. At this point Neymar had taken up Firmino’s place ,whilst Oscar found himself in the space previously occupied by Neymar. The goal was a good example of the interchange between Brazil’s attackers and the way they pulled the French defenders around.

From the recent Aston Villa 0-6 match last Sunday:





You would think Firmino is going to be used centrally and more as a second striker, playing just off a forward like Sturiddge or Origi - rather than a traditional number ten, in behind creating. As for his duties, pressing relentlessly from the front, dragging defenders around creating space for Sturiddge and Coutinho is one of them. Something you can see quite clearly against Villa. I see our shape being more 1-4-4-2 or 1-4-3-1-2 with the ball and 1-4-4-1-1 without the ball, with Firmino playing just off a center forward.

[Rush 82]

Another criticism I have against Markovic is that he is too selfless. He needs to believe in his ability more and try things himself. I  am sure Klopp is the man to bring it out in him.

On topic though. Firmino is just churning out end product every game now. He will only get better.

This.

He's done it for Origi
He's done it for Firmino

He'll do it for Marko - he gets players to believe in themselves and recognise just how good they actually are.

I'm looking forward to his return.

On Firmino, I hope he sticks with those Neon Green Boots of his - makes it so easy to follow what he's up to  - he's fecking brilliant!

[Redcap]

He'll do it for Marko - he gets players to believe in themselves and recognise just how good they actually are.

I'm also hopeful this will happen, but I think it's far from a sure thing next season. This is especially the case for Markovic, because he'll have had the least amount of Klopp time, and he's playing in a position (LW/RW) where we have the least amount of reliable quality.

The question we need to ask ourselves when it comes to all of our young-ish players this season - but especially those in positions less well stocked with quality is this:

How far are they from the quality we need them to be, to challenge for the title (and hence have more than a 'challenge' for the top 4)?

If the answer is: "quite a distance", then we are taking a significant risk by relying on them to get the job done next season. Now, can they get starts? Of course. Can they get games in the PL? With our injury record, quite probably. But should we be relying on them to make up a 15 point deficit on the top spot (keeping in mind that it's been a particularly tough season for the traditional top sides this season)? We would be crazy to, unless our goal is not to get the CL next season, but just try our best with the young players we have and hope that if they don't get us there next season, they'll be good enough to do it the season after.

I like Markovic, and I think he's got a lot of useful tools in his locker. But in his first season he was variously frozen out or played out of position, and perhaps not surprisingly showed himself to be a real 'confidence player'. I'd love to see him develop under Klopp, but I think he's at a similar stage of development as Origi - i.e. not good enough to be our first choice left-sided or right-sided attacking midfielder. Throwing him into the deep end (and potentially expecting him to succeed where Lallana and Ibe have so far been unsuccessful) may not be the best idea for a player that didn't exactly look like Cristiano Ronaldo in his self-belief. For me, that means we will need to get someone better in to play in that position for next season.

[BobPaisley3]

I agree and think we will, the fact that we were negotiating for texiera shows we want more quality in the final third. I'd expect two more additions in that area over the summer, a wide player and a goal scorer.

Back to firmino, he's gone from a slow start to probably being the first name on the team sheet, shows what a bit of time can do. Sometimes you can watch a player and get an instant feeling of 'no he's not good enough', i remember that with Ryan Babel. This fella though, even at the start he had something about him which suggested this wasn't money wasted. With Coutinho, an injury free sturridge and a new signing in a front four, it could be exciting times ahead.

[keyo]

We definitely need another reliable attacker in there with some pace. Unfortunately with Sturridge's injuries we still will need another striker.

All 3 have plenty of flair though and you wonder whether Klopp would want a solid but not spectacular choice to balance that out on the wing. Kind of like Milner but with a bit more speed.

i agree that pace and reliability is required. i tend to think that origi is potentially that, and that he is at the stage of his career that he needs to step it up. 

but in reality firmino is pretty much a starter come choosing our best line up.  as is coutinho. and sturridge.  we then have origi, lallana, benteke, ings.  i think it is more likely we look for creative options, as take coutinho out and we start back struggling to total reliance on firmino to run around doing all the work.  and firmino looks reliable. strong, able to get through alot of work, get through alot of games.  he will get better.  and his output will contnue to get better. he has all the looks of being our mainstay for years to come, even with coutinho and sturridge there.

[DeLeiva]

Like the way that he takes on the physical battle for a smaller bloke.

Always fighting to every inch, not blessed with out and out pace but more then makes up with his skill and willingness to scrap.

[El Denzel Pepito]

Glad Klopp went with him, over Benteke for the FW position whilst Sturridge was out.

Benteke's average passing completion % is... wait for it, 66.6 (65.4 away from home in PL). With stats like that, you can see why Klopp doesn't trust him to start for us, without us being countered on (especially away from home) from a bad pass by him.

Firmino's a weird one, because at times I think he's looked quite casual making the pass and tends to underhit them. But his average is 76% with an average of 32 passes per PL game, compared to Benteke's 20.

Besides Firmino's consistent goalscoring, his underlying numbers show he passes more and passes more accurately, and for that reason alone I'd have him over Benteke no matter what, even if his goalscoring dries up, which it inevitably may.

Edit: Just for comparison, Origi's pass completion: 80%, Sturridge's (although a small sample): 75%, Ings (see before): 71.2%, Ibe: 83%, Lallana: 80%, Coutinho: 78%. Benteke's far below these and it's easy to see why Firmino doesn't really have much competition for the starting berth as the main ST, besides for Origi and Sturridge, as of now.

[an fear dearg]

Glad Klopp went with him, over Benteke for the FW position whilst Sturridge was out.

Benteke's average passing completion % is... wait for it, 66.6 (65.4 away from home in PL). With stats like that, you can see why Klopp doesn't trust him to start for us, without us being countered on (especially away from home) from a bad pass by him.

Firmino's a weird one, because at times I think he's looked quite casual making the pass and tends to underhit them. But his average is 76% with an average of 32 passes per PL game, compared to Benteke's 20.

Besides Firmino's consistent goalscoring, his underlying numbers show he passes more and passes more accurately, and for that reason alone I'd have him over Benteke no matter what, even if his goalscoring dries up, which it inevitably may.

Edit: Just for comparison, Origi's pass completion: 80%, Sturridge's (although a small sample): 75%, Ings (see before): 71.2%, Ibe: 83%, Lallana: 80%, Coutinho: 78%. Benteke's far below these and it's easy to see why Firmino doesn't really have much competition for the starting berth as the main ST, besides for Origi and Sturridge, as of now.

I'm not trying to defend Benteke here but do those stats include headers won from long balls as 'passes'?  It's not right to compare the two as they are different players,  as is Sturridge, as is Coutinho.  Firmino suits our style of play and that's clear and that's all that matters,

[ScottScott]

Glad Klopp went with him, over Benteke for the FW position whilst Sturridge was out.

Benteke's average passing completion % is... wait for it, 66.6 (65.4 away from home in PL). With stats like that, you can see why Klopp doesn't trust him to start for us, without us being countered on (especially away from home) from a bad pass by him.

Firmino's a weird one, because at times I think he's looked quite casual making the pass and tends to underhit them. But his average is 76% with an average of 32 passes per PL game, compared to Benteke's 20.

Besides Firmino's consistent goalscoring, his underlying numbers show he passes more and passes more accurately, and for that reason alone I'd have him over Benteke no matter what, even if his goalscoring dries up, which it inevitably may.

Edit: Just for comparison, Origi's pass completion: 80%, Sturridge's (although a small sample): 75%, Ings (see before): 71.2%, Ibe: 83%, Lallana: 80%, Coutinho: 78%. Benteke's far below these and it's easy to see why Firmino doesn't really have much competition for the starting berth as the main ST, besides for Origi and Sturridge, as of now.

Interesting analysis. Would Benteke's be lower because flick on's are counted as a pass and no one in our team seems to be able to read one?

[Funky_Gibbons]

Glad Klopp went with him, over Benteke for the FW position whilst Sturridge was out.

Benteke's average passing completion % is... wait for it, 66.6 (65.4 away from home in PL). With stats like that, you can see why Klopp doesn't trust him to start for us, without us being countered on (especially away from home) from a bad pass by him.

Firmino's a weird one, because at times I think he's looked quite casual making the pass and tends to underhit them. But his average is 76% with an average of 32 passes per PL game, compared to Benteke's 20.

Besides Firmino's consistent goalscoring, his underlying numbers show he passes more and passes more accurately, and for that reason alone I'd have him over Benteke no matter what, even if his goalscoring dries up, which it inevitably may.

Edit: Just for comparison, Origi's pass completion: 80%, Sturridge's (although a small sample): 75%, Ings (see before): 71.2%, Ibe: 83%, Lallana: 80%, Coutinho: 78%. Benteke's far below these and it's easy to see why Firmino doesn't really have much competition for the starting berth as the main ST, besides for Origi and Sturridge, as of now.

Don't think passing percentage is particularly important when it comes to comparing or choosing strikers. Vardy has a lower passing accuracy than Benteke and Giroud is only slightly better yet they're playing regularly in teams sitting first and third in the league. Even Harry Kane is just above 70%.

They're playing because they're putting the ball in the net regularly.

[cdav]

Sorry lads, he's not as good as we thought as Owen says so

http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/liverpool-fc-forward-roberto-firmino-10899496

“He’s done well lately. But to be a Liverpool player you have to do it every week. You can have one bad game in five, but at the moment he’s more one good game in five."

[ThePeetmix]

Sorry lads, he's not as good as we thought as Owen says so

http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/liverpool-fc-forward-roberto-firmino-10899496

“He’s done well lately. But to be a Liverpool player you have to do it every week. You can have one bad game in five, but at the moment he’s more one good game in five."

Sums up him all over. No clue what he's talking about. Sure he can be more consistant, but a 1 good game in 5 player? What nonsense.

[Digger2God]

Does anyone have a full comparison between Sterling and Firmino? I know Roberto has more goals and assists in the PL games.

[rscanderlech]

Does anyone have a full comparison between Sterling and Firmino? I know Roberto has more goals and assists in the PL games.

Whats the point? We can see that Firmino has a good shot and final ball whereas Sterling has no idea what he is doing in the final third, while Sterling is quicker

[SerbianScouser]

Does anyone have a full comparison between Sterling and Firmino? I know Roberto has more goals and assists in the PL games.

We`ve done alright for ourselves. Massive upgrade.

[rocco]

Been fantastic for a good few weeks now  , much prefer him centrally than pushed out wide

[redprodigal]

Sorry lads, he's not as good as we thought as Owen says so

http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/liverpool-fc-forward-roberto-firmino-10899496

“He’s done well lately. But to be a Liverpool player you have to do it every week. You can have one bad game in five, but at the moment he’s more one good game in five."

Owen's not far off to be honest. Too many on here who are easily taken in by stats and the good things he does sporadically. If everyone watched the game closely and took their blinkers off they'd see that he's been far too inconsistent. He's deffo got the talent but needs to show it more often. Expecting him to show a lot more if Sturridge and Coutino can stay fit as he's the type of player who thrives with those types around him. Next season should be the making of him.

[Redinho]

Owen's not far off to be honest. Too many on here who are easily taken in by stats and the good things he does sporadically. If everyone watched the game closely and took their blinkers off they'd see that he's been far too inconsistent. He's deffo got the talent but needs to show it more often. Expecting him to show a lot more if Sturridge and Coutino can stay fit as he's the type of player who thrives with those types around him. Next season should be the making of him.

We get it.

[cdav]

Owen's not far off to be honest. Too many on here who are easily taken in by stats and the good things he does sporadically. If everyone watched the game closely and took their blinkers off they'd see that he's been far too inconsistent. He's deffo got the talent but needs to show it more often. Expecting him to show a lot more if Sturridge and Coutino can stay fit as he's the type of player who thrives with those types around him. Next season should be the making of him.

But even ignoring his (very impressive) stats since the turn of the year, just using your eyes shows how much of a threat he is. He is scoring goals, testing the opposition's defence and keeper, creating chances and generally being our biggest threat. I think its a question of expectations- very few players affect games all the time, only the very best (think Suarez, Messi, Ronaldo, etc). You look at the best Premier League players over the last few years in similar positions- Silva, Hazard, Ozil, Sanchez- they do not do that. I hope he does go on to do that, but even if he doesn't do it every game as long as he can be a consistent threat over a season that would be good.

I also think he will benefit from other good attacking players being on the pitch, creating space and options. If we can get a pacy goalscoring winger and a good backup striker, we are looking really good I think with a front four of Sturridge, Coutinho and Firmino plus new winger.

[Chakan]

It's weird, he's playing like it's his first season in the premier league in a team that's been hit with injuries and and he's had some himself. Can't explain it really. Utterly baffling.

[Caston]

Owen's not far off to be honest. Too many on here who are easily taken in by stats and the good things he does sporadically. If everyone watched the game closely and took their blinkers off they'd see that he's been far too inconsistent. He's deffo got the talent but needs to show it more often. Expecting him to show a lot more if Sturridge and Coutino can stay fit as he's the type of player who thrives with those types around him. Next season should be the making of him.

Owen would be right if he said this about 4-5 months ago. But he's been brilliant all 2016

[harryc]

Just needs to sort out those under hit passes and giving the ball away because his output is there.

[Keita Success]

http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/liverpool-fc-forward-roberto-firmino-10899496

Michael Owen spouting bollocks about Firmino not caring about giving the ball away... He's the best at regaining posession in the opponent's half, for me.

[the_red_pill]

Don't think passing percentage is particularly important when it comes to comparing or choosing strikers. Vardy has a lower passing accuracy than Benteke and Giroud is only slightly better yet they're playing regularly in teams sitting first and third in the league. Even Harry Kane is just above 70%.

They're playing because they're putting the ball in the net regularly.

Yip- pass accuracy is not too important for a striker. Luis had 73%/74% for example in 2013/2014 and he done okay AND he "fit our style of play". As you say, the form-striker in the league has even less than Benteke and Giroud's numbers are about the same or even less than Luis'.

What's more important, is how many they can score with the possession and seconds they have on the ball.
Most stikers will be around the 75% mark, I presume since 73%-77% is by far the most "popular" numbers in that statistic.

This has to do with the area where they are supposed to pass the ball around(if they have to). Frequently a pass/lay-off will be snuffed out by the oppo defense/midfield in an overcrowded area, inbetween the tightest of spaces and angles. It's not the same as passing it around midfield or the defense.

[redprodigal]

Just needs to sort out those under hit passes and giving the ball away because his output is there.

Agree

[the_red_pill]

Sums up him all over. No clue what he's talking about. Sure he can be more consistant, but a 1 good game in 5 player? What nonsense.

To be fair to him, he's only giving his view on it and he uses the phrase "at the moment" a lot. He's wrong about the 1 in 5 games thing though.
Like the fact he still refers to Liverpool as "we".

[B0151?]

He'll need to sharpen his passes up with Sturridge/Origi back. They'll be giving it away a fair bit themselves.

I expect a main reason it has suffered is because he's been up front, so it will probably tighten up naturally, but he has been rather sloppy at times you'd expect him to not be.

[Stockholm Syndrome]

To be fair to him, he's only giving his view on it and he uses the phrase "at the moment" a lot. He's wrong about the 1 in 5 games thing though.
Like the fact he still refers to Liverpool as "we".

But it's not even true for "at the moment". Maybe 2 or 3 months ago, sure, but right now he has in fact been the 5 good games to 1 bad game player he described as acceptable.

[Solomon Grundy]

Firmino has been very good this year. Even on Sunday when he had a pretty quiet game compared to recently, he still managed an assist and was a constant pain in the arse for the Villa back 4. Pressing the shit out of them and either nicking the ball back or forcing them into a stray pass. This lad is only going to get better for us.

[rocco]

Firmino has been very good this year. Even on Sunday when he had a pretty quiet game compared to recently, he still managed an assist and was a constant pain in the arse for the Villa back 4. Pressing the shit out of them and either nicking the ball back or forcing them into a stray pass. This lad is only going to get better for us.

never had any doubts but watching him play in Germany he did seem a bit more aggressive in his play ?

[Tobez]

Because I like the odd stat here and there I put both him and Sterling into the comparison matrix on Squawka with what I consider to be the 4 main stats for comparing attacking players: goals scored, assists, chances created and key passes. In every single one (per 90), Firmino comes out on top. Now, I know that it's not the be-all and end-all of comparisons. But if we consider that he didn't have a particularly great start to the season, was adjusting to the league, was injured and has been playing with teammates of lesser quality than Sterling, then I would say he's performed pretty well.

He also cost at least £20 million less than Sterling did. It's strange to think how many pundits have been praising Sterling this year whilst simultaneously questioning how effective a signing Firmino has been. Still, I suppose that's the standard of punditry in this country.

[Solomon Grundy]

never had any doubts but watching him Germany he did seem a bit more aggressive in his play ?

I think that will come the more he gets used to this league mate.

[the_red_pill]

But it's not even true for "at the moment". Maybe 2 or 3 months ago, sure, but right now he has in fact been the 5 good games to 1 bad game player he described as acceptable.

Yeah, I did say he was wrong about that. He's just a pundit and he looks at this from the angle of a "true" number 9. Firmino's not the sort of player he wants him to be though. He's a hard worker with a sneaky streak and aggression when it's needed.
Doesn't walk around showing how bad he is by pulling he's brain round his head and strapping it on his face.

[rocco]

I think that will come the more he gets used to this league mate.

Expect so

[TepidT2O]

Even Suarez took a few months to settle at barca.

mostly because he was banned

[B0151?]

Even Suarez took a few months to settle at barca.

Took him over a year and a half to get people to believe he was a striker here!

[Solomon Grundy]

Took him over a year and a half to get people to believe he was a striker here!

Ahhhhh... The good old days when he wasn't a patch on Nikola Jelavic...